NextOfQuinn
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Post by NextOfQuinn on Jan 31, 2017 11:24:25 GMT
Think of it like this: how many straight male gamers found Garrus "attractive"? None, assuming they're straight. But many straight/bi females found Garrus attractive, and not just his voice. /shrug Just how sexuality works, I guess. I still really don't get that, particularly with the Turians. How alien does a species need to get before their gender, assuming the species even has them, becomes irrelevant? On a more serious note I always thought it was Garrus was not attracted to Shep, like mentioned above he more cared for her deeply and wanted to try these things with her - he wouldn't want sexy time with a human with our weird knees otherwise. Garrus doesn't put the moves on Shep, she pursues him. So why wouldn't Garrus feel the exact same about BroShep? He just cares for her more because she's female? Why? As a human I loved the Garrus romance because of Garrus 's personality (AND YEAH, HIS VOICE) I wasn't attracted to his physical features in the slightest. Those mandibles would be shit at kissing. Wouldn't have mattered if Garrus was female because it wouldn't have made a lick of difference. ...arn't they raptors? They don't even have the same sex chromosomes that we do.
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Post by Elsariel on Jan 31, 2017 15:01:06 GMT
I still really don't get that, particularly with the Turians. How alien does a species need to get before their gender, assuming the species even has them, becomes irrelevant? On a more serious note I always thought it was Garrus was not attracted to Shep, like mentioned above he more cared for her deeply and wanted to try these things with her - he wouldn't want sexy time with a human with our weird knees otherwise. Garrus doesn't put the moves on Shep, she pursues him. So why wouldn't Garrus feel the exact same about BroShep? He just cares for her more because she's female? Why? As a human I loved the Garrus romance because of Garrus 's personality (AND YEAH, HIS VOICE) I wasn't attracted to his physical features in the slightest. Those mandibles would be shit at kissing. Wouldn't have mattered if Garrus was female because it wouldn't have made a lick of difference. ...arn't they raptors? They don't even have the same sex chromosomes that we do. This is the reason I don't romance really different looking aliens. The face must be somewhat similar for me to get into it. I'd need to see a mouth with lips to kiss at the very least.
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Post by fialka on Jan 31, 2017 15:42:16 GMT
I still really don't get that, particularly with the Turians. How alien does a species need to get before their gender, assuming the species even has them, becomes irrelevant? On a more serious note I always thought it was Garrus was not attracted to Shep, like mentioned above he more cared for her deeply and wanted to try these things with her - he wouldn't want sexy time with a human with our weird knees otherwise. Garrus doesn't put the moves on Shep, she pursues him. So why wouldn't Garrus feel the exact same about BroShep? He just cares for her more because she's female? Why? As a human I loved the Garrus romance because of Garrus 's personality (AND YEAH, HIS VOICE) I wasn't attracted to his physical features in the slightest. Those mandibles would be shit at kissing. Wouldn't have mattered if Garrus was female because it wouldn't have made a lick of difference. ...arn't they raptors? They don't even have the same sex chromosomes that we do. Actually he does become sexually attracted to a female Shepard, once the idea is planted. Before she approaches him with the idea, he never considered a relationship with a human, which is why he comes across as a bit hesitant at first. He does get on board pretty quickly once he's made to consider it though, and his attraction to Shepard is clear in ME3, especially in the Citadel DLC. We talked a bit about primary vs. secondary attraction in a different thread in reference to demisexuality, so I think that's what's at play here. It's a bit like how you might not find someone attractive or your type when you first meet them, but then it happens later when you get to know them better. That said, it doesn't mean you're going to feel that sort of attraction to someone of a gender outside your orientation preference. As a straight woman, I've never been interested in a female LI in a game the same way as a male one, no matter how alien they might be. Where I have come to find a male character attractive based on personality, even if they aren't someone I'd be attracted to in real life. Case in point: Garrus. I think turians are really cool looking. But I wouldn't be physically attracted to one in real life because they're too far away from resembling humans for me. But I did come to find Garrus attractive because of his voice and personality and relationship to my character. I would totally be open to another male turian romance. I have zero interest, however, in a female turian romance, because I'm not into women in real life. Javik's an even better example. I totally would have gone for him were he a romance because I like his character and thought it would make for a cool love story, despite objectively finding him rather ugly. I doubt I would feel that way were he female. Also, gender preference doesn't necessarily go away in the absence of sexual attraction either. Even asexual people will describe themselves as hetero- or bi-romantic. Not being interested in sex doesn't make their orientation suddenly moot. Now, I'm all for having bi/pan alien romances in games so more players are happy, but the argument that a straight Garrus wouldn't care about gender if he's already making the leap in romancing a human is one that doesn't really make sense to me.
