Draining Dragon
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Draining Dragon
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 6, 2017 21:36:12 GMT
I’ve talked about this proposal a bit in the Chasing the Stars thread and it seemed to get a generally positive reception, so I figured I would make a separate thread to discuss it.
In order to provide guidelines for roleplaying, I thought it would be cool and helpful to represent character abilities with numeric values. Think of the SPECIAL system from Fallout, or the Ability Scores of Dungeons & Dragons. It wouldn’t need to be a straitjacket or anywhere near as extensive as D&D (I'm not looking for skill checks or anything like that), but it would let us compare different characters and understand how effectively they would deal with different situations. It would also make it easier for those who are familiar with traditional roleplaying games to get involved in the RP scene on the forum. In keeping with the Mass Effect theme, I came up with the following areas of expertise (and related skills):
Combat Prowess: This reflects a character’s ability to handle him or herself in a direct fight. Tough characters tend to have higher Combat Prowess. Specific skills include Endurance, Strength, and Weapons. -The Endurance skill is an indicator of your character's overall health, stamina, resistance to disease, and ability to wear armor. Fortitude is a power from this skill. -The Strength skill is an indicator of your character's melee combat ability, carrying capacity, and ability to lift weight. Omni-blade attacks are related to this skill. -The Weapons skill is an indicator of proficiency with different types of weapons and ammunition. The subcategories of weapons are Pistol, SMG, Sniper Rifle, Assault Rifle, Shotgun, Heavy, Explosive, and Low-Tech. Weapon Familiarity is indicated separately. Concussive Shot is a power from this skill.
Tech Prowess: This reflects a character’s ability to make use of general technology, including the omni-tool. Smart characters tend to have higher Tech Prowess. Specific skills include Electronics, Medicine, and Fabrication. -The Electronics skill is an indicator of your character's skill with computers, hacking, and AIs. Sabotage is a power from this skill. -The Medicine skill is an indicator of your character's knowledge of first aid and the anatomy of different creatures. Unity is a power from this skill. -The Fabrication skill is an indicator of how well you can assemble and repair things. Combat Drone is a power from this skill.
Biotic Prowess: This reflects a character’s ability to manipulate dark energy. Strong-willed characters tend to have higher Biotic Prowess, though most people have no biotic abilities at all. Specific skills include Telekinesis, Kinetic Fields, and Spatial Distortion*. -The Telekinesis skill indicates how well you can move objects without touching them. Pull is a power from this skill. -The Kinetic Fields skill indicates how well you can generate biotic barriers. Barrier is a power from this skill. -The Spatial Distortion skill indicates how well you can use shifting Mass Effect fields to rip objects apart. Singularity is a power from this skill.
Tactical Prowess: This reflects a character’s ability to operate in the field. Agile characters tend to have higher Tactical Prowess. Specific skills include Stealth, Perception, and Mobility. -The Stealth skill indicates how effectively you can sneak and evade detection. Tactical Cloak is a power from this skill. -The Perception skill indicates how aware you are of your surroundings and your ability to sense when things aren't right. Tactical Scan is a power from this skill. -The Mobility skill indicates your talent for dodging and maneuvering in the battlefield. The rolling and dodging movement options from ME3 are examples of this skill.
Social Prowess: This reflects a character’s ability to influence others. Charismatic characters tend to have higher Social Prowess. Specific skills include Charm, Intimidate, and Bluff. -The Charm skill indicates your talent for inspiring positive feelings and loyalty in others. Paragon interrupts from Mass Effect 2 and 3 are examples of this skill. -The Intimidate skill indicates your talent for inspiring negative feelings and fear in others. Renegade interrupts from Mass Effect 2 and 3 are examples of this skill. -The Bluff skill indicates your talent for misleading others.
*Shamelessly ripped from the ME wiki
For regular characters, these areas of expertise would be tracked on a 0-10 scale. I’ll provide a scale to give an idea of what each level entail. I go into more detail on the first five, and you can figure the rest out from there.
