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Post by helios969 on May 8, 2018 18:39:36 GMT
But the BSG reboot worked, didn't it? Sure, there were some whiny fans of the old series around, but whiny fans are always with us. Yeah I dunno if "backlash" is even the right word to use here, unless there really were that many people clamoring to relive the grand cheesefest of the original. My thoughts exactly. Who the hell would complain about turning a subpar show with terrible actors and writing and replace it with the opposite of all that? Good grief. My view of any sort of reboot is that if it can be done with a fresh and interesting take, go for it. Those stuck in the past can remain there...no sweat off my back. If it's good there will be no shortage of accolades and people clamoring to play.
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Post by griffith82 on May 8, 2018 19:15:17 GMT
Yeah I dunno if "backlash" is even the right word to use here, unless there really were that many people clamoring to relive the grand cheesefest of the original. My thoughts exactly. Who the hell would complain about turning a subpar show with terrible actors and writing and replace it with the opposite of all that? Good grief. My view of any sort of reboot is that if it can be done with a fresh and interesting take, go for it. Those stuck in the past can remain there...no sweat off my back. If it's good there will be no shortage of accolades and people clamoring to play. I find your faith in the fandom disturbing. Most will not accept that.
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Post by helios969 on May 8, 2018 19:23:01 GMT
My thoughts exactly. Who the hell would complain about turning a subpar show with terrible actors and writing and replace it with the opposite of all that? Good grief. My view of any sort of reboot is that if it can be done with a fresh and interesting take, go for it. Those stuck in the past can remain there...no sweat off my back. If it's good there will be no shortage of accolades and people clamoring to play. I find your faith in the fandom disturbing. Most will not accept that. Given the state of things (or my perception of where we're at) it doesn't really matter what you or I or any of the existing fans want. By the time any reboot could be delivered to market there will be an entirely new generation of gamers to sell to. And frankly, plenty of general scify geeks (like myself) that will come back for a fresh take. I know it sucks that your patronage doesn't really matter in the long run, but it doesn't. If it really did, we'd still have support, we'd have a DLC (or three) by now, and at least hints that MEA2 was in the works. Feel free to go ostrich if it makes you feel better.
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Post by griffith82 on May 8, 2018 19:27:38 GMT
I find your faith in the fandom disturbing. Most will not accept that. Given the state of things (or my perception of where we're at) it doesn't really matter what you or I or any of the existing fans want. By the time any reboot could be delivered to market there will be an entirely new generation of gamers to sell to. And frankly, plenty of general scify geeks (like myself) that will come back for a fresh take. I know it sucks that your patronage doesn't really matter in the long run, but it doesn't. If it really did, we'd still have support, we'd have a DLC (or three) by now, and at least hints that MEA2 was in the works. Feel free to go ostrich if it makes you feel better. I’m not jumping to any conclusions. But I choose to believe that we will get a conclusion. If they reboot it I might give it a chance but I’d not be happy.
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Post by alanc9 on May 8, 2018 20:56:52 GMT
Yeah I dunno if "backlash" is even the right word to use here, unless there really were that many people clamoring to relive the grand cheesefest of the original. My thoughts exactly. Who the hell would complain about turning a subpar show with terrible actors and writing and replace it with the opposite of all that? Good grief. Back in the day there were whole boards dedicated to that. Some still exist. This one was always my favorite. At one point it was set up as a forum, but only the forum creator had posting rights there.
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Post by Phantom on May 8, 2018 21:39:01 GMT
This is just me; a re-telling of the OT with a much darker tone that averts the Humans are Special tropes but have at least have an active organization called, Paragon of Our Kind that believe truly that Humans are bastards tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HumansAreBastards by their assertive behavior towards aliens. Paragon of Our Kind are a human extremely xenophile organization that believes due to the aliens were here on the Citadel before human became a member of the Citadel, that the Aliens have more rights to direct the fate of human and Batarians have a rightful claims the Skyillan verge and they are willing to side with them inorder to get in their good graces. Many members of the Paragons have a thing for the Asari and their religion Siari. Having Paragon of Our Kind from an extremely xenophile bend with anti human tendencies moving into an un-indoctrinated Reaper Cult that happily assist the Reapers to balance out the Milk Way Species to achieve an universal balance. Another organization that is floating in my head, Cabal. The Cabal is an cabal of lesser known Citadel species and non Citadel species to pool their resources and have a massive say on matters within the Citadel matters. Known for their vast wealth due to some of their leadership are volus bankers and buy, sell and trade technology on the Citadel both on the black market and legal channels. Black Talon is a legal merc company that work heavily for the Cabal and known for their work in all terrorities and often recruit members of all species for various jobs.
