The Pyjack's Den! The ME News Discussion Thread

Just having a look at the full transcript...

Grubb: “You want some original reporting? This game is just nowhere near coming out. This is not, this, I was told, like, so, when they announced, when they, like, revealed Dragon Age: Dreadwolf in 2018, this is similar in terms of timeline, where that was announced in 2018, and we’re not getting that game til maybe next year. So now do the math for that, and we’re talking 2029 for Mass Effect 5.”

Host: “This game is so far away.”

Grubb: “It is - so far away.”

Host: “It’s in another galaxy right now.” [referring to how far away it is in time irl]

Grubb: “Uh-huh. So, hey, why’d they do this?” [plugging the Spot On show]

Host: “Maybe you’ll find out and you’ll hear a discussion about this on the latest episode of Spot On.” [alt link - apparently this show is weekly and airs on Fridays]

Grubb: “We definitely will have a conversation about this. When I asked, it was just like, ‘Hey, is this just because they felt they had to do something for N7 Day?’ Yes, for this, this thing, that’s exactly, that’s all this is. You gotta imagine, like, they would be having, they have to talk about it, like, 'Hey, is this a good idea?’ Who knows if they thought it was a good idea or not.”

Host: “It’s proof of life, it’s just proof of life.”

Grubb: “I suppose the, yeah, I think fans would probably rather have it than not.”

—

Grubb: “I think, this [Mass Effect] teaser can eventually be a 'W’ if we do get a decent amount of info about Dragon Age: Dreadwolf soon. The Game Awards 2023 sounds right to me, they’ve done stuff at The Game Awards before. I’m expecting them to be there. If they’re not, it better be soon after, because Dragon Age: Dreadwolf, was, you know, there was a chance Dragon Age: Dreadwolf could’ve came out this year. Obviously it did keep moving internally, as I’ve reported before. It’s now, they’re looking at, you know, by the mid of next year, something like that.”

In another thread I was calling it a "Proof of Life" as well...

But the more public-facing you make it, the harder it is for EA to cancel. I think that's part of it as well.

Hopefully, we'll get that DA:D trailer at the Game Awards, but my expectations are firmly in check.

Funny vibes. Given the chatter on this potentially being an antagonistic force in the series rather then a protagonist one I instantly thought of Halo 5...or to a lesser extent Battlefront 2...where the Master Chief was really being talked up as having gone rogue and how that was kind of a nonsense idea and didn't really work in the game. So thought that it would just be like BioWare to do that to the N7s. 

But then I had completley forgotten about the Grey Wardens and my much more positive reception of that choice in DAI. 

Still I suppose it was as much of how they handled each thing given that in Halo 5 it was a bit of a massive fake out given how the media kept on talking up the hunt that Spartan Locke was going to go on against the Master Chief which didn't ever actually materialize in game and the two even pretty quickly ended up working with one another. 

It would also be a bit of a bold move though because the implication I am getting from this chatter is humanity is being painted as the bad guys in full with this N7 operative as the face of it. Given Mass Effects focus on humanity and their relation with the greater galaxy this would still strike me as an odd choice. 

Mark Meer @ Mark_Meer
UPDATE: @alixwiltonregan will be joining us too! Tune in to @jhaletweets’ YouTube on Sun Nov 12 at 1pm PT! 🥳

I follow the devs on X & Blusky but I don't have time to go digging up their comments, I'm afraid you'll have to do that yourself.

Courtenay's in as well!


So right now they have...

@ Mark_Meer
@jhaletweets
@missalihillis
@ashsroka
@faronear
@wlsalyers
@raphaelsbarge
@ashsevilla
@courtenaytaylor
@kimberlydbrooks
@mrdcdouglas
@alixwiltonregan

Yeah you are spitting a lot of good perspectives here and I agree with pretty much most of it. 

This is going to be another aspect that will be really curious to see where they go from here with this concept because on the one hand you are probably right in BioWare wanting to do more *alien perspectives* and for instance I do wonder if the protagonist will be able to be from multiple species like the Big Four plus Krogans might be a good option...maybe Quarians? But either way the tension in my mind would be between doing that but also keeping that focus on humanity while also expanding on these perspectives. And I am trying to remember how Andromeda did that nuance with the governments and you are probably right actually just been awhile since I've played so maybe some of the details have fallen through the cracks. 