1: Inept -Combat: completely out of shape and literally cannot aim to save your life -Tech: unable to use even the simplest machine without assistance -Biotic: has no biotic abilities -Tactical: you're clumsy and lack any kind of awareness of what is around you -Social: unable to communicate in any meaningful fashion 2: Below Average (Child) -Combat: you will lose just about any fight, but you could at least inconvenience your opponent -Tech: technology confuses you, but you manage -Biotic: has very weak biotic potential and would likely struggle to manifest any powers at this point, even with training -Tactical: you have a short attention span and are still fairly clumsy -Social: you can talk to people but you can't guarantee they'll listen 3: Average (Adult Civilian) -Combat: you are in decent health and can use a gun -Tech: can operate basic technology, such as the Omni-tool and most terminals -Biotic: has biotic potential but cannot actually use biotic powers -Tactical: is reasonably aware of their surroundings and can be a bit sneaky when necessary -Social: can converse normally with other people 4: Above Average (Law Enforcement) -Combat: can learn combat-related skills and use some combat powers -Tech: can learn tech-related skills and use some tech powers -Biotic: can learn biotic-related skills and use some biotic powers -Tactical: can learn tactical skills and you have an instinctive sense when something isn't right -Social: you can influence people to a limited extent 5: Experienced (Military Grunt) -Combat: can engage multiple opponents at close range successfully and knows how to use military weapons and armor -Tech: can use most tech powers -Biotic: can reliably use biotic powers -Tactical: can maneuver effectively in the field and notice oncoming threats -Social: the average person will rarely question you 6: Very Experienced (Veteran) 7: Specialized (Operative) 8: Expert 9: Master -Combat: Wrex -Tech: EDI -Biotic: Jack -Tactical: Kasumi -Social: to be determined 10: Legendary -Combat: Saren -Tech: Overlord -Biotic: Benezia -Tactical: Kai Leng -Social: Shepard 11+: Godlike
As for the skills, a character would be limited by their knowledge of specific subjects. A character with high Tech Prowess and knowledge of Medicine would still struggle with Electronics if they were not knowledgeable of that subject. Their natural affinity for Tech might help them learn, but they still wouldn’t be as capable as someone with slightly lower Tech Prowess but decent knowledge in Electronics. A character with a score of 3 in any area of expertise does not know any skills from that area. A character with at least 4 Prowess in an area can know any number of skills from that area of expertise.
As for how points would be allocated, I’m not sure. My natural instinct is to start characters at 1 in everything and let players choose how many points to allocate between a minimum and maximum, which would allow diversity in ability levels without making any characters absurdly weak or OP. On the other hand, there might be situations which called for weak or OP characters, and this could also encourage min-maxing, which isn’t really what a story-driven roleplay should be about. With that in mind, I recommend the following power level for a character, subject to change:
15-30 Prowess Points 5-10 skills 2-6 weapon familiarities 2-6 powers
Here is a sample character and the template to use:
If we did implement this system, it would be wise to stress that these values are not the sole deciders of outcomes and that you should build your character to be interesting from a roleplaying perspective, not to necessarily be better than everyone else. We might also just make it an optional concept for character creation rather than a requirement, so that people who want to describe their character more organically can do so. Thoughts?
1/7/2017: updated to give more information on skills, make the Prowess scale more comprehensive, give a recommended power level, and provide a sample character as a template
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Post by Space Cowboy on Jan 6, 2017 22:45:14 GMT
I think its a great idea to determine everyones skill level in various things when compared to others. And to help write realistically about yor characters skills.
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Post by smilesja on Jan 6, 2017 22:54:15 GMT
Might be a separate rule set but loving the idea!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2017 23:37:31 GMT
I feel like Carina is a average citzen while Ice Queen Rosie is 7 on the chart, lol. 
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Draining Dragon
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You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 6, 2017 23:44:45 GMT
It occurred to me that I should provide an example of a character with this system, so here it goes.
Birdface (yes, I know, I was too lazy to come up with a good Roman-sounding name for this example) Turian Veteran
Birdface served in the Reaper War and is skilled with all manner of weapons as well as being a decent tactician. He's never been one for tech, though, and only learned enough to be able to apply first aid in the field. He has experience as a leader and knows how to pull a team together, as well as how to mess with an enemy's head.
Combat Prowess: 7/10 (Endurance, Strength, Weapons) Tech Prowess: 4/10 (Medicine) Biotic Prowess: 3/10 Tactical Prowess: 5/10 (Perception) Social Prowess: 6/10 (Bluff, Intimidate)
The skills in parentheses are the specific skills that he knows. He has none in Biotic Prowess because he's not a biotic. His total Prowess is 25 and he knows 7 skills.
