guanxi
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Post by guanxi on Jan 15, 2017 22:13:32 GMT
So we're told the long term goal of the AI is to 're-establish connection' with the MW galaxy... If this goes beyond communication and the arc contains a whole bunch of mass relays which are set up along the way to expedite travel between and connect the galaxies via relay network which would explain the 'plans in place' to bring back missing species and the onset of mass colonisation from MW in future instalments somehow. But is this really a good idea for the series? Doesn't this muddy the waters and bring back a whole bunch of narrative structural can of worms that the change in setting with pre ME3 world state was supposed to resolve?
For this reason I would really like BioWare to not go this route, leave the baggage in the past and let Andromeda be the clean break that the series needs it to be.
The only way to respect previous choices and reconnect with the present day Milky Way galaxy is to essentially bring back pseudo save game importation and fractured world states with legions of story flag variables which was a burdensome nightmare to edit on Gibbed let alone develop on top of all of the complex RPG systems I can only imagine.
If they beefed up the numbers of colonists and made sure Quarians and Geth (gatecrashers) and Batarians (stowaways) etc made the trip in sufficient numbers there would be no needed for this reconnect with the Milky Way nonsense and all of the baggage this will entail.
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Post by rspanther on Jan 15, 2017 22:33:56 GMT
If they do try and reconnect with the MW galaxy it probably won't be until the 3rd game in the Andromeda galaxy trilogy. If they make three games. If MEA is successful.
How I visualize the Andromeda arc is, unless all three games have the same protagonist, the first game is all about establishing the colonies. The second game is set a few hundred years in the future, with a large scale conflict with the Kett, due to how successful our colonies have become. The third game will be after we have successfully defended our colonies and are now ready to send a ship back to the MW galaxy.
But the biggest stumbling block will be that it means that Bioware will have to pick a canon ending, which they have said they won't do.
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Post by dmc1001 on Jan 15, 2017 22:40:10 GMT
But the biggest stumbling block will be that it means that Bioware will have to pick a canon ending, which they have said they won't do. Others have covered this. The AI could reconnect at the end of the game (or trilogy, depending on how it goes) and we never see what's happening in the Milky Way. It could be the final sendoff for the ME franchise. |
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Sarayne
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Post by Sarayne on Jan 15, 2017 23:23:48 GMT
But the biggest stumbling block will be that it means that Bioware will have to pick a canon ending, which they have said they won't do. Others have covered this. The AI could reconnect at the end of the game (or trilogy, depending on how it goes) and we never see what's happening in the Milky Way. It could be the final sendoff for the ME franchise. I really hope this happens or they just never make contact at all to be honest. |
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GannayevOfDreams
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Post by GannayevOfDreams on Jan 15, 2017 23:44:18 GMT
It may be a goal of the AI but I don't see it ever being realized. For exactly the reasons everyone would assume. They'd have to canonize some ending and alienate a bunch of people.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Jan 16, 2017 1:34:50 GMT
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Post by tbr1 on Jan 16, 2017 2:03:59 GMT
If andromeda restablishes contact with the milky way galaxy it may cause some "problems" im talking about canon and retcon issues.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 16, 2017 2:08:32 GMT
Doesn't this muddy the waters and bring back a whole bunch of narrative structural can of worms that the change in setting with pre ME3 world state was supposed to resolve? Not really. Having it reconnect allows Bioware to control what from the Milky Way comes to Andromeda, which that plus the 600 year difference eliminates most of the different choices and leaves the few that are left a lot easier to handle while respecting player choice. |
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Ianamus
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Post by Ianamus on Jan 16, 2017 2:43:11 GMT
Doesn't this muddy the waters and bring back a whole bunch of narrative structural can of worms that the change in setting with pre ME3 world state was supposed to resolve? Not really. Having it reconnect allows Bioware to control what from the Milky Way comes to Andromeda, which that plus the 600 year difference eliminates most of the different choices and leaves the few that are left a lot easier to handle while respecting player choice. The final decision of ME3 ruins any chance of having anything from the Milky Way reappear without establishing some form of canon. Control and Destroy you could maybe get away with. Maybe. But Synthesis and Refusal? Impossible without some form of time travel. |
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 16, 2017 2:47:35 GMT
Not really. Having it reconnect allows Bioware to control what from the Milky Way comes to Andromeda, which that plus the 600 year difference eliminates most of the different choices and leaves the few that are left a lot easier to handle while respecting player choice. The final decision of ME3 ruins any chance of having anything from the Milky Way reappear without establishing some form of canon. Control and Destroy you could maybe get away with. Maybe. But Synthesis and Refusal? The second one of the milky way aliens comes through we'll know Refusal isn't canon in ME:A. Well, if they incorporate something like the Dragon Age Keep for Mass Effect which they may and probably will do then if Refuse was chosen they could just say it doesn't work due to an issue on the Milky Way end and whatever content that connection would have given is inaccessible. As for Synthesis, that's even easier since all they have to do is either just add an effect overlay on the characters who come through so they have the Synthesis lines or have it explained that as time went by those faded until they weren't seen anymore. |
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Post by themikefest on Jan 16, 2017 2:53:26 GMT
If Bioware wants to continue in the Milky Way, they can. It wouldn't be hard to do. They have their get-out-of-jail-for-free card. Remember? The details have changed over time.
