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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Jun 26, 2017 17:12:23 GMT
Well, I'm all for a "good" romance ending for female protags and the Solas romance. Hopefully, you'll get one. I think Solas is one of Bioware's best/most interesting characters. Ramsay, you want to take this? If the story were completely linear, I'd tend to agree with Ramsay, but it's possible since there's limited choice involved that Bioware will throw the female romance a bone following certain parameters/choices.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2017 17:28:12 GMT
In which case it will still be a time-honoured closure, but for a male PC. The amazing number of minor villains were saved between the sheets.... but the female pc gets big win then, probably the most major win by seduction scenario. Well, I'm all for a "good" romance ending for female protags and the Solas romance. Hopefully, you'll get one. I think Solas is one of Bioware's best/most interesting characters. Ah, I am all for the womanhood getting a happy ending, but ironically, I won't be (in immortal words of F!Ryder) benefitting. I love Solas as a character, but not as a romantic option. I was looking towards that statement as a foreshadowing of broader strokes in the history of Thedas, and some epic scale changes, but I don't think it's coming. Overall, I got my major romance in DAT in DA2, and I am okay with it staying the major love theme for now. DA4 has to provide something out of this world to top DA2
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Jun 26, 2017 17:53:46 GMT
Josiah Renaudin @josiahrenaudin 🚨 PODCAST 🚨 @dragonage guru @mike_Laidlaw joins me to talk creating open worlds, reviews, and Jade Empire. LISTEN: bit.ly/2s9wVZMpbs.twimg.com/media/DDQuNrQVwAAxKzi.jpgOn this week's episode, the creative director of Dragon Age, Mike Laidlaw, joins host Josiah Renaudin to discuss how the team at BioWare creates such massive open worlds. Mike explains the different roles he's played at BioWare, the struggles of even starting a five-year AAA project, what a linear Dragon Age (similar to Uncharted) would look like, how he deals with Dragon Age reviews, and the possibility of a Jade Empire 2.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2017 17:56:05 GMT
Josiah Renaudin @josiahrenaudin 🚨 PODCAST 🚨 @dragonage guru @mike_Laidlaw joins me to talk creating open worlds, reviews, and Jade Empire. LISTEN: bit.ly/2s9wVZMpbs.twimg.com/media/DDQuNrQVwAAxKzi.jpgOn this week's episode, the creative director of Dragon Age, Mike Laidlaw, joins host Josiah Renaudin to discuss how the team at BioWare creates such massive open worlds. Mike explains the different roles he's played at BioWare, the struggles of even starting a five-year AAA project, what a linear Dragon Age (similar to Uncharted) would look like, how he deals with Dragon Age reviews, and the possibility of a Jade Empire 2. I gotta see that!
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 26, 2017 18:34:36 GMT
I'm pretty much with you on this. Whilst I have the feeling the choice to "redeem" Solas was largely for the benefit of the romances, I know plenty of people who saw him simply as a friend and want to save him as well. When I had my male Lavellan say he wanted to help Solas he didn't mean in order to destroy the present world but to directly help him find a way to help the elves without having to do that. Sadly, the words put in Solas' mouth make it seem as though he thinks we agree with his plan but he is saving us from taking the burden of that responsibility.
I want to make the world a better place for the elves but also, in Solas' words, "free the slaves of all races", which I really want to be an option if we are going to Tevinter. Judging from my efforts in previous games, nothing I do ever seems to last beyond that particular game, so sadly even if we are given the "free the slaves" option it will be negated in some way further down the line.
