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Post by fialka on Dec 13, 2016 14:34:33 GMT
'Connected to you permanently' suggests some sort of physical connection to me as well. I have to say, the bits they've teased about SAM are very intriguing to me. I think I said before (or meant to say but never posted?) on the threads that I really didn't want another synth companion, because while I loved Legion (and to a lesser extent EDI) I really wasn't interested in hearing that story again. But SAM sounds like he/it could be a really fresh take on the concept.
I doubt they'll make the same mistake as they did with EDI. I didn't mind that she got a humanoid body, but the way it was so overtly sexualized with the massive boobs and camel toe was just unnecessary. And then to have the men from the crew ogling her like that. Just... ew. Do they lust after naked barbie dolls too? Female mannequins at stores? I work retail so I've seen my fair share of little boys looking up mannequin skirts and giggling, but... those are little boys, not grown men. I would certainly have found the Joker romance a lot less creepy, even cute, if they just made her look normal and not had him lusting over her 'hot robot body' like that. Hopefully if SAM does get a body (I actually think it might be more interesting if he doesn't) it's something cool and alien and machine-like.
But I'm curious about how Dad came to be in possession of an illegal AI like that, and what our relationship to it is prior to receiving it. Did we know about it? Did we know it was more than just a VI if we did? Who developed it? Dad doesn't really strike me as the science-y type (though I suppose he could be). Some connection to our missing mother, perhaps? Or to that juicy family secret they've been teasing about? There's certainly some fun possibilities there.
I do imagine they'll let us have some agency in our relationship with this character, even if we can't remove him. Just as we could treat EDI as this thing to be tolerated because it was useful, or we could treat her as a person we'd come to care for as a friend. Though I actually wouldn't mind if there was some potential for creepiness there - like he could turn on you/try to take over if you're hostile enough to his presence.
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Dec 13, 2016 14:55:21 GMT
I like the voice snippets so far, even if I'm generally not a fan of British (nasal) accent otherwise. It's definitely synthetic. Just a hunch, because of EDI being an "illegal and unique prototype" (and ME2 and ME3) as well as Andromeda launching before ME3, it won't be an AI, maybe not even just the Tempest ship's "computer", but rather the Pathfinder or just Ryder's personal virtual assistant. In his tool, the Nomad, Tempest, Pathfinder HQ. One thing I do not like is the name SAM. Not because I don't like it, but because I wanted to play as a SysRyder with the name Sam/Samantha, but that makes it weird now. Yeah I was thinking of using th ename Sam on my Ryder as an option purely because it kind of clicks with me woith the name Ryder. I may still do so despite the computer name but I do have other names as well so may use one of those instead at least for the first playthrough. |
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Post by Fredward on Dec 13, 2016 15:08:38 GMT
He's probably not gonna be a VI cuz having a deep personal connection to something that fundamentally can't reciprocate is... actually probably an interesting concept to explore, maybe not in ME. He could be a VI that becomes an AI but it would be serious shades-of-EDI which is just pat. He could be a (un?)modified Geth consciousness/platform, your father seems to have been in the military for a while so he's probably had run ins with the Geth before. Stellaris (Paradox game) has a character modifier for when you unlock AI where your explorer/scientists units have an AI assistant, might be the role he's fulfilling. I definitely would like AIs role in AI to be addressed directly then cuz it seems like a not unsubstantial risk to take. If each Pathfinder has their own AI assistant your father might have left SAM behind for you to find once he disappeared/died/went rogue.
