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Post by Nightscrawl on May 29, 2017 14:31:47 GMT
Both Players and characters shutting down romances, for whatever reason, should be honest and amicable. However, not allowing the player to initially try and flirt is meta gaming, takes away control of their character, and is all around immersion breaking for the entire game world. Your character, or the player if they are actually able to start blind, are not mind readers. Giving the PC "gaydar" is just lazy and ridiculous. i feel obligated to point out: morrigan, alistair, blackwall, solas, miranda, tali, jack, jacob, garrus, thane, jaal, probably a few i'm forgetting... these are all characters that gay players can't flirt with. they're straight, we're supposed to know they're straight, therefore not for us and that's it. we can't force our icky gay attentions on them. so while you think giving the PC a gaydar is ridiculous, bioware PCs have apparently had heterometres built in from the beginning. Heterometers!
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Post by lauratsoni on May 29, 2017 14:33:38 GMT
i feel obligated to point out: morrigan, alistair, blackwall, solas, miranda, tali, jack, jacob, garrus, thane, jaal, probably a few i'm forgetting... these are all characters that gay players can't flirt with. they're straight, we're supposed to know they're straight, therefore not for us and that's it. we can't force our icky gay attentions on them. so while you think giving the PC a gaydar is ridiculous, bioware PCs have apparently had heterometres built in from the beginning.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2017 14:37:09 GMT
Both Players and characters shutting down romances, for whatever reason, should be honest and amicable. However, not allowing the player to initially try and flirt is meta gaming, takes away control of their character, and is all around immersion breaking for the entire game world. Your character, or the player if they are actually able to start blind, are not mind readers. Giving the PC "gaydar" is just lazy and ridiculous. i feel obligated to point out: morrigan, alistair, blackwall, solas, miranda, tali, jack, jacob, garrus, thane, jaal, probably a few i'm forgetting... these are all characters that gay players can't flirt with. they're straight, we're supposed to know they're straight, therefore not for us and that's it. we can't force our icky gay attentions on them. so while you think giving the PC a gaydar is ridiculous, bioware PCs have apparently had heterometres built in from the beginning. That moment when you realize that you hate something that you didn't realize that you hate...... Yeah, this is bullshit. The gay characters always have rejection lines for the o/s PC, but the straight ones don't.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2017 14:44:24 GMT
Yes but the problem is the delicate little petal straight guys who are too insecure to be around gay and feel any remotely flirtacious remarks are them being unfairly ninjamanced and how it's heterophobia for them to be forced to acknowledge the existence of gay. But it's ok for characters like Kelly and Pelessaria to ask for your d or v with no precursor whatsoever. I've been on BioWare forums for over four years, and in that time I've never once seen anyone complain about being ninjamanced by a gay person, when people complain about ninjamancing its inevitably about Liara. Or are you referring to the infamous Anders flirt? Lots and lots of people lost their shit about Kaidan too.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2017 14:52:16 GMT
The only time I'm aware of a gay flirt from a character was Anders in DA2. I would welcome seeing flirts from any character (the more the merrier), my only minor concern about the Anders flirt was that he got angry at being turned down. If he had been chilled about it, that would have been perfectly fine. I go back and forth on this a little. Yeah, it's annoying the way he reacts, but, I'm fine with it for three reasons: 1.) While you gain rivalry, you can easily make it up with friendship within that same dialogue tree if you pick the right options. 2.) If you metagame, you can actually get through that discussion without entering a romance with him OR gaining rivalry points, but it involves a flirt initially and then a more gentle "let down". 3.) Anders is a super emotional guy who is possessed by a righteous spirit so he's even more passionate and emotional. And he just poured his heart out to you and you rejected him. How else would he react? I mean, people want realistic characters, right? So people want to reject Anders and have him be chill? That's super out of character for him, no? I mean, I can understand wanting to have Hawke react differently, but Anders? I think he reacts exactly how he should given his character.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2017 14:58:46 GMT
The only time I'm aware of a gay flirt from a character was Anders in DA2. I would welcome seeing flirts from any character (the more the merrier), my only minor concern about the Anders flirt was that he got angry at being turned down. If he had been chilled about it, that would have been perfectly fine. I go back and forth on this a little. Yeah, it's annoying the way he reacts, but, I'm fine with it for three reasons: 1.) While you gain rivalry, you can easily make it up with friendship within that same dialogue tree if you pick the right options. 2.) If you metagame, you can actually get through that discussion without entering a romance with him OR gaining rivalry points, but it involves a flirt initially and then a more gentle "let down". 3.) Anders is a super emotional guy who is possessed by a righteous spirit so he's even more passionate and emotional. And he just poured his heart out to you and you rejected him. How else would he react? I mean, people want realistic characters, right? So people want to reject Anders and have him be chill? That's super out of character for him, no? I mean, I can understand wanting to have Hawke react differently, but Anders? I think he reacts exactly how he should given his character. You traditionally did lose approval ratings in the older games when you rejected the characters. DA2 is a game where they were sort of messing around with KOTOR2 meld with BioWARE's older set up (that you still can see in Origins). So, some of it is WIP and inconsistent.
