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Post by anarchy65 on Oct 22, 2017 4:08:17 GMT
Arya judged a dead Florianne on the Iron Throne, which was most bizarre. However, using her historical knowledge, the girl mentioned a precedent and gave the woman's lands to the Orlesian crown. Where did the girl get all this historical knowledge, some would wonder? It almost seems as she was a noble girl before... Yet the time finally came to assault Adamant. She took with her Vivienne, Cassandra and her good friend Dorian. She had never been in a battle before, but... a girl once had a father who told her about a lot of battles. Her daggers, Needle and Jon, made quick work of both demons and Grey Wardens. She told them to surrender, which they wouldn't do, so she cutted them down. She also met Hawke during the attack. She disgusted him. In another life, he was Theon Greyjoy, but here he was Theon Hawke. She knew what he did to Winterfell, to Robb, to her brothers... even if it was another girl, she remembered. The North remembered. In the end, she met Commander Clarel, and noticed she was being played when she said she thought Corypheus was dead. Arya urged them to think about the Grey Warden's legacy, which reminded her that once she had a brother called Jon Snow that served in an order very similar to the Grey Wardens... she felt she had to help them. For Jon, for her friend Blackwall, for Alistair. They turned on the Tevinter magister to help her. It seemed victory was close... until the dragon came. But when the dragon was about to attack... something happened Arya: Leliana! Are you here to help us? Leliana: No Inquisitor, I just wanted to inform you that my report on the war table mission is ready. Arya: Oh well... quick as a snake! *runs away* She ran as fast as she could, Clarel attacked the dragon before she died, but Arya fell... and now, somehow, she was in the Fade, with Alistair, Theon and all the others. What will she do now?!
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Post by Exile Isan on Oct 22, 2017 4:13:51 GMT
How many times did you play? I like that part of the game. Only once I banished the Wardens. I played it the other day, maybe a week ago? But with a different character, (my two-handed warrior Elisabeth). This time I played it through with my elven archer rogue/artificer, Saffana. Now, I'm off to craft Saffa some epic armor.
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Post by dmc1001 on Oct 22, 2017 4:19:30 GMT
My Dalish elf rogue went saved Crestwood from the onslaught of undead and fixed everything that needed fixing. Then he headed into the Emerald Graves, making sure to bring Solas and Sera along. Sera has zero appreciation for it and Solus is very quiet. Did stop some Templars from smuggling red lyrium out of the area to their base.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 11:15:22 GMT
Is this hair a mod? Looks awesome On my PC? Yes, thanks. I used the mod "Ferelden Models" to create my last two Player Characters. And this, in turn, required the installation of numerous hair mods to support it. I couldn't tell you which mod Boudica's hair came from. i wanted to try that mod, but wasn't sure, you can tweak those heads? (i mean, change nose, change mouth, change eyes form etc) or as they are premade, can't do anything else?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 11:23:30 GMT
Played Here Lies the Abyss (again) Different character though. And I decided to banish the Wardens this time. How many times did you play? I like that part of the game. Only once I banished the Wardens. I love people banishing the Orlesian Wardens, (i don't quite understand why some people still confuse or believe that they are Fereldan Wardens tho, when it's clearly Orlesian ones, the Fereldan Wardens had nothing to do with this and it's clearly stated that they are missing) it's the right thing to do, that way, the Inquisition can't intervene in Grey Wardens business when weisshaupt fortress goes silent in the epilogue slides. But i can understand that some take pity on them and can make an alliance, maybe it's nostalgia from past games or who knows, can be a bunch of reasons, tho it's bad, because then, the Inquisition intervenes in business and they don't have any right to do it, you made your hero action of the day, now begone.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 22, 2017 11:33:57 GMT
How many times did you play? I like that part of the game. Only once I banished the Wardens. I love people banishing the Orlesian Wardens, (i don't quite understand why some people still confuse or believe that they are Fereldan Wardens tho, when it's clearly Orlesian ones, the Fereldan Wardens had nothing to do with this and it's clearly stated that they are missing) it's the right thing to do, that way, the Inquisition can't intervene in Grey Wardens business when weisshaupt fortress goes silent in the epilogue slides. But i can understand that some take pity on them and can make an alliance, tho it's bad, because then, the Inquisition intervenes in business and they don't have any right to do it, you made your hero action of the day, now begone. I suppose both are a well-reasoned decision at the moment. These wardens can be dangerous, while Corypheus lives, but even can help to the Inquisition.
