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Post by warbaby2 on Mar 27, 2017 3:17:38 GMT
Finally, after about 50+ hours, I get to point where they story around Jien Garsons death leads to some sensical - for ME - revelations... It appears that her original idea was not much more then a huge pipe dream, that only could even become reality after a VERY wealthy, mysterious benefactor stepped in to fund it all. While I didn't get it confirmed yet, that could only mean one thing: Cerberus. Mounting a last ditch effort to send 100000 colonists away from the MW in case Shepard failed to stop "something big coming to the Milky Way".
The fact that agents of said benefactor also killed Garson, does support this theory... So, yea, the Ai was a stupid idea that only the threat of the Reapers made even viable. That makes much more sense. Still doesn't save the very cliched overall story, but it helps...
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Post by TheEmptyRoad on Mar 27, 2017 3:33:52 GMT
This honestly was one of my favorite parts of the story and I'm amazed it wasn't more tied to the Critical Path. Lot's of cloak-and-dagger stuff going on. Still don't buy Cora's "I was raised on a freighter" story. There is NO way the writers are THAT bad, to give her the name of Harper with no connection to the Illusive Man.
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Post by warbaby2 on Mar 27, 2017 3:37:07 GMT
This honestly was one of my favorite parts of the story and I'm amazed it wasn't more tied to the Critical Path. Lot's of cloak-and-dagger stuff going on. Still don't buy Cora's "I was raised on a freighter" story. There is NO way the writers are THAT bad, to give her the name of Harper with no connection to the Illusive Man. Yup, I think so too now... ...maybe TIM dropped her off their with a relative from his past, or something, but I doubt she is his daughter or a "natural" blood relative. My guess is, she is the result of some sort of breeding program or some such.
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Post by Plague Doctor on Mar 27, 2017 3:57:57 GMT
This honestly was one of my favorite parts of the story and I'm amazed it wasn't more tied to the Critical Path. Lot's of cloak-and-dagger stuff going on. Still don't buy Cora's "I was raised on a freighter" story. There is NO way the writers are THAT bad, to give her the name of Harper with no connection to the Illusive Man. I may remind you that James Vega was originally named James Sanders, even though he has no connection to Kahlee. I also dont see how it is bad writing when unrelated people share a name. The One Steve Limit is a really stupid trope. Im not saying shes not connected to TIM, she probably is,just that Bioware has made that mistake before.
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Post by kastrenzo on Mar 27, 2017 4:01:16 GMT
This honestly was one of my favorite parts of the story and I'm amazed it wasn't more tied to the Critical Path. Lot's of cloak-and-dagger stuff going on. Still don't buy Cora's "I was raised on a freighter" story. There is NO way the writers are THAT bad, to give her the name of Harper with no connection to the Illusive Man. For once I hope that her boring story is the truth, I don't want to see TIM and Cora being related. There's too many random cameos as is, Kandros, Verner, Massani, Yes it's OK to have the odd cameo and easter egg referencing the original trilogy, but this was supposed to be a fresh start in a new galaxy, 600 some years after the OT. Sometimes I think some people are just too attached to Shepard and the original trilogy. So far, obviously andromeda doesn't stack up to the OT, But it deserves a chance. and it doesn't have to be constant fan service to something that happened 600 years ago in lore, and coming up on 5-6 years in our own time.