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Post by arvaarad on Jun 26, 2017 19:11:00 GMT
Josiah Renaudin @josiahrenaudin 🚨 PODCAST 🚨 @dragonage guru @mike_Laidlaw joins me to talk creating open worlds, reviews, and Jade Empire. LISTEN: bit.ly/2s9wVZMpbs.twimg.com/media/DDQuNrQVwAAxKzi.jpgOn this week's episode, the creative director of Dragon Age, Mike Laidlaw, joins host Josiah Renaudin to discuss how the team at BioWare creates such massive open worlds. Mike explains the different roles he's played at BioWare, the struggles of even starting a five-year AAA project, what a linear Dragon Age (similar to Uncharted) would look like, how he deals with Dragon Age reviews, and the possibility of a Jade Empire 2. I'm liking the sudden uptick in interviews of Dragon Age people.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 26, 2017 19:16:39 GMT
I'm pretty much with you on this. Whilst I have the feeling the choice to "redeem" Solas was largely for the benefit of the romances, I know plenty of people who saw him simply as a friend and want to save him as well. Why would Bioware put in a significant declaration from PC largely for the sake of romance, when only a small percent of the audience chose to romance Solas? That simply does not compute - and I'm saying this from perspective of someone who likes the character and has a PC who romanced him. The option appears to be there predominantly for those who have befriended Solas and will indeed try and redeem him. The potential friendship with Solas is a way more important chunk of theme going on there than romance is - there's no romance without underlying friendship first. The option of romance merely gives this whole thing an additional edge. I'm fairly sure that Solas makes it quite clear in multiple responses that he doesn't think that the non-destructive (in whatever way) solution exists and seems to think that the only way Inquisitor is able to prove him wrong is when they're working in opposition to him. Hence no joining. Well, prepare to be disappointed if you think the solution to slavery is just dealing with Tevinter - especially when Inquisition makes it crystal clear that Solas thinks that the Qun is even worse offender than Tevinter, at least in some respects, and that's among other problems existing on the continent. IMO at some point we will be getting an opportunity to "correct the course", but we will never get "and they lived happily ever after" (likely the opportunity itself will carry its own risks), at least so long as the franchise is going to be continued in some way.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Jun 26, 2017 19:21:08 GMT
Josiah Renaudin @josiahrenaudin 🚨 PODCAST 🚨 @dragonage guru @mike_Laidlaw joins me to talk creating open worlds, reviews, and Jade Empire. LISTEN: bit.ly/2s9wVZMpbs.twimg.com/media/DDQuNrQVwAAxKzi.jpgOn this week's episode, the creative director of Dragon Age, Mike Laidlaw, joins host Josiah Renaudin to discuss how the team at BioWare creates such massive open worlds. Mike explains the different roles he's played at BioWare, the struggles of even starting a five-year AAA project, what a linear Dragon Age (similar to Uncharted) would look like, how he deals with Dragon Age reviews, and the possibility of a Jade Empire 2. Quote from this interview: "Something is happening with Dragon Age... one of the things I am doing right now is hiring" - at around 1:03:05 or so.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 26, 2017 19:24:15 GMT
Quote from this interview: "Something is happening with Dragon Age... one of the things I am doing right now is hiring" - at around 1:03:05 or so. He also said something about 'a few things going on' that he's excited about and I have to assume that he's not talking about DA4 itself when he mentions them, but some additional content.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Jun 26, 2017 19:44:36 GMT
Josiah Renaudin @josiahrenaudin 🚨 PODCAST 🚨 @dragonage guru @mike_Laidlaw joins me to talk creating open worlds, reviews, and Jade Empire. LISTEN: bit.ly/2s9wVZMpbs.twimg.com/media/DDQuNrQVwAAxKzi.jpgOn this week's episode, the creative director of Dragon Age, Mike Laidlaw, joins host Josiah Renaudin to discuss how the team at BioWare creates such massive open worlds. Mike explains the different roles he's played at BioWare, the struggles of even starting a five-year AAA project, what a linear Dragon Age (similar to Uncharted) would look like, how he deals with Dragon Age reviews, and the possibility of a Jade Empire 2. Love his comments about Dave Gaider's head.
