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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 23, 2020 15:23:08 GMT
So you don’t want realistic then? Not really. I want exemplary. The finest of the finest. I'm not going to roll particularly with a ... what would be a PC term to not get me banned from twitter ... presentably challenged individual. At least, not if it isn't in a "cool" way.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Kabraxal on Dec 23, 2020 15:25:14 GMT
So you don’t want realistic then? Not really. I want exemplary. The finest of the finest. I'm not going to roll particularly with a ... what would be a PC term to not get me banned from twitter ... presentably challenged individual. At least, not if it isn't in a "cool" way. At least you admit there is little realism to the OT then.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 23, 2020 15:43:16 GMT
At least you admit there is little realism to the OT then. I don't consider realism as a must for my escapism. I don't do it for realism reasons.
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Highwayman667
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"In uncertainty, find infinite possibility"
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 522 Likes: 722
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Post by Highwayman667 on Dec 23, 2020 15:57:34 GMT
At least you admit there is little realism to the OT then. I don't consider realism as a must for my escapism. I don't do it for realism reasons. That's good for you, but a game isn't tailored to the tastes of a single person. You don't like realism ? That's fine, but other people do. The rational thing to do is to find a middle ground where everyone can have what they want and still be able to enjoy a great story and a great game. My point was about expectations, if your character, for whatever reason, doesn't look like a Victoria's Secret or Men's Magazine sculpture, then that's perfectly okay. If some of your love interests in the game don't look attractive, that's also perfectly okay. Those are healthy attitudes to promote in a story, which is a good thing that Bioware's always had as foundations for their narratives.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 23, 2020 16:01:21 GMT
That's good for you, but a game isn't tailored to the tastes of a single person The assumption here being that I am the only person that likes to look at attractive people, in a visual story telling medium. I disagree with that notion as well. At least for our main cast.
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Highwayman667
N3
"In uncertainty, find infinite possibility"
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 522 Likes: 722
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Post by Highwayman667 on Dec 23, 2020 16:08:48 GMT
That's good for you, but a game isn't tailored to the tastes of a single person The assumption here being that I am the only person that likes to look at attractive people, in a visual story telling medium. I disagree with that notion as well. At least for our main cast. Oh, the entire community is filled with people who wants every character to be a paragon of beauty. It's a rather unhealthy perception. Still, even if it was a hundred thousand people, even more, it doesn't mean it would be a good decision nor a proper feature that would the serve the story or the gameplay; demand doesn't justify quality.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 23, 2020 16:13:50 GMT
It's a rather unhealthy perception. I don't share that perspective. Still, even if it was a hundred thousand people, even more, it doesn't mean it would be a good decision nor a proper feature that would the serve the story or the gameplay; demand doesn't justify quality. How about sales? It's a luxury product, after all. You need to make it appeal to people and people like to look at pretty things.
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Highwayman667
N3
"In uncertainty, find infinite possibility"
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 522 Likes: 722
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"In uncertainty, find infinite possibility"
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Post by Highwayman667 on Dec 23, 2020 18:14:11 GMT
How about sales? It's a luxury product, after all. You need to make it appeal to people and people like to look at pretty things. Obviously we both want ME5 to succeed financially, but we also want it to tell meaningful stories. If everyone is a sexually idealized character then we can't take the story seriously. Recently I was watching Babylon V (please no spoilers) and part of the effectiveness of the show is how every character looks like normal, regular people: Commander Sinclair is a grey-haired middle aged man, Chief Garibaldi is balding, Lieutenant Ivanova is short. I won't even touch aliens like Londo and G'Kar, which are some of the ugliest depictions of extraterrestrials I think I've ever seen. Naturally of course, there's also attractive people as well, like in any real setting. The show however, like any succesful series, is careful to pick it's actors on their skills and contributions to the story, rather than how appealing they might look on-screen.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 23, 2020 18:48:10 GMT
If everyone is a sexually idealized character then we can't take the story seriously. Why not? Solas was absolutely repulsive and I couldn't take him seriously. Recently I was watching Babylon V (please no spoilers) and part of the effectiveness of the show is how every character looks like normal, regular people: Commander Sinclair is a grey-haired middle aged man, Chief Garibaldi is balding, Lieutenant Ivanova is short. I won't even touch aliens like Londo and G'Kar, which are some of the ugliest depictions of extraterrestrials I think I've ever seen. Naturally of course, there's also attractive people as well, like in any real setting. The show however, like any succesful series, is careful to pick it's actors on their skills and contributions to the story, rather than how appealing they might look on-screen. Video games don't suffer from the same drawback, though, as you can pair any performance with whatever appearance you want.