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Post by Iakus on May 8, 2018 21:41:28 GMT
I remember the backlash with the changes they made to Battlestar to update it for a modern audience, I really think it would make any BioWare backlash we have seen so far be minor if they aren't able to do a 100% recreation of the first games and I don't see how that would be possible with how games never really get released as they were designed for things always seem to be changed or removed. But the BSG reboot worked, didn't it? Sure, there were some whiny fans of the old series around, but whiny fans are always with us. The first two seasons did. Then it got stupid. Sounds kinda familiar...
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Post by alanc9 on May 8, 2018 21:47:28 GMT
*shrugs* As usual, we disagree.
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2018 1:07:21 GMT
These ideas could work for ME-4 or MEA II. Perhaps ME-4 would take Shepard into the galaxy beyond the Omega 4 Relay, after the Reaper War. The crew needs to rescue a race that had been trapped there, or intercede to stop a war - interacting with both sides. For the Paragon he/she would find a peaceful resolution, while the Renegade would deceive one faction and become the supreme dictator in this galaxy quadrant. Just speculating. Not bad. I would be curious how they learned about a species that is trapped beyond the relay. Here's something I posted that could work. Reply to themikefestThanks Mike. To answer your question, I was thinking that an ME4 crew entering back through the Omega Relay would not know what they would encounter (the previous visit was a suicide mission and then they got the hell out of there), much as the MEA crew did not know what they would find after their arrival in the new galaxy. This trip would be an Omega 4 exploration, or a MEA II exploration into a new Andromeda star system, but with very different game ending outcomes. Perhaps in the MW a galaxy race mentions (of course after the Reaper War) that an older race just upped and vanished 1,000 years earlier, and they want to go searching for them; the lost race may be racial 'cousins' to the Salarians, turians, or quarians, kinda like the Vulcans and Romulans were related in the past. The ME4 crew would simply find themselves in the middle of a civil war after passing through the Omega Relay, much as MEA ran into the war between the Angara and the Kett. The difference in this story's ending options are that the P/R plot options would have three very different ending outcomes. For example, by the end of this game the player can choose to either... 1) Prevent the Omega quadrant's civil war from spilling back through the Omega Relay into the Terminus region; Perhaps destroy the Omega Relay? (Sacrifices have to be made to protect the MW! Lol) 2) A paragon acts to resolve the civil war and seek a peaceful resolution for both races (i.e. Get some intel, and then go fight strategic battles to take out assassins, terrorists, and protect civilians from attacks - on both sides of the warring factions; or 3) Allow a Renegade to lie, cheat, and betray one side to bring about their ruin (kinda like allying with a Kett-like race). Maybe perform a double or triple cross on one of the warring races. And, thank you for the link to your March '18 post. I enjoy reading your ideas for a darkspace investigation. Lots of good ideas there, Mike. Your contributions to the NBSN are always well thought out. K
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2018 21:13:16 GMT
Since the most fans -at least I hope so- know the lore by now, I would go for a more free approach in character creation. Meaning finally at least 4 races and not human only. No mmo style but, maybe a bit live services for the companies that push it so hard atm. I am thinking about how Dark Souls handled it. Not intrusive.
The story should be the same. Well not exactly the same, but the Mythology should be there.
Many fans were disappointed about the whole dark matter/energy bait. This could be expanded. The reapers could get another antithesis in form of another race of ancient beings. But this is kind of the problem with DA. Always a fight between two not surrendering forces. Well it is wishful thinking.
