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Post by Beregond5 on Mar 25, 2017 21:54:32 GMT
To balance out my negativity, Anders breaking Idunna's compulsion is kinda sexy. I wish Merril got the option. She has the option, actually; I often take her with me in that quest.
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Post by phoray on Mar 25, 2017 22:08:02 GMT
Beregond5Oh neat! It must be that Anders takes Precedence over her. ^^ Speaking of Anders, Act of Mercy Quest, you agree to help the mages for Ser Thrask. And there is a scene dedicated to Anders just turning his head and smiling at you. I was like "Awwwww."
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Post by Beregond5 on Mar 25, 2017 22:11:14 GMT
Beregond5 Oh neat! It must be that Anders takes Precedence over her. ^^ Speaking of Anders, Act of Mercy Quest, you agree to help the mages for Ser Thrask. And there is a scene dedicated to Anders just turning his head and smiling at you. I was like "Awwwww." I love that part. He looks positively adorable there.
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Post by Catilina on Mar 25, 2017 22:45:56 GMT
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Post by phoray on Mar 25, 2017 23:11:39 GMT
Bartrand: "3?! 4?! entrances into the Deep Roads? Where did you get this?" Anders: "A Wizard did it." Geez, is Sarcastic Hawke rubbing off on him a little?
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Post by phoray on Mar 26, 2017 2:44:20 GMT
I do appreciate how passionately he argues for the Sibling to be made into a Warden.
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Post by Catilina on Mar 26, 2017 2:50:18 GMT
I do appreciate how passionately he argues for the Sibling to be made into a Warden. He's passionate in everything. Even when a good boy, and even when become an asshole. Not very moderate...
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Apr 2, 2017 2:35:11 GMT
Catilina that Easter egg, where is it/how did you get it? I haven't seen it... Figures I manage to find other ones but not Anders'.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 2, 2017 2:50:40 GMT
Catilina that Easter egg, where is it/how did you get it? I haven't seen it... Figures I manage to find other ones but not Anders'. Not mine, I didn't see these yet in game.
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Apr 6, 2017 20:06:04 GMT
I found that Easter Egg and I'm annoyed I peeked, because now it wasn't a surprise. :srs: But I thought it might've been something I missed early on... No spoiler details, only when you see it (for those curious): Post-campaign. At any rate, it did surprisingly make me smile. Like, it's cheeky and all, but... idk I love Anders so :heh:
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2017 1:33:59 GMT
Oh, no, I have not seen it. I missed Anders' mail... now I will read every piece of mail thoroughly on the second pt.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 9, 2017 11:33:23 GMT
I just found this scene among my videos (Act 2, Qunari war):
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Post by ComedicSociopathy on Apr 16, 2017 20:31:25 GMT
This made me LOL.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 16, 2017 22:53:35 GMT
It's just nice:
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Post by aimingtolove on Apr 17, 2017 0:11:07 GMT
So I've read bits and pieces of this thread but apologize in advance for asking a question that's probably been covered 100% over on here...
I'm planning on finally doing a Templar-siding-playthrough and am considering rivalmancing Anders since I generally friendship romance him as a mage (siding with mages throughout). Is a rivalmance with him equally rewarding/ punishing? Or is it just plain abusive and over-the-top (more so than his friendship romance)?
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 2:21:24 GMT
So I've read bits and pieces of this thread but apologize in advance for asking a question that's probably been covered 100% over on here...