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Post by JayKay on Dec 13, 2016 16:36:49 GMT
Unless I'm pretty dramatically misinterpreting this part of the interview: "It is connected to you permanently and was connected to - and knew - your father, Alec." When I first heard that I was just thinking it was an emotional connection rather than a physical one. You are more emotionally connected to Sam than you were to EDI because of Sam's connection to your father. It never occurred to me that it could be a physical connection! I really don't think you could fit the necessary hardware to support an AI inside an implant. Didn't EDI take up a large part of the ship to house her Core? If there's anything implanted I think it would have to just be a comm link of some kind. I don't know about LARGE part. EDI basically took the same room that Liara was in the SR-1 in ME1, maybe a little bigger. But it's possible it's similar to the SR-2 and her chassis in ME3, where the bulk of her was still in the ship, but she could also roam around and basically be in two places at once. All Ryder needs is something similar to an omni-tool with access to stuff like Ryder's scanner. As for the VI, I could see them going for that, or something that sort of blends the two together, to the point where he FEELS real, even though he technically isn't. Again, the Master Chief/Cortana dynamic. |
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Post by azarhal on Dec 13, 2016 16:58:40 GMT
But I'm curious about how Dad came to be in possession of an illegal AI like that, and what our relationship to it is prior to receiving it. Did we know about it? Did we know it was more than just a VI if we did? Who developed it? Dad doesn't really strike me as the science-y type (though I suppose he could be). Some connection to our missing mother, perhaps? Or to that juicy family secret they've been teasing about? There's certainly some fun possibilities there. Dad was part of the Jon Grissom's team that went through the Charon relay in 2149. He was probably already part military, scientist and explorer back then. Could SAM be a souvenir from that expedition? Better yet, when did Earth/Alliance ban AI? Did they have AI around prior to going through the Charon relay and Alec just kept his little AI around secretly? |
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Post by KirkyX on Dec 13, 2016 17:51:26 GMT
Unless I'm pretty dramatically misinterpreting this part of the interview: "It is connected to you permanently and was connected to - and knew - your father, Alec." When I first heard that I was just thinking it was an emotional connection rather than a physical one. You are more emotionally connected to Sam than you were to EDI because of Sam's connection to your father. It never occurred to me that it could be a physical connection! I really don't think you could fit the necessary hardware to support an AI inside an implant. Didn't EDI take up a large part of the ship to house her Core? If there's anything implanted I think it would have to just be a comm link of some kind. Oh, yeah, there's definitely a significant emotional bond there - Fabrice says so in specific terms, later in the quoted paragraph - but to me, the whole passage taken together makes it sound very much like there's an actual, physical connection between Ryder and SAM as well: "Yes and no. Yes, in the sense that SAM is ultimately not a living being - its more of an AI or robot. But it's way broader than EDI - the relationship is way different. SAM handles a number of things as well as your vessel. It is connected to you permanently and was connected to - and knew - your father, Alec. There's a very specific relationship there. It's more of a partner than EDI was - you're way closer emotionally to SAM." I could be wrong, of course, but the way I read that, there's a physical connection between you and SAM that's similar to what exists between SAM and, say, the Tempest, and that bond is distinct from - though almost certainly related to - the emotional bond you share. As for the lore viability of having a complex AI - not that we actually know for sure that SAM is one, I suppose - run on something small enough to be part of your body... Eh, I'm sure they could fudge it for the sake of the story they want to tell if necessary. Oooh, here's a creepy thought: what if some aspect of SAM's programme is actually run by the Pathfinder's brain? |
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Post by javeart on Dec 13, 2016 18:24:42 GMT