I liked it when characters used to initiate flirting and LTs with your PC, but many, many players did not, so overtime, it got more and more into the player initiated only territory.
I'd think that after you'd flirted with a character a few times, it would be nice for him or her to initiate a dialogue or two without waiting for the PC to get into the hub and wait for a "heart" option to become available... Aww, well. Dream on.
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Post by Ryzaki on May 29, 2017 15:40:54 GMT
Yes but the problem is the delicate little petal straight guys who are too insecure to be around gay and feel any remotely flirtacious remarks are them being unfairly ninjamanced and how it's heterophobia for them to be forced to acknowledge the existence of gay. But it's ok for characters like Kelly and Pelessaria to ask for your d or v with no precursor whatsoever. I've been on BioWare forums for over four years, and in that time I've never once seen anyone complain about being ninjamanced by a gay person, when people complain about ninjamancing its inevitably about Liara. Or are you referring to the infamous Anders flirt? Leliana had a bug where she'd somehow think you were involved. It was more hilarious than anything with her randomly coming at me near the end of my Alistair romance like HOW COULD YOU? I was so confused XD
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Post by Felya87 on May 29, 2017 15:55:33 GMT
I've been on BioWare forums for over four years, and in that time I've never once seen anyone complain about being ninjamanced by a gay person, when people complain about ninjamancing its inevitably about Liara. Or are you referring to the infamous Anders flirt? Leliana had a bug where she'd somehow think you were involved. It was more hilarious than anything with her randomly coming at me near the end of my Alistair romance like HOW COULD YOU? I was so confused XD This happened more than once at me too... but only with my female elves! It was even more WTF?! when she had just asked me how Alistair was in bed...
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Post by Catilina on May 29, 2017 17:56:30 GMT
The only time I'm aware of a gay flirt from a character was Anders in DA2. I would welcome seeing flirts from any character (the more the merrier), my only minor concern about the Anders flirt was that he got angry at being turned down. If he had been chilled about it, that would have been perfectly fine. I go back and forth on this a little. Yeah, it's annoying the way he reacts, but, I'm fine with it for three reasons: 1.) While you gain rivalry, you can easily make it up with friendship within that same dialogue tree if you pick the right options. 2.) If you metagame, you can actually get through that discussion without entering a romance with him OR gaining rivalry points, but it involves a flirt initially and then a more gentle "let down". 3.) Anders is a super emotional guy who is possessed by a righteous spirit so he's even more passionate and emotional. And he just poured his heart out to you and you rejected him. How else would he react? I mean, people want realistic characters, right? So people want to reject Anders and have him be chill? That's super out of character for him, no? I mean, I can understand wanting to have Hawke react differently, but Anders? I think he reacts exactly how he should given his character. Yes! That's what I suppose too. Hawke's rejection in this scene isn't really gentle. In additional Anders would angry on himself too, beause he misjudged the situation. This rivalry's completely understandable, instantaneous reaction. Later, if Hawke try to flirt with him, he reject that, telling why he teasing him, but he's not angry anymore, and the friendship continuing. But I saw a lot of hatred for this and only a few neutral / understanding reactions.
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Post by Dirk on May 29, 2017 20:13:01 GMT
I really had bad day (my beloved dog is sick badly and other things), I watched some ''straight propaganda'' that being gay is a choice... !@?!@! (sorry) They don't know sh*t, if I could I would be straight or bi, it would make my life so much easier in my homophobic country and family It's like saying that being straight is a choice, so maybe straight people should try to ''change sides''? They can't? So only gay people can ''switch sides''??! See how stupid it sounds? So yeah, LGBT situation in Andromeda did not help me to feel less unwanted Oh no, I hope your dog is getting well soon. Dogs can be quite resilient. One of my dogs got hit by a car but he survived. Don't lose hope yet! Those "straight propaganda" is pure bullshit, friend. It is very stupid so don't pay it much attention. We are gay and we are here to stay, regardless of stupid shits those people say.