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Post by tacsear on Jun 26, 2017 19:52:25 GMT
Josiah Renaudin @josiahrenaudin 🚨 PODCAST 🚨 @dragonage guru @mike_Laidlaw joins me to talk creating open worlds, reviews, and Jade Empire. LISTEN: bit.ly/2s9wVZMpbs.twimg.com/media/DDQuNrQVwAAxKzi.jpgOn this week's episode, the creative director of Dragon Age, Mike Laidlaw, joins host Josiah Renaudin to discuss how the team at BioWare creates such massive open worlds. Mike explains the different roles he's played at BioWare, the struggles of even starting a five-year AAA project, what a linear Dragon Age (similar to Uncharted) would look like, how he deals with Dragon Age reviews, and the possibility of a Jade Empire 2. Kinda disappointed with origin stories, but I understand 52:08 lol
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Post by SwobyJ on Jun 26, 2017 20:02:52 GMT
Kuro 🌸 @kurocyouart
#solavellan #Solas #DragonAgeInquisition #commission #art #illustration @patrickweekes what do you think about the Inquisitor joining Solas? Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes
Absolutely get the appeal, but we wouldn't have been able to support it if we ever did a future game, so it felt wrong to make it an option. Wow, that's a huge response. So, I assume this means no joining Solas in DA4. I am a bit disappointed, but it is not unexpected. Not necessarily. 'Joining' can happen, but within a plot structure that allows it. His plan, it can change. The next game's context, it can change. The situation faced, it can change. The extent of joining, it can change. In Trespasser the gist was that Solas is bad guy (no matter any sympathetic layers) and you are good guy. Even Solas himself may not see it that way, but it was too straining of character or plot to have the Inquisitor not see it that way, and so even with appealing to Solas (if female elf and romanced), he knows this is too much for you. There's a whole game where the circumstances and potential varied effects (most can become off-screen) to change. Basically, I'm still considering it possible for 'the Inquisitor to join Solas'. I just don't expect it to ever be a big structural deal. Perhaps an interesting touch to future content.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 26, 2017 20:07:52 GMT
Wow, that's a huge response. So, I assume this means no joining Solas in DA4. I am a bit disappointed, but it is not unexpected. Not necessarily. 'Joining' can happen, but within a plot structure that allows it. His plan, it can change. The next game's context, it can change. The situation faced, it can change. The extent of joining, it can change. In Trespasser the gist was that Solas is bad guy (no matter any sympathetic layers) and you are good guy. Even Solas himself may not see it that way, but it was too straining of character or plot to have the Inquisitor not see it that way, and so even with appealing to Solas (if female elf and romanced), he knows this is too much for you. There's a whole game where the circumstances and potential varied effects (most can become off-screen) to change. Basically, I'm still considering it possible for 'the Inquisitor to join Solas'. I just don't expect it to ever be a big structural deal. Perhaps an interesting touch to future content. Basically - we don't even know where the story is heading. We know where the story will likely start, but we don't yet know how it'll end. We don't even know what Inquisitor's or Solas's arcs will be or what decisions they'd have to make, or whether they'd both stay in same position in terms of designated role - same with DA4 main protagonist. I expect some twists and sudden turns though, as well as some meaty revelations. Kinda disappointed with origin stories, but I understand TBH I feel a tiny bit vindicated, because I've been pointing out issues with bringing back origin stories on basically same grounds for years now. IMO that doesn't mean that some elements of origin stories can't be brought back at all, but not really anything to the extent of DAO.
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Post by arvaarad on Jun 26, 2017 20:16:26 GMT
Josiah Renaudin @josiahrenaudin 🚨 PODCAST 🚨 @dragonage guru @mike_Laidlaw joins me to talk creating open worlds, reviews, and Jade Empire. LISTEN: bit.ly/2s9wVZMpbs.twimg.com/media/DDQuNrQVwAAxKzi.jpgOn this week's episode, the creative director of Dragon Age, Mike Laidlaw, joins host Josiah Renaudin to discuss how the team at BioWare creates such massive open worlds. Mike explains the different roles he's played at BioWare, the struggles of even starting a five-year AAA project, what a linear Dragon Age (similar to Uncharted) would look like, how he deals with Dragon Age reviews, and the possibility of a Jade Empire 2. Kinda disappointed with origin stories, but I understand I wonder if cinematic/non-interactive origin stories are significantly easier than interactive ones, or if they'd be nearly the same level of extra work. Perhaps there's a middle ground between "origin story is in a textbox during character creation" and "origin story is several hours of branching background-specific content" - maybe something more like "origin story is a couple cutscenes set in the past, with limited/no player control". I can only speak for myself, but I think I'd enjoy that kind of origin story, even if it were totally non-interactive. Or interactive, but with no real effects on later plot points. To me, it would feel very similar to the DA:O origins, but without generating quite so many combat encounters (which must be designed and balanced), branching dialogue options (which must be mapped out and potentially tied to later outcomes), and quests (which have their own dialogue and character models and journal entries and rewards and all that). Of course, I'm not a game dev. My hunch is that non-branching stuff is significantly easier, but I could be guessing totally wrong. Maybe the bottleneck is in the animation, in which case non-interactive origins wouldn't be much of a time/resource savings.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Jun 26, 2017 20:50:09 GMT
