crusty
N3
Righteous Paragon of Truth and Justice
Posts: 776 Likes: 3,195
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Post by crusty on Sept 7, 2016 14:25:54 GMT
The Courier is one man. Not a demigod. It's all about the factions. It's their vision of the Mojave. It's their resources and personal. It's their ambitions and greed that drive armies to clash not the actions of a single person. It's how it should be. The Courier is basically designed as the pebble that starts the avalanche. Now, how big of a pebble you are is up to you and your decisions. But the story is very deliberately setup to have the player as the agent of change. Now, Bethesda's Fallout games are done similarly but the setup is very different. The player in Bethesda games is designed as this sort of messianic figure. On one hand, this seems like a good thing because the player character is always at the centre of what's going on. The problem is that the protagonist is not given a genuine stake in the events of the story. You have a family, but you're not given the time to get to know them. Or interact with them in a meaningful way. They're plot points for YOUR GRAND EPIC STORY. You find it hard to care about the events in Boston because the player character feels detatched from it. This is somewhat true for New Vegas, in that the Courier as that pebble might lack narrative grounding in the story (Why me? Why should my character care?). But your range of actions and ways to interact and solve quests are much more varied, involving and have much more consequences. So by taking a more active role in how you accomplish your goals, the emotional connection is made too. A side effect of this, is (temporarily) making skill selection important, giving the player a real sense of roleplay and character building. You know, RPG stuff. Making a game an RPG goes beyond just "rising numbers". What's important is how they're used in a game. Bethesda hasn't really understood those ideas since Morrowind, if they ever did. They can create a technically more proficient, nicer looking game with better shooting mechanics and all. But it lacks a lot of what the clunky and outdated New Vegas has in spades.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Jade Empire
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Post by Panda on Sept 7, 2016 14:27:55 GMT
I might be in minority, but I actually really like FO4's main story. I found it pretty touching, liked characters in it (Kellogg, Father- as well as followers) even got teary-eyed at the end ^^
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kraidy
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 117 Likes: 164
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by kraidy on Sept 7, 2016 15:01:01 GMT
I wold be less harsh on FO4 if it even had one quest as complex as stuff like Beyond the beef from NV.
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Post by flyingsquirrel on Sept 7, 2016 16:02:33 GMT
Yeah, that's part of the problem with FO4 - there are plenty of potentially interesting characters and locations, but most of them have problems that boil down to "raiders, super mutants, and feral ghouls are bothering us." There was the town that was an Institute front where people were disappearing or something like that, and the trip through Kellogg's memories was a neat concept, but most of the time you were just fighting enemies who had no agenda or personality besides "kill anything that moves."
In FO3 you had the Arefu/Family situation where you could negotiate peace between the two, the Antagonizer and the robot guy to be talked down, and the various personal subplots in Megaton and Rivet City, and even the main quest gave you some meaningful choices and wasn't just about shooting. FONV was frequently pretty light on combat with more emphasis on "detective work" and dealing with the factions, and when you did have to fight (e.g. in the vault with the hostile plants), it still led you to characters with more to say than "thanks, here are some caps."
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by flyingsquirrel on Sept 7, 2016 16:03:34 GMT
This is also where I wonder what goes into beta testing and quality control. Did nobody tell Bethesda that all of Preston's "here's another settlement that needs help" quests were annoying and tiresome until the game actually game out?
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House Targaryen
N5
The night is dark and full of terrors, but the fire burns them all away.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: gscott7833
Prime Posts: 1,584
Posts: 4,535 Likes: 10,214
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House Targaryen
The night is dark and full of terrors, but the fire burns them all away.