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Post by deadlydwarf on Oct 22, 2017 11:43:25 GMT
On my PC? Yes, thanks. I used the mod "Ferelden Models" to create my last two Player Characters. And this, in turn, required the installation of numerous hair mods to support it. I couldn't tell you which mod Boudica's hair came from. i wanted to try that mod, but wasn't sure, you can tweak those heads? or as they are premade, can't do anything else? They have both mor and mop versions of all those faces. I used the mor version which added the various heads as additional presets which were completely adjustable. The only problem is that even after installing every single required mod - and there are a ton of them - some of the heads weren't usable (glassy skin or eyes, etc.). As it happened with Boudica, I found a usable head that had no hair, so I added the hair that I liked. If I had wanted to, I could've tweaked the face more.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 11:46:05 GMT
I love people banishing the Orlesian Wardens, (i don't quite understand why some people still confuse or believe that they are Fereldan Wardens tho, when it's clearly Orlesian ones, the Fereldan Wardens had nothing to do with this and it's clearly stated that they are missing) it's the right thing to do, that way, the Inquisition can't intervene in Grey Wardens business when weisshaupt fortress goes silent in the epilogue slides. But i can understand that some take pity on them and can make an alliance, tho it's bad, because then, the Inquisition intervenes in business and they don't have any right to do it, you made your hero action of the day, now begone. I suppose both are a well-reasoned decision at the moment. These wardens can be dangerous, while Corypheus lives, but even can help to the Inquisition. Yes, i suppose. But i'll admit it, i quite enjoyed the hate Wardens got from the newcomers fanbase and the ones that switched opinion about them. I like to portrait in my head canon, Grey Wardens vs Inquisition as the Wardens got "antagonized", and the HoF just obliterates them to dust.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 11:48:28 GMT
i wanted to try that mod, but wasn't sure, you can tweak those heads? or as they are premade, can't do anything else? They have both mor and mop versions of all those faces. I used the mor version which added the various heads as additional presets which were completely adjustable. The only problem is that even after installing every single required mod - and there are a ton of them - some of the heads weren't usable (glassy skin or eyes, etc.). As it happened with Boudica, I found a usable head that had no hair, so I added the hair that I liked. If I had wanted to, I could've tweaked the face more. nice, good to know, i shall take a look, cause it's quite a nice mod to be honest, very good looking.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 22, 2017 12:01:13 GMT
I suppose both are a well-reasoned decision at the moment. These wardens can be dangerous, while Corypheus lives, but even can help to the Inquisition. Yes, i suppose. But i'll admit it, i quite enjoyed the hate Wardens got from the newcomers fanbase and the ones that switched opinion about them. I like to portrait in my head canon, Grey Wardens vs Inquisition as the Wardens got "antagonized", and the HoF just obliterates them to dust. Haha, indeed! The whole Warden-issue was presented stupidly. Who didn't played the previous games, just can't imagine, why this dangerous outlaw "cult" exists (Cole, Solas, Cassandra, Vivienne also suggest that – Varric's biased). Hawke also seems hate the Wardens in the Inquisition, the Wardens, while he knows (must know), why they are important... even if of course, s/he has bad feeling toward their methods.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 12:42:00 GMT
Catilina Orsino didn't know, that he was a serial killer.Templars didn't know their leader went corrupt. You're making an allowance for Orsini's crime that he didn't know. But with Templars no there is no excuse for them not knowing. How didn't Orsini know? He had full access to research which he dubbed as criminal and then became a monster based on that research. Just like the Templars he must have suspected. But he does nothing. It's OK for Orisini and not OK for Templars. I never searched for any excuse to Anders. I understand his position, and agree with him.When you write a long post explaining Ander's point of view you call it 'understanding it.' I have written plenty of long posts explaining why Cullen didn't see through Meredith earlier - but somehow those posts are not considered me understanding his point of view, they get shot down with 'those crimes are terrible anyway and no excuse for them.' So, when I explain Cullen's position it's 'excuses.' When you explain Ander's position it's 'understanding his point of view.' Even though I can dismiss all those arguments for Anders just like you're dismissing mine by saying how blowing up the church is a horrible crime no matter what.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 22, 2017 13:28:03 GMT
