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Post by Son of Dorn on Aug 7, 2021 22:33:38 GMT
I never understood why they executed him and spared her. It would have made more sense if they had kept them both alive as hostages... or rather for sale as slaves later. For the same reason, I never understood why they killed the three (actually 4) engineers they found on the planet. Batarians are depicted as slavers, yet they so easily killed almost everyone they encountered on X-57. It wasn't a slave grab. It was about smashing a asteroid into that planet.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2021 22:36:16 GMT
I never understood why they executed him and spared her. It would have made more sense if they had kept them both alive as hostages... or rather for sale as slaves later. For the same reason, I never understood why they killed the three (actually 4) engineers they found on the planet. Batarians are depicted as slavers, yet they so easily killed almost everyone they encountered on X-57. It wasn't a slave grab. It was about smashing a asteroid into that planet. I'm aware of that... but the few people on the asteroid, were vulnerable and could have easily been taken as slaves rather than just shot. Why bother to take Kate and a couple of others as hostages, while just outright shooting the other three (actually 4) who were out at the perimeter stations.... makes no sense.
Also, why hold the hostages at the main facility? After Shepard succeeds in shutting down all three torches, the asteroid is not going to crash into the planet. Why didn't Balak try to make a run for his ship instead? Where is his ship even?
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Post by Son of Dorn on Aug 7, 2021 22:39:40 GMT
It wasn't a slave grab. It was about smashing a asteroid into that planet. I'm aware of that... but the few people on the asteroid, were vulnerable and could have easily been taken as slaves rather than just shot. I doubt that Balak was interested in grabbing any salves. Plus the batarians would have to waste time watching over them.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2021 22:46:15 GMT
I'm aware of that... but the few people on the asteroid, were vulnerable and could have easily been taken as slaves rather than just shot. I doubt that Balak was interested in grabbing any salves. Plus the batarians would have to waste time watching over them. Still, they had Kate and couple of others in the room with her anyways. Why didn't they just immediately kill everyone they saw, then?
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Post by Son of Dorn on Aug 7, 2021 22:50:12 GMT
I doubt that Balak was interested in grabbing any salves. Plus the batarians would have to waste time watching over them. Still, they had Kate and couple of others in the room with her anyways. Why didn't they just immediately kill everyone they saw, then? Who knows? Batarians are clearly not known for being intelligent.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2021 22:55:34 GMT
Further question... since Isaac Newton is the deadliest SOB in space, how does just shutting down the torches prevent the asteroid from continuing on its trajectory towards the planet? Shouldn't redirecting the torches to steer the asteroid away from the planet been a thing?
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Post by dmc1001 on Aug 8, 2021 18:58:41 GMT
Further question... since Isaac Newton is the deadliest SOB in space, how does just shutting down the torches prevent the asteroid from continuing on its trajectory towards the planet? Shouldn't redirecting the torches to steer the asteroid away from the planet been a thing? You would think so. Turning off the torches would hardly do anything. It won't even stop the acceleration, at least not before it decimated Terra Nova. Basically, BW devs don't know much about physics and that lack was also present in the engineers. BTW, I don't know much about physics but I do know that if I throw a ball hard, it's still going to go pretty far even though I'm not continuously pushing it. It won't even lose momentum right away, not without something stopping it.
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Post by shotgunjulia on Aug 8, 2021 21:29:11 GMT
Balak seems to have been a member of the Batarian Special Intervention Unit, although the game and lore doesn't say - it makes sense since his last rank in ME1 was Commander (wiki) and in ME3 he was an Admiral. Balak had killed pretty much everyone else in the facility. Kate knew that or at minimum suspected that since she lost contact with them... and couldn't re-establish contact even after Shepard fixed the com-link. Balak hated humans. Kate's brother was to be killed regardless. So why would she even give a name? It would make no difference. It might even endanger her own life in addition to her brother's.
Also, when you meet Charn, he says that he thought the operation was going to be a quick slave grab and nothing like this. Balak ordered everyone killed. Aside from Charn, these guys were mercs. Shepard has the choice of letting Charn's group go... or if you're role playing a Mindoir survivor you probably should just kill him and his men because the words "slave grab" would be the wrong answer as well. My last run was Colonist-War Hero so Charn died. There was that, too.