I'm planning on finally doing a Templar-siding-playthrough and am considering rivalmancing Anders since I generally friendship romance him as a mage (siding with mages throughout). Is a rivalmance with him equally rewarding/ punishing? Or is it just plain abusive and over-the-top (more so than his friendship romance)? At the Templar side, I think, the rivalry with him inevitable, but I'm not sure, because with Fenris the friendship easy also as hard-line pro-mage. But I think, in Anders' case this is quite unbelievable. So: according to me, the rivalry romance with Anders is just about the pure sexual attraction. Perhaps it sounds rude, but there are two people, who not only don't like each other's views, but they did not live with it because of enemies of each others. Anders isn't able to support Templars, until he has himself, so before can force him to support the Templars and turn against the mages, he needs to refuse everything, what he believed from his age of 12 years, when the Templars arrested him. And I spoke about only Anders yet, not about Justice. Justice will not disappear just because Hawke wants it. This is what about the rivalry: crush him, and take away his faith, his broken friendship with Justice, and everything what was important in his life, for what? For a wo/man, who only wants to control him? When Anders rivalry with Hawke, Anders rivalry also with Justice and himself. Okay, the love is blind. But sure, that this is love? 7 years pure disagreement, rejection, and questioning? I saw videos. This is interesting, perhaps more than the friendship path (shows more from Anders' passion toward his goal and Justice's change), but I was never to able it. I don't want to see him as a miserable, broken man, who lost everything and don't want anything just die. Ugh, I'm so dramatic! But this is only me. Someone argues that Hawke just wants to "fix" him, and take away him from this "demon". But he's a man, not a broken car, and Justice (who probably still spirit) already a part of him. Many people think, that the rivalry with him is beautiful, and the rivalry is the only way with him, if Hawke wants to save him from Justice, and steer him to the "right way". I'm not among them. But just feel free to ask, this is a romance thread, and rivalry romance still exists with him, just as with the others.
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Post by aimingtolove on Apr 17, 2017 2:56:23 GMT
So I've read bits and pieces of this thread but apologize in advance for asking a question that's probably been covered 100% over on here...
I'm planning on finally doing a Templar-siding-playthrough and am considering rivalmancing Anders since I generally friendship romance him as a mage (siding with mages throughout). Is a rivalmance with him equally rewarding/ punishing? Or is it just plain abusive and over-the-top (more so than his friendship romance)?
At the Templar side, the rivalry with him inevitable. So: I think, the rivalry romance with Anders is just about the pure sexual attraction. Perhaps it's sounds cruel, but there are two people, who not only don't like each other's views, but they did not live with it because of enemies of each other's. Anders doesn't able to support Templars, until he has himself, so before can force him to support the Templars and turn against the mages, he needs to refuse everything, what he believed from his age of 12 years, when the Templars arrested him. And I spoke about only Anders yet, not about Justice. Justice will not disappear just because Hawke wants it. This is what about the rivalry: crush him, and take away his faith, his broken friendship with Justice, and everything what was important in his life, for what? For a wo/man, who only wants to control him? When Anders rivalry with Hawke, Anders rivalry also with Justice and himself. Okay, the love is blind. But sure, that this is love? 7 years pure rejection and questioning? I saw videos. This is interesting, perhaps more than the friendship path (shows more from Anders' passion toward his goal and Justice's change), but I was never to able it. I don't want to see him as a miserable, broken man, who lost everything and don't want anything just die. Ugh, I'm so dramatic! And this is only me. Someone argues that Hawke just wants to fix him, and take away him from this "demon". But he's not a broken car, and Justice already his a part of him. Many people think, that the rivalry with him is beautiful. I'm not among them. Thanks for your response! I understand where you're coming from, and seeing as how I absolutely love Anders and generally go the friendship romance route, I actually doubt my ability to get through the rivalmance without feeling like a heaping pile of trash by its end. I really like Anders' romance, more so than any other romance I've played in the game (though Fenris' rivalmance and friendship romance come pretty close).. and even though I'll be siding with the Templars on a new playthrough, I'm hoping I'll be able to romance Anders and somehow feel like the romance means as much taking a rivalry stance as it did/ does while taking the friendship one.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 3:04:13 GMT
At the Templar side, the rivalry with him inevitable. So: I think, the rivalry romance with Anders is just about the pure sexual attraction. Perhaps it's sounds cruel, but there are two people, who not only don't like each other's views, but they did not live with it because of enemies of each other's. Anders doesn't able to support Templars, until he has himself, so before can force him to support the Templars and turn against the mages, he needs to refuse everything, what he believed from his age of 12 years, when the Templars arrested him. And I spoke about only Anders yet, not about Justice. Justice will not disappear just because Hawke wants it. This is what about the rivalry: crush him, and take away his faith, his broken friendship with Justice, and everything what was important in his life, for what? For a wo/man, who only wants to control him? When Anders rivalry with Hawke, Anders rivalry also with Justice and himself.