Orsino didn't know, that he was a serial killer.Templars didn't know their leader went corrupt.You're making an allowance for Orsini's crime that he didn't know. But with Templars no there is no excuse for them not knowing. How didn't Orsini know? He had full access to research which he dubbed as criminal. Just like the Templars he must have suspected. But he does nothing. It's OK for Orisini and not OK for Templars. I never searched for any excuse to Anders. I understand his position, and agree with him.When you write a long post explaining Ander's point of view you call it "understanding it." I have written plenty of long posts explaining why Cullen didn't see through Meredith earlier - but somehow those posts are not considered me understanding his point of view, they get shot down with "those crimes are terrible anyway and no excuse for them." So, when I explain Cullen's position it's 'excuses.' When you explain Ander's position it's 'understanding his point of view.' Even though I can dismiss all those arguments for Anders just like your dismissing mine by saying how blowing up the church is a horrible crime no matter what. We just walk round around. My standpoint will never change: a corrupt, evil system can't be acceptable, who serves it, can be a good person, who doesn't recognize the system's evil, is no matter: s/he serves the evil, even if thinks, this is necessary (Cassandra admitted: she before thought, the Tranquility is a necessary evil...) The Templars were misled by the Chantry, as many people. You can argue, what Anders is similar: a good man, who used terrible tool against this evil system, and yes, still committed murder. But Hawke can kill Anders, and he will understand it. Even he knew, that his tool was cruel, was murder. (What a terrible idea to make Hawke an executioner!) But Elthina, for example, while admitted, she doesn't want to live in this PRISON (locked in the Gallows), she said, this is necessary, and both sides have flaws. This viewpoint, what the game wants to suggest, is totally wrong. This two side is not equally wrong. The oppression isn't grey morality(TM). The Chantry's system is clearly evil. The mages are this system's victim (and the Templars too!) You can say, that Anders's a criminal, but he still right. While I can understand Cullen's viewpoint and fear, he's still not right. The law for him was still clear: don't tranquilize Harrowed mages. This law is Templar law, Chantry law: Cullen's law, which he accepted, to which he swore. And was clear, that Meredith broke this law. (Cullen said in the Inquisition, that for lesser "sins" than Maddox's(!) was mages tranquilized...). You can't say, he didn't know about Meredith's crimes... Cullen has a spine, he's a good man, who joined the Order for protecting people. He tried to stay on this way. I don't judge him, but he needs excuse.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 13:43:03 GMT
And you just ignored my point.
When we talk about Orsini not knowing you say it's was reason a and b and c why he didn't know - so it makes it ok. But, when someone gives reasons a, b or c why Templars wouldn't know - you say still not ok. You're judging two parties unequally.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 22, 2017 13:47:13 GMT
And you just ignored my point. When we talk about Orsini not knowing you say it's was reason a and b and c why he didn't know - so it makes it ok. But, when someone gives reasons a, b or c why Templars wouldn't know - you say still not ok. You're judging two parties unequally. Because these two parties aren't equal. I said already. I even wrote, why I can't consider Orsino's silence as crime, and why I consider Meredith's support is a crime. This is a double standard, yes, in a world, where the double standard rules. I"m just trying to fit to the laws of this world.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 14:07:44 GMT
And you just ignored my point. When we talk about Orsini not knowing you say it's was reason a and b and c why he didn't know - so it makes it ok. But, when someone gives reasons a, b or c why Templars wouldn't know - you say still not ok. You're judging two parties unequally. Because these two parties aren't equal. I said already. I even wrote, why I can't consider Orsino's silence as crime, and why I consider Meredith's support is a crime. Yes you did. You're willing to take personal circumstances into account for Orsini, but for Templars no matter which argument is invoked it's just not good enough. Orsini knew that Q wrote those books. When you side with Templars he says, 'Initially I dismissed Q's research as dangerous...' Those weren't just books Q owned - Orsini knew Q had written them. And in order to write about those experiments you have to conduct them. He knew the Q was dangerous. He knew those experiment belonged to Q. It wasn't just random exchange of knowledge. There is no excuse for him either. As for those mages supposedly committing suicide, to conduct a ritual this powerful you need life force, otherwise, why won't blood mages use corpses instead of killing people. When you enter the room and Orsini claims that it's first time he's done it, Meredith points out that this specific ritual is extremely complex and a novice who'd never done it couldn't just yolo it. At the very least he had studied it extremely closely. You take Orsini's word as gospel of truth. He could be twisting the truth.