As for the lore viability of having a complex AI - not that we actually know for sure that SAM is one, I suppose - run on something small enough to be part of your body... Eh, I'm sure they could fudge it for the sake of the story they want to tell if necessary. Oooh, here's a creepy thought: what if some aspect of SAM's programme is actually run by the Pathfinder's brain?   This thread is setting my expectations for creepiness so high that I can only be disappointed now |
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Post by azarhal on Dec 13, 2016 18:40:05 GMT
As for the lore viability of having a complex AI - not that we actually know for sure that SAM is one, I suppose - run on something small enough to be part of your body... Eh, I'm sure they could fudge it for the sake of the story they want to tell if necessary. Oooh, here's a creepy thought: what if some aspect of SAM's programme is actually run by the Pathfinder's brain? This thread is setting my expectations for creepiness so high that I can only be disappointed now Oh, I'm sure we can come up with something. What if SAM is based off the Ryder twin you aren't playing after the accident at the start of the game and injected into the player character's brain? |
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Post by Element Zero on Dec 13, 2016 23:58:52 GMT
Unless I'm pretty dramatically misinterpreting this part of the interview: "It is connected to you permanently and was connected to - and knew - your father, Alec." When I first heard that I was just thinking it was an emotional connection rather than a physical one. You are more emotionally connected to Sam than you were to EDI because of Sam's connection to your father. It never occurred to me that it could be a physical connection! I really don't think you could fit the necessary hardware to support an AI inside an implant. Didn't EDI take up a large part of the ship to house her Core? If there's anything implanted I think it would have to just be a comm link of some kind. SAM's hardware would likely be aboard Tempest, but the Pathfinder implant(s) would host several special functions that are managed by SAM. That's my guess, at least. We know the Pathfinder implanted tech exists; we know that special Pathfinder abilities are linked to this implanted tech; and we know young Ryder inherits SAM from Alec, the previous Pathfinder. The part about SAM being an application designed specifically to aid Pathfinders, and it's being installed in the Pathfinder implant, seemed like reasonable speculation. |
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Post by Ahriman on Dec 15, 2016 9:31:57 GMT
But I'm curious about how Dad came to be in possession of an illegal AI like that, and what our relationship to it is prior to receiving it. Did we know about it? Did we know it was more than just a VI if we did? Who developed it? Dad doesn't really strike me as the science-y type (though I suppose he could be). Some connection to our missing mother, perhaps? Or to that juicy family secret they've been teasing about? There's certainly some fun possibilities there. Dad was part of the Jon Grissom's team that went through the Charon relay in 2149. He was probably already part military, scientist and explorer back then. Could SAM be a souvenir from that expedition? Better yet, when did Earth/Alliance ban AI? Did they have AI around prior to going through the Charon relay and Alec just kept his little AI around secretly? AI requires Blue Box to function, it's kinda hard to hide this thing in your pocket. |
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by azarhal on Dec 15, 2016 12:26:48 GMT
Dad was part of the Jon Grissom's team that went through the Charon relay in 2149. He was probably already part military, scientist and explorer back then. Could SAM be a souvenir from that expedition? Better yet, when did Earth/Alliance ban AI? Did they have AI around prior to going through the Charon relay and Alec just kept his little AI around secretly? AI requires Blue Box to function, it's kinda hard to hide this thing in your pocket. But a communicator can hide in your pocket. |
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Dec 16, 2016 17:17:15 GMT
Do we get the option for a female voice? I prefer a female voice.
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Post by Vall on Dec 20, 2016 13:01:58 GMT
Do we get the option for a female voice? I prefer a female voice. I doubt it, it will be treated same as any other character. And you didn't have option for male voiced EDI. |
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Post by Muddy Boots on Dec 21, 2016 19:24:50 GMT
I'm not sure why you are comparing SAM to MamaRyder. Do you mean you think it'll try to fill that role or that it'll be like her? Because I don't get that at all.
Someone beat me to saying it in the twitter thread, but I could see SAM being more like JARVIS.
