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Post by x19dude95 on Feb 18, 2021 13:19:49 GMT
If we must. We MUST That's right I'm behind you and have a gun point at you to type it out what you would want to see. Me my list is pretty short. 1 climbing 2 swimming 3 day/night cycle 4 music toggle 5 more NPCs and towns to find I'll bite, though I'm more of the camp that actually enjoyed the open setting (I don't call it open world for reasons of my own). First, if you don't mind me checking some of your requests be cause I'm always curious. 1: Climbing - I'm assuming you don't mean ladders and fallen logs that you could climb in DA:I. There's the rub for any RPG designer: what does being able to climb surfaces that the designers/level builders didn't intend to be climbed add to the experience? Is that worth all the time testing climbing in those places to be sure it doesn't break the game? I don't personally see any advantage to storytelling over appropriately placed transitions that mimic that ability, but I'm open to examples. 2: Swimming - Pretty much the same as above; what do you get from a storytelling/game perspective simulating an activity that has to be closely regulated and heavily tested that you don't get from simpler implementations, like getting on a boat transition in Jaws of Hakkon? You can't really engage in combat or other activities while swimming in a game like DA. To me, it's just walking/running with a far trickier animation and implementation. Again, my experience is not broad so if there are games this has really added to, please give me some examples. I would love to hear about them. 3: Day/Night Cycle. This is an oldie and maybe notso goodie. I remember day/night cycles and what they basically did in BG2, but, in my memory, that largely had only two effects of any impact (vampires only came out at night and there were a few merchants who only appeared at night while most others were unavailable). That offers some realism but it's still a little lightweight in terms of punch to implementation issues. Again, what would be the big storytelling opportunities this would open up? 4: Music toggle: I'll reiterate what DragonKing asked: how is this different from just turning music off in the sound settings? 5: I thought there were plenty of NPCs to interact with in the Hinterlands (which I think is what Bioware was shooting for as an adventure area before the time crunch came down). We'd all like more NPCs, but that can be expensive in models and VA. Maybe its better to have somewhat deeper NPCs that actually have more function then dispense quest, accept quest end and give reward, generic praise of conquering hero? I know I got a kick out of the groups of refugees that would spawn in the Hinterlands that would comment on various things as well. As for more towns, again, I would prefer quality over quantity. I'm pretty sure we can all agree Val Royeux was just a mistake. Haven had more life and things going on than the jewel of the Orleasean Empire. Maybe I'm rambling a bit here. Now, for my own suggestion: have solid themes through each adventure area that link to each other and to either the Main Quest or another theme in another area. By link , I mean having a real impact on the related theme or the Main Quest. For example: in my Alternate Reality DA:I, you could pick to side with the templars, the mages, or quash them both. Siding with one side or the other would lead into Hushed Whispers or Champions or a third quest centered on bringing them both back under the Chantry. The second theme then would be the line from the east Road Bandits through the Smugglers Fortress to Valamarr with that completion weakening the Red Templars in some way for later. (Side note: how many dang Red Lyrium mines/sources did they have? Even if they were eating the stuff, there's so many quests that strike at Red Lyrium sources that have zero impact on the plot. But I digress ). Weaving a good story is like a web: it only works when the strands are linked together to support each other. thanks for the thoughts and the time. 1 Well for climbing I was thinking about Zelda BOTW you could find hidden things for gameplay reasons 2 As for swimming. if you need to ad it to the story maybe we could learn a spell what allows us to breath underwater, and we need to go underwater for something. it would look nice and feel like a fantasy, going to a underwater forgotten city. 3 Okay dude I get you like story but games are more than just story. its about a living world 4 tbh forget my point about this one sorry 5 as for npc I should have went in to more detail but if you ever played Saints Row 2 it had NPCS just doing daily tasks what made the city feel real what I want DA$ to have. i want NPCS to be doing things and not just standing there waiting fore me to talk to them you know what I mean. make it feel like a living real world.
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Cyberstrike
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is wanting to have some fun!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
XBL Gamertag: cyberstrike nTo
PSN: cyberstrike-nTo
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Post by Cyberstrike on Feb 18, 2021 13:56:23 GMT
I think BioWare saw and heard about all the games with horses that were out or coming out and decided to have them in DAI so I guess they thought since Oblivion, Skyrim, The Last of Us Part 1, RDR, and others that were in development like MGS5, The Last of Us Part II and RDR2 had horses or were going to have in them so they had better have horses and mounts in DAI too. Without any thought on how to make the mounts interesting, useful, or cool.
I think actually... there might be a reason why the mounts didnt go faster: Streaming speed on the old consoles was not enough for the content. Not sure if this was the case but ... it could be. On Anthem the walking speed was originally slow in the fortress, and I seem to remember them saying this is the reason and they did some stuff to get it a bit faster though. Of course Anthem is on newer hardware etc. but they have their limits too especially how slow the HDD's are in those..