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Post by phoray on Oct 22, 2017 14:18:32 GMT
And you just ignored my point. When we talk about Orsini not knowing you say it's was reason a and b and c why he didn't know - so it makes it ok. But, when someone gives reasons a, b or c why Templars wouldn't know - you say still not ok. You're judging two parties unequally. I've not totally watched this whole discussion, but Orsino is locked in a tower with limited rights to rebuke even at the highest echoleons of power in the tower: First Enchanter. In a building he was never allowed to leave due to birth. All the Templars voluntarily choose to train and work as Templars.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 14:27:25 GMT
And you just ignored my point. When we talk about Orsini not knowing you say it's was reason a and b and c why he didn't know - so it makes it ok. But, when someone gives reasons a, b or c why Templars wouldn't know - you say still not ok. You're judging two parties unequally. I've not totally watched this whole discussion, but Orsino is locked in a tower with limited rights to rebuke even at the highest echoleons of power in the tower: First Enchanter. In a building he was never allowed to leave due to birth. All the Templars voluntarily choose to train and work as Templars. Of course, but society views it as good/prestigious to work as Templars. Cullen didn't dream becoming a Templar because he wanted to kick mages around, he wanted to become a Templar because he had an illusion that they are heroic and will protect innocent people from harm. Templars don't recruit students under the motto of, 'hey let oppress someone.' They recruit them on the basis of 'you will serve as the defenders of the nation.' The Chantry is horrible towards Templars too. Because it completely brainwashes them, turns drug addict and when Templars get hurt in the line of duty they are simply abandoned to die in the dumpster by the order they have dedicated their entire life to.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 22, 2017 14:27:31 GMT
Because these two parties aren't equal. I said already. I even wrote, why I can't consider Orsino's silence as crime, and why I consider Meredith's support is a crime. Yes you did. You're willing to take personal circumstances into account for Orsini, but for Templars no matter which argument is invoked it's just not good enough. Orsini knew that Q wrote those books. When you side with Templars he says, 'Initially I dismissed Q's research as dangerous...' Those weren't just books Q owned - Orsini knew Q had written them. And in order to write about those experiments you have to conduct them. He knew the Q was dangerous. He knew those experiment belonged to Q. It wasn't just random exchange of knowledge. There is no excuse for him either. As for those mages supposedly committing suicide, to conduct a ritual this powerful you need life force, otherwise, why won't blood mages use corpses instead of killing people. When you enter the room and Orsini claims that it's first time he's done it, Meredith points out that this specific ritual is extremely complex and a novice who'd never done it couldn't just yolo it. At the very least he had studied it extremely closely. You take Orsini's word as gospel of truth. He could be twisting the truth. I know the Templar side, and I already wrote my answers. This will not change. Sorry.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 22, 2017 14:30:33 GMT
I've not totally watched this whole discussion, but Orsino is locked in a tower with limited rights to rebuke even at the highest echoleons of power in the tower: First Enchanter. In a building he was never allowed to leave due to birth. All the Templars voluntarily choose to train and work as Templars. Of course, but society views it as good/prestigious to work as Templars. Cullen didn't dream becoming a Templar because he wanted to kick mages around, he wanted to become a Templar because he had an illusion that they are heroic and will protect innocent people from harm. Templars don't recruit students under the motto of, 'hey let oppress someone.' They recruit them on the basis of 'you will serve as the defenders of the nation.' The Chantry is horrible towards Templars too. Because it completely brainwashes them, turns drug addict and when Templars get hurt in the line of duty they are simply abandoned to die in the dumpster by the order they have dedicated their entire life to.And this a good point to Anders. The system is unacceptable. Nobody deserves to become a drooling miserable human wreck.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 14:50:24 GMT