4,535
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thehound
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
gscott7833
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Post by House Targaryen on Sept 7, 2016 16:08:20 GMT
Thought I would take on Nuka World at level 15. Already died a couple of times. I'm out of my league. That Nuka Galaxy looks like it would have been a fun ride.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 7, 2016 16:28:56 GMT
Thought I would take on Nuka World at level 15. Already died a couple of times. I'm out of my league. That Nuka Galaxy looks like it would have been a fun ride. I believe it was stated that the recommended level for starting Nuka-World is 30. Though that's cool that you can start it at any time. I may do that in the new playthrough I'm planning so I can get some stuff for the early game.
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Post by KingTony on Sept 7, 2016 23:30:51 GMT
God. Damn. It. I have a problem in my load order that's making the game crash whenever I finish taking over Nuka World and talk to Gage. At first I thought it was my save game, so I loaded up a new character and cheated to level 30 to try again, but the same thing happened again.
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kraidy
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 117 Likes: 164
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by kraidy on Sept 7, 2016 23:54:07 GMT
Could be one of your mods is not patched to work with Nuka World and is causing a nasty error. That happen to me with Dawnguard once because I had a one that affected trainers (would always crash soon as I entered the castle)
Sadly happens often.
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Post by KingTony on Sept 8, 2016 0:44:50 GMT
Could be one of your mods is not patched to work with Nuka World and is causing a nasty error. That happen to me with Dawnguard once because I had a one that affected trainers (would always crash soon as I entered the castle) Sadly happens often. I'm gonna look through and see what I have, if I can't figure it out I may share what I'm using here.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 8, 2016 3:31:15 GMT
God. Damn. It. I have a problem in my load order that's making the game crash whenever I finish taking over Nuka World and talk to Gage. At first I thought it was my save game, so I loaded up a new character and cheated to level 30 to try again, but the same thing happened again. That's a well-known glitch, and it is happening to people with and without mods. A lot of people are having him either not finish the conversation or the game crashing as you have it. Hopefully they patch it soon.
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Post by KingTony on Sept 8, 2016 6:31:44 GMT
God. Damn. It. I have a problem in my load order that's making the game crash whenever I finish taking over Nuka World and talk to Gage. At first I thought it was my save game, so I loaded up a new character and cheated to level 30 to try again, but the same thing happened again. That's a well-known glitch, and it is happening to people with and without mods. A lot of people are having him either not finish the conversation or the game crashing as you have it. Hopefully they patch it soon. I ended up just reinstalling the DLC. Fixed it right up.
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kraidy
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 117 Likes: 164
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by kraidy on Sept 8, 2016 21:33:46 GMT
Typical Bethesda.
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BountyhunterGER
N2
Trying to be more active.. We'll see how this goes. - This went well..
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR
Origin: BountyhunterGER
PSN: BountyhunterGER
Posts: 231 Likes: 456
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Trying to be more active.. We'll see how this goes. - This went well..
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Post by BountyhunterGER on Sept 9, 2016 15:34:54 GMT
If someone owns Fallout 4 on the PS4 and is interested in using mods (which could already be implemented according to bethesda) this might interest you too: PS4 Mod Update After months of discussion with Sony, we regret to say that while we have long been ready to offer mod support on PlayStation 4, Sony has informed us they will not approve user mods the way they should work: where users can do anything they want for either Fallout 4 or Skyrim Special Edition. Like you, we are disappointed by Sony’s decision given the considerable time and effort we have put into this project, and the amount of time our fans have waited for mod support to arrive. We consider this an important initiative and we hope to find other ways user mods can be available for our PlayStation audience. However, until Sony will allow us to offer proper mod support for PS4, that content for Fallout 4 and Skyrim on PlayStation 4 will not be available. We will provide an update if and when this situation changes. bethesda.net/#en/events/game/ps4-mod-update/2016/09/09/199
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House Targaryen
N5
The night is dark and full of terrors, but the fire burns them all away.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: gscott7833
Prime Posts: 1,584
Posts: 4,535 Likes: 10,214
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The night is dark and full of terrors, but the fire burns them all away.