Okay, the love is blind. But sure, that this is love? 7 years pure rejection and questioning?
I saw videos. This is interesting, perhaps more than the friendship path (shows more from Anders' passion toward his goal and Justice's change), but I was never to able it. I don't want to see him as a miserable, broken man, who lost everything and don't want anything just die.
Ugh, I'm so dramatic! And this is only me. Someone argues that Hawke just wants to fix him, and take away him from this "demon". But he's not a broken car, and Justice already his a part of him. Many people think, that the rivalry with him is beautiful. I'm not among them. Thanks for your response! I understand where you're coming from, and seeing as how I absolutely love Anders and generally go the friendship romance route, I actually doubt my ability to get through the rivalmance without feeling like a heaping pile of trash by its end. I really like Anders' romance, more so than any other romance I've played in the game (though Fenris' rivalmance and friendship romance come pretty close).. and even though I'll be siding with the Templars on a new playthrough, I'm hoping I'll be able to romance Anders and somehow feel like the romance means as much taking a rivalry stance as it did/ does while taking the friendship one. Ofc, try it, just ignore me, I never played pro-templar Hawke, only I have one playthrough with Templar end, for this stupid Carver and achievement, but I felt bad... The rivalry with Anders has interesting information about him and Justice. But very sad. Probably, if Hawke don't kill him, he commit suicide, or lose himself, and becomes Abomination finally. (I also liked Fenris rivaly, but this is not same, nor even similar than Anders. Fenris wants to get rid of his hatred, Anders doesn't want to get rid of his beliefs. And Fenris break up until he able to love relationship, and when he able to continue, the rivalry already doesn't exist – as I see.)
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Post by phoray on Apr 17, 2017 21:57:31 GMT
So I've read bits and pieces of this thread but apologize in advance for asking a question that's probably been covered 100% over on here...
I'm planning on finally doing a Templar-siding-playthrough and am considering rivalmancing Anders since I generally friendship romance him as a mage (siding with mages I throughout). Is a rivalmance with him equally rewarding/ punishing? Or is it just plain abusive and over-the-top (more so than his friendship romance)?
I don't find it abusive- because you can rival him in non mean ways.. In a way, you're helping him maintain his pre justice self. He is more at war with Justice.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 22:11:04 GMT
So I've read bits and pieces of this thread but apologize in advance for asking a question that's probably been covered 100% over on here...
I'm planning on finally doing a Templar-siding-playthrough and am considering rivalmancing Anders since I generally friendship romance him as a mage (siding with mages I throughout). Is a rivalmance with him equally rewarding/ punishing? Or is it just plain abusive and over-the-top (more so than his friendship romance)?
I don't find it abusive- because you can rival him in non mean ways.. In a way, you're helping him maintain his pre justice self. He is more at war with Justice. And this war will kill Anders slowly and painfully, and help to Justice to kill Anders, and lose his purpose and finally to turns into demon. But this probably can be prevented, if Hawke supports the mages finally. But if Hawke supports the Templars, we can say, that this relationship would be healthy. Not to mention, that Anders suffers during this whole love relationship, except in the bed... so: this is about the pure sex, not more. Summa summarum: on mage side, this is an unnecessary torture, perhaps from Hawke's good will, but rather Hawke's desire for dominance... At Templar side inevitable constant suffering, and Hawke's desire for dominance. Nice drama, but I think, this isn't a love.