Josiah Renaudin @josiahrenaudin 🚨 PODCAST 🚨 @dragonage guru @mike_Laidlaw joins me to talk creating open worlds, reviews, and Jade Empire. LISTEN: bit.ly/2s9wVZMpbs.twimg.com/media/DDQuNrQVwAAxKzi.jpgOn this week's episode, the creative director of Dragon Age, Mike Laidlaw, joins host Josiah Renaudin to discuss how the team at BioWare creates such massive open worlds. Mike explains the different roles he's played at BioWare, the struggles of even starting a five-year AAA project, what a linear Dragon Age (similar to Uncharted) would look like, how he deals with Dragon Age reviews, and the possibility of a Jade Empire 2. He also confirms that Alexis Kennedy revealed Bioware working on a Dragon Age game... though I think Alexis tried to obfuscate that if memory serves... I may be wrong.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 26, 2017 20:53:32 GMT
I wonder if cinematic/non-interactive origin stories are significantly easier than interactive ones, or if they'd be nearly the same level of extra work. Perhaps there's a middle ground between "origin story is in a textbox during character creation" and "origin story is several hours of branching background-specific content" - maybe something more like "origin story is a couple cutscenes set in the past, with limited/no player control". I can only speak for myself, but I think I'd enjoy that kind of origin story, even if it were totally non-interactive. Or interactive, but with no real effects on later plot points. To me, it would feel very similar to the DA:O origins, but without generating quite so many combat encounters (which must be designed and balanced), branching dialogue options (which must be mapped out and potentially tied to later outcomes), and quests (which have their own dialogue and character models and journal entries and rewards and all that). Of course, I'm not a game dev. My hunch is that non-branching stuff is significantly easier, but I could be guessing totally wrong. Maybe the bottleneck is in the animation, in which case non-interactive origins wouldn't be much of a time/resource savings. My suspicion is that if we'd have such 'cinematic origins' there will be people who'd grumble or even start accusing Bioware for being lazy for not replicating Origins and not giving us ability to control the character - even if that 'control' literally amounted to having control over camera and some other minor stuff that will still leave us mostly in the role of passive spectator. I'm not a game dev either, but I'm sort of leaning towards the probability of best choices (in this particular case) being either the game going 'all out' and giving us a lengthy prologue, or just throwing us right into the story and we'd go from there, with little in-between. Anyway... I do recall that someone here has proposed literally a separate game with origin stories for characters that will be released prior to DA4 - seems a bit too ambitious to demand that, given that Mike Laidlaw just explicitly told us that this thing is just damn expensive, but I wonder... what if DA Keep was used to set up a character? With minimal or no CC except basic options like gender or race and a few simple animations like in DA story summary, with VO from Varric or maybe even VA for PC's? It could be imported into the game together with world state record - and if nobody wants to deal with that, they'd just get a textbox during character creation.
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Post by Lazarillo on Jun 26, 2017 21:12:58 GMT
I'd want them to "fix" the problems with disparate origins first anyway, before bringing back "origin stories". The PC came off as too bland in Inquisition due in part to how many different character types they were simultaneously trying to cater to. Foregoing "origins" entirely to create a focused but malleable character (ala Hawke) is more appealing, IMO, if they're going to continue in the same stylistic vein they've been going.
S'why I'm really hoping for a "slave" in DA4...allows plenty of customization options, but limits the amount of variety that has to be accounted for in player dialogue choices.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2017 21:30:59 GMT
I'm pretty much with you on this. Whilst I have the feeling the choice to "redeem" Solas was largely for the benefit of the romances, I know plenty of people who saw him simply as a friend and want to save him as well. When I had my male Lavellan say he wanted to help Solas he didn't mean in order to destroy the present world but to directly help him find a way to help the elves without having to do that. Sadly, the words put in Solas' mouth make it seem as though he thinks we agree with his plan but he is saving us from taking the burden of that responsibility. I want to make the world a better place for the elves but also, in Solas' words, "free the slaves of all races", which I really want to be an option if we are going to Tevinter. Judging from my efforts in previous games, nothing I do ever seems to last beyond that particular game, so sadly even if we are given the "free the slaves" option it will be negated in some way further down the line. Mmgh, not sure if we are in alignment. While I am tired of the negations and just returning everything to the status quo, I ultimately am tired of the status quo, even if we carve out an elven state in the middle of the human lands. I want to see something cataclysmic and irreversible, bringing in the large themes currently tacked away behind the Veil. Fade is not a different plane of existence in Thedas, neither it is an afterlife. Origins and DA2 imo were fairly interesting, but DA3 just did not bring anything particularly exciting. Neither it went the way of local politicking and a personal struggle; nor it did anything world-shattering. Basically, all it did is let us meet and get to know Solas & introduced us to his agenda somewhat. Maybe if Tevinter ends up mouthwateringly awesome I'd be sold on more status quo. But atm, I am not given anything so cool to not wish for a land where demons and spirits and various races mix in a cacophony of a crazy apocalypse.