Ironically if you left Balak for the Alliance, regardless of what it said in the Wiki, Balak appears in ME3. Apparently the Alliance did a prisoner exchange.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2021 15:28:09 GMT
Balak seems to have been a member of the Batarian Special Intervention Unit, although the game and lore doesn't say - it makes sense since his last rank in ME1 was Commander (wiki) and in ME3 he was an Admiral. Balak had killed pretty much everyone else in the facility. Kate knew that or at minimum suspected that since she lost contact with them... and couldn't re-establish contact even after Shepard fixed the com-link. Balak hated humans. Kate's brother was to be killed regardless. So why would she even give a name? It would make no difference. It might even endanger her own life in addition to her brother's. Also, when you meet Charn, he says that he thought the operation was going to be a quick slave grab and nothing like this. Balak ordered everyone killed. Aside from Charn, these guys were mercs. Shepard has the choice of letting Charn's group go... or if you're role playing a Mindoir survivor you probably should just kill him and his men because the words "slave grab" would be the wrong answer as well. My last run was Colonist-War Hero so Charn died. There was that, too. Ironically if you left Balak for the Alliance, regardless of what it said in the Wiki, Balak appears in ME3. Apparently the Alliance did a prisoner exchange. Charn always dies in my game. I see no reason at all to try to save him by just letting him go. There should have been an option to arrest him... that si, Normandy needed a brig.
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Post by dmc1001 on Aug 13, 2021 6:36:22 GMT
Balak seems to have been a member of the Batarian Special Intervention Unit, although the game and lore doesn't say - it makes sense since his last rank in ME1 was Commander (wiki) and in ME3 he was an Admiral. Balak had killed pretty much everyone else in the facility. Kate knew that or at minimum suspected that since she lost contact with them... and couldn't re-establish contact even after Shepard fixed the com-link. Balak hated humans. Kate's brother was to be killed regardless. So why would she even give a name? It would make no difference. It might even endanger her own life in addition to her brother's. Also, when you meet Charn, he says that he thought the operation was going to be a quick slave grab and nothing like this. Balak ordered everyone killed. Aside from Charn, these guys were mercs. Shepard has the choice of letting Charn's group go... or if you're role playing a Mindoir survivor you probably should just kill him and his men because the words "slave grab" would be the wrong answer as well. My last run was Colonist-War Hero so Charn died. There was that, too. Ironically if you left Balak for the Alliance, regardless of what it said in the Wiki, Balak appears in ME3. Apparently the Alliance did a prisoner exchange. Charn always dies in my game. I see no reason at all to try to save him by just letting him go. There should have been an option to arrest him... that si, Normandy needed a brig. Always dies in my game, too. Sorry, but "muh culture" isn't okay in taking slaves from people outside of your culture. I don't mean to say it's acceptable even against other batarians but their culture ends when it actively works to steal from me. I wouldn't arrest him. George Lucas: "Greedo shot first." Han would never do that...
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2021 21:43:19 GMT
Charn always dies in my game. I see no reason at all to try to save him by just letting him go. There should have been an option to arrest him... that si, Normandy needed a brig. Always dies in my game, too. Sorry, but "muh culture" isn't okay in taking slaves from people outside of your culture. I don't mean to say it's acceptable even against other batarians but their culture ends when it actively works to steal from me. I wouldn't arrest him. George Lucas: "Greedo shot first." Han would never do that... The option should have still been there to arrest him rather than shoot him or just let him walk free. It's there with Balak... why not with Charn?
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Post by dmc1001 on Aug 14, 2021 17:27:20 GMT
Always dies in my game, too. Sorry, but "muh culture" isn't okay in taking slaves from people outside of your culture. I don't mean to say it's acceptable even against other batarians but their culture ends when it actively works to steal from me. I wouldn't arrest him. George Lucas: "Greedo shot first." Han would never do that... The option should have still been there to arrest him rather than shoot him or just let him walk free. It's there with Balak... why not with Charn? Shepard is supposed to take the time to arrest Charn while having to run off after Balak? Was Shepard supposed to hope that Charn would stay put in the meantime? As far as we can tell, the only people who knew what was happening were the people on the asteroid. No was coming anytime soon and wasting time waiting is outright stupid. Shoot him and go rather than waiting to be backstabbed.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2021 18:44:57 GMT
The option should have still been there to arrest him rather than shoot him or just let him walk free. It's there with Balak... why not with Charn? Shepard is supposed to take the time to arrest Charn while having to run off after Balak? Was Shepard supposed to hope that Charn would stay put in the meantime? As far as we can tell, the only people who knew what was happening were the people on the asteroid. No was coming anytime soon and wasting time waiting is outright stupid. Shoot him and go rather than waiting to be backstabbed. Shepard does have other squad mates and crew on Normandy who could come down to the planet/asteroid and take Charn into custody while he chases down Balak. It's not like there's only 3 people on the ship. As I said, Normandy needed a brig... and before you say "but there's only one Makoe"... keep in mind that, right at the beginning of the game, Joker drops off Nihilus, Shepard, Jenkins, and Alenko without any use of the mako.