Sorry but I don't buy that.
If you have it play Oblivion with no mods on XB1 or PC and the first horse you get is slow moving then get a white or black horse and they move very fast and this game was originally on Xbox 360, PS3, and PC.
So no, I'm not buying this "it's always because of old hardware" excuse this time. IMHO it was the fault of BioWare (and maybe them figuring out the Frostbite engine), it's not fault of the Xbox 360, PS3, and PC. Because other games made horses/mounts work on those consoles.
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Post by Unicephalon 40-D on Feb 18, 2021 14:08:01 GMT
I think actually... there might be a reason why the mounts didnt go faster: Streaming speed on the old consoles was not enough for the content. Not sure if this was the case but ... it could be. On Anthem the walking speed was originally slow in the fortress, and I seem to remember them saying this is the reason and they did some stuff to get it a bit faster though. Of course Anthem is on newer hardware etc. but they have their limits too especially how slow the HDD's are in those..
Sorry but I don't buy that.
If you have it play Oblivion with no mods on XB1 or PC and the first horse you get is slow moving then get a white or black horse and they move very fast and this game was originally on Xbox 360, PS3, and PC.
So no, I'm not buying this "it's always because of old hardware" excuse this time. IMHO it was the fault of BioWare (and maybe them figuring out the Frostbite engine), it's not fault of the Xbox 360, PS3, and PC. Because other games made horses/mounts work on those consoles.
Maybe, maybe not, but I just said it might be. For Anthem we know it was about this. Different engines are done and use hardware differently. Frostbite on PS3/X360 was not a good idea I think and they have also said supporting the old console generation did slow them down and they also had to remove parts of the game shown before because of the limitations. Anyway, just guessing here about what I've heard and seen.
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Post by kotoreffect3 on Feb 18, 2021 22:40:37 GMT
Swimming, better questing (less collect 10 of these, mark 5 of those) more towns and cities, more organic environments.
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Post by catcher on Feb 19, 2021 0:43:18 GMT
1 Well for climbing I was thinking about Zelda BOTW you could find hidden things for gameplay reasons 2 As for swimming. if you need to ad it to the story maybe we could learn a spell what allows us to breath underwater, and we need to go underwater for something. it would look nice and feel like a fantasy, going to a underwater forgotten city. 3 Okay dude I get you like story but games are more than just story. its about a living world 4 tbh forget my point about this one sorry 5 as for npc I should have went in to more detail but if you ever played Saints Row 2 it had NPCS just doing daily tasks what made the city feel real what I want DA$ to have. i want NPCS to be doing things and not just standing there waiting fore me to talk to them you know what I mean. make it feel like a living real world. 1: I've never played any of the Zelda games but I do remember there were several chests, lore bits, and shards you had to climb up ladders to reach or you had to do some interesting jumping and pathfinding to reach several of the Oculara or a Astrarium. I am wondering what is the difference between these instances and what you would like to see more of in a DAX. What I would prefer not to see is a bunch of resources given over so your character can climb virtually anywhere in a vain fishing expedition for content that isn't there (and game breaking opportunities that are). That's why I preferred what was done in DA:I. 2: This is kind of what I am talking about above. I don't believe in adding features just to tic them off some list and because other games do them (like the discussion about horses. They did nothing for me as a player in DA:I). For me, if they are added, they need a purpose that advances storytelling in at least as much weight as they will cost in development and testing. The concept of some sort of an underwater adventure is a sound one, but you don't need to implement swimming (with all the animation, clipping, and implementation issues) to do this. Bard's Tale 3 from 1988 just let you jump into a lake and transitioned directly to it's "castle" dungeon where you could cast a breathing spell to let the party breathe underwater. It wasn't really into storytelling once you got there, but that's where I would want the resources to go. The way it sounded, you would like to have the character try swimming anywhere and maybe if she/he is in the right place. 3: Yup, unapologetically. Bioware's strength has always been its stories and characters. I appreciate and enjoy other gameplay elements as Bioware is able to integrate them, but story is the center of a Bioware CRPG. Simulating a 'living world' is great when it works, but it's exceedingly difficult to pull off and can look terrible when it fails. See Cyberpunk 2077. Give me more time on meaningful, impactful quests over games of wait around for the right light cycle to start, continue, or end the quest. 4: No problem. happens to me all the time. 5: Kind of like with 3 above, it's fine as long as it doesn't take too much away from pulling the story together or letting the player and characters shine. There seemed to be plenty going on among the non-interacting NPCs in Haven, the Crossroads, Redcliffe, etc. Several places you could just stop and listen to conversations evolve in Haven, for example. From your response, though, it sounds more like schedules for for all NPCs, including quest critical. That's quite an investment in resources that makes more sense in a true "open world" game like Saints Row than for a story game with an "open environment" like Dragon Age has been trending to. I'm just not sure that most arguments for a 'living world' work for me since they tend to introduce more headaches than rewards, but I know there are all types of gamers. Thanks again for your time and your response.
