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Post by midnight tea on Dec 7, 2018 23:13:48 GMT
The whole teaser was about the Dread Wolf, so it's not surprising - plus, Solas has multiple images (his murals or tarot cards) in which he is portrayed together with his wolf persona on the side. Some people here were in favour of Elgar'nan or Falon'Din. Now that the artist has apparently confirmed the figure is indeed bald, there is little doubt who it is. Not so many bald elves around. But when they started making this fan art all of them must have immediately jumped to that conclusion, which could have gone very wrong.
Mural aside - we know that Solas is bald, but during a visit in Temple of Mythal we see that many ancient elves appear to be bald too. People were speculating at times whether it's an effect of prolonged Uthenera. Interestingly enough, all Evanuris mosaics we see in DAI portray their gods as bald - irony of ironies: the Dread Wolf is the only exception!
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Post by Julilla on Dec 7, 2018 23:16:03 GMT
Though admittedly, I just had to ask, how optimistic are you guys about this romance not ending in a tear-jerking festival? 😅 (just curious) I give it maybe 10% chance for a happy ending. Although, I would be forever grateful to Patrick Weekes if he let my Lavellan change Solas' mind, or join him. I would definitely send Patrick some Legos or something he likes. Yes, I definitely would. :::please tell me that he is easy to bribe!:::
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Post by Psychedelic on Dec 7, 2018 23:18:25 GMT
Some people here were in favour of Elgar'nan or Falon'Din. Now that the artist has apparently confirmed the figure is indeed bald, there is little doubt who it is. Not so many bald elves around. But when they started making this fan art all of them must have immediately jumped to that conclusion, which could have gone very wrong.
Mural aside - we know that Solas is bald, but during a visit in Temple of Mythal we see that many ancient elves appear to be bald too. People were speculating at times whether it's an effect of prolonged Uthenera. Interestingly enough, all Evanuris mosaics we see in DAI portray their gods as bald - irony of ironies: the Dread Wolf is the only exception! If Bioware is worried fans might confuse Qarinus with Qunari, the better don't put several bald elves in their game.
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Post by close2myheart on Dec 7, 2018 23:24:36 GMT
Though admittedly, I just had to ask, how optimistic are you guys about this romance not ending in a tear-jerking festival? 😅 (just curious) I give it maybe 10% chance for a happy ending. Although, I would be forever grateful to Patrick Weekes if he let my Lavellan change Solas' mind, or join him. I would definitely send Patrick some Legos or something he likes. Yes, I definitely would. :::please tell me that he is easy to bribe!::: You know what, you guys are brave 😆 Since all romance/friendship path has their sad-happy version, I hope at the very least he'll have 1 that isn't overtly heartbreaking.
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Post by ladyiolanthe on Dec 8, 2018 0:35:41 GMT
Some people here were in favour of Elgar'nan or Falon'Din. Now that the artist has apparently confirmed the figure is indeed bald, there is little doubt who it is. Not so many bald elves around. But when they started making this fan art all of them must have immediately jumped to that conclusion, which could have gone very wrong.
Mural aside - we know that Solas is bald, but during a visit in Temple of Mythal we see that many ancient elves appear to be bald too. People were speculating at times whether it's an effect of prolonged Uthenera. Interestingly enough, all Evanuris mosaics we see in DAI portray their gods as bald - irony of ironies: the Dread Wolf is the only exception! I've written at length about this before, but I see hair in the patterns of the tesserae around their heads. ETA: It was on the old BSN, but here you go: fextralife.com/forums/p3047323/solas-thread--now-officially-moved-to-cyonans-bsn-link-in-op/#p3047323
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Post by Sifr on Dec 8, 2018 0:37:46 GMT
Would you kill me, ma vhenan? For the People? Without. Question. If the Inquisitor returns to confront Solas, I'd love to have a unique option for Lavellan that echoes his own words back to him;
Solas: You would oppose the restoration of our People?
Lavellan: "Our people". You use that phrase so casually, it should mean more.