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Post by dmc1001 on Aug 15, 2021 1:17:22 GMT
Shepard is supposed to take the time to arrest Charn while having to run off after Balak? Was Shepard supposed to hope that Charn would stay put in the meantime? As far as we can tell, the only people who knew what was happening were the people on the asteroid. No was coming anytime soon and wasting time waiting is outright stupid. Shoot him and go rather than waiting to be backstabbed. Shepard does have other squad mates and crew on Normandy who could come down to the planet/asteroid and take Charn into custody while he chases down Balak. It's not like there's only 3 people on the ship. As I said, Normandy needed a brig... and before you say "but there's only one Makoe"... keep in mind that, right at the beginning of the game, Joker drops off Nihilus, Shepard, Jenkins, and Alenko without any use of the mako. I wasn't even going to touch on the Mako. I was talking about time. Shepard was going to have to waste time waiting for people. Yes, I said Alliance but it still plays out the same hanging around rather than hunting down Balak. It's not like Charn was going down without a fight. He had no intention of being taken down. He just wanted to leave and that wasn't an option.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2021 10:57:26 GMT
Shepard does have other squad mates and crew on Normandy who could come down to the planet/asteroid and take Charn into custody while he chases down Balak. It's not like there's only 3 people on the ship. As I said, Normandy needed a brig... and before you say "but there's only one Makoe"... keep in mind that, right at the beginning of the game, Joker drops off Nihilus, Shepard, Jenkins, and Alenko without any use of the mako. I wasn't even going to touch on the Mako. I was talking about time. Shepard was going to have to waste time waiting for people. Yes, I said Alliance but it still plays out the same hanging around rather than hunting down Balak. It's not like Charn was going down without a fight. He had no intention of being taken down. He just wanted to leave and that wasn't an option. It wasn't an offered option to arrest him. If it had been, Charn's reaction would have been written in to accommodate that decision by the player as well... just like it was accommodated when doing the Major Kyle mission. The writers control what options are offered and how they turn out. In general principle, there should have been an option (IMHO) to arrest Charn rather than just shoot him or let him go. The writing of the game should have accounted for the fact that there are more than 3 people on Normandy and that, even on the Major Kyle mission, it would not have been practical or realistic for Shepard to have to call in another ship from the Fifth Fleet every time he/she wanted to arrest someone. For me, it would have helped with immersion if there was more times when there was a sense that people other than Shepard's current squad were actually doing "something" relative to the current mission rather than just standing around in the usual spots waiting for Shepard to come back to talk with them. We do get a little bit of that in ME3 with, for example, Cortez taking out the jamming tower on Rannoch and his involvement in the last Leviathan mission. I think having a shuttle pilot in that game was a good move.
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Post by dmc1001 on Aug 15, 2021 17:50:20 GMT
It wasn't an offered option to arrest him. "Shepard can convince Charn to leave the asteroid peacefully, under the promise that Balak will be eliminated and Charn will then be the one calling the shots. In that event, Charn agrees immediately and provides Shepard with a pass to the main facility along with a warning that Balak is a "mean bastard"." Source: masseffect.fandom.com/wiki/CharnIt may not be an arrest but it also doesn't require killing. I thought this was the case but had to go back to the wiki to make sure.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2021 19:07:38 GMT
It wasn't an offered option to arrest him. "Shepard can convince Charn to leave the asteroid peacefully, under the promise that Balak will be eliminated and Charn will then be the one calling the shots. In that event, Charn agrees immediately and provides Shepard with a pass to the main facility along with a warning that Balak is a "mean bastard"." Source: masseffect.fandom.com/wiki/CharnIt may not be an arrest but it also doesn't require killing. I thought this was the case but had to go back to the wiki to make sure. I said several times to two current choices were to kill him or let him walk, so I'm not sure what difference you think it makes that he says that Balak is a mean bastard. He walks free to do whatever he wants to do... no guarantees that he'll be a better "boss" of those Batarians than Balak at all. All Shepard knows about Charn is he's second in command and... as he overheard, he's the one who shot Aaron.
I'm just stating an opinion... there should have been another choice... to arrest him for the crimes he has already committed... and adding in a dialogue about having someone come from Normandy to take him into custody wouldn't take that long and it would give a semblance of the others on the Normandy actively contributing to the missions even when they aren't on Shepard's immediate squad. They could have also handled an "arrest" choice by having Shepard decide leave one squad mate behind to get Charn transfered into custody (much like the have us leave one squad mate behind to help Garrus in ME2). The final battle could still be made to work with Shepard and one squadmate to take down Balak.
AGAIN... It's just stating an OPINION, PREFERENCE, ... a suggestion that I THINK would possibly make the game a little better. It's not an invitation to argue on and on about it. On another thread... I'm being accused of being a troll for the same sort of BS. I am a member here and I can participate in these threads by stating my opinons and preferences as well as anybody else here. If people don't respond with posts that start an argument over it... I won't argue anything... I really would prefer to not argue at all.
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