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Post by kastrenzo on Mar 27, 2017 4:03:38 GMT
This honestly was one of my favorite parts of the story and I'm amazed it wasn't more tied to the Critical Path. Lot's of cloak-and-dagger stuff going on. Still don't buy Cora's "I was raised on a freighter" story. There is NO way the writers are THAT bad, to give her the name of Harper with no connection to the Illusive Man. I may remind you that James Vega was originally named James Sanders, even though he has no connection to Kahlee. I also dont see how it is bad writing when unrelated people share a name. The One Steve Limit is a really stupid trope. Im not saying shes not connected to TIM, she probably is,just that Bioware has made that mistake before. At this point I would rather Cora be a distant relative of noted shithead Stephen Harper, than the Illusive man. I agree with the one Steve thing, it doesn't feel like the big galaxy that it should be when you keep finding random cousins of random characters. Statistically speaking that should be almost impossible
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Post by TheDoorfighter on Mar 27, 2017 4:52:29 GMT
I may remind you that James Vega was originally named James Sanders, even though he has no connection to Kahlee. I also dont see how it is bad writing when unrelated people share a name. The One Steve Limit is a really stupid trope. Im not saying shes not connected to TIM, she probably is,just that Bioware has made that mistake before. At this point I would rather Cora be a distant relative of noted shithead Stephen Harper, than the Illusive man. I agree with the one Steve thing, it doesn't feel like the big galaxy that it should be when you keep finding random cousins of random characters. Statistically speaking that should be almost impossible Well it's not like big galaxy has many high places with a lot of random people. When Ryder is not dealing with side-quest nonames, she's dealing with people who're there for a reason.
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Post by SwobyJ on Mar 27, 2017 5:40:30 GMT
Space travelers in ME, or at least regular ones, are actually a minority. Sure that only turns trillions/billions into billions/millions, but it already narrows down populations.
Add to that the circumstances Shepard meets others - regulars in places like Citadel and Omega especially, chosen powerful figures, etc, and while things are a stretch, they're not such an extreme stretch.
But yes, to an extent, this is very silly.
But no, you need to remember that this has always been Bioware's Star Wars. AKA there IS an element, even since ME1, of 'roll with it and enjoy with popcorn'. Unless you think that the first sequences of ME1 made real sense (wow Shepard really lucked out with amazing circumstances to start chasing Saren lmao).
I don't really think Cora may be good as 'long lost dear daughter of TIM', but considering that TIM is at least chummy (sarc) with someone who clones daughters, I wouldn't consider it terrible if Cora was one of a bunch of clones and was actually a castoff, with her name given to her as a clue, or even a trigger, etc. Maybe she's even someone TIM doesn't know, but one created or birthed by others for another reason. Maybe even the 'benefactors' are not even (at least directly) Cerberus, but a story of elite sectors of the Milky Way with their own interests that indirectly affect this Initiative and its people. Maybe maybe maybe whatever.
Not that her story in MEA is all that much. I'm just saying it, like so much of MEA, looks like it is open for opportunity if the writers feel like it works. Depending on how much they view it as appropriate to tie to the Milky Way, or stick with an Andromeda arc, or do even something else.
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Post by ATR16 on Mar 27, 2017 6:46:30 GMT
This honestly was one of my favorite parts of the story and I'm amazed it wasn't more tied to the Critical Path. Lot's of cloak-and-dagger stuff going on. Still don't buy Cora's "I was raised on a freighter" story. There is NO way the writers are THAT bad, to give her the name of Harper with no connection to the Illusive Man. I feel like originally it was supposed to, but through re-writes and writers leaving I think that got lost. Between her name, a lot of the Cerberus weaponry available to you, the AI, sheer ridiculousness that a non-Cerberus human group would try spearheading this project when humans are like 30 years into galactic travel and can barely seem to establish colonies inside the MW...
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Post by Ahriman on Mar 27, 2017 7:29:24 GMT
Finally, after about 50+ hours, I get to point where they story around Jien Garsons death leads to some sensical - for ME - revelations... It appears that her original idea was not much more then a huge pipe dream, that only could even become reality after a VERY wealthy, mysterious benefactor stepped in to fund it all. While I didn't get it confirmed yet, that could only mean one thing: Cerberus. Mounting a last ditch effort to send 100000 colonists away from the MW in case Shepard failed to stop "something big coming to the Milky Way".