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Post by phoray on Apr 17, 2017 22:23:57 GMT
I don't find it abusive- because you can rival him in non mean ways.. In a way, you're helping him maintain his pre justice self. He is more at war with Justice. And this war will kill Anders slowly and painfully, and help to Justice to kill Anders, and lose his purpose and finally to turns into demon. But this probably can be prevented, if Hawke supports the mages finally. But if Hawke supports the Templars, we can say, that this relationship would be healthy. Not to mention, that Anders suffers during this whole love relationship, except in the bed... so: this is about the pure sex, not more. There is nothing in game to support the idea that Justice will kill Anders. Or that Justice would become a Demon. You're either helping them merge, and becoming one more seamlessly, or you're helping maintain their individuality. Two minds are not meant to live as one. I also think there are more shades of grey to being a Templar Leaning Hawke then you give credit for in this reply. I can honestly believe mages should be in Towers and still not agree that they should be made Tranquil at the drop of a hat or murdered in cold blood at the final choice.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 22:36:31 GMT
And this war will kill Anders slowly and painfully, and help to Justice to kill Anders, and lose his purpose and finally to turns into demon. But this probably can be prevented, if Hawke supports the mages finally. But if Hawke supports the Templars, we can say, that this relationship would be healthy. Not to mention, that Anders suffers during this whole love relationship, except in the bed... so: this is about the pure sex, not more. There is nothing in game to support the idea that Justice will kill Anders. Or that Justice would become a Demon. You're either helping them merge, and becoming one more seamlessly, or you're helping maintain their individuality. Two minds are not meant to live as one. I also think there are more shades of grey to being a Templar Leaning Hawke then you give credit for in this reply. I can honestly believe mages should be in Towers and still not agree that they should be made Tranquil at the drop of a hat or murdered in cold blood at the final choice. They already merged, and they still have independent thoughts, even in friendship. This is just an illusion, that Hawke is able to influence the process. They are already one. This is the starting point. And Anders will die. The battle kiss at the Templar side is a farewell kiss. Anders is clear. Yes, this is about the dominance. But not only in sex. Hawke wants to rule over Anders thoughts. If Hawke believes the Circle, then believes the Tranquility. At the moment, in Kirkwall the Circle and the Tranquility one and the same. Only a fool can not see or who do not want to see.
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Post by phoray on Apr 17, 2017 22:43:05 GMT
There is nothing in game to support the idea that Justice will kill Anders. Or that Justice would become a Demon. You're either helping them merge, and becoming one more seamlessly, or you're helping maintain their individuality. Two minds are not meant to live as one. I also think there are more shades of grey to being a Templar Leaning Hawke then you give credit for in this reply. I can honestly believe mages should be in Towers and still not agree that they should be made Tranquil at the drop of a hat or murdered in cold blood at the final choice. They already merged, and they still have independent thoughts, even in friendship. This is just an illusion, that Hawke is able to influence the process. They are already one. This is the starting point. And Anders will die. The battle kiss at the Templar side is a farewell kiss. Anders is clear. Yes, this is about the dominance. But not only in sex. Hawke wants to rule over Anders thoughts. If Hawke believes the Circle, then believes the Tranquility. At the moment, in Kirkwall the Circle and the Tranquility one and the same. Only a fool can not see or who do not want to see. How is it a farewell kiss considering my Hawke then goes on to speak about him in DAI....and even says, "sorry Anders" when she sacrifices herself in the Fade? she'd be insane to be chatting about a dead person. LOL I'm just going to disagree. I'm pro freedom anyway, I just don't think your response allows for the moderate Templars such as DAI Cullen or Templar Evangeline in Asunder. Or even for certain factions of the mages themselves, excluding Viv. Edit Add: Additionally, as of Jaws of HAkkon, we know a consensual spirtual posession does not use up or merge the spirit.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 17, 2017 23:00:38 GMT