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thehound
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Post by House Targaryen on Sept 9, 2016 16:18:36 GMT
I haven't been here much this past week, too busy playing Nuka World. I like exploring that place. I like Nuka Cola because it reminds me of Coke Cola and I collect Coke Cola memorabilia when finances allow.
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Post by SofaJockey on Sept 9, 2016 16:59:31 GMT
If someone owns Fallout 4 on the PS4 and is interested in using mods (which could already be implemented according to bethesda) this might interest you too: PS4 Mod Update After months of discussion with Sony, we regret to say that while we have long been ready to offer mod support on PlayStation 4, Sony has informed us they will not approve user mods the way they should work: where users can do anything they want for either Fallout 4 or Skyrim Special Edition. Like you, we are disappointed by Sony’s decision given the considerable time and effort we have put into this project, and the amount of time our fans have waited for mod support to arrive. We consider this an important initiative and we hope to find other ways user mods can be available for our PlayStation audience. However, until Sony will allow us to offer proper mod support for PS4, that content for Fallout 4 and Skyrim on PlayStation 4 will not be available. We will provide an update if and when this situation changes. bethesda.net/#en/events/game/ps4-mod-update/2016/09/09/199Yep, commiserations to PS4 players, that's a great shame...
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BountyhunterGER
N2
Trying to be more active.. We'll see how this goes. - This went well..
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR
Origin: BountyhunterGER
PSN: BountyhunterGER
Posts: 231 Likes: 456
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Trying to be more active.. We'll see how this goes. - This went well..
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR
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Post by BountyhunterGER on Sept 9, 2016 17:53:50 GMT
If someone owns Fallout 4 on the PS4 and is interested in using mods (which could already be implemented according to bethesda) this might interest you too: PS4 Mod Update After months of discussion with Sony, we regret to say that while we have long been ready to offer mod support on PlayStation 4, Sony has informed us they will not approve user mods the way they should work: where users can do anything they want for either Fallout 4 or Skyrim Special Edition. Like you, we are disappointed by Sony’s decision given the considerable time and effort we have put into this project, and the amount of time our fans have waited for mod support to arrive. We consider this an important initiative and we hope to find other ways user mods can be available for our PlayStation audience. However, until Sony will allow us to offer proper mod support for PS4, that content for Fallout 4 and Skyrim on PlayStation 4 will not be available. We will provide an update if and when this situation changes. bethesda.net/#en/events/game/ps4-mod-update/2016/09/09/199Yep, commiserations to PS4 players, that's a great shame... Thinking about it again it would have been a shame either way. I'm 100% sure that mods if they came to PS4 they would disable achievements for the game (They do in steam and I'm sure most PS4 people want to keep their achievemnts). Which is quite funny if the only mod you are using is something that fixes bethesdas buggy games. It's not funny.. it's a I like that gif
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 10, 2016 1:15:56 GMT
Thinking about it again it would have been a shame either way. I'm 100% sure that mods if they came to PS4 they would disable achievements for the game (They do in steam and I'm sure most PS4 people want to keep their achievemnts). Which is quite funny if the only mod you are using is something that fixes bethesdas buggy games. Well, I do know that the mods on Xbox shut down the achievements since it gives you that warning. Then again, there are mods for Xbox that let you get achievements while using mods so people would have figured it out for Playstation.