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Post by midnight tea on Dec 8, 2018 0:46:55 GMT
Mural aside - we know that Solas is bald, but during a visit in Temple of Mythal we see that many ancient elves appear to be bald too. People were speculating at times whether it's an effect of prolonged Uthenera. Interestingly enough, all Evanuris mosaics we see in DAI portray their gods as bald - irony of ironies: the Dread Wolf is the only exception! I've written at length about this before, but I see hair in the patterns of the tesserae around their heads. I think it's just aura or decorative filler - it doesn't look like hair because it's separated from the head and there's not the slightest hint of hairline.
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Post by ladyiolanthe on Dec 8, 2018 0:48:02 GMT
I've written at length about this before, but I see hair in the patterns of the tesserae around their heads. I think it's just aura or decorative filler - it doesn't look like hair because it's separated from the head and there's not the slightest hint of hairline. I think that's part of the crude style of the mosaics. They're not exactly artistic masterpieces. The tesserae are quite large, for one thing - so it's hard to capture fine detail as our own Roman and Byzantine mosaic masters were able to with their tiny tesserae.
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Post by midnight tea on Dec 8, 2018 0:50:23 GMT
Would you kill me, ma vhenan? For the People? Without. Question. If the Inquisitor returns to confront Solas, I'd love to have a unique option for Lavellan that echoes his own words back to him;
Solas: You would oppose the restoration of our People?
Lavellan: "Our people". You use that phrase so casually, it should mean more. Well, only that THAT specific dialogue option would probably not work, lest it contradicts what Solas said to Lavellans willing to go with him to help restore the People. Then there's also the issue of what that 'restoration' means...
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Post by midnight tea on Dec 8, 2018 0:53:08 GMT
I think it's just aura or decorative filler - it doesn't look like hair because it's separated from the head and there's not the slightest hint of hairline. I think that's part of the crude style of the mosaics. They're not exactly artistic masterpieces. The tesserae are quite large, for one thing - so it's hard to capture fine detail as our own Roman and Byzantine mosaic masters were able to with their tiny tesserae. Simplified style or no, there's enough wiggle room to make hair look more like hair. Fen-Harel certainly doesn't look like a bald dog, lol. Instead - again - no hairline and clear distinction between head and surrounding lines.
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Post by ladyiolanthe on Dec 8, 2018 0:56:09 GMT
I think that's part of the crude style of the mosaics. They're not exactly artistic masterpieces. The tesserae are quite large, for one thing - so it's hard to capture fine detail as our own Roman and Byzantine mosaic masters were able to with their tiny tesserae. Simplified style or no, there's enough wiggle room to make hair look more like hair. Fen-Harel certainly doesn't look like a bald dog, lol. Instead - again - no hairline and clear distinction between head and surrounding lines. We're just going to have to agree to disagree.
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Post by Sifr on Dec 8, 2018 0:57:26 GMT
If the Inquisitor returns to confront Solas, I'd love to have a unique option for Lavellan that echoes his own words back to him;
Solas: You would oppose the restoration of our People?
Lavellan: "Our people". You use that phrase so casually, it should mean more. Well, only that THAT specific dialogue option would probably not work, lest it contradicts what Solas said to Lavellans willing to go with him to help restore the People. Then there's also the issue of what that 'restoration' means... True, maybe instead then the option to have an ironic echo of the line "But the people, they need me", given by a reluctant Inquisitor who doesn't want to fight Solas, but feels that they have to do so for good of the people of Thedas?
Then again, as it's a line that the Inquisitor never heard Solas say, it loses some of that same punch as if they were directly quoting him.
Still, it'd be cool to have some degree of callback appear in the dialogue, if we got some kind of confrontation between the two.
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Post by AlleluiaElizabeth on Dec 8, 2018 1:00:20 GMT
this is it - Would you kill me, ma vhenan? For the People? Without. Question. ಥ___ಥ edit: i'm gonna eat an entire packet of cheeseMy Lavellans the same. (Though she’s not badass as Okoye lol) I’m really hoping he doesn’t make me kill him, though.