They already merged, and they still have independent thoughts, even in friendship. This is just an illusion, that Hawke is able to influence the process. They are already one. This is the starting point. And Anders will die. The battle kiss at the Templar side is a farewell kiss. Anders is clear. Yes, this is about the dominance. But not only in sex. Hawke wants to rule over Anders thoughts. If Hawke believes the Circle, then believes the Tranquility. At the moment, in Kirkwall the Circle and the Tranquility one and the same. Only a fool can not see or who do not want to see. How is it a farewell kiss considering my Hawke then goes on to speak about him in DAI....and even says, "sorry Anders" when she sacrifices herself in the Fade? she'd be insane to be chatting about a dead person. LOL I'm just going to disagree. I'm pro freedom anyway, I just don't think your response allows for the moderate Templars such as DAI Cullen or Templar Evangeline in Asunder. Or even for certain factions of the mages themselves, excluding Viv. Edit Add: Additionally, as of Jaws of HAkkon, we know a consensual spirtual posession does not use up or merge the spirit. I think, this will kill him slowly. As he said at Gallows. 1. It may help to survive that the war finally started, but I think, so hard to live with a thought, that he betrayed his fellows, and fought against them, especially after that he caused the rebellion. 2. Or (and this version even worse in my eyes): he just try to live for Hawke, s/he is only who/what remained in his life (and Justice as an internal enemy), because anything what was important to him, is destroyed by Hawke. And he now believes in one thing: he failed in everything: he failed as warden (escaped), he failed as healer (he killed people, instead healed them), he failed as revolutioner (betrayed his fellows), he failed as mage (he possessed, willingly), he failed as friend (he trapped Justice, and makes him demon), and he failed as human (he killed many innocents for ...what? He doesn't know anymore...). Hawke finally won: Anders only his/hers property. (This is why I think, that not the death sentence is the biggest punishment to rival-Anders. Perhaps an exaggeration, but I think there is little chance to him to able ever really live in the future.) There are moderate Templars, yes, but they are Templars, they mostly joined the order as a naive boy/girl, and stayed, because brainwashed/lyrium addict, or this is a good job. They believe the Circle, because they learned this*. But Hawke isn't Templar. Hawke is a mage's son/daughter, this is different. Hawke sees the Kirkwall Templars' cruelty as a member of the mage family. I know, Malcolm was written as a "neutral" mage, but just see Bethany: she would rather die, than become Tranquil. Kirkwall's Circle isn't safe place for any mages. Perhaps, a templar doesn't see that (Thrask and Keran were able to see), but Hawke must see after Karl's and Ella's case. And don't forget: Cullen agree with Tranquility. At least in DA2, perhaps later... I don't know, this wasn't clear. And Fle/Myth said, that they are one, just as Anders. (Okay, Fle/Myth is old, very old, Anders/Justice isn't.) True, they have independent thought. I think Hawke only can influence, that they will able to live together in peace, or always will in war. I think, the "You are a monster, love, you must hate your demon-friend" isn't help too much. ______________ * This applies equally to the mages: they learned to fear themselves since their early childhood. They don't remember, their family life, or have terrible past (Wynne). Anders was elder (12), when arrested, he remembered. Fiona was 14, when went into the Circle, and found the Circle not so much better than the slavery. If there are many Mages were able to believe that s/he's a monster, how easy was that as a Templar...