The fact that agents of said benefactor also killed Garson, does support this theory... So, yea, the Ai was a stupid idea that only the threat of the Reapers made even viable. That makes much more sense. Still doesn't save the very cliched overall story, but it helps... I'd prefer it not to be Cerberus personally. Aside my subjective tiredness of them, it would make little sense for them to help other council (and even non-council) species with funding. Also the fact that -Nexus Uprising spoilers- Human director was eliminated and some Salarian with insignificant position was higher than Addison or Sloan in chain of inheritance. doesn't look like Cerberus thing. However if we rule out Cerberus, the only private organization with unlimited funds, it leaves only government structures. The Council, to be specific, - they, in theory, could have enough funds, close eyes on AI restriction and get potential spectres and matriarchs on board.
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Post by laxian on Mar 27, 2017 7:48:51 GMT
This honestly was one of my favorite parts of the story and I'm amazed it wasn't more tied to the Critical Path. Lot's of cloak-and-dagger stuff going on. Still don't buy Cora's "I was raised on a freighter" story. There is NO way the writers are THAT bad, to give her the name of Harper with no connection to the Illusive Man. Yup, I think so too now... ...maybe TIM dropped her off their with a relative from his past, or something, but I doubt she is his daughter or a "natural" blood relative. My guess is, she is the result of some sort of breeding program or some such. Probably, I mean TIM was obsessed enough with his dead lover to make sex-bot (the body EDI is later using in ME3) look like her (well, the biological shell anyway), so I wouldn't put it past him to keep some genetic material from her (or even her whole dead body in stasis) and pull a "Lawson" to make himself a "perfect" child (strong biotics, intelligent, longer lifespan than the norm, healthier that most people etc. etc.) Hell, Cora kind of has the same issues Miranda has, too (people fear her for her biotics and she kind of stopped trying to fit in and felt more at home with an Asari commando unit that with most humans!) As for the premise making sense - yeah! Still I don't get why they had the A.I. leader killed (now that TIM etc. are dead for hundreds of years, why does that secret have to be kept (unless TIM himself came along and only left a clone in the MW? I mean he did clone Shepard as a backup!)) and if TIM is involved: Why is the A.I. equiped so crappily (the Nexus needs the Arks for power, the Arks aren't self-sufficient either because they don't have equipment and materials, their vehicles and ships are unarmed (and you don't even get the option to make yourself weapons for either the Nomad or Tempest, despite the fact that in the ME-Universe making some jerry-rigged gun turret istn't really that hard, I mean we carry deployable turrets with us for fuck's sake...at least for the Nomad I mean, armind the Tempest should not be that hard either and after meeting the Kett this should be one of the first orders of business: Equip your vehicles, the Nexus and even the Arks (once people are out of cryo turning the Arks into warships should be something they consider!) to fight, otherwise the A.I. stands not chance even in a small battle (much less a straight up fight!)) greetings LAX ps: Sadly you never get any of that fear of biotics in the games (people don't treat you differently, even if your Shepard is a biotic...neither is Ryder treated differently, even if your starting out training is biotics!), except when dealing with those screwed over biotics in ME1 (I think it was 1...)
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Post by warbaby2 on Mar 27, 2017 8:15:53 GMT
Ok, but I doubt that anyone - aside of Cerberus - would believe that "something big is coming to to the Milky Way"? Not by by '85.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Mar 27, 2017 8:18:28 GMT
Ok, but I doubt that anyone - aside of Cerberus - would believe that "something big is coming to to the Milky Way"? Not by by '85. Why? We know that other people knew something was coming or even knew it was the Reapers specifically other than Cerberus. For example the Shadow Broker knew.
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Post by Ahriman on Mar 27, 2017 8:25:35 GMT
Ok, but I doubt that anyone - aside of Cerberus - would believe that "something big is coming to to the Milky Way"? Not by by '85. "I don't believe that anyone aside of Cerberus would believe" is kind of strange argument, don't you think? Anyone paranoid enough could think about various suspicious info presented before '85.
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Post by Croatsky on Mar 27, 2017 9:41:33 GMT
I absolutely don't think that a Secret Benefactor is someone from Cerberus. He wouldn't give a damn for aliens well being in that case.