EDIT: Also, I'm kind of tempted to come up with a name for Tactical Prowess that doesn't start with a T, so I can abbreviate it without it being confused for Tech Prowess... Field Prowess, maybe?
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Draining Dragon
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You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 0:17:51 GMT
0: Inept (BP: you feel ill when biotics are used in your presence) I'm trying to figure out how I feel about this specific part, on one hand it's kinda cool, but on the other hand I don't remember any indication in canon that such a thing could be possible. I mean, I can understand being allergic to a specific substance, like Eezo, but using biotics shouldn't do anything that *can* cause illness in someone close. I don't think humans can be allergic to Dark Energy, we simply can't interact with dark energy directly (without the reaction pf electricity + Eezo, and that's indirect). Yeah, it needs some work. We might just have to say that Biotic Prowess is unique and that all non-biotics have 0 (or 1, if we make that the lowest point on the scale).
Let's suppose a new scale with 1 as the baseline. I'll go into a bit of detail on the first 5 and you can figure out the rest from there. I also provide a few examples of a typical person who would fall into a given category.
1: Inept -Combat: completely out of shape and literally cannot aim to save your life -Tech: unable to use even the simplest machine without assistance -Biotic: has no biotic abilities -Tactical: you're clumsy and lack any kind of awareness of what is around you -Social: unable to communicate in any meaningful fashion
2: Below Average (Child) -Combat: you will lose just about any fight, but you could at least inconvenience your opponent -Tech: technology confuses you, but you manage -Biotic: has very weak biotic potential and would likely struggle to manifest any powers at this point, even with training -Tactical: you have a short attention span and are still fairly clumsy -Social: you can talk to people but you can't guarantee they'll listen
3: Average (Adult Civilian) -Combat: you are in decent health and can use a gun -Tech: can operate basic technology, such as the Omni-tool and most terminals -Biotic: has biotic potential but cannot actually use biotic powers -Tactical: is reasonably aware of their surroundings and can be a bit sneaky when necessary -Social: can converse normally with other people
4: Above Average (Law Enforcement) -Combat: can learn combat-related skills and use some combat powers -Tech: can learn tech-related skills and use some tech powers -Biotic: can learn biotic-related skills and use some biotic powers -Tactical: can learn tactical skills and you have an instinctive sense when something isn't right -Social: you can influence people to a limited extent
5: Experienced (Military Grunt) -Combat: can engage multiple opponents at close range successfully and knows how to use military weapons and armor -Tech: can use most tech powers -Biotic: can reliably use biotic powers -Tactical: can maneuver effectively in the field and notice oncoming threats -Social: the average person will rarely question you
6: Very Experienced (Veteran)
7: Specialized (Operative)
8: Expert
9: Master
10: Legendary
11+: Godlike
A typical character who is going on these sorts of adventures would average around a 5, while a typical person in the ME universe would average around a 3 (hence why I label it "average).
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2017 17:28:28 GMT
This kinda feels... restrictive in a way
I would kinda like to see something along the lines of this (just an example not the truth):

Something which shows where their strengths and weaknesses lie kinda comparatively but I wouldnt want to assign like actual values to it... because tech covers a lot of things
Like you could have a scientist who knows a LOT about AIs and VIs but absolutely nothing about other things... so what would be the value of tech in that case??? Or you could have a character who is trained in only one type of weapon instead of all of them... would their combat stat be high or low??? Would you say "ok, theyre great with shotguns, assign them a high combat number", or "theyre only trained in one type of weapon, so you give them a low number" or even "take away the weapons theyre trained in from the ones you arent and get a medium-sized number"??? Would any actually be accurate???
To me, comparisons between different abilities would be better instead of assigning numbers to them, because bah categories... you couldnt really do it to the abilities of a real person so cant do it to a character really, and like even though its just kinda to aid a character bio of some kind it still will be hard to do properly
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Draining Dragon
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You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.
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drainingdragon
Draining Dragon
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 18:24:08 GMT
^Excellent points. I'm trying to avoid making this system too restrictive, because as I've said, I just want it to be a guide for describing characters rather than a straitjacket for gameplay.
With regards to assigning values, I think that if you're going to have visual bars like that, it's sensible to assign values to it, if only to make it easier to understand.
