fikraag7
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Post by fikraag7 on Apr 18, 2017 19:04:18 GMT
Equalizer is a good secondary for Observers, etc since it gives you a bit more range and oomph compared to the Scattershot, is light enough to run also (10 WT at Rank X, plus 18 WT on Scattershot), and most importantly doesn't need to be reloaded while you do your charge/melee/etc. Also really good at taking out shields
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2017 19:39:48 GMT
IDK if you play on PC or console. But on xbox I find the melee to be Godly garbage. What do I mean by that? It is a very powerful melee especially with all her bonuses you can rank into for it. But it is so unreliable. 50% of the time I miss. And when I do connect the camera is facing the ground or in a weird position. I really wish I could use her as a melee class but I cant. Probably a l2p I know but that is my experience. I just built her for full weapon damage and put my piranha on her and use her more as a hit and run class.
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Post by ramsen on Apr 18, 2017 19:56:42 GMT
I like Scorpion with Backlash 6b, assuming it works the way I think it does. Shoot > Backlash absorb > bonus damage applied to Scorpion shots while reflecting damage.
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Post by niroz on Apr 18, 2017 21:02:12 GMT
IDK if you play on PC or console. But on xbox I find the melee to be Godly garbage. What do I mean by that? It is a very powerful melee especially with all her bonuses you can rank into for it. But it is so unreliable. 50% of the time I miss. And when I do connect the camera is facing the ground or in a weird position. I really wish I could use her as a melee class but I cant. Probably a l2p I know but that is my experience. I just built her for full weapon damage and put my piranha on her and use her more as a hit and run class. I play on PC, and it's extremely reliable; I rarely whiff if I am not experimenting. I don't have experience with her on consoles however, but I am sorry to hear that you are having trouble on the Xbox. When I get time, I'll expand the guide with additional melee tips and demonstrations.
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xaijin
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Post by xaijin on Apr 18, 2017 21:07:17 GMT
Nay sir, not even kinda. Good melee? Oh yes, probably has the most utility, but the point of melee is to dead things and Angaran melee is hells of fast and does nice damage, and asari punching aside from one completely absurd over the top animation (you can guess which one) is ass fast and can be pointed whereever in an instant. I respect your opinion but, I have to disagree. Where as other melee attacks are prone to interruption, the iframes attached to the Duelist's makes it nearly impossible to interrupt. I say nearly, because dogs can sometimes grab through parts of the animation that clearly contain iframes. The silly up time of iframes during the melee animation is one of the main reasons why the Duelist can hang out in melee for so long and continue to use her melee attack unimpeded. Hell, I've 45% to 0%ied a Hydra with one hand w/o moving, just using timed melee attacks when I had to take an important phone call. I wouldn't have been able to do the same thing with any other melee attack in the game. Then there's the range and gap close nature built into her melee on top of that. It hits like a truck, gap closes, gives you invincibility frames, triggers drain barrier, goes through walls, goes through cover, and provides mobility. If I could only use melee, the Asari Duelist's melee would 100% without a doubt be the one I would choose. Sure, it has a long animation compared to other melee attacks out there, but you're invincible for the majority of it. For all of these reasons, I have to again disagree with you and again state that the Asari Duelist's melee attack, is best in the game. Pick a fight with two disruptors and you will see it is not "nearly impossible" to interrupt in the slightest, it's just has inherent iframes, which do not make it "best". In your theoretical you could have killed the hydra twice as fast. As SalarianMasticatorBassist and Crashsoots pointed out in other threads, those "built in" functions are inherent in ALL melee, hers is obvious because it's length but the homing and lock in aren't unique. It has the most utility, but it isn't the best, because the point of melee is to dead things, and there are three character who do it about 2.5 times faster with same tracking and sliding to a lesser degree and you'll recall from one of teawrex's streams the reason it has iframes to begin with is a UR and b Slooooooow, and the iframes do not encompass the entire animation so she can quite be knocked out of it, especially off host. Utility, yes, make dead all the things in a blinding barrage of YAA YEA YAR YAW YAW, nope.
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Post by niroz on Apr 18, 2017 21:14:52 GMT
I like Scorpion with Backlash 6b, assuming it works the way I think it does. Shoot > Backlash absorb > bonus damage applied to Scorpion shots while reflecting damage. I played around with it a ton on my Asari Sentinel, and 6b just didn't impress me. You only get the bonus after you release Backlash. That bonus is dependent on the amount of damage you absorbed prior. From my testing, it seems you need to be well into half the Aegis's hp to get the full bonus and it only last 3 seconds. Regardless, I'll be revisiting it eventually. Glad it's working out for you though.