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Post by Catilina on May 29, 2017 20:41:14 GMT
I really had bad day (my beloved dog is sick badly and other things), I watched some ''straight propaganda'' that being gay is a choice... !@?!@! (sorry) They don't know sh*t, if I could I would be straight or bi, it would make my life so much easier in my homophobic country and family It's like saying that being straight is a choice, so maybe straight people should try to ''change sides''? They can't? So only gay people can ''switch sides''??! See how stupid it sounds? So yeah, LGBT situation in Andromeda did not help me to feel less unwanted Why for the name of Andraste you watch such a fucking thing?! Is the life not hard enough without this shit? Try don't worry about it! I hope, your dog will soon be better!
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Post by dhalion on May 29, 2017 21:48:50 GMT
I go back and forth on this a little. Yeah, it's annoying the way he reacts, but, I'm fine with it for three reasons: 1.) While you gain rivalry, you can easily make it up with friendship within that same dialogue tree if you pick the right options. 2.) If you metagame, you can actually get through that discussion without entering a romance with him OR gaining rivalry points, but it involves a flirt initially and then a more gentle "let down". 3.) Anders is a super emotional guy who is possessed by a righteous spirit so he's even more passionate and emotional. And he just poured his heart out to you and you rejected him. How else would he react? I mean, people want realistic characters, right? So people want to reject Anders and have him be chill? That's super out of character for him, no? I mean, I can understand wanting to have Hawke react differently, but Anders? I think he reacts exactly how he should given his character. Yes! That's what I suppose too. Hawke's rejection in this scene isn't really gentle. In additional Anders would angry on himself too, beause he misjudged the situation. This rivalry's completely understandable, instantaneous reaction. Later, if Hawke try to flirt with him, he reject that, telling why he teasing him, but he's not angry anymore, and the friendship continuing. But I saw a lot of hatred for this and only a few neutral / understanding reactions. People looooooove to complain about Anders for that rivalry gain. Yet, you never see me or any other gay guy shitting on Morrigan because she disapproved of my gay warden saying that, no, he never thought about the possibility of there being "more" between her and him. lol
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Post by gaycaravaggio on May 29, 2017 22:06:11 GMT
Alright, you want me to start a romance discussion? Next time, I hope the lesbian character rejects the male player character as brutally as possible. Hmmm, I didn't actually flirt with anyone for the 'rejection' line (because I already knew the orientations). How were the 'rejection' lines in MEA? I thought Sera's 'I'm just not into you' was rather well done, in DAI... Everyone said that they're not into your gender, except Suvi who said she wanted to keep it professional. In return, I wish for the next lesbian to be the exact opposite, to make it obvious in the most rude manner possible that she will never be with a man. Variety is the spice of life.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 29, 2017 22:39:10 GMT
Hmmm, I didn't actually flirt with anyone for the 'rejection' line (because I already knew the orientations). How were the 'rejection' lines in MEA? I thought Sera's 'I'm just not into you' was rather well done, in DAI... Everyone said that they're not into your gender, except Suvi who said she wanted to keep it professional. In return, I wish for the next lesbian to be the exact opposite, to make it obvious in the most rude manner possible that she will never be with a man. Variety is the spice of life. Ha, for balance and variety, that would be fun to see...
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Post by Catilina on May 29, 2017 22:45:59 GMT
Yes! That's what I suppose too. Hawke's rejection in this scene isn't really gentle. In additional Anders would angry on himself too, beause he misjudged the situation. This rivalry's completely understandable, instantaneous reaction. Later, if Hawke try to flirt with him, he reject that, telling why he teasing him, but he's not angry anymore, and the friendship continuing. But I saw a lot of hatred for this and only a few neutral / understanding reactions. People looooooove to complain about Anders for that rivalry gain. Yet, you never see me or any other gay guy shitting on Morrigan because she disapproved of my gay warden saying that, no, he never thought about the possibility of there being "more" between her and him. lol Haha, Morrigan! My Warden gave her the gift mirror, with some nice words (she is a beautiful woman or something), and she immediately became jealous, and asks my Warden to choose between she and Zevran... –30 approval... (Just as Leliana.) Isabela after one silly flirt option appeared in Hawke's mansion, and as I remember she also got rivalry, if Hawke refused her. (I'm not sure about rivalry, but she told, that probably Hawke likes better the ladies of Hightown...)