With regards to your example, a character who is very well trained in only one weapon would have a high combat prowess and would know the weapons skill, but would note in their character description that they're only familiar with one type of weapon. If we want to make it easier, we could break Weapons down into Pistols, SMGs, Assault Rifles, Sniper Rifles, Shotguns, Heavy, and Explosives. I think this description of abilities would always need to be accompanied by a "notes" section to indicate special circumstances, regardless. Think of it as an "at-a-glance" way for people to see what your character is good at, rather than a comprehensive analysis of her abilities.
EDIT: We could even add a separate place on the character sheet to indicate what weapons your character is familiar with.
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You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.
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Draining Dragon
You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.
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drainingdragon
Draining Dragon
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 18:50:14 GMT
With some of the changes I've made, here's an updated ability sheet for Birdface.
Birdface Turian Veteran
Birdface served in the Reaper War and is skilled with a variety of weapons as being a decent tactician. He's never been one for tech, though, and only learned enough to be able to apply first aid in the field. He has experience as a leader and knows how to pull a team together, as well as how to mess with an enemy's head.
Combat: 7/10 (Endurance, Strength, Weapons) Tech: 4/10 (Medicine) Biotic: 1/10 Tactical: 6/10 (Perception) Social: 5/10 (Intimidate, Bluff)
Weapon Familiarity: Pistol, Shotgun, Assault Rifle, Heavy, Explosive Powers: First Aid, Frag Grenade, Marksman, Fortitude
This character has 22 Total Prowess, knows 7 skills, is familiar with 5 weapon types, and has 4 powers.
I think 15-30 points would be a good range of Prowess Point to use as a guideline. 15 would let you have 3 in every Prowess (if you want to be an average citizen with biotic potential), while 30 would let you have 6 in every Prowess. You can then distribute it however you like. Of course, this might be different for some characters.
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Post by smilesja on Jan 7, 2017 18:53:24 GMT
I would like to see more examples please
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Draining Dragon
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You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.
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You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.
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drainingdragon
Draining Dragon
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 19:15:26 GMT
Roger that. I'll try classifying @tzeenchianapostrophe 's drell character (not saying this is necessarily the distribution he would have to go with, this is just my interpretation). I'll walk through it step by step, referencing his character sheet. The infiltration training indicates a high Tactical Prowess with the skills Stealth, Perception, and Mobility, and the combat training indicates a decent combat score with the skills Strength and Weapons. Note the keyword "specialized" for the infiltration training, which in my system indicates 7 Tactical Prowess. Perfect for a ninja-like character. From this I would say his Combat is a 6 (Advanced). Obviously a good Biotic Prowess right here. I'll give it a 6. He gives us a useful description of his powers. Sounds like his Warp is especially powerful. This affirms my assessment of his BP as 6. Here he goes into the weapons he uses. Evidently he has Weapon Familiarity for Pistol, Assault Rifle, and Sniper Rifle. I stand by my earlier Combat Score of 6. Ah, and here we see his weakness. He's able to operate a hacking program, though not very efficiently. That would register as a 4 on my Tech Prowess scale. For Social Prowess, I'll consult his Personality section. There's nothing in here that would render him especially bad in social situations, but he also appears to have no special talent for influencing people. I'll give him a 4, though he might even be a 3. My final verdict: Combat: 6/10 (Strength, Weapons) Tech: 4/10 (Electronics) Biotic: 6/10 (Telekinesis, Kinetic Fields, Spatial Distortion) Tactical: 7/10 (Stealth, Perception, Mobility) Social: 4/10 Weapon Familiarity: Pistol, Assault Rifle, Sniper Rifle, Low-Tech Powers: Throw, Pull, Biotic Charge, Barrier, Warp This character has 27 Prowess Points, knows 9 skills, is familiar with 4 weapons, and has 5 powers. That seems a reasonable power level for someone with Kato's backstory.
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Post by smilesja on Jan 7, 2017 19:37:55 GMT
Do Tarik next XD!
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Draining Dragon
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You have power over your mind - not outside events. Realize this, and you will find strength.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 19:40:48 GMT
For another example, I'll classify Tali from the trilogy (specifically her in ME3).
