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Post by sdzald on Apr 3, 2017 22:44:35 GMT
Ok this has been bugging me for a few days.
Why don't we see any children in the game? I know they came along on the Arc as they are mentioned in the story several times, you even come across a bunch of destroyed stasis pods on one of the planets and when scanned SAM tells you it was a child.
Yet we see NO children on the Nexus, none on any of the Outposts and even none on any of the Angara worlds.
There are only two reason I can think of why they are left out. The first is Bioware just didn't want to deal with the outcry if any children were harmed in the game.
The second reason is their crappy engine just couldn't handle a bunch of "small sized" avatars without throwing up worse then it currently does.
Any other reasons? Neither of those two seem very good to me.
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Post by canuckgamer on Apr 3, 2017 22:55:03 GMT
You clearly haven't done some of the side content, this very issue gets addressed before having the first child born in Andromeda.
Just like in pioneer times, children don't usually come along until their is a degree of stability, until then the adults must forcus on basic survival and creating a safe environment for people to live in. Hence, like in real life, children will often come after the first few years. There are some children in cryo which is alluded to, but given people are being taken out of cryo based on their merits and use, children would obviously be low on the board. The one guy tried to barter with Vetra to get his son out of cryo right off the bat. Also every member of the initiative has been fitted in an implant preventing them from getting pregnant, and they only started deactivating them towards the end of the game.
I frankly would have seen a huge plot hole if people just started popping out babies right off the bat.
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Post by CTPhipps on Apr 3, 2017 22:56:01 GMT
They're all frozen because they can't do jack and are a drain on resources.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2017 22:56:10 GMT
The child in cryo I found was a Turian. And Angara children help the Resistance.
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Post by sdzald on Apr 3, 2017 23:13:53 GMT
Sorry canuckgamer I am not buying that answer. Also please note, I never mentioned babys, just children.
So you would be 'thawing' out people with children and leaving those children in stasis? Sorry but the social unrest that would cause would be very unworkable. Children and your Children's future would have been one of the reason to join the Initiative. Not to mention all the exile settlements also have no children. Do you really think they would have allowed the Nexus to exile them without their children???? You want a massive riot that would be the way to get it.
I don't know where you get your historical info but the pioneers, when they migrated west normally brought their entire families. When I walk through the Nexus or visit any of the Outpost the absents of children just makes it so unreal for me.
Also you did not mention that Angara also have no children around. Yep you can 'make up' all kinds of reasons for that as well, but the truth of the matter is there is, for me at least, not a story reason you can come up with that fits.
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Post by sdzald on Apr 3, 2017 23:22:39 GMT
They're all frozen because they can't do jack and are a drain on resources. Hummm that is really odd because children can be very productive and in fact until very recently they helped with all kinds of family work, and still do in many. There is a reason there is 3 months a year off in public schools in the summer, family's needed the kids home to help. I just can NOT conceive how you could convince a mass of people to work and be good citizens while their children were kept frozen. I have 3 daughters, there is NO way I would agree to work in that system without first having my kids with me. They are the very fabric of our society and that crosses all human cultural boundaries.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2017 23:24:15 GMT
They're all frozen because they can't do jack and are a drain on resources. Hummm that is really odd because children can be very productive and in fact until very recently they helped with all kinds of family work, and still do in many. There is a reason there is 3 months a year off in public schools and in the summer, family's needed the kids home to help. I just can NOT conceive how you could convince a mass of people to work and be good citizens while their children were kept frozen. I have 3 daughters, there is NO way I would agree to work in that system without first having my kids with me. They are the very fabric of our society and that crosses all human cultural boundaries. Remember the protesters? They wanted their families out of cryo and we can choose to grant it or kick them out.