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Post by midnight tea on Jun 26, 2017 21:39:07 GMT
I'd want them to "fix" the problems with disparate origins first anyway, before bringing back "origin stories". The PC came off as too bland in Inquisition due in part to how many different character types they were simultaneously trying to cater to. Foregoing "origins" entirely to create a focused but malleable character (ala Hawke) is more appealing, IMO, if they're going to continue in the same stylistic vein they've been going. S'why I'm really hoping for a "slave" in DA4...allows plenty of customization options, but limits the amount of variety that has to be accounted for in player dialogue choices.... I don't really see how that's different from start of Inquisition. You're basically saying that characters should start in pretty much the same place, with customization options limited to different reactions to characters depending on their race or background. Well, that's how Inquisition did it, soooooo.... Also - I don't see how 'slave' origin could really limit the variety that has to be accounted for in player's dialogue choices, given that different slaves will be treated differently even in terms of where they're going to be on their limited social ladder. Slaves with magical talents will be treated differently than non-mages and receive training. Talented warriors like Marcus the mageslayer would likely need an entirely different story and scenes. Elves might be used as fuel for blood magic ritual. Qunari (do Vints even have qunari slaves?) may be used as warriors or heavy work. Also, I'm not sure there are dwarf slaves in Tevinter. So basically, all of them would have to be given differently structured stories, unless they're starting at the same place and time... which really makes it no different than Inquisition. Plus, Hawke is not best example to give, considering that story told as it was in DA2 is entirely incompatible with choice of multiple races with different backgrounds as we have in DAO or DAI. And we know (from David Gaider's interview) that DA2 didn't have multiple races and story the way it did due to lack of budget and time.
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Post by tacsear on Jun 26, 2017 22:47:20 GMT
Kinda disappointed with origin stories, but I understand I wonder if cinematic/non-interactive origin stories are significantly easier than interactive ones, or if they'd be nearly the same level of extra work. Perhaps there's a middle ground between "origin story is in a textbox during character creation" and "origin story is several hours of branching background-specific content" - maybe something more like "origin story is a couple cutscenes set in the past, with limited/no player control". I can only speak for myself, but I think I'd enjoy that kind of origin story, even if it were totally non-interactive. Or interactive, but with no real effects on later plot points. To me, it would feel very similar to the DA:O origins, but without generating quite so many combat encounters (which must be designed and balanced), branching dialogue options (which must be mapped out and potentially tied to later outcomes), and quests (which have their own dialogue and character models and journal entries and rewards and all that). Of course, I'm not a game dev. My hunch is that non-branching stuff is significantly easier, but I could be guessing totally wrong. Maybe the bottleneck is in the animation, in which case non-interactive origins wouldn't be much of a time/resource savings. That would be cool, but I'm sure lots of people pop up and say they hate the fact that you cannot conrol your origin story, so I dunno
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Jun 27, 2017 0:56:55 GMT
I wonder if cinematic/non-interactive origin stories are significantly easier than interactive ones, or if they'd be nearly the same level of extra work. Perhaps there's a middle ground between "origin story is in a textbox during character creation" and "origin story is several hours of branching background-specific content" - maybe something more like "origin story is a couple cutscenes set in the past, with limited/no player control". I can only speak for myself, but I think I'd enjoy that kind of origin story, even if it were totally non-interactive. Or interactive, but with no real effects on later plot points. To me, it would feel very similar to the DA:O origins, but without generating quite so many combat encounters (which must be designed and balanced), branching dialogue options (which must be mapped out and potentially tied to later outcomes), and quests (which have their own dialogue and character models and journal entries and rewards and all that). Of course, I'm not a game dev. My hunch is that non-branching stuff is significantly easier, but I could be guessing totally wrong. Maybe the bottleneck is in the animation, in which case non-interactive origins wouldn't be much of a time/resource savings. That would be cool, but I'm sure lots of people pop up and say they hate the fact that you cannot conrol your origin story, so I dunno I think time separation helps a bit. If something happens in the distant past, I feel less like I need to "own" the character's actions. As an example, the very first narrate-y bit of DA:O ("You are a casteless dwarf...") is the same for every protag of a given background. But it doesn't feel intrusive or railroady because it describes stuff that happened before the PC belonged to me. And yet, I feel it does almost as much to situate the unique race/class backgrounds as the full origin story quests. That seems like a pretty good value for what is basically "guy reads what would have been the background text blurb while a noninteractive cinematic plays".