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Post by Ianamus on Jan 16, 2017 2:55:57 GMT
The final decision of ME3 ruins any chance of having anything from the Milky Way reappear without establishing some form of canon. Control and Destroy you could maybe get away with. Maybe. But Synthesis and Refusal? The second one of the milky way aliens comes through we'll know Refusal isn't canon in ME:A. Well, if they incorporate something like the Dragon Age Keep for Mass Effect which they may and probably will do then if Refuse was chosen they could just say it doesn't work due to an issue on the Milky Way end and whatever content that connection would have given is inaccessible. As for Synthesis, that's even easier since all they have to do is either just add an effect overlay on the characters who come through so they have the Synthesis lines or have it explained that as time went by those faded until they weren't seen anymore. If the Milky Way connection is only used as a footnote at the very end of the series then what is the point of including it at all? They may as well just say that the connection can't be established because of the damage inflicted and leave it at that. It's not worth letting players import/state which ending they picked for a five minute scene at the very end. If it's at the end of, say, ME:A and is intended to follow on to the next game, that will be impossible to work with. Having half the characters in game possibly not be there isn't workable, and the story differences of having all these half-synthetic people appear verses people who've grown up with the Reapers as a force for good vs those who grew up in destroy... and in Synthesis death due to natural causes may not even exist... You could make it work cosmetically, but character and plot wise it would be unrealistic to make it a major plot element without establishing a canon. |
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 16, 2017 3:01:39 GMT
Well, if they incorporate something like the Dragon Age Keep for Mass Effect which they may and probably will do then if Refuse was chosen they could just say it doesn't work due to an issue on the Milky Way end and whatever content that connection would have given is inaccessible. As for Synthesis, that's even easier since all they have to do is either just add an effect overlay on the characters who come through so they have the Synthesis lines or have it explained that as time went by those faded until they weren't seen anymore. If the Milky Way connection is only used as a footnote at the very end of the series then what is the point of including it at all? They may as well just say that the connection can't be established because of the damage inflicted and leave it at that. It's not worth letting players import/state which ending they picked for a five minute scene at the very end. If it's at the end of, say, ME:A and is intended to follow on to the next game, that will be impossible to work with. Having half the characters in game possibly not be there isn't workable, and the story differences of having all these half-synthetic people appear verses people who've grown up with the Reapers as a force for good vs those who grew up in destroy... and in Synthesis death due to natural causes may not even exist... You could make it work cosmetically, but character and plot wise it would be unrealistic to make it a major plot element without establishing a canon. Because then it is a culmination of the end goal of the Andromeda Initiative: to connect the Milky Way and Andromeda. That makes perfect sense to add at the end of this storyline if they have that be the end. Not having that would be like ending Mass Effect 3 before the Battle of Earth. Who says the Milky Way people would be half the people in future games? There could just be a few that we actually interact with, and if Refuse was chosen have backup characters like they did for dead squadmates in ME3. As for those differences, you are making them bigger than they have to be. A few differing lines of dialogue will address those since what's happening back in the Milky Way wouldn't really be on the new people's minds. |
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Italian_Pathfinder
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Post by Italian_Pathfinder on Jan 16, 2017 3:14:55 GMT
Or maybe once we try to re-establish a connection with the Milky Way we receive no response because everyone is dead. That's sad but atleast they don't have to touch the ending of ME3. The Leviathan could be involved. After all, they didn't seem really friendly toward the other species. I always got the feeling that once the Reapers threat was solved, the Leviathan would've been a new problem.