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Post by kali073 on Jan 31, 2017 16:10:14 GMT
On a more serious note I always thought it was Garrus was not attracted to Shep, like mentioned above he more cared for her deeply and wanted to try these things with her - he wouldn't want sexy time with a human with our weird knees otherwise. Garrus doesn't put the moves on Shep, she pursues him. So why wouldn't Garrus feel the exact same about BroShep? He just cares for her more because she's female? Why? As a human I loved the Garrus romance because of Garrus 's personality (AND YEAH, HIS VOICE) I wasn't attracted to his physical features in the slightest. Those mandibles would be shit at kissing. Wouldn't have mattered if Garrus was female because it wouldn't have made a lick of difference. ...arn't they raptors? They don't even have the same sex chromosomes that we do. Actually he does become sexually attracted to a female Shepard, once the idea is planted. Before she approaches him with the idea, he never considered a relationship with a human, which is why he comes across as a bit hesitant at first. He does get on board pretty quickly once he's made to consider it though, and his attraction to Shepard is clear in ME3, especially in the Citadel DLC. We talked a bit about primary vs. secondary attraction in a different thread in reference to demisexuality, so I think that's what's at play here. It's a bit like how you might not find someone attractive or your type when you first meet them, but then it happens later when you get to know them better. That said, it doesn't mean you're going to feel that sort of attraction to someone of a gender outside your orientation preference. As a straight woman, I've never been interested in a female LI in a game the same way as a male one, no matter how alien they might be. Where I have come to find a male character attractive based on personality, even if they aren't someone I'd be attracted to in real life. Case in point: Garrus. I think turians are really cool looking. But I wouldn't be physically attracted to one in real life because they're too far away from resembling humans for me. But I did come to find Garrus attractive because of his voice and personality and relationship to my character. I would totally be open to another male turian romance. I have zero interest, however, in a female turian romance, because I'm not into women in real life. Javik's an even better example. I totally would have gone for him were he a romance because I like his character and thought it would make for a cool love story, despite objectively finding him rather ugly. I doubt I would feel that way were he female. Also, gender preference doesn't necessarily go away in the absence of sexual attraction either. Even asexual people will describe themselves as hetero- or bi-romantic. Not being interested in sex doesn't make their orientation suddenly moot. Now, I'm all for having bi/pan alien romances in games so more players are happy, but the argument that a straight Garrus wouldn't care about gender if he's already making the leap in romancing a human is one that doesn't really make sense to me. Agreed. I'm not sure if I would qualify as asexual (I love romance books, tv shows, video game relationships etc. and I find handsome male characters "hot" sort of) but I have never, not even once, wanted to have sex with someone IRL. The thought is about as entertaining as watching paint dry at best. Despite that, gender does matter to me. I wouldn't have found Garrus "attractive/appealing" if he was female. I'm not sure why it works like that, but it does. So just because they're alien doesn't mean gender preference doesn't matter.