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Highwayman667
N3
"In uncertainty, find infinite possibility"
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 522 Likes: 722
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Post by Highwayman667 on Dec 23, 2020 19:35:40 GMT
Why not? Solas was absolutely repulsive and I couldn't take him seriously. Video games don't suffer from the same drawback, though, as you can pair any performance with whatever appearance you want. So you would've liked him more if he was pretty ? I get your point but it does affect the stories we want to see in the games. If we want to have meaningful stories then the context for those stories has to be somewhat relatable and realistic; not only is it productive but also healthy that in ME5 you can find people of all walks of life: overweight, short, with weird hair, big noses, one-eyed, and far more.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: ShinobiKillfist
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
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Post by ahglock on Dec 23, 2020 19:50:28 GMT
Why not? Solas was absolutely repulsive and I couldn't take him seriously. Video games don't suffer from the same drawback, though, as you can pair any performance with whatever appearance you want. So you would've liked him more if he was pretty ? I get your point but it does affect the stories we want to see in the games. If we want to have meaningful stories then the context for those stories has to be somewhat relatable and realistic; not only is it productive but also healthy that in ME5 you can find people of all walks of life: overweight, short, with weird hair, big noses, one-eyed, and far more. Pretty people are relatable and realistic and can have meaningful stories as well. I'd be pretty depressed in 2200 if they had FTL, aliens, space magic and still hadn't figured out fat and ugly as things to fix. Fat Goth Chick Batman may sell a bunch of issue 1s as people virtue signal their agreement with fat pride, but issue 2 tanks.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 23, 2020 20:31:50 GMT
So you would've liked him more if he was pretty ? Definitely. I get your point but it does affect the stories we want to see in the games. If we want to have meaningful stories then the context for those stories has to be somewhat relatable and realistic; not only is it productive but also healthy that in ME5 you can find people of all walks of life: overweight, short, with weird hair, big noses, one-eyed, and far more. Variety, sure. But I would probably not be as interested in a rather challenging looking appearance for an LI. There is a difference between something unconventionally beautiful, like Jack and something ugly, like a Vorcha.
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Highwayman667
N3
"In uncertainty, find infinite possibility"
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 522 Likes: 722
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Post by Highwayman667 on Dec 23, 2020 20:49:06 GMT
Pretty people are relatable and realistic and can have meaningful stories as well. I'd be pretty depressed in 2200 if they had FTL, aliens, space magic and still hadn't figured out fat and ugly as things to fix. Fat Goth Chick Batman may sell a bunch of issue 1s as people virtue signal their agreement with fat pride, but issue 2 tanks. I see your point and perfectly understand you, even though "fat and ugly" seems a like a rather mean way to refer to people who are just overweight and not as attractive to you. I'm not a virtue signaling for pointing that out... just in case Still, to make a simple point and close this issue: I'd like for variety to be the norm in ME5. In an immense galaxy filled with a great number of alien species and humans, it's only logical to see different types of people in it.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 23, 2020 21:21:00 GMT
I'd say that making attractive characters doesn't mean they'd be unrealistic. Everyone looking like a supermodel is something different. The only one that I'd say is remotely in the latter's category is Miranda, if we discount the problems with certain facial expression that has little to do with the model. I wouldn't say that the other ME romances were supermodels...and the most popular male one wasn't certainly attractive in the conventional sense.