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Post by cryptic137 on Jan 16, 2017 3:32:21 GMT
Or maybe once we try to re-establish a connection with the Milky Way we receive no response because everyone is dead. That's sad but atleast they don't have to touch the ending of ME3. The Leviathan could be involved. After all, they didn't seem really friendly toward the other species. I always got the feeling that once the Reapers threat was solved, the Leviathan would've been a new problem. i can already see the headlines Mass Effect: Andromeda 3 - Take Earth back..... (again)  Well, storywise it would make sense that they try everything in their power to establish a connection to the milky way after they established the basic needs for survival (self sustaining colonies). To be honest if they didnt do this it would bug the hell out of me. No halfway intelligent species sends of their people to another galaxy and wouldnt want them to make contact as soon as possible, this is not how it would work in real life and this is not how it should be in ME:A. Also, asuming that the reapers wiped out the milky way and didnt touch andromeda due to their programing (this was discussed in another thread actually), if the AI tries to make contact and the reapers obtain this knowledge, they would probably invade andromeda, due to their (failed) ultimate goal. |
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Post by Italian_Pathfinder on Jan 16, 2017 4:37:04 GMT
Or maybe once we try to re-establish a connection with the Milky Way we receive no response because everyone is dead. That's sad but atleast they don't have to touch the ending of ME3. The Leviathan could be involved. After all, they didn't seem really friendly toward the other species. I always got the feeling that once the Reapers threat was solved, the Leviathan would've been a new problem. i can already see the headlines Mass Effect: Andromeda 3 - Take Earth back..... (again) Well, storywise it would make sense that they try everything in their power to establish a connection to the milky way after they established the basic needs for survival (self sustaining colonies). To be honest if they didnt do this it would bug the hell out of me. No halfway intelligent species sends of their people to another galaxy and wouldnt want them to make contact as soon as possible, this is not how it would work in real life and this is not how it should be in ME:A. Also, asuming that the reapers wiped out the milky way and didnt touch andromeda due to their programing (this was discussed in another thread actually), if the AI tries to make contact and the reapers obtain this knowledge, they would probably invade andromeda, due to their (failed) ultimate goal. I can already imagine that game but I don't think people would be happy about it  Also Yes I agree they should make contact. I think I've seen somewhere that the purpose is to build a bridge between the Milky Way and Andromeda at some point. But I'm not sure. Let's say that the Reapers wiped all the Milky Way species, they should be hiding in the dark space for other 50.000 years right? So, when we try to establish contact with the Milky Way the Reapers shouldn't be there anymore. Except for the Leviathan because I don't think they sent all their forces to Earth. I don't think they were that stupid to risk extinction just for the Milky Way species. And bioWare could say that they never showed up to help the fight against the Reapers. We don't even see them in the final fight. So in case Shepard did the refuse ending, the Leviathan saw how to complete the Crucible. They know how to do it. All the Leviathan have do is to use the Crucible again. In this way, the Reapers threat would be gone in all 4 endings. And no matter what ending ME3 had, there's nothing left except for the Leviathan. Honestly, I don't even know if that makes any sense |
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Ivory Samoan
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Post by Ivory Samoan on Jan 16, 2017 7:18:57 GMT
If Bioware wants to continue in the Milky Way, they can. It wouldn't be hard to do. They have their get-out-of-jail-for-free card. Remember? The details have changed over time. /thread. They laid the ground work with the Buzz scene for a post-Andromeda reconnect right there; and by that time we'll all be a bit older and a bit grayer.....I'm sure we'll get over any lore inconsistencies and canon problems by then, we'll be knee deep in Terminators and AI drones and whatever else will be getting thrown our way in ~2025 XD |
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Post by sgtreed24 on Jan 16, 2017 16:47:36 GMT
I feel for them to successfully set up a way to get back and forth between the galaxies faster than their current 600 year voyage... a lot of time (and advances in technology) will have to take place.