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Post by AlleluiaElizabeth on Dec 8, 2018 1:03:33 GMT
Sure. Just not in the last 24 hours. Lol
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Post by midnight tea on Dec 8, 2018 1:04:03 GMT
Well, only that THAT specific dialogue option would probably not work, lest it contradicts what Solas said to Lavellans willing to go with him to help restore the People. Then there's also the issue of what that 'restoration' means... True, maybe instead then the option to have an ironic echo of the line "But the people, they need me", given by a reluctant Inquisitor who doesn't want to fight Solas, but feels that they have to do so for good of the people of Thedas?
Then again, as it's a line that the Inquisitor never heard Solas say, it loses some of that same punch as if they were directly quoting him.
Still, it'd be cool to have some degree of callback appear in the dialogue, if we got some kind of confrontation between the two.
Well, even if Inquisitor didn't hear Solas utter certain words, it'd still be significant that they repeat them. Parallels run strong in Dragon Age after all, and we know that there are strong parallels between Inquisitor and Solas already.
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Post by Sifr on Dec 8, 2018 1:46:47 GMT
Sure. Just not in the last 24 hours. Lol They can go back to power-napping in the Fade afterwards, but for now, give us ART!
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Post by Sunegami on Dec 8, 2018 2:39:42 GMT
I am in a glass case of emotion~
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Post by ellawyn on Dec 8, 2018 7:10:25 GMT
Hmmmmm yes. This trailer pleases me. Good, good... *rubs hands together all evil-like*
Looking at the theories going around, how do we feel about Solas getting corrupted with Blight? Or otherwise messing with the power. I feel like it makes a lot of things make sense - especially his "I would not have you see what I become" line - but I guess I worry about all the ways it could go wrong. A very easy (and kinda lame, imo) road to take would be to have Solas use the blight, go crazy, and then become a Cory 2.0 madman that can be guiltlessly put down. I guess I feel like it would be a disservice to the character, and I'd hate for it to be that simple. Cory was a huge disappointment for me for how... how expected his takedown was. Oh, he's a power-hungry lunatic! Oh, he's lying to his followers and they can all turn on him! Oh man what a dick! Hoo boy, Mr or Mrs or Ms Player, you don't need to feel bad about taking this guy down!
But it could be really cool, too. Solas slowly descending into corruption, knowing what he's becoming but feeling compelled to do it. Trying to stave off the song in his head just long enough to put his plan through. His final act asking the protagonist to kill him, because he knows what he is and knows there's no future for a blighted creature... Throw that fuel on my cozy little angst fire.
I just hope they give it some nuance. I don't want it to be easy, or simple. I want the decisions around Solas to be tough. Do his ends justify his means? Are his ends better for the world? All I want is that it's not a case of clear-cut right or wrong. I doubt that anything will happen to wholly absolve Solas - and I'm cool with that. I want it, even. I love how his character's struggling to do good at great cost. I feel like it'd be lame if he came out as objectively heroic or villainous. But I just... worry. It's easier to push him to the latter than the former.
God the next three years cannot come soon enough.
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Post by Ajna on Dec 8, 2018 10:00:43 GMT
I don't know who remembers me here but.....