I was speculating that SAM was around pre-trip to Andromeda and Alec had it raise the twins while he was away on duty (he's the first N7 we see with "time" for a family, so I suspect he wasn't around much). Effectively making SAM a surrogate parent to the twins and it gives them an emotional connection to it that isn't just "it used to be used by my father". I also got the crazy idea that SAM isn't an artificial intelligence, but a synthetic based off the real Mama Ryder's brain, but that's another story and might be too crazy. I wondered this as well, once they started talking about a closer relationship than you would have with your average AI/VI. But then wouldn't it have mom's voice track? |
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by azarhal on Dec 21, 2016 20:18:02 GMT
I was speculating that SAM was around pre-trip to Andromeda and Alec had it raise the twins while he was away on duty (he's the first N7 we see with "time" for a family, so I suspect he wasn't around much). Effectively making SAM a surrogate parent to the twins and it gives them an emotional connection to it that isn't just "it used to be used by my father". I also got the crazy idea that SAM isn't an artificial intelligence, but a synthetic based off the real Mama Ryder's brain, but that's another story and might be too crazy. I wondered this as well, once they started talking about a closer relationship than you would have with your average AI/VI. But then wouldn't it have mom's voice track? You don't think people who know Alex wouldn't have found it weird to hear is dead/ex/whatever wife whenever SAM is talking? Although, nothing stop "mom" from having been a guy either.  |
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Post by Muddy Boots on Dec 21, 2016 20:40:09 GMT
I wondered this as well, once they started talking about a closer relationship than you would have with your average AI/VI. But then wouldn't it have mom's voice track? You don't think people who know Alex wouldn't have found it weird to hear is dead/ex/whatever wife whenever SAM is talking? Although, nothing stop "mom" from having been a guy either. True, she could have been a guy. I don't think it would be weird for Alec to hear the dead spouse's voice. Who knows, it might be a comfort to him and the kids to hear her. Are we sure she's even dead and not just left behind? I don't think they ever mentioned Mom. Maybe she or he is part of this family mystery that was mentioned by one of the devs. |
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by azarhal on Dec 22, 2016 3:55:15 GMT
You don't think people who know Alex wouldn't have found it weird to hear is dead/ex/whatever wife whenever SAM is talking? Although, nothing stop "mom" from having been a guy either. True, she could have been a guy. I don't think it would be weird for Alec to hear the dead spouse's voice. Who knows, it might be a comfort to him and the kids to hear her. Are we sure she's even dead and not just left behind? I don't think they ever mentioned Mom. Maybe she or he is part of this family mystery that was mentioned by one of the devs. I'm not talking about Alec, but about his coworkers and others. Unless SAM isn't heard by anyone but Alec and the kids and which case they all look crazy for speaking out load to someone called SAM, lol. As for RyderMom, she is a total mystery. |
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Post by Muddy Boots on Dec 22, 2016 13:59:24 GMT
True, she could have been a guy. I don't think it would be weird for Alec to hear the dead spouse's voice. Who knows, it might be a comfort to him and the kids to hear her. Are we sure she's even dead and not just left behind? I don't think they ever mentioned Mom. Maybe she or he is part of this family mystery that was mentioned by one of the devs. I'm not talking about Alec, but about his coworkers and others. Unless SAM isn't heard by anyone but Alec and the kids and which case they all look crazy for speaking out load to someone called SAM, lol. As for RyderMom, she is a total mystery. Gotcha. I can see it now...the entire crew wondering what king of nutcase they're supposed to be working with. Maybe SAM was a grandparent. We just have to wait to find out, I guess. |
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Post by Sifr on Dec 25, 2016 4:27:09 GMT
Dad was part of the Jon Grissom's team that went through the Charon relay in 2149. He was probably already part military, scientist and explorer back then. Could SAM be a souvenir from that expedition? Better yet, when did Earth/Alliance ban AI? Did they have AI around prior to going through the Charon relay and Alec just kept his little AI around secretly? I do like the idea that if SAM is an Artificial Intelligence, he might be a relic from before the ban on AI research. The ban probably was one of the many stipulations that was required in order for Humanity to join the Council races following the First Contact War, along with signing the Treaty of Farixen to limit their dreadnought size. Perhaps Alec could justify secretly keeping SAM around by exploiting a few legal loopholes? The law might be firm that no-one is allowed to create Artificial Intelligence... but the law might say nothing to suggest it retroactively applies to Artificial Intelligences that already exist. But even if it does retroactively apply, how has he broken that law, if he didn't create SAM in the first place? |