Meaning the time that they are able to get back to the milky way can be hundreds of years in the future where the decisions from the original trilogy will no longer matter. They'll just be stories and myths from history.
I'd kinda like to see the return/reconnection to the milky way galaxy been done way off in the future to where earth is just a myth to the humans of Andromeda.
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Post by Iakus on Jan 16, 2017 16:51:05 GMT
If Bioware wants to continue in the Milky Way, they can. It wouldn't be hard to do. They have their get-out-of-jail-for-free card. Remember? The details have changed over time. They could, but it would probably interfere with "Muh Artistic INTEGRITY!" |
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Post by Muddy Boots on Jan 16, 2017 16:52:21 GMT
To throw in a sinister motivation: maybe Jien or others lied about the whole project of connecting to the MW to get more decent tech people on board. Which could also foment a rebellion. There are all kinds of conspiracy theories out there about Jien Garson. I can't wait to see if any of them come close.
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Post by cymercenary285 on Jan 16, 2017 16:59:50 GMT
If they do try and reconnect with the MW galaxy it probably won't be until the 3rd game in the Andromeda galaxy trilogy. If they make three games. If MEA is successful. How I visualize the Andromeda arc is, unless all three games have the same protagonist, the first game is all about establishing the colonies. The second game is set a few hundred years in the future, with a large scale conflict with the Kett, due to how successful our colonies have become. The third game will be after we have successfully defended our colonies and are now ready to send a ship back to the MW galaxy. But the biggest stumbling block will be that it means that Bioware will have to pick a canon ending, which they have said they won't do. You forgot a forth game: Rebel and drive away oppressive milky way regime! Glory to the Andromedans! |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2017 17:10:43 GMT
By the way, what's the contrivance in the ME universe that allows for instantaneous communication over several lightyears of distance? In Star Trek, it's 'subspace communication'. What about ME? I can't seem to recall if there was a sciencey-magical pseudo explanation. Which I guess is better than nothing.
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Post by Iakus on Jan 16, 2017 17:14:37 GMT
By the way, what's the contrivance in the ME universe that allows for instantaneous communication over several lightyears of distance? In Star Trek, it's 'subspace communication'. What about ME? I can't seem to recall if there was a sciencey-magical pseudo explanation. Which I guess is better than nothing. Codex: Communications Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.
Comm buoys are maintained in patterns built outward from each mass relay. The buoys are little more than a cluster of primitive, miniature mass relays. Each individual buoy is connected to a partner on another buoy in the network, forming a corridor of low-mass space. Tightbeam communications lasers are piped through these "tubes" of FTL space, allowing virtually instantaneous communication to anywhere on the network. The networks connect across regions by communications lasers through the mass relays.
With this system, the only delay is the light lag between the source or destination and the closest buoy. So long as all parties remain within half a light-second (150,000 km) of buoys, seamless real time communications are possible. Since buoys are maintained in all traveled areas, most enjoy unlimited instant communications. Ships only suffer communications lag when operating off established deep space routes, around uninhabited outer system gas giants, and other unsettled areas.
During wartime, comm buoy networks are the first target of an attack. Once the network is severed, it can take anywhere from weeks to years to get a message out of a contested system. In systems where a buoy network has not yet been built or has been destroyed, rapid communication means ferrying information through high-speed courier ships and unmanned data drones. |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2017 17:18:20 GMT
Codex: Communications Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.Right; now I remember. So will the AI be planting buoys along the way? If yes, communication with the MW shouldn't be an issue as soon as they arrive in Andromeda. If not -- why not? |
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Post by Iakus on Jan 16, 2017 17:20:33 GMT
Codex: Communications Real-time communication is possible thanks to networks of expensive mass relay comm buoys that can daisy-chain a transmission via lasers.Right; now I remember. So will the AI be planting buoys along the way? If yes, communication with the MW shouldn't be an issue as soon as they arrive in Andromeda. If not -- why not? Unknown. But it does seem to be a first step in relay technology. |
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