Look at some beloved IPs EA crushed. I hope that there will be another ME, but I guess mobile games and maybe the treatment that Metal Gear and Resident Evil are getting, in discount crap games -not all but they were there- is what we can expect, sadly.
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Post by griffith82 on May 10, 2018 18:31:12 GMT
Since the most fans -at least I hope so- know the lore by now, I would go for a more free approach in character creation. Meaning finally at least 4 races and not human only. No mmo style but, maybe a bit live services for the companies that push it so hard atm. I am thinking about how Dark Souls handled it. Not intrusive. The story should be the same. Well not exactly the same, but the Mythology should be there. Many fans were disappointed about the whole dark matter/energy bait. This could be expanded. The reapers could get another antithesis in form of another race of ancient beings. But this is kind of the problem with DA. Always a fight between two not surrendering forces. Well it is wishful thinking. Look at some beloved IPs EA crushed. I hope that there will be another ME, but I guess mobile games and maybe the treatment that Metal Gear and Resident Evil are getting, in discount crap games -not all but they were there- is what we can expect, sadly. Metal Gear I give you. Not RE though. Plus I don’t think they’ll go the route of Mobile only.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2018 18:47:08 GMT
Not the new one, but this abomination
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Post by KaiserShep on May 10, 2018 18:51:53 GMT
Not the new one, but this abomination I can never get enough of Corporate Commander. This review had me in stitches.
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Post by Deleted on May 10, 2018 20:09:43 GMT
Yeah Angry Joe got big with ME.
Straight forward hard working dude. And the temper tantrums are mostly show. He seems more like a laid back Nerd with some bad ass leather jacket and a cool attitude.
Back on topic. I dunno, but when Anthem hits really hard, I doubt Mass Effect would be big on EAs agenda for the next 2 or 3 years. Look at the Star Wars games. I am waiting for a new SW RPG since TOR went f2p and getting not even a good adventure. Only shooter after shooter. What is okay for some. But they are not even good shooters, just good looking ones.
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Post by griffith82 on May 10, 2018 21:41:38 GMT
But the BSG reboot worked, didn't it? Sure, there were some whiny fans of the old series around, but whiny fans are always with us. The first two seasons did. Then it got stupid. Sounds kinda familiar... World must be ending because I agree with you on something.😉
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Post by Basquemercat117 on May 11, 2018 3:25:11 GMT
honestly i only want the endings to be rebooted. Maybe through andromeda they go back in time and back to the milky way and reboot the endings.
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Post by dmc1001 on May 11, 2018 3:43:35 GMT
This is just me; a re-telling of the OT with a much darker tone that averts the Humans are Special tropes but have at least have an active organization called, Paragon of Our Kind that believe truly that Humans are bastards tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HumansAreBastards by their assertive behavior towards aliens. Paragon of Our Kind are a human extremely xenophile organization that believes due to the aliens were here on the Citadel before human became a member of the Citadel, that the Aliens have more rights to direct the fate of human and Batarians have a rightful claims the Skyillan verge and they are willing to side with them inorder to get in their good graces. Many members of the Paragons have a thing for the Asari and their religion Siari. Having Paragon of Our Kind from an extremely xenophile bend with anti human tendencies moving into an un-indoctrinated Reaper Cult that happily assist the Reapers to balance out the Milk Way Species to achieve an universal balance. The only thing I would really change is the length of time the Alliance was part of galactic civilization. Thirty years is way too fast to have one of the strongest fleets out there and to get a seat on the Council. The volus, for all that they're put down for not being physically adept, created the galactic economy and seem to have most of the money. How is that not worth a seat on the Council? I'd have had humanity lose the First Contact War and become a client state of the turians for at least a century. During that time, they could build up their fleet, develop more biotics because there's a lot more time to be exposed to eezo and then, after proving themselves in the battle against Sovereign, they're freed from being a client state and given a seat on the Council. Much more plausible. It would really only affect Ashley's background, unless the Alliance is really still punishing a family a century later. (Then again, the Ryder twins had their careers essentially ended because of Alec working on an AI - never mind that the Alliance was doing the same thing in ME: Revelation and probably on Luna with the "rogue VI".)