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Post by phoray on Apr 18, 2017 2:23:37 GMT
How is it a farewell kiss considering my Hawke then goes on to speak about him in DAI....and even says, "sorry Anders" when she sacrifices herself in the Fade? she'd be insane to be chatting about a dead person. LOL I'm just going to disagree. I'm pro freedom anyway, I just don't think your response allows for the moderate Templars such as DAI Cullen or Templar Evangeline in Asunder. Or even for certain factions of the mages themselves, excluding Viv. Edit Add: Additionally, as of Jaws of HAkkon, we know a consensual spirtual posession does not use up or merge the spirit. I think, this will kill him slowly. As he said at Gallows. 1. It may help to survive that the war finally started, but I think, so hard to live with a thought, that he betrayed his fellows, and fought against them, especially after that he caused the rebellion. 2. Or (and this version even worse in my eyes): he just try to live for Hawke, s/he is only who/what remained in his life (and Justice as an internal enemy), because anything what was important to him, is destroyed by Hawke. And he now believes in one thing: he failed in everything: he failed as warden (escaped), he failed as healer (he killed people, instead healed them), he failed as revolutioner (betrayed his fellows), he failed as mage (he possessed, willingly), he failed as friend (he trapped Justice, and makes him demon), and he failed as human (he killed many innocents for ...what? He doesn't know anymore...). Hawke finally won: Anders only his/hers property. (This is why I think, that not the death sentence is the biggest punishment to rival-Anders. Perhaps an exaggeration, but I think there is little chance to him to able ever really live in the future.) There are moderate Templars, yes, but they are Templars, they mostly joined the order as a naive boy/girl, and stayed, because brainwashed/lyrium addict, or this is a good job. They believe the Circle, because they learned this*. But Hawke isn't Templar. Hawke is a mage's son/daughter, this is different. Hawke sees the Kirkwall Templars' cruelty as a member of the mage family. I know, Malcolm was written as a "neutral" mage, but just see Bethany: she would rather die, than become Tranquil. Kirkwall's Circle isn't safe place for any mages. Perhaps, a templar doesn't see that (Thrask and Keran were able to see), but Hawke must see after Karl's and Ella's case. And don't forget: Cullen agree with Tranquility. At least in DA2, perhaps later... I don't know, this wasn't clear. And Fle/Myth said, that they are one, just as Anders. (Okay, Fle/Myth is old, very old, Anders/Justice isn't.) True, they have independent thought. I think Hawke only can influence, that they will able to live together in peace, or always will in war. I think, the "You are a monster, love, you must hate your demon-friend" isn't help too much. ______________ * This applies equally to the mages: they learned to fear themselves since their early childhood. They don't remember, their family life, or have terrible past (Wynne). Anders was elder (12), when arrested, he remembered. Fiona was 14, when went into the Circle, and found the Circle not so much better than the slavery. If there are many Mages were able to believe that s/he's a monster, how easy was that as a Templar... 1. You don't have to side Templars at the end, or even Templar leaning, to rival Anders throughout the game. As a mage, you can also believe in more freedom for mages- just not be willing the pay the price of chaos and anarchy to achieve it. I think the end decision is poorly written. No matter how you look at it, Meredith is insane: A. turning her back on the man who openly admitted to commiting a massivecrime B. Turning her back on a group of individuals who claim they'll fight against her and her people. C. Not helping the citizens of Kirkwall burning and buried in their homes to D. Kill a bunch of unrelated trapped mages in the gallows. Even Cullen turns on her in the end- so a moderate Templar would NOT side with Meredith. In the end, Anders decided unilaterally and at the behest of an insistent vengeance spirit, to make the choice for all mages everywhere. Then they and many other citizens of Thedas got to pay the price for his unilateral decision. And you DON'T have to be a self hating mage. You can just feel that complete freedom for mages isn't worth the cost of death, chaos, and anarchy. Plain and simple. 2. And I think that there isn't enough information on spirit posession either way to have anything but circular debate. But that's why I point out that you can't be certain either. Connor was posessed by a demon, but would come out sporadically. Flemeth is posessed by an elven goddess, but they've already been together for the entirety of that human's body, so whatever problems the merge would have had have already worked out. A third example is what the Avaar do. 4th example is the seers in Rivain. There may be things happening in Tevinter. And then we have Anders. It was consensual, but then he regretted it- then he tried to make peace with it. But why make peace when you could also seek to reverse the merge?
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