And I am one of the harshest critics of how they handled Cerberus I guess in the trilogy but especially in Mass Effect 3 because its weird the organization went from being very muhahaha in 1, a very gray counterpart to the Alliance in ME 2, and then back to a stupid dark and...as you say super powerful...organization in ME 3. The thing is I've been around this forum long enough where the discussions about Cerberus, about the Alliance, about these organizations is probably a little bit more nuanced and because of N7 day I have been re reading a lot of my own arguments on the subject. But its fascinating since my first ME game was ME 2 I got a lot of sympathy built in for Cerberus and their perspective. Even then though Cerberus has its defenders and its fans around here, the Alliance has its detractors, the Council has its detractors as well. I am someone who does fall into these categories to even if at the end of the day I do prefer the Alliance/Council over Cerberus still very sympathetic to them. But the Alliance maybe in the 'darkest timeline' where you renegade kill the Council and put a full human Council on the throne its still indicitive that give them a little bit of power and the Systems Alliance goes crazy tyranical over the galaxy. Restricting movement, the right to protest, massive security restrictions, curtailing of civil liberties and a whole lot of other issues which does not make them look too good and does create a little nuance between them and Cerberus. And same thing with the Council to. Meanwhile on the flip side of the occasion Cerberus themselves did a lot of evil things even in the game we were working on them which really tested our loyalty to them with David Archer and the Jack experiments just that A. they were a renegade 'ends justify the means' organization and B. the independence of the cells allowed them some plausible deniability. 

Still though I think to your point the trouble is most of this nuance was hand waved in ME 3. Given how they steamlined their choices a lot of this nuance was wiped away. The Council was replaced with an all alien council no matter what you do and any of the conversations of Alliance corruption was hand waved away. So yes, a more nuanced and seedy story where these lines are further blurred could be a welcome addition to the series. 

I think going to Andromeda only makes sense in the first place, if you have a link to the Milky Way, i.e. if you report back to the Milky Way and long-term have Mass Relays set up. That should've been the plan all along, because otherwise any discovery in the other Galaxy is meaningless for the development/evolution of the species. You explore to share with your kind. Otherwise you could've stayed home (or build up a colony in the Milky Way).

Mass Relays are the solution for any distance in the universe's lore, so of course they should be understood 600 years after the Reaper war and build/used when linking to other galaxies. Before you ask: that new knowledge can be shared via QEC with the other side according to existing lore. 

I also don't think we should divide the fandom into fans of the one and the other and the ME development team shouldn't even think about catering to one side or another. It is way simpler: The Mass Effect storyline went 600 years ahead, so that's why any future game shouldn't start at an earlier time. The timeline gotta move forward whether you tell a story here or there and because of the necessary link with the other galaxy, you can tell whatever story you want. The only important part is, that they come up with a good story, with a great premise from the start. so none of us thinks at the beginning of the next game "what are they even doing there?"

The Milky Way part of the Andromeda Initiative, so the guys staying behind and trying to get up the connection for the last 600 years (and/or sending more people over in that timespan), going against council rules (that likely would fear what could come through a relay with the Andromeda galaxy) could be a starting point with the distress call being a warning from the Andromeda side, that something dangerous is coming in the direction of the Milky Way. Whether that's the Jaardan or the Kett or who-/whatever. A game about the risk of linking to unknown space... 

How is it not addressed with a confirmed 600 year jump in time and N7 simply being BioWare's Mass Effect marketing tool? Anyone who thinks that Shep is returning, should think again. No one should expect a return of Shepard. If it happens and they really play the "he/she was 600 years in a cryo pod"-card, that would be the surprise, not that we will play a different character.

Anyone interested in Mass Effect, whether casual or not should understand by now that N7 doesn't equal Shepard. It's not THAT hard to understand and there is no deciphering needed for that.

I also don't understand how you can be disappointed if you know that it would be a major surprise if they would play the cryo-card and why you are worried about anyone not getting it? I mean even if it would be true that more people are interested because they have a wrong impression right now, that can only help BioWare, because more buzz should help no matter what. So in that case I would say making N7 the de facto logo of Mass Effect was the right choice 10 years ago. Also: there has always been a reveal of the protagonist before a game releases, so anyone who is only interested in playing Shepard (although Mass Effect has moved on in the timeline) should know in advance. So right now is not the time to say anything more than they have IMO.

Speaking of face value: commander Shepard has signed off in 2015:



So I would just turn my expectation around or in other words, I am looking at it from the other side: it would completely shock me if Commander Shepard returns. That would be THE sensation IMO. A sensation that probably would make many people happy/excited, but a sensation that no one should expect nonetheless. Nothing in all trailers/vids so far has given me any sign of a Shepard return.