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Post by helios969 on May 11, 2018 10:02:12 GMT
Well if we're all presenting our fantasy reboot, I'd want to allow people to feel their original playthroughs were valid, so I'd make the first Prothean beacon we encounter on Eden Prime a Reaper trap that was a simulation of everything that happened before as a way for the Reapers to learn about the operational tactics and decision making processes of the current cycle. I would introduce all new alien companions (since it wouldn't make sense to have Shepard meet characters fabricated in a simulation). A fertile female Krogan bounty hunter who has turned away from her "duty" to reproduce was one decent idea I could come up with (good potential for both internal and external conflict). Probably do all sorts of gender swapping of the original aliens...and definitely include a "surly" Batarian this time around...one not inclined to kiss the Commander's azz. Overall story I'd keep with the appropriate tweaks for coherency and completely redo the ending that eliminates the nonsense. Might go with an "Illusive Woman." Make her less reclusive, super hot (with freaky eyes)...one not opposed to using her feminine wiles to enlist Shepard's assistance. Cerberus less over the top and more about the actual advancement of human interests. Paragon, Renegade, and a 3rd smart azz option for dialogue (but no stupid grayed out conversations due to a lack of points)...would be inclined to have a charisma/persuade mechanism to provide additional options in "key" moments. Probably could go on and on but you get the general idea.
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Post by dmc1001 on May 11, 2018 14:11:17 GMT
honestly i only want the endings to be rebooted. Maybe through andromeda they go back in time and back to the milky way and reboot the endings. What kind of end are you looking for? I choose Destroy every time (except that one time I was curious about Synthesis). Why not just pick that one and not give a damn about what the Catalyst wants? At this point, removing the Catalyst actually requires altering significant portions of the game (anything alluding to it), not to mention the Leviathan DLC discussing the "Intelligence" turning on the Leviathan and Vendetta noticing that the Reapers were servants of the cycles rather than the motivators of it. Changing the ending would take a lot of work.
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Post by Iakus on May 12, 2018 16:32:44 GMT
Would the spaceship crew be younger or older? Would the Reapers still be the threat or be replaced by something else? Would it be darker or more optimistic? If hey rebooted the series:
They should have a clear idea from ME1 where they wanted to take the trilogy, and what sorts of choices and consequences they want to deal with. That's what killed the ME trilogy as well as the BSG reboot for me.
I don't think age of the crew is a factor
Reapers can still be a threat but they should either have a better motivation than "lol conflict" or the motivation should be kept mysterious and never fully addressed at all. You can't just half-*ss cthulhoid monstrosities.
Whether it's darker or optimistic should at least in part be dependent on player choice. Clearly a galaxy-spanning war against immortal alien intelligences needs to have SOME darkness. But the player should be able to determine through their choices just how bad it gets.
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Post by Phantom on May 12, 2018 16:58:08 GMT
a sensible Cerberus storyline that deals with shady underbelly of galactic stage(for example having legit threats against Humanity from internal and external threats) and less lolzy evil and less keystone cop mode. Also able to do experimental project similar to the Larzaus Project but Not large scale enough to develop a navy that could rival the System Alliance in a ridiulous small time schedule presented in ME3 while keeping Mass Effect: Retribution canon.
Volus, Hanar and Elcor with greater exposure both good and bad in relationship to the main game.
Having Shepard tell Anderson both nice or harshly that using Dreams as possible evidence against Saren given that Shepard went thru a tramatic experience with the beacon and telling Anderson that the dreams could mean anything and possiblity un-related to the task at hand.
Also a greater and more detail quest line that involves exposing Saren outside of a recording.
A Rescue Mission by a Cerberus Agent to recover Shepard on a Collector Ship and handing a bad injured Shepard to Miranda after he slips into a deep almost a death like coma. When I say a bad injured Shepard I mean, Nightmare inducing injuries(both internal and external) to justify extensive reconstructive surgery by Miranda Lawson and her team. Converting Shepard into a Super-Soldier to face the Collectors and the Reapers.