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Hrungr
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Posts: 30,832 Likes: 112,279
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151
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112,279
Hrungr
More coffee...? More coffee.
30,832
August 2016
hrungr
Hrungr
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Hrungr
18,258
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Post by Hrungr on Jun 27, 2017 1:13:48 GMT
Danny Shorago @thefuxedos
My 1st @almagiccitycon panel this week: Friday @ 7:30pm w/ the lovely 'n talented @mike_Laidlaw. Complete schedule: www.magiccitycon.com/con-schedule/"Behind the Scenes: Video Games" Mike Laidlaw @mike_Laidlaw
I dunno about “lovely” but it’s going to be fun.
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7,815
Nightscrawl
3,266
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nightscrawl
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Nightscrawl on Jun 27, 2017 1:29:20 GMT
That would be cool, but I'm sure lots of people pop up and say they hate the fact that you cannot conrol your origin story, so I dunno Yepper. Applies to me. That would be cool, but I'm sure lots of people pop up and say they hate the fact that you cannot conrol your origin story, so I dunno I think time separation helps a bit. If something happens in the distant past, I feel less like I need to "own" the character's actions. As an example, the very first narrate-y bit of DA:O ("You are a casteless dwarf...") is the same for every protag of a given background. But it doesn't feel intrusive or railroady because it describes stuff that happened before the PC belonged to me. And yet, I feel it does almost as much to situate the unique race/class backgrounds as the full origin story quests. That seems like a pretty good value for what is basically "guy reads what would have been the background text blurb while a noninteractive cinematic plays". No, the time separation would not help. I don't want a great deal dictated about my character's origin. Full stop. I greatly preferred the bare bones origin DAI gave us for this reason. It gave me just enough bits to build on, without, for example, saddling us with specific people we have to care about, as did the origins in both DAO and DA2. Yeah, you can certainly roleplay that you don't care about these people, but the game expects you to; that much is evident from the dialogue options you're presented with, autodialogue, and animated expressions on your character's face (that you can't control). The Temple of Sacred Ashes presents the PC with Jowan if you play the mage origin. I don't give a shit about Jowan; fuck off, Jowan. I do not consider my Inquisitor to be "bland," and in fact he is my favorite Dragon Age PC because of they way they did it. I think the story from Fallout 4 is probably one of the worst examples. Here you are in a typical Bethesda open world game, where you can go anywhere and do anything, yet you are forced to play as a person with a spouse of the opposite gender with a child (a son). NPCs ask you questions about it and following the main story, which you have to do at some point to get to certain parts in the game, forces you to think about it, so you can't ignore it completely. My biggest peeve with origin stories is being saddled with people at the beginning of the game I have no emotional attachment to or investment in, yet the game expects me to care about them simply because they exist. I felt disconnected from the DA2 siblings because of this, especially in successive plays. I don't want to be saddled with people. I don't want many facets of my character's life and experiences dictated. Saying that someone is a noble, or a slave, or lived in poverty are things I can work with. More than that I don't want. I suppose I should be clear that I don't expect this from games with a more defined protagonist, like Witcher. But since Dragon Age allows you to create your PC, I do want that level of freedom.