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Post by Elessara on Dec 8, 2018 12:22:15 GMT
Hmmmmm yes. This trailer pleases me. Good, good... *rubs hands together all evil-like* Looking at the theories going around, how do we feel about Solas getting corrupted with Blight? Or otherwise messing with the power. I feel like it makes a lot of things make sense - especially his "I would not have you see what I become" line - but I guess I worry about all the ways it could go wrong. A very easy (and kinda lame, imo) road to take would be to have Solas use the blight, go crazy, and then become a Cory 2.0 madman that can be guiltlessly put down. I guess I feel like it would be a disservice to the character, and I'd hate for it to be that simple. Cory was a huge disappointment for me for how... how expected his takedown was. Oh, he's a power-hungry lunatic! Oh, he's lying to his followers and they can all turn on him! Oh man what a dick! Hoo boy, Mr or Mrs or Ms Player, you don't need to feel bad about taking this guy down! But it could be really cool, too. Solas slowly descending into corruption, knowing what he's becoming but feeling compelled to do it. Trying to stave off the song in his head just long enough to put his plan through. His final act asking the protagonist to kill him, because he knows what he is and knows there's no future for a blighted creature... Throw that fuel on my cozy little angst fire. I just hope they give it some nuance. I don't want it to be easy, or simple. I want the decisions around Solas to be tough. Do his ends justify his means? Are his ends better for the world? All I want is that it's not a case of clear-cut right or wrong. I doubt that anything will happen to wholly absolve Solas - and I'm cool with that. I want it, even. I love how his character's struggling to do good at great cost. I feel like it'd be lame if he came out as objectively heroic or villainous. But I just... worry. It's easier to push him to the latter than the former. God the next three years cannot come soon enough. Honestly I really don't like that idea at all. I know Solas can be arrogant but is he really *that* stupid? Yes he needs power to do whatever he feels he needs to do but if he's trying to recreate the world as it was you'd think he'd want less Blight and given that the Blight corrupts everything it touches then any world created with that power would be corrupted. I don't know, I just feel like using the Blight would, as you said basically turn him into Cory 2.0 and also that it's the easiest and dumbest route he could take. And I think that no matter how much of a struggle they portray Solas going through it will be far too easy for a player to ignore all of that and simply think, "Oh well the Blight corrupted him and he's nuts - gotta kill him!"
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Post by uirebhiril on Dec 8, 2018 15:04:42 GMT
See, this is why if it comes down to being able to kill him, I hope that it comes at a cost. It's already going to be difficult for people who were friends with or romanced him if it is necessary; if people who just hated him and want him dead get a free and clear shot at murdering him, it should be weighed against a consequence for doing so. Most would still totally off him, but in that shade of gray, I gather they will then reveal something about themselves.
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Post by ladyiolanthe on Dec 8, 2018 16:16:14 GMT
Honestly I really don't like that idea at all. I know Solas can be arrogant but is he really *that* stupid? Yes he needs power to do whatever he feels he needs to do but if he's trying to recreate the world as it was you'd think he'd want less Blight and given that the Blight corrupts everything it touches then any world created with that power would be corrupted. I don't know, I just feel like using the Blight would, as you said basically turn him into Cory 2.0 and also that it's the easiest and dumbest route he could take. And I think that no matter how much of a struggle they portray Solas going through it will be far too easy for a player to ignore all of that and simply think, "Oh well the Blight corrupted him and he's nuts - gotta kill him!" I honestly can't see Solas relying on red lyrium/the Blight to accomplish what he plans to accomplish. That stuff has him shook in DAI. (I've attached the conversation you can have with him after Here Lies The Abyss under the spoiler, if you wish to refresh your memories.) Solas: I cannot believe the Grey Wardens could even conceive of such a plan. To seek out these Old Gods deliberately in some bizarre attempt to pre-empt the Blight… Option 1: Inquisitor: How many lives were lost in the last Blight? Corypheus notwithstanding, I don’t blame the wardens for acting instead of reacting. Solas: They acted stupidly. Inquisitor: By trying to end the Blight forever? Solas: Yes! Would it have worked? Do you know? Did they? The fools who first unleashed the Blight upon this world thought they were unlocking the ultimate power. Option 2: Inquisitor: And calling the army of demons. That’s my favourite part. Solas: The demons are nothing. They’re a tool. Inquisitor: A tool that would have let Corypheus ride roughshod over most of Orlais. Solas: Even if they hadn’t, the entire idea is wrong. The Blight is not something one smugly outsmarts. Option 3: Inquisitor: Grey Wardens have always been dangerous. They care for nothing beyond stopping the darkspawn. Solas: Like a fair maiden chasing a butterfly off a cliff. Except that if you hadn’t stopped them, we’d all have fallen. Those fools and duty. Responsibility is not expertise. Action is not inherently superior to inaction. (All options continue with...) Solas: Forgive me. The entire idea is… unnerving.