Tali obviously has high Tech Prowess (probably 8 by ME3). Her skills there are Electronics and Fabrication. We can also guess she knows basic medicine, since for the pilgrimage a quarian receives survival training. She has no biotic powers, which puts her at a 1 for that. Her Combat Prowess is decent, since she was able to stand alongside Shepard. We'll give her a 5 there, and skill with Weapons. Tali's familiar with Pistols and Shotguns, and given the knife she carries with her, Low-Tech as well. Tactically, she's nothing special, but has some basic training and a lot of experience which puts her at a 5 for that and gives her skill in Perception. Socially, she was a bit awkward in the first two games, but has become a leader in ME3 and has a certain force of personality, so we could give her a 5 there. She gets the Intimidate skill due to her fondness for threatening people with her shotgun. We know her powers are Combat Drone, Energy Drain, Sabotage, and Defense Drone. In conclusion:
Combat: 5/10 (Weapons) Tech: 8/10 (Electronics, Medicine, Fabrication) Biotic: 1/10 Tactical: 5/10 (Perception) Social: 5/10 (Intimidate)
Weapon Familiarity: Pistol, Shotgun, Low-Tech Powers: Energy Drain, Combat Drone, Defense Drone, Sabotage
This character has 24 Prowess Points, knows 6 skills, is familiar with 3 weapons, and has 4 powers.
EDIT: switched Tali's combat from 6 to 5
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 19:42:06 GMT
Draining Dragon You summed up Kato very well. I really have nothing important to add. I do wonder how I can quantify his specialty with Warp. Perhaps a note that when using Warp he can be considered a level 7 biotic. (Kato: "Beware my plus one warp!"  ) Edit: I will consider adding this to Kato's profile, hope you don't mind? Go right ahead, and feel free to give him the "+1 warp" thing. That seems like a good way to indicate that his warp is uniquely powerful.
Though come to think of it, I would recommend putting the skills he knows in parentheses rather than as bullet points, just to save space.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 20:19:01 GMT
Sure.
Looks like he's a bit inexperienced, so he'll be on the lower end of the scale when it comes to his Total Prowess. He's not a biotic, so that gives him a 1 there. His likeable personality gives him a 5 socially, along with the Charm skill. He has typical combat training, so we'll give him a 5 there, along with the skills Strength, Endurance, and Weapons . Tech-wise, you don't give many details, but if he did well in school I'll assume he's above average (4) there. Tactically, he's definitely a 5. He's experienced with Pistols and Assault Rifles, and you laid out his powers.
Combat: 5/10 (Endurance, Strength, Weapons) Tech: 4/10 Biotic: 1/10 Tactical: 5/10 (Perception, Mobility) Social: 5/10 (Charm)
Weapon Familiarity: Pistol, Assault Rifle Powers: Adrenaline Rush, Concussive Shot, Frag Grenade, Incendiary Ammo, Disruptor Ammo, Cryo Ammo
20 Total Prowess 6 skills 2 weapon familiarities 6 powers
EDIT: gave Tarik the "Mobility" skill
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 20:29:31 GMT
It just occurred to me that "Acrobatics" could be renamed to "Mobility." I'll update all the posts accordingly.
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Post by SofaJockey on Jan 7, 2017 20:40:29 GMT
So as a little test I'll do the Volus: Reasonable combat skills but not experienced, so 4. Same for tech and no biotics. Tactically astute 7 and social skills good but limited by being a Volus, 4. Combat: 4/10 (Weapons) Tech: 4/10 (Electronics, Medicine, Fabrication) Biotic: 1/10 Tactical: 7/10 (Perception) Social: 4/10 (Intimidate) Weapon Familiarity: Avenger & Shuriken. Powers: Recon & Proximity Mines. How does this impact the roleplay as I pretty much knew this and we've been quite careful not to put actions in each others' mouths? 
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 20:59:18 GMT
... How does this impact the roleplay as I pretty much knew this and we've been quite careful not to put actions in each others' mouths? I think of it as a numerical representation that helps to illustrate your character's skills better. Not something that has actual "gameplay" implications. This. It's more like what you'd call "guidelines" than actual rules.