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Post by sdzald on Apr 3, 2017 23:28:39 GMT
Hummm that is really odd because children can be very productive and in fact until very recently they helped with all kinds of family work, and still do in many. There is a reason there is 3 months a year off in public schools and in the summer, family's needed the kids home to help. I just can NOT conceive how you could convince a mass of people to work and be good citizens while their children were kept frozen. I have 3 daughters, there is NO way I would agree to work in that system without first having my kids with me. They are the very fabric of our society and that crosses all human cultural boundaries. Remember the protesters? They wanted their families out of cryo and we can choose to grant it or kick them out. Yes and I granted them there demands, so where are the kids now? Not to mention if you denied people their children, the very heart and sole of the family unit, there would be a LOT more protesters then a few. Once again I just can not conceive, from a realistic point of view, how anyone with children would accept their children not being with them.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2017 23:30:33 GMT
Remember the protesters? They wanted their families out of cryo and we can choose to grant it or kick them out. Yes and I granted them there demands, so where are the kids now? Not to mention if you denied people their children, the very heart and sole of the family unit, there would be a LOT more protesters then a few. Once again I just can not conceive, from a realistic point of view, how anyone with children would accept their children not being with them. The theme is strong regarding them, even with Jill, Gil and having babies. Even Sara mentions having kids someday. It can't be avoided forever. I'm reminded of something Jaal said when I was driving around Eos. He said he hoped our people don't just work all the time. We should be living because that's what the planets need.
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Post by projectpatdc on Apr 3, 2017 23:31:20 GMT
Ok this has been bugging me for a few days. Why don't we see any children in the game? I know they came along on the Arc as they are mentioned in the story several times, you even come across a bunch of destroyed stasis pods on one of the planets and when scanned SAM tells you it was a child. Yet we see NO children on the Nexus, none on any of the Outposts and even none on any of the Angara worlds. There are only two reason I can think of why they are left out. The first is Bioware just didn't want to deal with the outcry if any children were harmed in the game. The second reason is their crappy engine just couldn't handle a bunch of "small sized" avatars without throwing up worse then it currently does. Any other reasons? Neither of those two seem very good to me. I wrote a thread about children in the game weeks before the game came out hoping we would have some. I was a little disappointed to at least not see some angara children but I'm glad Bioware explains the reasons for no children and no infants through multiple sources. The side quest with the first born in Andromeda was pretty cool though
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2017 23:34:41 GMT
Short answer? Because making models for children takes time, and cost money. I can't really remember the last time Bioware did children in a game. DA:O? Maybe DA:II. Never in Mass Effect except Starbrat.
Still it is a huge part of world building and the fact that we don't see Angaran children is very weird.
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Post by sdzald on Apr 3, 2017 23:38:04 GMT
Also remember that you, Ryder, have only been thawed out for a very short time, imagine having been out of stasis for over year and not seeing your children at all. Then there are the exiles, where are all their kids? Wouldn't the authorities taken the opportunity to 'dump' those kids when they dumped the Exiles, not to mention that the Exiles would have DEMANDED it.
Nope it would never work in real live. There has to be another reason Bioware didn't include them.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 3, 2017 23:38:18 GMT
Short answer? Because making models for children takes time, and cost money. I can't really remember the last time Bioware did children in a game. DA:O? Maybe DA:II. Never in Mass Effect except Starbrat. Still it is a huge part of worldl building and the fact that we don't see Angara children is very weird. DAI had one child and even then that child doesn't have to exist.
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Post by sdzald on Apr 3, 2017 23:46:08 GMT
Short answer? Because making models for children takes time, and cost money. I can't really remember the last time Bioware did children in a game. DA:O? Maybe DA:II. Never in Mass Effect except Starbrat. Still it is a huge part of worldl building and the fact that we don't see Angara children is very weird. There you go, that is what I believe, A lot more work for them and a lot bigger load on an engine that already has problems with any avatar that is not the exact same size and shape. The exact same reason we see NO aliens other then ones the same size with two arms, two legs, two eyes, all the same except for color and facial appearance. Of course it should be a part of the world they have created, for me it is just another failure to a believable world.