As well we seen a few Cerberus defectors in ME:A, who despise Cerberus for various reasons. Couple of them despise Cerberus due to Illusive Man not being evil enough in doing pointless, dangerous and evil experiments on aliens.
So, I doubt severely he or she is part of Cerberus. Maybe connected to them, but nothing more then an associate.
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Post by warbaby2 on Mar 27, 2017 10:39:09 GMT
I absolutely don't think that a Secret Benefactor is someone from Cerberus. He wouldn't give a damn for aliens well being in that case. As well we seen a few Cerberus defectors in ME:A, who despise Cerberus for various reasons. Couple of them despise Cerberus due to Illusive Man not being evil enough in doing pointless, dangerous and evil experiments on aliens. So, I doubt severely he or she is part of Cerberus. Maybe connected to them, but nothing more then an associate. The only thing I could come up with there is: Even Cerberus needed other investors to make the Ai happen, so they approached the other races to join in... we never actually are told Jien Garson did that, after all. Come to think of it, after seeing the Ai background plot to it's conclusion, it doesn't seam as if she did much of the heavy lifting at all, she just came up with the original plan.
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Post by ts1279 on Mar 27, 2017 15:40:29 GMT
I got the feeling Cora was weird cross or Jack and Miranda.
A Cerberus vanity/genetic engineering project that result in a super powerful super aggressive human biotic, but instead of lashing out when she ran away from Cerberus the Asari touch her discipline and how to use her anger in combat.
Harper may be her real name, or my be a name she took from TIM because she doesn't know hers or even have one.
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Post by dmc1001 on Mar 28, 2017 14:47:55 GMT
Ok, but I doubt that anyone - aside of Cerberus - would believe that "something big is coming to to the Milky Way"? Not by by '85. Why? We know that other people knew something was coming or even knew it was the Reapers specifically other than Cerberus. For example the Shadow Broker knew. So did the Council. The Citadel Archives prove that to be true. They just didn't do anything about it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2017 14:57:08 GMT
Why? We know that other people knew something was coming or even knew it was the Reapers specifically other than Cerberus. For example the Shadow Broker knew. So did the Council. The Citadel Archives prove that to be true. They just didn't do anything about it. Garrus's father also says that the Council was aware, just didn't officially admit. The question is: couldn't have the Council secretly supported the Initiative behind the scenes? While everything seems to point at Cerberus, they are the only other group I can think of for having the necessary resources, awareness of the Reapers's arrival and motivation to get as many people as they could out of the Milky Way. If somehow the councilors began moving money to help the Initiative take off, that wouldn't be so far fetched. They are known for having their own personal dirty secrets. They could be the secret benefactor, but that only creates more mysteries, as to why Garson was assassinated or what the asari councilor meant when she said: "continuity of civilization has to be considered", or even their support for Alec's SAM. But I still think it will be cooler if it's someone we've never heard about.
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Post by zan on Mar 28, 2017 15:08:01 GMT
While TIM was a human supremacist, he has shown willingness to employ aliens when necessary to accomplish his goals (In both ME2 and ME3). He is also perfectly willing to utilize people who hate him as long as they are working toward his goal. If he believed that Ai would not happen without having non-human Arks present for some undisclosed reason, I would not be at all surprised at him being willing to support the construction of alien Arks.
The current Ai director does not seem to be difficult to control and makes a nice non-human figurehead. It is possible that the previous (human) officers were too idealistic and/or not controllable enough.
Cora could be the actual person in the control of Cerberus operation in Ai. BW has already given us Solas as a team member/possible love interest, so I would not get it past them to pull it again.