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Post by Steelcan on May 29, 2017 23:49:35 GMT
I've been on BioWare forums for over four years, and in that time I've never once seen anyone complain about being ninjamanced by a gay person, when people complain about ninjamancing its inevitably about Liara. Or are you referring to the infamous Anders flirt? Lots and lots of people lost their shit about Kaidan too. well people need to stop picking the upper right hand choice like their life depends on it
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Post by SofaJockey on May 30, 2017 0:09:11 GMT
Lots and lots of people lost their shit about Kaidan too. well people need to stop picking the upper right hand choice like their life depends on it. Don't the stats support around 80% picking 'good' in a 'good' vs 'bad' choice? I rather like the new tone options, I'm now making a choice each time (albeit a marginal one). And as for folk losing their shit, to be upset that content 'simply exists' despite it being content the player does not have to choose, seems royally entitled (or worse).
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2017 0:23:19 GMT
Lots and lots of people lost their shit about Kaidan too. well people need to stop picking the upper right hand choice like their life depends on it More like people need to stop being so insecure. People fancy people like it's literally the most natural thing in the world. If these people cant handle the possibility that someone not of their preferred gender might take interest then it says a lot about their lack of masculinity if you ask me. Perhaps the fear they might like it?
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Post by Steelcan on May 30, 2017 0:25:13 GMT
well people need to stop picking the upper right hand choice like their life depends on it. Don't the stats support around 80% picking 'good' in a 'good' vs 'bad' choice? I rather like the new tone options, I'm now making a choice each time (albeit a marginal one). And as for folk losing their shit, to be upset that content 'simply exists' despite it being content the player does not have to choose, seems royally entitled (or worse). For ME? Not sure, I know 96% of players cured the genophage, but only 60% has Wrex present...implications unpleasant
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Post by Steelcan on May 30, 2017 0:26:14 GMT
well people need to stop picking the upper right hand choice like their life depends on it More like people need to stop being so insecure. People fancy people like it's literally the most natural thing in the world. If these people cant handle the possibility that someone not of their preferred gender might take interest then it says a lot about their lack of masculinity if you ask me. Perhaps the fear they might like it? I for one am always pleased when I get compliments from guys, inebriated as they usually are.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2017 0:26:20 GMT
Don't the stats support around 80% picking 'good' in a 'good' vs 'bad' choice? I rather like the new tone options, I'm now making a choice each time (albeit a marginal one). And as for folk losing their shit, to be upset that content 'simply exists' despite it being content the player does not have to choose, seems royally entitled (or worse). For ME? Not sure, I know 96% of players cured the genophage, but only 60% has Wrex present...implications unpleasant Statistics are skewered by the default world state. If you dont import a save file then wrex is always dead.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2017 0:28:07 GMT
More like people need to stop being so insecure. People fancy people like it's literally the most natural thing in the world. If these people cant handle the possibility that someone not of their preferred gender might take interest then it says a lot about their lack of masculinity if you ask me. Perhaps the fear they might like it? I for one am always pleased when I get compliments from guys, inebriated as they usually are. I know you do honey that's why you go to gay bars. You should try not getting them so drunk though. You need them to keep it up to make your bottom self happy.
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Post by Dirk on May 30, 2017 0:28:11 GMT
What I would find interesting is what if there are more than one flirt options in a conversation when talking to a NPC, and each option is responded differently. For example, if your PC is very forward in flirting, the NPC will in turn be blunt when not reciprocating the flirt.
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Post by Steelcan on May 30, 2017 0:30:15 GMT
For ME? Not sure, I know 96% of players cured the genophage, but only 60% has Wrex present...implications unpleasant Statistics are skewered by the default world state. If you dont import a save file then wrex is always dead. Then people should be smart enough to not cure the genophage in such world states
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Post by Steelcan on May 30, 2017 0:41:39 GMT
I for one am always pleased when I get compliments from guys, inebriated as they usually are. I know you do honey that's why you go to gay bars. You should try not getting them so drunk though. You need them to keep it up to make your bottom self happy. honestly i don't think there's a gay bar within a 30 mile radius of the college i went to
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