Making System Alliance a reasonable powerful organization for human but not beyond the scopes of other Races. In short, having Aliens doing what they do best, should be equal to or greater than Humans. Example, Asari making better biotic implants and amps for all species would be a part of their markets. Volus as successful business owners and working with various races to make more money. So a Volus would be a business partner with several people will not be out of left field. also owning several different stocks in companies thru out the galaxy.
More Plot lines with Reaper Sleeper agents within various organization within canon. If Henry Lawson gets more screen time, make him a villain with good publicity while keeping his sociopathic tendencies hidden from view.
Liara with a good balance of military commando training and historian and biotics.
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Post by themikefest on May 12, 2018 17:10:38 GMT
I haven't seen the rebooted version of Battlestar Galactic. Did watch the original series when it came out in 1978. Wasn't bad. I like Lorne Greene. I remember him from the tv series Bonanza
Oh yeah, reboot? I wouldn't complain if Bioware chose to reboot the trilogy. I would keep the reapers, but not have the reason why they did what they did. Have Harbinger, ASSUMING DIRECT CONTROL, take on a bigger role. Even include a mission that goes to darkspace. Either way, if they choose to reboot, I'm sure they'll come up with whatever they want to do that will fit the story they want to tell.
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Post by alanc9 on May 13, 2018 16:18:30 GMT
nuBSG is on Hulu -- used to be on Netflix, but it got pulled sometime back. If you don't stream, any decent library system would have the DVD sets. It's tonally very different from the original show, which may or may not work for you.
If they're going to rewrite the Reapers for a reboot, they should decide what they're trying to do before deciding how they do it. That was a big problem with the trilogy, ME1 in particular.
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Post by dmc1001 on May 13, 2018 17:05:30 GMT
nuBSG is on Hulu -- used to be on Netflix, but it got pulled sometime back. If you don't stream, any decent library system would have the DVD sets. It's tonally very different from the original show, which may or may not work for you. If they're going to rewrite the Reapers for a reboot, they should decide what they're trying to do before deciding how they do it. That was a big problem with the trilogy, ME1 in particular. I loved BSG as a kid but enjoyed nuBSG at least as much. Gave a new and compelling difference with the Cylons. I'm having a hard time seeing the Reapers rehashed in a way that doesn't seem repetitive. If they remain uber powerful then their's not much difference. The only thing I could really see is the motivation behind the actions of the Reapers. If they followed up on the dark energy plotline, rather than stick to "finding a solution" to organic/synthetic warring so that the Leviathan can once again dominate the galaxy without that pesky problem of servants (aka tribute) being killed off by synthetics. If, instead, we go for the dark energy, and have the Reapers going after races who manipulate it and make stars unstable, we've got something. It completely changes the motivations of the Reapers, doesn't make them seem so bad (and they are bad in the current iteration, I don't give a shit their motivations) and maybe the end goal is finding a way to prevent damage to the galaxy from self-destructing and that's how we end the cycles. The Reapers then retreat to dark space, or maybe even become dormant since they've succeeded in their goal. Alternately, the Reapers actually become the tech itself, thus eliminating them as a future threat permanently.
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alanc9
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alanc9
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Post by alanc9 on May 13, 2018 19:12:12 GMT
The main conceptual problem with the dark energy plot was that it doesn't map well onto the Reapers' actions. Their idea of preventing later races from using this destructive power is to give it to them? They're looking for different approaches by giving out the same one to every cycle? I don't think this is insuperable, though; all that really needs to go away is the Reapers deliberately leaving one cycle's ruins around for other races to discover. It's OK for them to not bother to clean up Prothean, etc., ruins in systems without a next-cycle species, since that cycle can't discover such ruins without independently reinventing the mass effect drive. The time between cycles should also be shortened. It's stupid for the Reapers to wait 50,000 years between iterations of their experiment. After suppressing a failed cycle, they should give some basic technologies like agriculture to candidates for the next cycle before withdrawing.
It's still not clear why the Reapers wait so long to come back after races discover the mass effect, though. I suppose that depends on what a success-condition for their experiment would look like. I've got nothing.
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