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Post by CTPhipps on Apr 4, 2017 0:05:55 GMT
They're all frozen because they can't do jack and are a drain on resources. Hummm that is really odd because children can be very productive and in fact until very recently they helped with all kinds of family work, and still do in many. There is a reason there is 3 months a year off in public schools in the summer, family's needed the kids home to help. I just can NOT conceive how you could convince a mass of people to work and be good citizens while their children were kept frozen. I have 3 daughters, there is NO way I would agree to work in that system without first having my kids with me. They are the very fabric of our society and that crosses all human cultural boundaries. They can be helpful in small ways but the simple fact is that people are starving and living in darkness in the Nexus at the start. Any responsible parent would want the colonies and the ship at full capacity before they brought their kids out.
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Post by sdzald on Apr 4, 2017 0:11:23 GMT
Hummm that is really odd because children can be very productive and in fact until very recently they helped with all kinds of family work, and still do in many. There is a reason there is 3 months a year off in public schools in the summer, family's needed the kids home to help. I just can NOT conceive how you could convince a mass of people to work and be good citizens while their children were kept frozen. I have 3 daughters, there is NO way I would agree to work in that system without first having my kids with me. They are the very fabric of our society and that crosses all human cultural boundaries. They can be helpful in small ways but the simple fact is that people are starving and living in darkness in the Nexus at the start. Any responsible parent would want the colonies and the ship at full capacity before they brought their kids out. Ok, knowing human nature I don't buy it but lets just agree to disagree on that point. Now answer me this, why would the Exiles allow themselves to be exiled without their children? Why wouldn't the Nexus want to 'unload' that burden when they could?
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Post by CTPhipps on Apr 4, 2017 0:24:08 GMT
They can be helpful in small ways but the simple fact is that people are starving and living in darkness in the Nexus at the start. Any responsible parent would want the colonies and the ship at full capacity before they brought their kids out. Ok, knowing human nature I don't buy it but lets just agree to disagree on that point. Now answer me this, why would the Exiles allow themselves to be exiled without their children? Why wouldn't the Nexus want to 'unload' that burden when they could? Honestly speaking, I wouldn't be surprised if any children they had were few or dead. The Exiles live in Mos Eisley Spaceport where the majority have degenerated into slavers and pirates who murder the weak or are exiled into the Badlands if they can't pay their taxes. It's one of the reasons Sloane Kelly is a monster since you find a refugee habitat of Exiles who are completely nice and decent people but couldn't pay their extortion tax and it's clear Kelly meant this as a death sentence. There definitely ARE children, though, because adolescent Krogan are referenced repeatedly in terms of board games they play as well as LARPS. So they, at least, have their families.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Apr 4, 2017 1:45:24 GMT
We clearly weren't ready for it
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 4, 2017 1:48:36 GMT
Sorry canuckgamer I am not buying that answer. Also please note, I never mentioned babys, just children. So you would be 'thawing' out people with children and leaving those children in stasis? Um, yes. That's actually said in the game to have happened. In actual dialogue.
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 4, 2017 1:50:39 GMT
I just can NOT conceive how you could convince a mass of people to work and be good citizens while their children were kept frozen. I have 3 daughters, there is NO way I would agree to work in that system without first having my kids with me. They are the very fabric of our society and that crosses all human cultural boundaries. Then imagine this: "Sure, we'll bring your kids out of cryo. However, resources are limited and they'll probably die. Does that sound appealing?"
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Post by mrobnoxiousuk on Apr 4, 2017 1:51:48 GMT
They can be helpful in small ways but the simple fact is that people are starving and living in darkness in the Nexus at the start. Any responsible parent would want the colonies and the ship at full capacity before they brought their kids out. Ok, knowing human nature I don't buy it but lets just agree to disagree on that point. Now answer me this, why would the Exiles allow themselves to be exiled without their children? Why wouldn't the Nexus want to 'unload' that burden when they could? They didn't let themselves get exiled,they got ejected out with a big old Krogan footprint on their arsecheeks!