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by dmc1001 on Dec 25, 2016 16:50:45 GMT
Dad was part of the Jon Grissom's team that went through the Charon relay in 2149. He was probably already part military, scientist and explorer back then. Could SAM be a souvenir from that expedition? Better yet, when did Earth/Alliance ban AI? Did they have AI around prior to going through the Charon relay and Alec just kept his little AI around secretly? I do like the idea that if SAM is an Artificial Intelligence, he might be a relic from before the ban on AI research. The ban probably was one of the many stipulations that was required in order for Humanity to join the Council races following the First Contact War, along with signing the Treaty of Farixen to limit their dreadnought size. Wasn't the Alliance working on AI as recently as ME1? I'm sure they'll say they just meant to create an extremely complex VI but, then, that seems to be what AI are anyway. The result was EDI. You could say this was a Cerberus action but pre-modified version of EDI was also created at an Alliance facility on Luna ~2183. (This further makes the lore confusing about Cerberus having a "recent" break from the Alliance in ME1 to other media saying otherwise.) Anyway, it seems like the Alliance continued to do AI research long after joining with the Council races. I think it would be interesting if SAM sort of came about as an AI without necessarily any intention of that being the case. If the limits kept getting pushed to make a VI that could handle anything thrown at it in a strange galaxy - then, at some point, it awakens to sentience. How does the crew handle it? Might be too much going on in MEA to properly handle that but perhaps in a future game it could be touched on. |
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Post by Sifr on Dec 25, 2016 17:21:33 GMT
I think it would be interesting if SAM sort of came about as an AI without necessarily any intention of that being the case. If the limits kept getting pushed to make a VI that could handle anything thrown at it in a strange galaxy - then, at some point, it awakens to sentience. How does the crew handle it? Might be too much going on in MEA to properly handle that but perhaps in a future game it could be touched on. What if SAM was a experimental VI that had been left "awake" for the entire trip to Andromeda to monitor the ship, causing him to develop true sentience by the time the colonists finally arrived in the new galaxy? Sort of like the Mass Effect equivalent of characters like WALL-E, or Holly and Kryten in Red Dwarf? All of them ended up slightly breaking their original programming and developing a few strange quirks after prolonged isolation. After 700 years by himself, WALL-E had begun collecting odd bits of junk rather than recycling it. Spending 3 million years alone after the death of the entire Red Dwarf crew (bar Lister in stasis) caused Holly to end up going slightly senile. Similarly, Kryten was discovered still tending to the skeletons of his crew, in complete denial that they'd all since died of old age. |
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by dmc1001 on Dec 25, 2016 17:24:35 GMT
I could imagine a "quirk" developing that SAM says is just something in the programming gone awry and doesn't actually acknowledge sentience. People around question if SAM is alive but SAM plays dumb.
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Post by geometricflowers on Dec 26, 2016 7:16:42 GMT
I'd like SAM to be kind of like Jarvis from Iron Man. He had his own unique personality, but in many ways he was an extension of Tony, controlling his building and armor upon command.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2016 0:43:24 GMT
Ignoring that the project is apparently already infested by nefarious intergalactic criminals smuggling illegal tech, this toaster had better be obedient and respectful of its rightful masters.
If it starts going all robo Pinnochio, we're gonna have problems. After all the time, resources and energy required to develop AIs it would be a shame if this one happened to malfunction in such a manner, and as a result suffered an.......unfortunate incident involving the airlock.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 28, 2016 1:02:30 GMT
Ignoring that the project is apparently already infested by nefarious intergalactic criminals smuggling illegal tech, this toaster had better be obedient and respectful of its rightful masters. If it starts going all robo Pinnochio, we're gonna have problems. After all the time, resources and energy required to develop AIs it would be a shame if this one happened to malfunction in such a manner, and as a result suffered an.......unfortunate incident involving the airlock. Are you referring to the people that left the nexus as shown in the VGA trailer? We don't even know if SAM has a body, which I personally doubt. In any case EDI, not withstanding my opinions on her body, served Shepard and the people of the Normandy well. At worst she might've been considered a bit annoying. The same might happen for SAM, but I doubt you'll have the option to throw it out of the airlock. I wonder what will be your opinion if it's linked permanently in some way with Ryder. |
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This thread is setting my expectations for creepiness so high that I can only be disappointed now 