With regards to the Weapon Familiarities, I was thinking those would be indicative of categories of weapons. So Delan would have Assault Rifle and SMG familiarity.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 21:09:49 GMT
Draining Dragon Do you have any ideas for examples for the 9 / 10 grade on the various categories? Like who is the 10 on the combat scale? (maybe Nihlus? Saren? Wrex with his lifetime of experience as a mercenary?) Biotics is easy, I'd just give 9 to Jack / Samara / Morinth, and 10 to Matriarch Benezia. Combat: Wrex would be a 9, Saren would be a 10. Reapers would be 11+. Tech: EDI would be a 9, Overlord would be a 10. Reapers would be 11+. Biotic: Jack would be a 9, Benezia would be a 10. Tactical: Kai Leng would be a 9. I can't come up with a good example of a 10. Social: Shepard (with high paragon/renegade) would be a 9, the Thorian would be a 10. Leviathans and Reapers, with their indoctrinaton powers, would be 11+.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 21:20:49 GMT
Combat: Wrex would be a 9, Saren would be a 10. Reapers would be 11+. Tech: EDI would be a 9, Overlord would be a 10. Reapers would be 11+. Biotic: Jack would be a 9, Benezia would be a 10. Tactical: Kai Leng would be a 9. I can't come up with a good example of a 10. Social: Shepard (with high paragon/renegade) would be a 9, the Thorian would be a 10. Leviathans and Reapers, with their indoctrinaton powers, would be 11+.
Nah... Shepard is 10 on social skills no question...  (at least when it comes to influence) But seriously, Thorian should be 11+ as well, because their abilities are almost on par with Indoctrination, if probably less efficient. (sealed armor seems to be enough to avoid it.) You might have a point about Shepard being a 10... I did classify 10 as "Legendary," after all. That still begs the question of what a 9 would be. Morinth, perhaps?
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 21:26:32 GMT
You might have a point about Shepard being a 10... I did classify 10 as "Legendary," after all. That still begs the question of what a 9 would be. Morinth, perhaps?
Nah, she's "unnatural" as well, like the Reapers and the Thorians but to a lower degree, I'd give her 11, and whatever you give the Thorian give the Reapers / Leviathan more. I'm not sure it necessarily needs to be natural, if we're measuring Social Prowess as sheer force of personality. Saren also has an unnatural source of his combat abilities, and an AI has unnatural tech prowess. I would characterize Morinth as a master at manipulating people, but not legendary or godlike in her power over others.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 21:27:55 GMT
Also, it occurred to me that Kasumi could be a 9 tactically and Kai Leng could be a 10. That plot armor...
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 21:48:25 GMT
I'm not sure it necessarily needs to be natural, if we're measuring Social Prowess as sheer force of personality. Saren also has an unnatural source of his combat abilities, and an AI has unnatural tech prowess. I would characterize Morinth as a master at manipulating people, but not legendary or godlike in her power over others. You have a point regarding the "unnatural" part. But the way I see it if she physically gets her hands on you and does her mojo, 99.9% of people are going to "see it her way". True, but given that Shepard was able to resist her Dominate ability through force of personality, that would suggest she is lower than him on the scale. This is getting a bit technical, though.
Do you have another idea for someone with 9 Social Prowess? I'll admit that Morinth is a very complex and confusing example, which isn't exactly what we want here.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 21:52:06 GMT
Also, it occurred to me that Kasumi could be a 9 tactically and Kai Leng could be a 10. That plot armor... Well... Kasumi is probably better at sheer acrobatics and stealth, and Kai Leng is probably higher on hand-to-hand and knives and on par or slightly less than a healthy Thane on close combat as a whole. My sense of Kai Leng in ME3 is that he was supposed to be more impressive than he was actually shown to be. In the books Kai Leng was an absolute badass, and that was before his Cerberus upgrades.
Kasumi is a master thief, but calling her legendary might be a bit of a stretch.
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Post by Draining Dragon on Jan 7, 2017 21:56:24 GMT
True, but given that Shepard was able to resist her Dominate ability through force of personality, that would suggest she is lower than him on the scale. This is getting a bit technical, though.
Do you have another idea for someone with 9 Social Prowess? I'll admit that Morinth is a very complex and confusing example, which isn't exactly what we want here.
Udina and the Turian councilor are tied for 9... I don't recall much about the Turian councilor, but Udina? Eh... I suppose he was able to manipulate the other council members and hide his ulterior motives, despite being unlikeable from the player's perspective. You might have a point.
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