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Post by oyabun on Oct 6, 2016 23:32:50 GMT
Celine can kill elves just as easly as Gaspard,she only cares about how much she is popular among the nobles,if they think kill elves is good Celine will behave accordingly to not disappoint them. Celene wasn't the one who commissioned papers saying sleeping with elves should be the same as bestiality since elves are no better than animals, the one who openly says that all elves belong in slums, who openly complains he isn't killing Dalish elves, and who is part of a group whose graduation is killing elves. Sorry but Gaspard is a thousand times worse with regards to elves than Celene could ever be. Well at the end of the day the one who burned the elves was Celine not Gaspard whom attitude is in general being a dochbag with everyone not just elves. Plus with what the elves are planning with Solas,doesn't really matter who rule they will be seen as enemies.
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Post by Duke Cameron on Oct 6, 2016 23:42:10 GMT
I've reunited them in the past but prefer to keep Celene in power alone with Florianne becoming my jester because i like her too much to kill her.
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polaris
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Post by polaris on Oct 7, 2016 2:02:10 GMT
I disagree. 1) The truce is just too hard to set up. 2) While no choice is particularly good for the elves, Gaspard is fundamentally a political idiot. He doesn't know how to really play the Game in a society that demands it. By contrast Brialla certainly does....and just because she may have lost control over the Elluvians doesn't mean that everyone in Orlais realizes this. Also before that happens, Brialla would almost surely strengthen her position in other ways. 3) We know 1) and 2) are true because if you do the Brialla+Gaspard ending, by the time Trespasser comes around the Orlesian nobles still grumble that the Emperor is Brialla's puppet, but she hasn't had control over the Elluvians for some time. 4) Finally, the universal truce is just too hard to set up and regarding Elves, both Celene and Gaspard despise the Elves (in their own way). That means with a truce it's two on a weak one (w/r/t the Elves). By contrast Gaspard + Brialla gives the Elves the weakest opponent and thus the best chance. Besides the universal truce is just too hard to set up for what you get...and you pass up too much to do it IMHO. Actually, as the endings stated, the reason why nobody is doing anything against Briala is because the Inquisition is backing her which is still happening until the end of Trespasser. Once the Inquisition is gone, what do you think is going to happen? You don't know the inquisition is going to be gone when you make the decision. Besides to be completely cold about it, it's not my problem. Gaspard is fundamentally stupid; Celene for all her faults (which are many) is not. I don't want Orlais to prosper but I do want it hamstrung so a puppet Gaspard is the way to go. Even if he does eventually shake his chains (by no means a given especially since we know he doesn't as of Trespasser), no one fill forget that he was an Elf's plaything, and thus his potential influence as a political player (even as emperor) will be severely curtained all of which weakens Orlais which IMHO is a good thing.
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our_lady_of_darkness
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Post by our_lady_of_darkness on Oct 7, 2016 15:21:11 GMT
I will actually reunite them tonight for the first time ever in my first time ever Lavellan playthrough I appreciate the way Celene-Briala relationship has been written, the toxic power-play and the general unpredictability of it. Despite the tendency to assume that Celene is more manipulative than her elven partner, I suspect that Briala has learnt her lesson well and might eventually outplay Celene. Whether it would beneficial or not to the elves in Thedas, that's an entirely different question.
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Post by gervaise21 on Oct 7, 2016 20:04:04 GMT
I have to admit that when you reconcile Celene and Briala the way Briala responds to Celene makes me think that she very much has learned her lesson and that on her side at least it is not genuine affection any more but simply playing her in order to get what she wants. People says that Celene was good at playing the game but I think that is largely down to having Briala at her side as her spymaster. When Briala was away in Halamshiral, Celene made mistake after mistake in not realising that Gaspard was engineering getting her out Val Royeaux and into an area where his supporters were strongest. So from that point of view, Briala is the stronger in the partnership.
I don't like any of the three really. Briala was quite happy to let an entire clan of elves be ripped apart by a demon, when they hadn't actually done her any harm and in fact had saved her entire party from sylvans. She was upset with them because they didn't seem concerned with what happened to city elves when actually they were in no position to do anything even if they were. "They let the elves in the alienages burn because the elves in the alienages were not their people". I doubt the clan were even aware that anything was going on in Halamshiral and even if they did, what could they have done about it? A clan of fifty elves, not all of them combatants. It was Celene who actually burned the elves in the alienage and yet Briala prefers to help Celene at the expense of the clan. Even Gaspard conceded that not even elves deserved what was done to them.