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TheThirdRace
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MEA MP Builder
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Post by TheThirdRace on Apr 18, 2017 21:16:06 GMT
Build in the MEA MP builder: Link
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Post by varicite on Apr 18, 2017 21:30:18 GMT
I like Scorpion with Backlash 6b, assuming it works the way I think it does. Shoot > Backlash absorb > bonus damage applied to Scorpion shots while reflecting damage. I played around with it a ton on my Asari Sentinel, and 6b just didn't impress me. You only get the bonus after you release Backlash. That bonus is dependent on the amount of damage you absorbed prior. From my testing, it seems you need to be well into half the Aegis's hp to get the full bonus and it only last 3 seconds. Regardless, I'll be revisiting it eventually. Glad it's working out for you though. The shield restoration is also based on the amount your Backlash absorbed and only lasts 3 seconds. Not sure why you feel it's so much better than stacking another 30% melee damage during Biotic Warrior windows (which are also 3 seconds). This allows you to have 3 seconds of huge damage after both charge and backlash, instead of just charge. Not saying that shield restore isn't nice, but the drawbacks you keep mentioning for Backlash 6b also exist for 6a. Honestly, I feel they both synergize well with her kit, depending on if you want to play more aggressively or defensively, which is the real beauty of the Duelist; flexibility with her powers.
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Post by niroz on Apr 18, 2017 23:32:19 GMT
I respect your opinion but, I have to disagree. Where as other melee attacks are prone to interruption, the iframes attached to the Duelist's makes it nearly impossible to interrupt. I say nearly, because dogs can sometimes grab through parts of the animation that clearly contain iframes. The silly up time of iframes during the melee animation is one of the main reasons why the Duelist can hang out in melee for so long and continue to use her melee attack unimpeded. Hell, I've 45% to 0%ied a Hydra with one hand w/o moving, just using timed melee attacks when I had to take an important phone call. I wouldn't have been able to do the same thing with any other melee attack in the game. Then there's the range and gap close nature built into her melee on top of that. It hits like a truck, gap closes, gives you invincibility frames, triggers drain barrier, goes through walls, goes through cover, and provides mobility. If I could only use melee, the Asari Duelist's melee would 100% without a doubt be the one I would choose. Sure, it has a long animation compared to other melee attacks out there, but you're invincible for the majority of it. For all of these reasons, I have to again disagree with you and again state that the Asari Duelist's melee attack, is best in the game. Pick a fight with two disruptors and you will see it is not "nearly impossible" to interrupt in the slightest, it's just has inherent iframes, which do not make it "best". In your theoretical you could have killed the hydra twice as fast. As SalarianMasticatorBassist and Crashsoots pointed out in other threads, those "built in" functions are inherent in ALL melee, hers is obvious because it's length but the homing and lock in aren't unique. It has the most utility, but it isn't the best, because the point of melee is to dead things, and there are three character who do it about 2.5 times faster with same tracking and sliding to a lesser degree and you'll recall from one of teawrex's streams the reason it has iframes to begin with is a UR and b Slooooooow, and the iframes do not encompass the entire animation so she can quite be knocked out of it, especially off host. Utility, yes, make dead all the things in a blinding barrage of YAA YEA YAR YAW YAW, nope. Dunno bro, guess I opened up the Billy Buskell special edition Asari Duelist then...because once she starts her melee animation, it never* gets interrupted. Here's one off host that was clearly laggy. Blood even comes out of my character, but I still take no damage and don't get interrupted: *Dogs though. Dogs don't give a f**k: Also, are we judging kits or melee attacks here, as I do not know of any melee attacks with remotely similar range that do 2.5x the damage that will not consistently get interrupted - except the Fiend's telegrab of course. You keep stating that the point of melee is to just do damage, but you cannot do melee damage if you die. Furthermore, if you ran around with no Annihilation Field and only Biotic punched things, you'd get dumped on fairly quickly. If you only ran around with an Asari Sword, you'd eventually get dumped on, but you'd yield much better results than biotic punch would, that's for sure.