Of course, but society views it as good/prestigious to work as Templars. Cullen didn't dream becoming a Templar because he wanted to kick mages around, he wanted to become a Templar because he had an illusion that they are heroic and will protect innocent people from harm. Templars don't recruit students under the motto of, 'hey let oppress someone.' They recruit them on the basis of 'you will serve as the defenders of the nation.' The Chantry is horrible towards Templars too. Because it completely brainwashes them, turns drug addict and when Templars get hurt in the line of duty they are simply abandoned to die in the dumpster by the order they have dedicated their entire life to.And this a good point to Anders. The system is unacceptable. Nobody deserves to become a drooling miserable human wreck. Our discussion originated from a point where Hawke is at the crossroads who to side with Mages or Templars. I said I don't enjoy siding with either because this leads to killing innocents no matter what. You countered that Templars aren't innocent. Well good for you. That makes your choice easier because you're siding with innocent mages and you're ok with killing the Templars because you believe they're automatically guilty for choosing a profession as a Templar no matter what. It doesn't change my point of view. For me siding with mages has problems too. a) I would have to kill Templars. Unlike you, I believe a lot of the men in that group don't deserve to die. I feel bad for killing them. b ) When I side with mages, I don't just side with innocent mages, I side with the entire group that contains blood mages and some of those blood mages will hide behind Hawke and run away in mayhem to continue their crimes.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 22, 2017 14:59:30 GMT
And this a good point to Anders. The system is unacceptable. Nobody deserves to become a drooling miserable human wreck. Our discussion originated from a point where Hawke is at the crossroads who to side with Mages or Templars. I said I don't enjoy siding with either because this leads to killing innocents no matter what. You countered that Templars aren't innocent. Well good for you. That makes your choice easier because you're siding with innocent mages and you're ok with killing the Templars because you believe they're automatically guilty for choosing a profession as a Templar no matter what. It doesn't change my point of view. For me siding with mages has problems too. a) I would have to kill Templars. Unlike you, I believe a lot of the men in that group don't deserve to die. I feel bad for killing them. b ) When I side with mages, I don't just side with innocent mages, I side with the entire group that contains blood mages and some of those blood mages will hide behind Hawke and run away in mayhem to continue their crimes. I always have a problem with killing innocents. In a war, most of the people are innocents, on both sides, you're right about it. But I even said: Hawke can't save everyone. Hawke and even Orsino offered the peace, Meredith was who refused. Meredith didn't need Anders' head, she comfortable with Anders, if he fights on her side. Meredith needed every mages' head, and this was not a sudden idea. We can know that if we speak with this Templar criminal, named Karras, at the Gallows, that Meredith planned the Annulment long ago, and already sent the request.
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Post by fylimar on Oct 22, 2017 15:20:30 GMT
Did you steal Orsini's staff? D: I suppose Orsino doesn't really miss that staff anymore... He is very much alive in my games - thanks to the mod, that erase the Harvester scene, if you side with the mages. In my headcanon, he had joined the inquisition and is helping in teh fight against Corypheus. And Sol and Alain and probably Mashas brother, that young templar recruit, you save ... I like my continuity Jyoti was busy today. She helped Varric deal with his sorry excuse of a brother - and Bartrand really did leave a mess in form of a blood bath. Still, neither Jyoti nor Varric could kill him, so they brought him to an asylum and are now trying to find that idol, he has sold to some unknown person. After that, she promised that nice templar Emeric, who was busy trying to solve the mystery of the vanished women for three years now, to look into one Gascard DuPuis. Emeric is convinced, Gascard is the murderer. Aveline not so much. So Jyoti thought it best, to bring Aveline along. They were met by demons in the entrance hall. After that, Aveline was adamant to find this DuPuis guy. They searched the whole mansion, found some thank note from an unknown writer about a shipment of something and then a room full of women's clothes. And then that coniving shit had the guts to tell the guard captain and her friends, that he has nothing to do with the disappearances - yeah right, go to hell. After they dealt with DuPuis, tehy went to the Gallows, to tell Emeric, that he was right all along, but a young recruit told them, that Emeric left to meet with Hawke and even showed them a message, which Hawke didn't send - it was a busy night at the Hanged Man last night, but Jyoti would still have remembered.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 15:35:33 GMT
I know the Templar side, and I already wrote my answers. This will not change. Sorry.