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panda
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Jade Empire
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Post by Panda on Sept 10, 2016 7:49:37 GMT
If someone owns Fallout 4 on the PS4 and is interested in using mods (which could already be implemented according to bethesda) this might interest you too: PS4 Mod Update After months of discussion with Sony, we regret to say that while we have long been ready to offer mod support on PlayStation 4, Sony has informed us they will not approve user mods the way they should work: where users can do anything they want for either Fallout 4 or Skyrim Special Edition. Like you, we are disappointed by Sony’s decision given the considerable time and effort we have put into this project, and the amount of time our fans have waited for mod support to arrive. We consider this an important initiative and we hope to find other ways user mods can be available for our PlayStation audience. However, until Sony will allow us to offer proper mod support for PS4, that content for Fallout 4 and Skyrim on PlayStation 4 will not be available. We will provide an update if and when this situation changes. bethesda.net/#en/events/game/ps4-mod-update/2016/09/09/199Saw it already on tumblr.. and it sucks. Sony is making mistake here, if they don't allow and support modding, then lot of players will likely change on platforms that do. Also does it only sound like that to me, or is Bethesda throwing Sony under the bus? They sound quite accusatory (and it's working)
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Post by SofaJockey on Sept 10, 2016 11:17:30 GMT
If someone owns Fallout 4 on the PS4 and is interested in using mods (which could already be implemented according to bethesda) this might interest you too: PS4 Mod Update After months of discussion with Sony, we regret to say that while we have long been ready to offer mod support on PlayStation 4, Sony has informed us they will not approve user mods the way they should work: where users can do anything they want for either Fallout 4 or Skyrim Special Edition. Like you, we are disappointed by Sony’s decision given the considerable time and effort we have put into this project, and the amount of time our fans have waited for mod support to arrive. We consider this an important initiative and we hope to find other ways user mods can be available for our PlayStation audience. However, until Sony will allow us to offer proper mod support for PS4, that content for Fallout 4 and Skyrim on PlayStation 4 will not be available. We will provide an update if and when this situation changes. bethesda.net/#en/events/game/ps4-mod-update/2016/09/09/199Saw it already on tumblr.. and it sucks. Sony is making mistake here, if they don't allow and support modding, then lot of players will likely change on platforms that do. Also does it only sound like that to me, or is Bethesda throwing Sony under the bus? They sound quite accusatory (and it's working) Sounds like a 'last resort' move to me. If weeks(months) of negotiation have got nowhere, sounds like Bethesda were no longer prepared to 'cover' for Sony.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Sifr on Sept 10, 2016 12:17:01 GMT
I can understand it as not wanting to potentially risk being sued for having copyrighted material from other companies (such as Star Wars Lightsaber mods), but for Sony to remove all mod support entirely seems like a drastic overreaction and a major step too far?
Glad to see that Bethesda are supporting the modding community in this.
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kraidy
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Posts: 117 Likes: 164
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kraidy
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by kraidy on Sept 10, 2016 18:15:57 GMT
Between the GB limit plus certain mod type restrictions on xbox one along with achievements disabled(has that been changed?) and Sony being an asshat , I can't see other companies trying to do mod support now.
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House Targaryen
N5
The night is dark and full of terrors, but the fire burns them all away.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: gscott7833
Prime Posts: 1,584
Posts: 4,535 Likes: 10,214
inherit
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House Targaryen
The night is dark and full of terrors, but the fire burns them all away.
4,535
August 2016
thehound
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by House Targaryen on Sept 11, 2016 19:54:52 GMT
Preston seems to be bent out of shape because I helped the Nuka World raiders. Guess that means no romance. Heart not broken.
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Praise the Justicat!
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Post by Pounce de León on Sept 12, 2016 12:42:29 GMT
Saw it already on tumblr.. and it sucks. Sony is making mistake here, if they don't allow and support modding, then lot of players will likely change on platforms that do. Also does it only sound like that to me, or is Bethesda throwing Sony under the bus? They sound quite accusatory (and it's working) Sounds like a 'last resort' move to me. If weeks(months) of negotiation have got nowhere, sounds like Bethesda were no longer prepared to 'cover' for Sony. What is Sony's motive? They fear nude stuff being distributed?
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Jade Empire
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Post by Panda on Sept 12, 2016 14:07:04 GMT
I finished Nuka World DLC. It was somewhat fun, but I didn't want to lose Minutemen and Preston so I went with "Open Season" approach when I couldn't go further with Raider quests. Ending was quite lackluster that way, I guess Bethesda just rushed something for those who didn't want to play Raider. Oh well, at least new clothing stuff from Raiders is aesthetically pretty pleasing.
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