PS I still want to know where TIM found the infinite money glitch, because his resources seem to be infinite.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2017 15:15:42 GMT
While TIM was a human supremacist, he has shown willingness to employ aliens when necessary to accomplish his goals (In both ME2 and ME3). He is also perfectly willing to utilize people who hate him as long as they are working toward his goal. If he believed that Ai would not happen without having non-human Arks present for some undisclosed reason, I would not be at all surprised at him being willing to support the construction of alien Arks. The current Ai director does not seem to be difficult to control and makes a nice non-human figurehead. It is possible that the previous (human) officers were too idealistic and/or not controllable enough. Cora could be the actual person in the control of Cerberus operation in Ai. BW has already given us Solas as a team member/possible love interest, so I would not get it past them to pull it again. PS I still want to know where TIM found the infinite money glitch, because his resources seem to be infinite. Yeah, even with all the income EDI claims Cerberus gets, resurrecting Shepard, building the Normandy and backing the Initiative almost by themselves, then later (after suffering a heavy blow in one of the novels) be able to have an army with Petrovski to take Omega and still fit a lot of indoctrinated soldiers to fight in the Reaper War and even try to capture the Citadel, it's too much.
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Post by vyndral on Mar 28, 2017 15:31:37 GMT
It still doesn't make much sense to me. Why?
Er edits so I make a little more sense. They trip here? Sure. The death of Jien? Makes no sense at all, unless I missed something completely.
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Post by LilTIM on Mar 28, 2017 16:30:59 GMT
Wasn't the shadow broker also aware of the reapers by ME2 start? It could explain Jien Garson murder as one agent of him doing it. If you ask me, i think the promotion of Tann is fishy - if Garson didn't die in an accident, then the other sucessors could have been dealt with too.
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Post by jastall on Mar 28, 2017 16:43:43 GMT
Ok, but I doubt that anyone - aside of Cerberus - would believe that "something big is coming to to the Milky Way"? Not by by '85. Why? We know that other people knew something was coming or even knew it was the Reapers specifically other than Cerberus. For example the Shadow Broker knew. The Shadow Broker also sold Alec some of the code needed to make SAM, and if memory serves knew about the Reapers. So he's definitely a potential candidate. Albeit then it would only raises further questions as to why Liara doesn't mention the Initiative to Shepard. But personally, my best guess is the Council. Cerberus being able to fund the Initiative on top of all the shit they did in ME2-3 would be ridiculous, plus they have no interest in letting aliens survive. While the Council would be able to fund it, was already wary of the Reapers even if not publically, and could also place agents such as Matriarchs and Specters on board of the project. Plus, why would Cerberus assassinate the human leader, and leave some two-bit Salarian bean counter as the boss? There's still a lot of questions surrounding the Benefactor. I won't rule out Cerberus, but they're not the only suspect by a long shot IMO.
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Post by vyndral on Mar 28, 2017 17:12:09 GMT
Why? We know that other people knew something was coming or even knew it was the Reapers specifically other than Cerberus. For example the Shadow Broker knew. The Shadow Broker also sold Alec some of the code needed to make SAM, and if memory serves knew about the Reapers. So he's definitely a potential candidate. Albeit then it would only raises further questions as to why Liara doesn't mention the Initiative to Shepard. But personally, my best guess is the Council. Cerberus being able to fund the Initiative on top of all the shit they did in ME2-3 would be ridiculous, plus they have no interest in letting aliens survive. While the Council would be able to fund it, was already wary of the Reapers even if not publically, and could also place agents such as Matriarchs and Specters on board of the project. Plus, why would Cerberus assassinate the human leader, and leave some two-bit Salarian bean counter as the boss? There's still a lot of questions surrounding the Benefactor. I won't rule out Cerberus, but they're not the only suspect by a long shot IMO. As far as Tann goes it doesn't sound like they meant to. From the memory logs it sounds like Jien dies before the accident, which would mean the assassin probably didn't know all major leadership was about to take a dirt nap. But on the other hand no one knows or remembers Tann. In Uprising they basically call him a banker like 7th in line for command that no one even knows. It is very odd. I can actually explain addisons poor animations now! When the accident happens she claims she was just out looking for Jien, since Jien just stepped out...so obviously Addison is the killer! It explains her dead eyes and expressionless face!
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