I wasn’t trying to change your point of view. You’re the one who attacked one of the points I was discussing.
All I said was how I feel bad for killing the Templars too in that situation.
You went on to write accusing paragraphs how all Templars are in league with the evil Chantry and thus it’s all good for killing them in that situation.
It sounds like it makes you angry when people discuss any other alternative than siding with mages. You’re the one who tried to change my point of view without even knowing what my point of view is.
Funny part is, I said earlier that after siding with Tempars the choice of siding with mages seems like a better one. That doesn’t mean I have to be all joyful about killing Templars, especially when there are personal examples like Carver and Cullen being amongst them.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by fylimar on Oct 22, 2017 15:53:27 GMT
adonniel Orsin o, not Orsini. And the end fight is different if you chose the mages side: @melbellas video showed a Hawke, sided with the mages. There the dead mages where killed by the templars in the fight before. If you side with the templars, some of the mages are indeed still alive and are killed by Orsinos spell. I think, Alain always survives (the young mage from Starkhaven, who surrendered himself in Act of Mercy) As I said in my post before, the whole Harvester thing doesn't make sense. The Harvester is a mythological creature, a flesh golem, no one apart from a few dwarves and a certain Warden commander knew anything about. And as GoA showed us, it's hard to make. Yeah, there were assholes on both sides, templars and mages. And it is sad, that a lot of nice people paid the price - Emeric and Ser Thrask for example, Karl and probably Sol (he wasn't in teh end scene, but apart from Alain and Bethany, I don't see any other mage character alive at the end)
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by fylimar on Oct 22, 2017 16:03:12 GMT
Our discussion originated from a point where Hawke is at the crossroads who to side with Mages or Templars. I said I don't enjoy siding with either because this leads to killing innocents no matter what. You countered that Templars aren't innocent. Well good for you. That makes your choice easier because you're siding with innocent mages and you're ok with killing the Templars because you believe they're automatically guilty for choosing a profession as a Templar no matter what. It doesn't change my point of view. For me siding with mages has problems too. a) I would have to kill Templars. Unlike you, I believe a lot of the men in that group don't deserve to die. I feel bad for killing them. b ) When I side with mages, I don't just side with innocent mages, I side with the entire group that contains blood mages and some of those blood mages will hide behind Hawke and run away in mayhem to continue their crimes. I always have a problem with killing innocents. In a war, most of the people are innocents, on both sides, you're right about it. But I even said: Hawke can't save everyone. Hawke and even Orsino offered the peace, Meredith was who refused. Meredith didn't need Anders' head, she comfortable with Anders, if he fights on her side. Meredith needed every mages' head, and this was not a sudden idea. We can know that if we speak with this Templar criminal, named Karras, at the Gallows, that Meredith planned the Annulment long ago, and already sent the request. That's something, I never understood: Why would Meredith not kill Anders herself? I always found it unfair, that everyone is screaming at my Hawkes to kill him, when Hawke has no autority at all. But Meredith has, she just doesn't act on it. I know, she was crazy from the red lyrium and was seeing the future mage world domination, but I would have thought, she would have started with Anders and then accuses Orsino and the other circle mages of being accomplices. That would have made more sense. I know gamewise, it would have eliminated the only healer, if Hawke isn't a spirit healer, but that isn't a good reason. At the very least, Meredith should have taken Anders into custody and then Hawke could have decided to free him before facing Meredith - problem solved and the whole story would have been much more believable (plus no Sebastian crybaby scene in the end - he, too, should go scream at Meredith).
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