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Post by Noxluxe on Feb 21, 2021 17:22:00 GMT
Much bigger and fuller and fewer maps. Especially the towns and cities. And mounts for the whole party, rather than just the player character.
But I'd give serious consideration to taking the bullet instead.
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Post by wickedcool on Feb 24, 2021 16:23:10 GMT
Bare minimum we need everything from original post. If they can’t deliver climbing and swimming etc they should resign immediately.
Put me down as a hell no on super dark nights unless you have torches and light spell etc
At this point I want flight. There’s no excuse for a levitate spell or a feather all spell. Get back to dao shapechangers. Tactical view with an eagle or crow etc. utilize the tactical camera option more
A sniper type view for archers
Maybe cover as options for defense
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Post by x19dude95 on Feb 24, 2021 17:56:01 GMT
1 Well for climbing I was thinking about Zelda BOTW you could find hidden things for gameplay reasons 2 As for swimming. if you need to ad it to the story maybe we could learn a spell what allows us to breath underwater, and we need to go underwater for something. it would look nice and feel like a fantasy, going to a underwater forgotten city. 3 Okay dude I get you like story but games are more than just story. its about a living world 4 tbh forget my point about this one sorry 5 as for npc I should have went in to more detail but if you ever played Saints Row 2 it had NPCS just doing daily tasks what made the city feel real what I want DA$ to have. i want NPCS to be doing things and not just standing there waiting fore me to talk to them you know what I mean. make it feel like a living real world. 1: I've never played any of the Zelda games but I do remember there were several chests, lore bits, and shards you had to climb up ladders to reach or you had to do some interesting jumping and pathfinding to reach several of the Oculara or a Astrarium. I am wondering what is the difference between these instances and what you would like to see more of in a DAX. What I would prefer not to see is a bunch of resources given over so your character can climb virtually anywhere in a vain fishing expedition for content that isn't there (and game breaking opportunities that are). That's why I preferred what was done in DA:I. 2: This is kind of what I am talking about above. I don't believe in adding features just to tic them off some list and because other games do them (like the discussion about horses. They did nothing for me as a player in DA:I). For me, if they are added, they need a purpose that advances storytelling in at least as much weight as they will cost in development and testing. The concept of some sort of an underwater adventure is a sound one, but you don't need to implement swimming (with all the animation, clipping, and implementation issues) to do this. Bard's Tale 3 from 1988 just let you jump into a lake and transitioned directly to it's "castle" dungeon where you could cast a breathing spell to let the party breathe underwater. It wasn't really into storytelling once you got there, but that's where I would want the resources to go. The way it sounded, you would like to have the character try swimming anywhere and maybe if she/he is in the right place. 3: Yup, unapologetically. Bioware's strength has always been its stories and characters. I appreciate and enjoy other gameplay elements as Bioware is able to integrate them, but story is the center of a Bioware CRPG. Simulating a 'living world' is great when it works, but it's exceedingly difficult to pull off and can look terrible when it fails. See Cyberpunk 2077. Give me more time on meaningful, impactful quests over games of wait around for the right light cycle to start, continue, or end the quest. 4: No problem. happens to me all the time. 5: Kind of like with 3 above, it's fine as long as it doesn't take too much away from pulling the story together or letting the player and characters shine. There seemed to be plenty going on among the non-interacting NPCs in Haven, the Crossroads, Redcliffe, etc. Several places you could just stop and listen to conversations evolve in Haven, for example. From your response, though, it sounds more like schedules for for all NPCs, including quest critical. That's quite an investment in resources that makes more sense in a true "open world" game like Saints Row than for a story game with an "open environment" like Dragon Age has been trending to. I'm just not sure that most arguments for a 'living world' work for me since they tend to introduce more headaches than rewards, but I know there are all types of gamers. Thanks again for your time and your response. I can see your point of view you want story to be the main focus and I agree. But you also need to keep updating gameplay with sequels. Like what's say we had a Kotor 3 on the Xbox 360, sure the game play would work fine it would probably take after dragon age. But if we had a Kotor 4 or DA2 gameolay was like DAO I could see reviews saying INTs not innovateed enough and feels like the first one.