<o:p></o:p> I have always thought that the thing he doesn't want Lavellan to see him become is the Dread Wolf, who I think is in fact a very powerful spirit/demon that happens also to be Solas' soul, for all intents and purposes. (I think all the elves have spirits, including our Lavellans since Solas does refer to it several times - see the spoiler if you'd like to refresh your memories.) Solas: Inquisitor, I was… do you have a moment? (They go to the balcony)
Solas: What were you like before the Anchor? Has it affected you? Changed you in any way? Your mind, your morals, your… spirit? ( Emphasis mine, and I know he says this to human, dwarf, and qunari Inquisitors as well, which is interesting because it's possible they all have spirits too, or in their case he might be referring to 'spirit' more figuratively. But with Dalish elves alone, he says other things later on that might indicate he means "spirit" quite literally with them.) Option 1:
Inquisitor: I don’t believe so. Solas: Ah. Inquisitor: Why do you ask? Option 2:
Inquisitor: If it had, do you really think I’d have noticed? Solas: No. That’s an excellent point. Inquisitor: Why do you ask? Option 3:
Inquisitor: What do you think is going on here? (All options continue with...)Solas: You show a wisdom I have not seen since… since my deepest journeys into the ancient memories of the Fade. You are not what I expected. Option 1:
Inquisitor: I don’t think of myself as different from anyone. Solas: Perhaps not in the form of your body, no. Option 2:
Inquisitor: Sorry to disappoint. Solas: It’s not disappointing, it’s… (sighs). Most people are predictable. Option 3:
Inquisitor: What have I done that’s so surprising? (All options continue with...)Solas: You have shown subtlety in your actions, a wisdom that goes against everything I expected. (Only Dalish elves get:) If the Dalish could raise someone with a spirit like yours… have I misjudged them? Option 1:
Inquisitor: I don’t hold the Dalish up as perfect, but we have something worth honouring. A memory of the ancient ways. Option 2:
Inquisitor: Most of the Dalish care more about impressing other hunters with a good shot or talking about how awful humans are. There are only a few who seem to care about the old ways. Option 3:
Inquisitor: The Dalish didn’t make me like this. The decisions were mine. Solas: Yes, you are wise to give yourself that due. Although the Dalish, in their fashion, may still have guided you. (All options continue with...)Solas: Perhaps that is it. I suppose it must be. Most people act with so little understanding of the world. But not you. And then there is that one option in the romance break-up scene:
Inquisitor: Solas… don’t leave me. Not now. I love you. Solas: You have a rare and marvelous spirit. In another world- Inquisitor: Why not this one? Solas: I can’t. I’m sorry.<o:p></o:p> But as others have suggested, I think that by becoming the Dread Wolf, Solas can accomplish his goals, though at great cost to himself. I doubt the Dread Wolf cares who it kills; it's a Pride Demon of sorts so everyone else is dust to be trodden down. The Dread Wolf would not feel happy when its companions take flowers to the grave of an elf for her husband, or help refugees. It can't care about those things. It probably can't care about a romanced Lavellan, either. But becoming the Dread Wolf will make it possible for a kind-hearted Solas to do the hard things. Solas doesn't want to go full demon but he knows it's the only way. And I think that is going to be a major point with his character - we already saw that he is struggling with what he "must" do in Trespasser, and the new art revealed in the teaser suggests to me that he is going to continue to struggle in The Dread Wolf Rises. I have also long wondered whether the reason he is calling elves to him - and I don't think all those elves are ancient elves who have persisted, as some in the fandom seem to think - is because another thing he doesn't want Lavellan to see him become is a blood mage. He needs tremendous power to tear down the Veil. Elves, even modern elves, have more magic in their blood than any other race, hence why blood mages seem to really like elves as sacrifices. He talks at length about blood magic being a tool if you ask him about it. He also says that he doesn't use it because it would prevent him from going to his beloved Fade. But if it would give him the power he needs to accomplish his goals, I think he would do it. "The healer has the bloodiest hands," after all. And that might be another part of his struggle - killing all these descendants of his people to get what he needs. Especially for a befriended/romanced Solas who realizes these are quite definitely people - indeed, his beloved's people - that would be a hard choice to make.