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Post by projectpatdc on Jan 31, 2017 18:39:55 GMT
Call this a small petty complaint, but as someone playing as a straight male who does not usually go for alien booty, having Cora as the only female human option feels like we got a bit shafted. I like cora's design, and I wouldn't want the devs to change her. I just feel that she's almost milf status compared to a younger Scott Ryder. At least she looks like Claire Underwood! If we played as Alec then game on, Cora! Hoping that we get a different option in the game for Scotty
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2017 18:41:17 GMT
Call this a small petty complaint, but as someone playing as a straight male who does not usually go for alien booty, having Cora as the only female human option feels like we got a bit shafted. I like cora's design, and I wouldn't want the devs to change her. I just feel that she's almost milf status compared to a younger Scott Ryder. At least she looks like Claire Underwood! If we played as Alec then game on, Cora! Hoping that we get a different option in the game for Scotty I'm pretty sure, she won't be the only female human option for Scott. Just because we don't know further options doesn't mean there aren't some.
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Post by Mintty on Jan 31, 2017 19:28:15 GMT
Agreed. I'm not sure if I would qualify as asexual (I love romance books, tv shows, video game relationships etc. and I find handsome male characters "hot" sort of) but I have never, not even once, wanted to have sex with someone IRL. The thought is about as entertaining as watching paint dry at best.
Despite that, gender does matter to me. I wouldn't have found Garrus "attractive/appealing" if he was female. I'm not sure why it works like that, but it does. So just because they're alien doesn't mean gender preference doesn't matter. Sounds similar to myself, I'm autochorissexual within the asexual spectrum. As for the gender thing, it's very much about sex when Garrus and Shep first hook up and just because the other participant is not the same species does not mean he would enjoy sex regardless of the way they do it... He seems very much a straight dude who enjoys "straight sex".
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Post by witchcocktor on Jan 31, 2017 20:08:29 GMT
Call this a small petty complaint, but as someone playing as a straight male who does not usually go for alien booty, having Cora as the only female human option feels like we got a bit shafted. welcome to the club, this is how it feels when games don't pander to your tastes. please read this with humor as i truly understand your frustration! but you gotta admit it is a bit funny to hear '' straight men getting shafted '' in video games. (tho i kno you are saying that straight men who arent into alien, not straight men per se, but the point still stands ;
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2017 20:15:27 GMT
Call this a small petty complaint, but as someone playing as a straight male who does not usually go for alien booty, having Cora as the only female human option feels like we got a bit shafted. welcome to the club, this is how it feels when games don't pander to your tastes. please read this with humor as i truly understand your frustration! but you gotta admit it is a bit funny to hear '' straight men getting shafted '' in video games. (tho i kno you are saying that straight men who arent into alien, not straight men per se, but the point still stands ;For those who don't like Cora we might get some non squad human romances. (And a straight white male shouldn't be getting shafted if you know what I mean )
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Post by witchcocktor on Jan 31, 2017 20:20:58 GMT
welcome to the club, this is how it feels when games don't pander to your tastes. please read this with humor as i truly understand your frustration! but you gotta admit it is a bit funny to hear '' straight men getting shafted '' in video games. (tho i kno you are saying that straight men who arent into alien, not straight men per se, but the point still stands ;For those who don't like Cora we might get some non squad human romances. (And a straight white male shouldn't be getting shafted if you know what I mean ) Pegging exists!
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Post by Panda on Jan 31, 2017 20:22:17 GMT
Just one human option for straight males happened in ME1 though as well in DA2. So if the LI count is low it might happen and I don't see it as being shafted at all (though people are free to be disappointed if LI isn't what they wanted, shafted to me implies something being unfair which it wouldn't be). Still, I doubt that will be case cause devs have been somewhat vocal that the game will have many romances and they will be different. So probably there will be multiple human options for straight male characters too.
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Post by kali073 on Jan 31, 2017 20:27:31 GMT
Agreed. I'm not sure if I would qualify as asexual (I love romance books, tv shows, video game relationships etc. and I find handsome male characters "hot" sort of) but I have never, not even once, wanted to have sex with someone IRL. The thought is about as entertaining as watching paint dry at best.