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N7
Little Pumpkin
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: Beerfish
XBL Gamertag: Beerfish77
Posts: 15,192 Likes: 36,403
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https://bsn.boards.net/user/314/personal
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Post by Beerfish on Feb 24, 2021 18:14:46 GMT
Need more hopping up the sides of mountains to get a lousy quest item only to find out you cant quite get there and have to walk around to the other side of the mountain with 20 minutes of game play time.....yeah we need more of that.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: helios969
Prime Posts: No Clue
Prime Likes: Who Cares
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by helios969 on Feb 28, 2021 8:49:30 GMT
Lots more...in addition to full grown and baby hordes give me some adolescent and young adult, plus the super deadly ancient variant. Then I'll take Bull's advice and "kill the shit out of them."
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Post by catcher on Mar 1, 2021 20:40:18 GMT
I can see your point of view you want story to be the main focus and I agree. But you also need to keep updating gameplay with sequels. Like what's say we had a Kotor 3 on the Xbox 360, sure the game play would work fine it would probably take after dragon age. But if we had a Kotor 4 or DA2 gameolay was like DAO I could see reviews saying INTs not innovateed enough and feels like the first one. My ultimate point, though, is that the two don't have to be exclusive, but you should have (multiple) story-based reasons to implement something like climbing and that implementation should be complete if you do it. You don't see people climbing every other tree and rock in the real world without a good reason to do it, the same should apply to any game. Further, to take a page from Beerfish, there really should be something worth climbing for beyond a treasure chest or a mini-game. Here's a couple of thoughts on how this one example might be done. 1: Climbing is needed to locate particular Quest locations or orient to certain goals. What if the Emerald Graves was a more densely populated forest and the big Quest markers aren't exactly located? Then to get to say, the Veridium Mines, you might be better to climb a tree to locate a scaffolding over the mine. It makes the Emerald Graves feel more like an alien forest environment. You would still want to make only certain tress 'climbable' and be sure there are enough to locate several spots but this is a basic application of climbing in literature that should translate to the game if properly implemented. 2: Climbing is important in battles. They did this to a small degree in a couple of cases for the In Hushed Whispers branch in DA:I. You are prompted by one of your Companions to notice scaffolding or other overlooks you can climb while the Venatori aren't paying attention. To some degree you can use this outside as well with climbable surfaces but it can be enhanced if the combats are more set pieces instead of random encounters. For example, what if the quest is to set-up an ambush of a opponent's caravan? Climbing to certain vantage points might make the ambush function better (or at all). 3: Climbing is integral to one (or more) actual Quests/Adventures. Imagine storming the Tree Citadel of the Evil Squirrels (an oxymoron because all squirrels are evil ). There's no convenient ramp built by the Inquisition because you just don't have the resources. You and your Companions will just have to climb and on the way up, fight it out with the squirrels who are better equipped and trained for this sort of thing. What does fighting while climbing look like? How are you at a disadvantage and how do things like talents and spells work differently in this environment? It's a bit juvenile (and probably dates me) but I remember a GI Joe cartoon from long ago where the Joes were scaling this near vertical cliff in walker machines with pitons on the end of the legs and jetpacks. There could be some wild ways to adapt to the environment and make even vanilla combat a whole different world, but again, the need for resources means this has to be a big build, not just something you can do up any tree or cliff. That goes for any of the other suggestions as well. The mounts in DA:I are a perfect example of something implemented with ZERO effect on the story outside of getting to the Horse Master in the Hinterlands. Ostensibly, Mounts were supposed to reduce travel times but with several areas of difficult terrain, multiple, well-spaced Camps and travel points, and instantaneous travel between zones. They wound up as a unfortunate mistake instead of a true selling feature. When a feature gets integrated into the story, it has a better (not perfect) chance of being well-implemented and THEN you can call it an innovation. Showing a Qunari climbing up some rock somewhere in the wilderness: not a deal. Showing that same Qunari climbing while pulling out a two-hander sword and using it one-handed to swing at a strafing dragon: that'll get people to sit up and notice. Thanks again.
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Post by samurailink on Mar 22, 2021 21:39:08 GMT
1.Combat shouldn't end by banter early. If it does I want one of the characters to say "So as I was saying" and then repeat the line that got interrupted and continue it. 2.Less jumping puzzles 3.Terrain that doesn't make the optimal solution for travel horse jumping up steep cliffs. 4.More little NPC hubs like the Crossroads. Now that they aren't forced to run it on the PS3 (and with luck PS4/Xbone ports will be canned) they should have the power to have NPC's. 5.Find some reason to let me play a mission that plays like that original Inquisition demo where me travelling through the existing map on a timer is important.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 22, 2021 23:22:29 GMT
If we have open levels the first thing I want to see is an apology letter.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: helios969
Prime Posts: No Clue
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Post by helios969 on Mar 23, 2021 8:04:01 GMT
Story, story, and uh, story.
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Post by fairdragon on Mar 28, 2021 16:19:05 GMT
1 more decision and consequences. 2 decision and consequences across games. (where decisions can't be ignored, leliana hint) 3 I want Origins back.
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