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Post by ellawyn on Dec 8, 2018 16:27:00 GMT
Man, it would be great if opposing Solas meant strengthening the Qunari, since the two are so opposed to each other that I imagine weakening one opponent gives the other an edge. Wanna live out that weirdly detailed and violent revenge fantasy? Well you can, you just have to fuck over Tevinter and most of Thedas to do it. Though I'm sure they'll find a way to blame Solas for that too. "I didn't give Thedas to the Qunari! If that stupid elf just happily walked himself into my sword, I wouldn't have been forced to hand the continent over to a totalitarian regime!"
Huh. Almost like we should be given some understanding for making rough choices that have a high cost and no "right" answer. I wonder who could sympathize with THAT problem, hmm?
... Okay, okay, I'm done! Bitter passive-aggresive rant over! People can hate Solas and want to kill him, it's fine. But it demonstrates the broad path I think the story might follow. Inquisition and especially Trespasser spent a lot of time building parallels between him and the Inquisitor. If Solas' conflict essentially boils down to "All of the choices before me kinda suck, but I've got to pick one," then the Inquisitor's story should too. I like the whole kill/redeem thing in that it's an intensely personal choice - but I feel like it's just too simple. I like Solas, of course I want to redeem him. And people who hate Solas, of course they want to kill him. I want the choice to be more than that.
I also wonder if the next game will have a bit of Solas popping into the protagonist's dreams, just to get to know his enemy. Have a polite chat if he's high-approval, or a vaguely condescending lecture if low. It'd help newcomers establish an opinion of him, too, in case they didn't play Inquisition.
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Post by ladyiolanthe on Dec 8, 2018 16:31:01 GMT
*snip* ... Okay, okay, I'm done! Bitter passive-aggresive rant over! People can hate Solas and want to kill him, it's fine. But it demonstrates the broad path I think the story might follow. Inquisition and especially Trespasser spent a lot of time building parallels between him and the Inquisitor. If Solas' conflict essentially boils down to "All of the choices before me kinda suck, but I've got to pick one," then the Inquisitor's story should too. I like the whole kill/redeem thing in that it's an intensely personal choice - but I feel like it's just too simple. I like Solas, of course I want to redeem him. And people who hate Solas, of course they want to kill him. I want the choice to be more than that. *snip* And this is where I think it's possible the red lyrium and Blight strands of the Dragon Age tapestry might tie in. What if what Solas is planning to do - tear down the Veil - will make it possible to end the Blight? What is worse? The Blight or a world with no Veil? How do you make that choice?
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Post by Elessara on Dec 8, 2018 16:43:43 GMT
*snip* ... Okay, okay, I'm done! Bitter passive-aggresive rant over! People can hate Solas and want to kill him, it's fine. But it demonstrates the broad path I think the story might follow. Inquisition and especially Trespasser spent a lot of time building parallels between him and the Inquisitor. If Solas' conflict essentially boils down to "All of the choices before me kinda suck, but I've got to pick one," then the Inquisitor's story should too. I like the whole kill/redeem thing in that it's an intensely personal choice - but I feel like it's just too simple. I like Solas, of course I want to redeem him. And people who hate Solas, of course they want to kill him. I want the choice to be more than that. *snip* And this is where I think it's possible the red lyrium and Blight strands of the Dragon Age tapestry might tie in. What if what Solas is planning to do - tear down the Veil - will make it possible to end the Blight? What is worse? The Blight or a world with no Veil? How do you make that choice? That's actually an easy choice for me but mostly because I really want to see what Thedas would be like without the Veil.
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