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Highwayman667
N3
"In uncertainty, find infinite possibility"
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 522 Likes: 722
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"In uncertainty, find infinite possibility"
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Post by Highwayman667 on Dec 23, 2020 21:35:52 GMT
I'd say that making attractive characters doesn't mean they'd be unrealistic. Everyone looking like a supermodel is something different. The only one that I'd say is remotely in the latter's category is Miranda, if we discount the problems with certain facial expression that has little to do with the model. I wouldn't say that the other ME romances were supermodels...and the most popular male one wasn't certainly attractive in the conventional sense. It goes without saying that, whoever the protagonist may be, everyone should be able to choose said character to look attractive if that is what they wanted. My issue is with the characters surrounding said protagonist because I think there's a lot of Bioware fans that are rather shallow in their aesthetic appreciations. Not much of an issue from the developers though, I've always felt they've implicitly understood that point.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 24, 2020 5:22:07 GMT
I didn’t see the Shepard Trilogy characters looking any more attractive than the Andromeda characters.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 24, 2020 8:52:07 GMT
I didn’t see the Shepard Trilogy characters looking any more attractive than the Andromeda characters. I’d say it’s a matter of personal preference. Personally, I found more characters attractive in the trilogy then Andromeda, at least in regards of women, but I’d also say that Cora is to me more attractive then most of the characters in the trilogy behind Miranda and Samara.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 24, 2020 9:33:46 GMT
I didn’t see the Shepard Trilogy characters looking any more attractive than the Andromeda characters. I’d say it’s a matter of personal preference. Personally, I found more characters attractive in the trilogy then Andromeda, at least in regards of women, but I’d also say that Cora is to me more attractive then most of the characters in the trilogy behind Miranda and Samara. And Jack has the most gorgeous face in any Bioware game ever.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 24, 2020 13:30:44 GMT
I’d say it’s a matter of personal preference. Personally, I found more characters attractive in the trilogy then Andromeda, at least in regards of women, but I’d also say that Cora is to me more attractive then most of the characters in the trilogy behind Miranda and Samara. And Jack has the most gorgeous face in any Bioware game ever. That’s fine, I like Jack a lot (and I think that on the face, it’s a toss up between her and Samara) but I’m not big into that many tattooes. I wasn’t considering faces alone. On the topic of Solas that you all discusses before, we should keep in mind that while we he was, most likely, thought as a big, important character going forward and after Inquisition, he wasn’t developed with a romance in mind. Though it’s ironic that, at least in my opinion, his concept art in the war table concept made him look more attractive then the actual game.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 24, 2020 13:59:31 GMT
That’s fine, I like Jack a lot (and I think that on the face, it’s a toss up between her and Samara) but I’m not big into that many tattooes Neither am I. But Jack is a fantastic character, one that we've barely explored in anything other than exposition and has a lot to offer, both in terms of writing and to the setting itself. On the topic of Solas that you all discusses before, we should keep in mind that while we he was, most likely, thought as a big, important character going forward and after Inquisition, he wasn’t developed with a romance in mind. Though it’s ironic that, at least in my opinion, his concept art in the war table concept made him look more attractive then the actual game. For such a powerful being, you'd think he'd have the sense to, at least, cure himself of male pattern baldness. He looks like Bruce Payne, Billy Zane and Arnold Vosloo all had a lovechild together. It creeps me out. Stick some bright blue lipstick on him and I'm getting D&D movie flashbacks.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 24, 2020 14:12:30 GMT
I’d say it’s a matter of personal preference. Personally, I found more characters attractive in the trilogy then Andromeda, at least in regards of women, but I’d also say that Cora is to me more attractive then most of the characters in the trilogy behind Miranda and Samara. And Jack has the most gorgeous face in any Bioware game ever. I didn’t think Miranda, Samara, or Jack were that attractive. Cora was better for sure. As well as many unmentioned characters.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 24, 2020 14:29:13 GMT
I didn’t think Miranda, Samara, or Jack were that attractive I found them plenty attractive, to be honest.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 24, 2020 15:55:47 GMT
That’s fine, I like Jack a lot (and I think that on the face, it’s a toss up between her and Samara) but I’m not big into that many tattooes Neither am I. But Jack is a fantastic character, one that we've barely explored in anything other than exposition and has a lot to offer, both in terms of writing and to the setting itself. On the topic of Solas that you all discusses before, we should keep in mind that while we he was, most likely, thought as a big, important character going forward and after Inquisition, he wasn’t developed with a romance in mind. Though it’s ironic that, at least in my opinion, his concept art in the war table concept made him look more attractive then the actual game. For such a powerful being, you'd think he'd have the sense to, at least, cure himself of male pattern baldness. He looks like Bruce Payne, Billy Zane and Arnold Vosloo all had a lovechild together. It creeps me out. Stick some bright blue lipstick on him and I'm getting D&D movie flashbacks To be clear, I was just referring to physical attractiveness, not their personality. That is a separate situation to what I was referring to, in regards of my personal preferences of different characters. I figure, given the changes from the concept art (which might’ve been a giveaway on his real identity, deep in the game), that they wanted to go for an unassuming look. Given his appearance, I’d have never said Solas was Fen’harel.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 24, 2020 15:57:17 GMT
And Jack has the most gorgeous face in any Bioware game ever. I didn’t think Miranda, Samara, or Jack were that attractive. Cora was better for sure. As well as many unmentioned characters. That just proves the point that it’s mostly a matter of opinion, as I said before.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Dec 24, 2020 16:08:56 GMT
Given his appearance, I’d have never said Solas was Fen’harel. Given his personality, I find it hard to believe he was Fen'harel. He seems to have some serious mental challenges and shortcomings. To be clear, I was just referring to physical attractiveness, not their personality. That is a separate situation to what I was referring to, in regards of my personal preferences of different characters. How about the contrast? A nearly perfect face on an otherwise blemished body. I do like contrast.
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