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Post by dmc1001 on Apr 4, 2017 1:54:35 GMT
Ok, knowing human nature I don't buy it but lets just agree to disagree on that point. Now answer me this, why would the Exiles allow themselves to be exiled without their children? Why wouldn't the Nexus want to 'unload' that burden when they could? They didn't let themselves get exiled,they got ejected out with a big old Krogan footprint on their arsecheeks! Yes, and I imagine the AI leaders aren't entirely unsympathetic, knowing that sending the children with them is almost certainly a death sentence. In contrast, it can keep the exiled parents somewhat in line because the children serve as [perhaps unintentional] hostages. That might even buy the future cooperation of exiles when the time comes to thaw them out.
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Post by dragontartare on Apr 4, 2017 3:29:21 GMT
They're all frozen because they can't do jack and are a drain on resources. Hummm that is really odd because children can be very productive and in fact until very recently they helped with all kinds of family work, and still do in many. There is a reason there is 3 months a year off in public schools in the summer, family's needed the kids home to help. I just can NOT conceive how you could convince a mass of people to work and be good citizens while their children were kept frozen. I have 3 daughters, there is NO way I would agree to work in that system without first having my kids with me. They are the very fabric of our society and that crosses all human cultural boundaries. Eh...you know the people still in stasis aren't being harmed, right? They were safely asleep for over 600 years. Staying asleep for a few more years while food supplies are established is actually safer for them (I mean, you remember that when you-as-Ryder first arrive on the Nexus, you are told that there was a very real fear of starving to death, right?) I imagine that if you hadn't agreed up front to the terms of who is thawed when, then you wouldn't have been allowed into the initiative in the first place. They would have prioritized people who understood -- at least in theory -- that they might have to spend a year or two missing their families until it is safe to bring them out of cryo. All that said, I think the real reason you don't see children in this game is because the models weren't created (as others have said). DAI didn't have any random villager children, either. Just pretend they are roaming around somewhere, if it bothers you that much. I think it would have been cute to see some little Angaran running around, but for me personally there are other issues they need to fix that are more important for immersion and quality-of-life while playing. There is a little easter egg that I think is amusing, though. On the Nexus radio, you can occasionally hear that officials are debating on a standardized curriculum for Andromeda children, and that the asari are happy to wait out the others until they get their way (essentially...the wording is different).
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Post by Yaslana on Apr 4, 2017 9:46:05 GMT
Short answer? Because making models for children takes time, and cost money. I can't really remember the last time Bioware did children in a game. DA:O? Maybe DA:II. Never in Mass Effect except Starbrat. Still it is a huge part of world building and the fact that we don't see Angaran children is very weird. DA2 had lots of urchins. There were lots of kids in DAO too. In ME123 there wasn't a single child. DAI hat OGB - but lets be honest, his model was a mess. Esp. in cutscenes where he was smaller here, bigger there. Still disappointed we didn't get kids in MEA though, too. At least they could have shown us the FHB, not just the sound of the baby crying. Also, there really should have been Angara kids. Lots of them. And at least a few milky way kids, b/c from the what we saw, some of them should be awake. Remember the Asari ark. There was data pad stuff there that was about trying to keep the children safe and stuff.
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Post by Soulforge on Apr 4, 2017 9:53:31 GMT
Short answer? Because making models for children takes time, and cost money. I can't really remember the last time Bioware did children in a game. DA:O? Maybe DA:II. Never in Mass Effect except Starbrat. Still it is a huge part of world building and the fact that we don't see Angaran children is very weird. DA2 had lots of urchins. There were lots of kids in DAO too. In ME123 there wasn't a single child. DAI hat OGB - but lets be honest, his model was a mess. Esp. in cutscenes where he was smaller here, bigger there. Still disappointed we didn't get kids in MEA though, too. At least they could have shown us the FHB, not just the sound of the baby crying. Also, there really should have been Angara kids. Lots of them. And at least a few milky way kids, b/c from the what we saw, some of them should be awake. Remember the Asari ark. There was data pad stuff there that was about trying to keep the children safe and stuff. Indeed, the Asari ark mentions children. But if we can't have more than 2 Asari faces in the game, we're definitely not going to see Asari children. Although I have to wonder what their definition of Asari children even look like. In ME1 Liara said among Asari she was barely considered more than a child.
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