Despite that, gender does matter to me. I wouldn't have found Garrus "attractive/appealing" if he was female. I'm not sure why it works like that, but it does. So just because they're alien doesn't mean gender preference doesn't matter. Sounds similar to myself, I'm autochorissexual within the asexual spectrum. As for the gender thing, it's very much about sex when Garrus and Shep first hook up and just because the other participant is not the same species does not mean he would enjoy sex regardless of the way they do it... He seems very much a straight dude who enjoys "straight sex". I had never heard about autochorissexual before so I googled it and it might or might not fit me (some things people brought up in forums don't really apply) but parts of it does. I agree with you on Garrus/Shepard relationship, it starts out very much about sex before changing into a more emotional relationship. They were kinda friends with benefits at first..
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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2017 20:30:18 GMT
I'm sure that there will be more than one human woman for a straight Scott. We just don't know of any other human women at all outside of Jien, Foster, Sloane, and your sister. If we got more information about Jien, Foster, & Sloane, we might be able to speculate. But we've gotten almost nothing from them so far. Even if none of them are LI's, I'm sure that there will be another human female somewhere for straight Scott.
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Post by projectpatdc on Jan 31, 2017 20:58:44 GMT
I'm sure that there will be more than one human woman for a straight Scott. We just don't know of any other human women at all outside of Jien, Foster, Sloane, and your sister. If we got more information about Jien, Foster, & Sloane, we might be able to speculate. But we've gotten almost nothing from them so far. Even if none of them are LI's, I'm sure that there will be another human female somewhere for straight Scott. I would hope so. You would think some form of Galactic Tinder would exist in the ME Universe by now. #plentyofhanar
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Post by NextOfQuinn on Jan 31, 2017 21:04:57 GMT
Actually he does become sexually attracted to a female Shepard, once the idea is planted. Before she approaches him with the idea, he never considered a relationship with a human, which is why he comes across as a bit hesitant at first. He does get on board pretty quickly once he's made to consider it though, and his attraction to Shepard is clear in ME3, especially in the Citadel DLC. Snipped for length Well I can't say I can relate personally but if other people tell me they experience it differently to me and that gender is important to them even if alieny aliens then ok!
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Post by fialka on Jan 31, 2017 21:23:38 GMT
Well I can't say I can relate personally but if other people tell me they experience it differently to me and that gender is important to them even if alieny aliens then ok! That's fine, I'm sure it's different for different people. I've just seen that particular view expressed a few times recently, specifically in regards to why Garrus 'should' have been a bi option, even as a straight turian, and wanted to address it and why I disagree. I believe that in order to be a bi option an alien should be bisexual. And you could certainly make a case for that (again, I'm all for having more options for everyone, so having a disproportionate number of bi people/aliens on our squad is fine by me!), but it's a different argument.
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Post by Vall on Jan 31, 2017 21:25:40 GMT
I'm sure that there will be more than one human woman for a straight Scott. We just don't know of any other human women at all outside of Jien, Foster, Sloane, and your sister. If we got more information about Jien, Foster, & Sloane, we might be able to speculate. But we've gotten almost nothing from them so far. Even if none of them are LI's, I'm sure that there will be another human female somewhere for straight Scott. I would hope so. You would think some form of Galactic Tinder would exist in the ME Universe by now. #plentyofhanar "There are no decent galactic dating services. If you want to have a shot at romance, you have to talk to people"
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Post by Elsariel on Jan 31, 2017 22:15:30 GMT
I'm sure that there will be more than one human woman for a straight Scott. We just don't know of any other human women at all outside of Jien, Foster, Sloane, and your sister. If we got more information about Jien, Foster, & Sloane, we might be able to speculate. But we've gotten almost nothing from them so far. Even if none of them are LI's, I'm sure that there will be another human female somewhere for straight Scott. I would hope so. You would think some form of Galactic Tinder would exist in the ME Universe by now. #plentyofhanar Especially in Andromeda where replenishing population would likely be high priority once suitable planets have been found. I mean, I would think so anyway...