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1,465
Mar 18, 2017 16:32:40 GMT
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Jun 27, 2017 1:48:30 GMT
[No, the time separation would not help. I don't want a great deal dictated about my character's origin. Full stop. I greatly preferred the bare bones origin DAI gave us for this reason. It gave me just enough bits to build on, without, for example, saddling us with specific people we have to care about, as did the origins in both DAO and DA2. Yeah, you can certainly roleplay that you don't care about these people, but the game expects you to; that much is evident from the dialogue options you're presented with, autodialogue, and animated expressions on your character's face (that you can't control). The Temple of Sacred Ashes presents the PC with Jowan if you play the mage origin. I don't give a shit about Jowan; fuck off, Jowan. I do not consider my Inquisitor to be "bland," and in fact he is my favorite Dragon Age PC because of they way they did it. I think the story from Fallout 4 is probably one of the worst examples. Here you are in a typical Bethesda open world game, where you can go anywhere and do anything, yet you are forced to play as a person with a spouse of the opposite gender with a child (a son). NPCs ask you questions about it and following the main story, which you have to do at some point to get to certain parts in the game, forces you to think about it, so you can't ignore it completely. Oh my goodness, I agree on Fallout 4! I know part of the conceit is that everyone in Fallout comes from this over-the-top version of the 50s. And I'm usually pretty on board with that kind of quirky world building. But something about baby+very 50s domestic life just rubs me the wrong way. It's tough for me to empathize with someone trying to reclaim a life I wouldn't have wanted in the first place. What I liked about the DA:O opening narration was that it gave some gentle character hooks for people of different backgrounds to use (or not), and was a nice pause for me to slip into the mindset of someone from that background. But it was still pretty broad. It was, basically, just a dude reading the background blurbs while scenes from the local area played behind it. As if the DA:I text blurbs had someone reading them out loud while scenery scrolled by. The origins only got more specific after the narration ended.
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Post by Gilli on Jun 27, 2017 3:41:50 GMT
That would be cool, but I'm sure lots of people pop up and say they hate the fact that you cannot conrol your origin story, so I dunno Yepper. Applies to me. I think time separation helps a bit. If something happens in the distant past, I feel less like I need to "own" the character's actions. As an example, the very first narrate-y bit of DA:O ("You are a casteless dwarf...") is the same for every protag of a given background. But it doesn't feel intrusive or railroady because it describes stuff that happened before the PC belonged to me. And yet, I feel it does almost as much to situate the unique race/class backgrounds as the full origin story quests. That seems like a pretty good value for what is basically "guy reads what would have been the background text blurb while a noninteractive cinematic plays". No, the time separation would not help. I don't want a great deal dictated about my character's origin. Full stop. I greatly preferred the bare bones origin DAI gave us for this reason. It gave me just enough bits to build on, without, for example, saddling us with specific people we have to care about, as did the origins in both DAO and DA2. Yeah, you can certainly roleplay that you don't care about these people, but the game expects you to; that much is evident from the dialogue options you're presented with, autodialogue, and animated expressions on your character's face (that you can't control). The Temple of Sacred Ashes presents the PC with Jowan if you play the mage origin. I don't give a shit about Jowan; fuck off, Jowan. I do not consider my Inquisitor to be "bland," and in fact he is my favorite Dragon Age PC because of they way they did it. I think the story from Fallout 4 is probably one of the worst examples. Here you are in a typical Bethesda open world game, where you can go anywhere and do anything, yet you are forced to play as a person with a spouse of the opposite gender with a child (a son). NPCs ask you questions about it and following the main story, which you have to do at some point to get to certain parts in the game, forces you to think about it, so you can't ignore it completely. My biggest peeve with origin stories is being saddled with people at the beginning of the game I have no emotional attachment to or investment in, yet the game expects me to care about them simply because they exist. I felt disconnected from the DA2 siblings because of this, especially in successive plays. I don't want to be saddled with people. I don't want many facets of my character's life and experiences dictated. Saying that someone is a noble, or a slave, or lived in poverty are things I can work with. More than that I don't want. I suppose I should be clear that I don't expect this from games with a more defined protagonist, like Witcher. But since Dragon Age allows you to create your PC, I do want that level of freedom. ^^^^^ This so much. As much as I love my first Warden (Dalish), I do not care a bit about Tamlen. Yet nearly every post I see (on tumblr) about Mahariel tells me how sad I should be that Tamlen is dead, while I'm just /That idiot did touch the mirror, even tho my Mahariel told him not to!/ The Inquisitor is so far my fav of the protagonists, because, as you said, I can much more headcanon/roleplay how they are, then being told that "You should care about X because they're your [lover/sibling/whatever]."
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