The main reason I like putting Briala in charge is that for a short time at least, the vile nobles have to suck it up and take orders from an elf and they do so because they respect the Inquisition and fear my elven Inquisitor. Briala should also note, he is a Dalish elf who cares about all elves. Nothing you do in Inquisition is lasting but placing Briala on the throne and making Leliana Divine, is probably the best result for the elves, since apparently the Divine does still have influence in these things. Of course, if the nobles are idiots, which they very often are, they will revert to making life difficult for the elves after the Inquisition is gone and thus very effectively drive them into the arms of the Dread Wolf. On the other hand, if they are wise, they will continue to support Briala, because I assume by the end of Trespasser she will have learned that it was Solas who killed her pal, Felassan, and thus she will be determined to work against him.
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oyabun
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Post by oyabun on Oct 7, 2016 20:44:33 GMT
I have to admit that when you reconcile Celene and Briala the way Briala responds to Celene makes me think that she very much has learned her lesson and that on her side at least it is not genuine affection any more but simply playing her in order to get what she wants. People says that Celene was good at playing the game but I think that is largely down to having Briala at her side as her spymaster. When Briala was away in Halamshiral, Celene made mistake after mistake in not realising that Gaspard was engineering getting her out Val Royeaux and into an area where his supporters were strongest. So from that point of view, Briala is the stronger in the partnership. I don't like any of the three really. Briala was quite happy to let an entire clan of elves be ripped apart by a demon, when they hadn't actually done her any harm and in fact had saved her entire party from sylvans. She was upset with them because they didn't seem concerned with what happened to city elves when actually they were in no position to do anything even if they were. "They let the elves in the alienages burn because the elves in the alienages were not their people". I doubt the clan were even aware that anything was going on in Halamshiral and even if they did, what could they have done about it? A clan of fifty elves, not all of them combatants. It was Celene who actually burned the elves in the alienage and yet Briala prefers to help Celene at the expense of the clan. Even Gaspard conceded that not even elves deserved what was done to them. The main reason I like putting Briala in charge is that for a short time at least, the vile nobles have to suck it up and take orders from an elf and they do so because they respect the Inquisition and fear my elven Inquisitor. Briala should also note, he is a Dalish elf who cares about all elves. Nothing you do in Inquisition is lasting but placing Briala on the throne and making Leliana Divine, is probably the best result for the elves, since apparently the Divine does still have influence in these things. Of course, if the nobles are idiots, which they very often are, they will revert to making life difficult for the elves after the Inquisition is gone and thus very effectively drive them into the arms of the Dread Wolf. On the other hand, if they are wise, they will continue to support Briala, because I assume by the end of Trespasser she will have learned that it was Solas who killed her pal, Felassan, and thus she will be determined to work against him. I did not played this game,it is possibile to select Briala as ruler?
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Post by polaris on Oct 7, 2016 20:55:35 GMT
I did not played this game,it is possibile to select Briala as ruler? It is sorta-kinda. No you can not make her the actual ruler of Orlais, but you can arrange things so that she is the power behind the throne and her puppet (generally Gaspard) can't change his own socks without her approval, Emperor or not.
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Post by cloud9 on Oct 11, 2016 20:17:19 GMT
Briala is nothing but a fetish and a sex toy to Celene anyways, and Briala is stupid to get back with that racist woman who killed her people and did not shed one tear. Eh @ least I killed the bitch.
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Cantina
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Post by Cantina on Oct 11, 2016 20:29:19 GMT
Honestly all three of them are twats.
But Gaspard is the biggest out of them all. An alcoholic more concerned with brute force and crying sobby tears he lost the throne.
I could not kill Celine because I thought to myself, "What if down the road some how word got out The Inquisition could have saved Celine but chose to let her died instead?" Even Cullen makes a comment towards this.
I just reunite Brialla and Celine, kill the Duchess and let Gaspard be executed. Whatever relationship issues Celine and Brialla have, well not my damn problem.
Have not had a chance to read, "The Masked Empire" but I got the footnotes. Maybe down the road I will have time to do so.
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