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Post by naytnavare on Feb 1, 2017 6:26:04 GMT
Call this a small petty complaint, but as someone playing as a straight male who does not usually go for alien booty, having Cora as the only female human option feels like we got a bit shafted. welcome to the club, this is how it feels when games don't pander to your tastes. please read this with humor as i truly understand your frustration! but you gotta admit it is a bit funny to hear '' straight men getting shafted '' in video games. (tho i kno you are saying that straight men who arent into alien, not straight men per se, but the point still stands ;On one hand, I feel for those who have yet to have that perfect romance in a Bioware game. On the other hand, DAI was probably the worst for male characters in BW games for a while, second only to male Force users in any Star Wars game (and KOTOR II), as it's always ' YOU ARE TEH MALE FORCE USER, HERE IS YOUR FEMALE STUDENT LOVE INTEREST!' Looking at you, Kira, Jaesa, Nadia, Ashara, Brianna, and even to a point, Lana and Bastila. I digress. Point being, I can understand, after DAI, where some male or male-toon gamers may feel a bit nervous at the breadth of their prospects. Either way, it is impossible to pander to 'all tastes' in a fandom, especially with all the silly titles folks give themselves now ('silly' being used in general context based on personal opinion on fine-pointing sexual identity). In all honesty, I think the Mass Effect trilogy, over the course of three games and including all characters Bioware employees have considered romances, did damned fine work; Three heterosexual human females. (Miranda, Jack, Ashley) One bisexual human male. (Kaidan) One heterosexual Turian male. (Garrus) One heterosexual Quarian female. (Tali) Two bisexual Asari females. (Liara, Samara) One lesbian human female. (Samantha) One homosexual human male. (Steve) One heterosexual human male. (Jacob) Two bisexual human females. (Diana, Kelly) One heterosexual Drell male. (Thane) Five flirty/fling options. (James, Javik, Consort, Gianna, Shiala) Based on game context alone, cases could be made that Garrus and Kelly do not include intercourse, and can be argued as asexual romance, per player view, in my opinion. As such, I genuinely believe we will all (without the finest of 'groups') find a few options or so in the game. It is my hope that everyone finds someone that trips their trigger, so long as I get a BroRyder and PeeBee arc.
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Post by Cannibal on Feb 1, 2017 15:34:06 GMT
Don't forget the male SW also gets Vette as an option.
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Post by naytnavare on Feb 1, 2017 17:12:00 GMT
Don't forget the male SW also gets Vette as an option. Oh, I didn't forget, but that changes nothing in regards to EVERY MALE FORCE USER gets a love interest in their female padawan or apprentice. There are even conversations from Jaesa who wants to have your children, even if you are with Vette, under certain circumstances.