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Post by niroz on Apr 19, 2017 0:13:52 GMT
I played around with it a ton on my Asari Sentinel, and 6b just didn't impress me. You only get the bonus after you release Backlash. That bonus is dependent on the amount of damage you absorbed prior. From my testing, it seems you need to be well into half the Aegis's hp to get the full bonus and it only last 3 seconds. Regardless, I'll be revisiting it eventually. Glad it's working out for you though. The shield restoration is also based on the amount your Backlash absorbed and only lasts 3 seconds. Not sure why you feel it's so much better than stacking another 30% melee damage during Biotic Warrior windows (which are also 3 seconds). This allows you to have 3 seconds of huge damage after both charge and backlash, instead of just charge. Not saying that shield restore isn't nice, but the drawbacks you keep mentioning for Backlash 6b also exist for 6a. Honestly, I feel they both synergize well with her kit, depending on if you want to play more aggressively or defensively, which is the real beauty of the Duelist; flexibility with her powers. You wont get 3 seconds of Aftermath bonus after Charging. As soon as you release the Aegis, the timer starts and Charge has at least a 1 second animation. Your best follow up in this scenario would be a melee attack, and the timing would still be extremely tight to the point where if you are off host, you'll most likely get inconsistent results. Without using Charge as a follow up - you'd have to be in a scenario where you'd not want to Charge, but still engage. Looking at my previous matches, this scenario doesn't come up too often post Backlash. I suppose the argument there is that maybe I need to adjust my play style, and I am not using Backlash optimally to accommodate Aftermath. That's a fair argument, and again, I'll be revisiting Aftermath in the future to further evaluate it. I do know however, that regardless of whether I decide to Charge, retreat, etc., Shield Resurgence will be giving me back shields regardless after absorbing any type of damage. The counter argument here is that it's entirely possible I wont need the shielding over time - hell after a Charge, your shields reset to full anyway. However, the scenarios where I am still underfire after a Charge, and thus taking damage come up more often than not. Not to mention the oh sh*t scenarios where your Aegis gets bursted down and you're underfire in the stagger animation. Regardless, there's good arguments for both - I just feel that the arguments for 6a are stronger and apply to more scenarios than 6b at the moment. If you are getting better results with 6b, please let me know. Even if you're not...more scenarios where it provided you value would be great. I'll be certain to add them to the guide.
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Post by xaijin on Apr 19, 2017 0:20:04 GMT
Like I stated and you ignored there definitely situations where you're not going to melee into things without getting hit, and picking your attack vector is entirely an experience/capability thing that has jack to with mechanics other than how they are leveraged.
and as for the 2.5X that's aggregated damage, not a single attack.
In any case I'm gonna bookmark this conversation for when platinum comes out just to see what happens.
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Post by varicite on Apr 19, 2017 2:14:23 GMT
I actually meant to alternate the bonuses, not to use backlash and then charge. That would be a waste.
Ideally, you'd want to charge (Biotic Warrior proc) shoot, melee (bio warrior ends)
Backlash (bio warrior proc), shoot, melee (bio warrior ends).
Lance for more bio warrior procs or detonations.
I was really just pointing out that both rank 6 evos have the same damage absorbed drawback, so you're really just choosing a weak shield buff or a weak damage buff.
I go damage, since bio warrior is already up when I use backlash anyway, so it's a bigger damage boost.
I don't generally have issues surviving with her kit, but with how slow her bread and butter melee swings is, I want it to hit as hard as possible.
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Post by niroz on Apr 19, 2017 11:47:55 GMT
Like I stated and you ignored there definitely situations where you're not going to melee into things without getting hit, and picking your attack vector is entirely an experience/capability thing that has jack to with mechanics other than how they are leveraged. and as for the 2.5X that's aggregated damage, not a single attack. In any case I'm gonna bookmark this conversation for when platinum comes out just to see what happens. I'm not ignoring anything. It's more that I legitimately am having a hard time understanding some of your points due to how you are phrasing some of your arguments - call me comprehensively handicapped if you like. Regardless, I have a good idea of what you are stating, though I still disagree. Either which way, I have changed the guide's Pro's section in regards to her melee from " the best melee attack in the game" to " Arguably the best melee attack in the game", which I think is more than fair at this point. That's probably going to be an old-ass bookmark by the time Platinum comes out at this rate. When they finally do release it, pretty sure we'll all be like:
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chugster
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Post by chugster on Apr 19, 2017 13:38:52 GMT
Quick query, I only have her at I so I cant max out more than 2 powers, I currently have both passives maxed and when i hit 20 will be able to get Charge to 5 (for the melee boost).
Should i leave her at this or should I sacrifice one of the maxed passives for maxed Charge?
Obviously this is only until the RNG gods see fit to bless me.
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Post by niroz on Apr 19, 2017 13:44:30 GMT
Quick query, I only have her at I so I cant max out more than 2 powers, I currently have both passives maxed and when i hit 20 will be able to get Charge to 5 (for the melee boost). Should i leave her at this or should I sacrifice one of the maxed passives for maxed Charge? Obviously this is only until the RNG gods see fit to bless me. Max Charge and Barrier.
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Post by JRandall0308 on Apr 19, 2017 14:32:09 GMT
'When Platinum Comes Out' we will be looking back at all guides and laughing that we ever needed a guide to do Gold.
Right? In ME3 today if you're the type of player who bothers to read guides, you can take any character into Gold and do well. You can probably take any character into Platinum and do well, too, but you presumably have some that you feel are more Platinum viable (or Platinum fun) than others.
I expect the same thing will happen with MEAMP. At some point we'll all be experts at Gold and guides for that difficulty will be irrelevant. We'll start out agonizing how to beat Platinum but eventually that too will become old hat and it won't really matter what character you take into it.
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