The Character Romance thread (Official)

They should have allowed Shepard from the beginning to be able to be gay. Then these problems would not have occurred to such an extent. That Vega was not gay was probably because they were afraid that the new character would be less accepted by the fanbase. they could have blame them to have him included only for gay politics... Steve was the safer choice because he was just a side character that the gamers could easily ignore. And I think Kaidan was their second choice because he was not so much effort since they only had to adapt his scenes from female Shepard. Maybe they also believed that fewer players were against it, because many straight gamers had already sacrificed Kaidan on Virmire.

Thanks. I hope so too.

Love is love, thought is thought. You should never have to apologize, or say thank you, for either. ♡♡♡

There are lots of heterosexual people who like the idea of LGBT characters. I hope I don't sound as if I want to lump all of them together... But sadly, there are also many straight gamers who still have problems with LGBT content, especially with m/m. It's just reality. I see it very often...but I know there are also people who wish us the same representation.And I really hope that some day we will be equally treated, although I honestly doubt this....

That's the next problem with Bioware characters... Compared to their female counterparts, male romanceable characters always tend to be less extravert and more dependend on the protagonist. Female characters often have their own agenda and they achieve a lot of progress during the game, for example Liara who became shadow broker. Morrigan and Miranda are very independend and strong compared to Kaidan or Jacob. (And Kaidan was even better than Jacob. Jacob was the worst character ever). In SWTOR all romanceable jedi companions have been female. A Coincidence? I don't think so. But at least the Dragon Age team seems to improve. We finally saw it's possible to create a strong, independent male character with his own agenda (Solas). I hope we see more strong male characters in future Bioware games.  

It's very interesting that the Carth syndrome is mainly observable in men. There are only very few females who suffer from their dead husband. But this proves that less effort is spent on an original background story in many male characters...

What the hell is Carth Syndrome?

I think the developers have been more involved in the development of female characters in the past. For me, the Carth syndrome is  often an indication that the developers didn't involve much time into a certain character. And usually these are male characters, since heterosexual men are the main target group and, of course, also want interesting romances with the female characters. Certainly, they do not want a girlfriend, who is mourning about her ex. It's no coincidence that it's always female characters who are strong, independent, with an own agenda and an interesting background...this doesn't mean that all male characters in Bioware games had a boring background or were weak, but the difference to their female counterparts is still very significant. But that seems to change slowly. You can see this with Dragon Age quite well. I hope that this will also be the case in Mass Effect Andromeda. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against shy or introvert characters, but after this whole time it seems like a trope. Male characters often missed interesting character traits in the past. Just compare Carth with Bastila, or Sky with Silk Fox or Dawn Star or Kaidan with Liara and Jacob with Miranda...The females are always stronger, more powerfull, independent and with higher goals in their life...whereas the males often suffer from Carth syndrome or don't have an own agenda at least. There are exceptions like Garrus who became Arc Angel...but even these exceptions don't have the same high rank like the most important female character in the respective game (for example Liara). Solas is the first real exception...and that's why I hate that he's not bisexual...I know I said it many times, but it's still a pity for me. xD

Actually, having only being introduced to Carth syndrome, it's occurred to me that recent patients may also have been in part the result of BW shifting towards the "Strong Woman" persona away from the "satisfy straight males first" strategy.  I don't even think that today this imbalance is much due to dev effort focus (as oppose to persona focus) on women; it's not necessarily that men are being ignored such that they are comparatively underachieving, it's that they, the males, are all middle-achieving and BW has focused on making "strong women" who are always successful.  It's funny to think how a welcome change in mindset towards female characters has not changed and somewhat reinforced a negative (or at least 'meh') mindset towards men, all that's changed is the reason why that mindset exist. 

I think that's the point being argued here. Most of the great male characters aren't romanceable. I would have given up my left kidney to be able to romance Varric. Fenris made up for it, but man. For whatever reason, the romanceable males haven't had as much umph overall as the romanceable females. At least, that's my takeaway from this discussion.

It's a problem in Mass Effect, Jade Empire, KOTOR and SWTOR (as far as I know all romanceable force users are female) and probably in all other games from Bioware that I don't know. I don't see equality at all, sorry. Only the Dragon Age team is more progressive (as I already pointed out).

Jade Empire: Sky who lost his wife and child < princess silk fox (daughter of the emperor, has a sharp tongue, wants to escape her predestined life, has a hidden identity, a great urge to be independent); mysterious dawn star (daughter of our antagonist with the ability to sense ghosts, she's very spiritual)
KOTOR: Carth who lost his wife and child < Bastila, most important jedi in the galaxy, Malak wants her power
SWTOR: ...only female romanceable force users; KOTFE: Lana, strongest companion, is described as a very strong force user and still higly reflective. Again no male force user.
Mass Effect 1: Kaidan, Soldier, introvert, not as noticeable as Ashley (no matter if you like her or not...she's still more noticeable than Kaidan in Mass Effect 1) < Liara who could connect with your brain and studies prothean technology, and she's Benezias daughter (who played in important role as well) and an Asari (Asari are the living powerfull female trope in Mass Effect: Biotic by nature, can reproduce with every species, can become very old, seem to be able manipulate peoples mind (see the bachelor party), have prothean technolofy, found Citadel as first species in the universe
Mass Effect 2: Jacob (who the fuck is Jacob?) < Miranda, perfect women, genetically modified, brought Shepard back to life
Garrus and Tali (equally treated), Thane and Jack (Thane is a complex character in general, but as far as I remember, we have the "I lost my wife and have a child" trope again, and he's more introvert and sees himself as a weapon without free will. Jack on the other hand fights for her freedom, she is really hardened, bitter, independend, strong and has an original background story. She only softens after you know her better and gain her trust)
Mass Effect 3: Kaidan (now 2nd Spectre, but mostly injured during the game; mostly changeable with Ashley, but a little better than her < Liara, Shadow Broker, really great development of personality, most screentime
Dragon Age Origins: Alistar (he's a great character in general...but) < Morrigan, is still more powerfull, always wins a conversation against Alistair, can get a child with the protagonist; Leliana, reappearing in Dragon Age Inquisition, great role in the whole series
Dragon Age 2: Anders and Isabela storyrelevant, but Anders seems more whiny than her
Dragon Age Inquisition: finally Solas, who's not only independend, intellectual and a strong mage, but also story relevant and an old god.

That is quite positive outlook on how humans continue to progress for better. I don't personally know if I quite believe in that. Devs might have that approach in ME universe though.