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Post by fialka on Feb 1, 2017 17:53:18 GMT
I'll just leave these here: (Note that you can also sleep with Sha'ira. Not a romance, necessarily, but... let's call it an extra RP opportunity for straight M/lesbian players specifically.) (Note they left out the Samara mini-romance from ME2 that gets acknowledged in the Citadel DLC.) I left out ME2, because I couldn't find a graphic for it, but here's the breakdown: Straight MShep: Tali, Miranda, Jack, Kelly, Liara (if you have the Shadow Broker DLC it does get acknowledged), Samara/Morinth (mini-romance, but still an option). Straight FShep: Jacob, Garrus, Thane Gay MShep: ... Lesbian FShep: Kelly, Liara (see above), Samara or Morinth (see above) Anyway, I'm not trying to feed into some tit-for-tat pissing contest here, but... it's hard not to see a disparity, and why it often does get pointed out that a straight male Shepard wins here in the sheer quantity of options he gets, be they more established romances or more fling-y ones. And why I tend to scratch my head at the notion that Mass Effect did this great job by giving all these varied options semi-equally across the board. Because they really kinda... didn't. And I understand that even with this plethora of choices, some people just aren't going to get what they want even then. But the chances certainly improve when there's more to pick from. I'm optimistic that for Andromeda we'll see a push for more balance in this regard. That's all we're asking for. Not for straight males to get 'punished' as they seem to sometimes think. Also, people call out DAI as the one example where straight females got more. Yes, this is true, and I can't say I'm sorry I got to benefit from that. But remember that Cullen and Solas (the generally more popular ones) got added later only because of added development time. Otherwise we would've gotten Iron Bull and Blackwall - which is arguably an even more unconventional, potentially unsatisfying choice, than Cass and Josie. For me, I would have zero interest in Blackwall, and Iron Bull would've been the 'I guess this is okay, at least he's fun' choice. And there's the fact that in Dragon Age and Mass Effect, your chances for a happy ending with your romance of choice rises quite a bit if you choose to romance a woman, rather than a man.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2017 17:58:09 GMT
welcome to the club, this is how it feels when games don't pander to your tastes. please read this with humor as i truly understand your frustration! but you gotta admit it is a bit funny to hear '' straight men getting shafted '' in video games. (tho i kno you are saying that straight men who arent into alien, not straight men per se, but the point still stands ;;)On one hand, I feel for those who have yet to have that perfect romance in a Bioware game. On the other hand, DAI was probably the worst for male characters in BW games for a while, second only to male Force users in any Star Wars game (and KOTOR II), as it's always ' YOU ARE TEH MALE FORCE USER, HERE IS YOUR FEMALE STUDENT LOVE INTEREST!' Looking at you, Kira, Jaesa, Nadia, Ashara, Brianna, and even to a point, Lana and Bastila. I digress. Point being, I can understand, after DAI, where some male or male-toon gamers may feel a bit nervous at the breadth of their prospects. Either way, it is impossible to pander to 'all tastes' in a fandom, especially with all the silly titles folks give themselves now ('silly' being used in general context based on personal opinion on fine-pointing sexual identity). In all honesty, I think the Mass Effect trilogy, over the course of three games and including all characters Bioware employees have considered romances, did damned fine work; Three heterosexual human females. (Miranda, Jack, Ashley) One bisexual human male. (Kaidan) One heterosexual Turian male. (Garrus) One heterosexual Quarian female. (Tali) Two bisexual Asari females. (Liara, Samara) One lesbian human female. (Samantha) One homosexual human male. (Steve) One heterosexual human male. (Jacob) Two bisexual human females. (Diana, Kelly) One heterosexual Drell male. (Thane) Five flirty/fling options. (James, Javik, Consort, Gianna, Shiala) Based on game context alone, cases could be made that Garrus and Kelly do not include intercourse, and can be argued as asexual romance, per player view, in my opinion. As such, I genuinely believe we will all (without the finest of 'groups') find a few options or so in the game. It is my hope that everyone finds someone that trips their trigger, so long as I get a BroRyder and PeeBee arc. :P I hope so too! The inverse of the SW universe was that a Female Character never got to romance a Force-User male. All those dashing jedi Knights and dangerous Sith lords? Nah, they are obviously of no interest to females at large. How could a girl possibly fathom to fall for a guy with a lightsabre? Inconceivable! One may blame the code on the Jedi's Order-wide indifference to the female beauty (unless it was the male protagonist!) but, apparently, Korriban Academy Graduates felt that if there is one passion to be left unexplored in their pursuit of power, it's sexual attraction to women. Unanimously and resolutely, all the male Force users of the Old Republic, in an unprecedented agreement between the Sith and Jedi Order, elected to ignore the drop-dead gorgeous PCs. It must have been the hair.
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