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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 6:45:22 GMT
I think we can do more ammo tests on SP where you can reload save after .. And then see how much applies to MP without wasting too much MP consumables
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Post by Kenny Bania on May 3, 2017 6:51:23 GMT
Something to keep an eye out for when getting around to shotguns and/or Talon, I'm not sure that they bypass shieldgate anymore (at least on Gold). Played several rounds with the Talon tonight, and multiple times on Sharpshooters I broke shield with a shot, and saw no damage pass through, even with very few shields left before hitting. I haven't payed a lot of attention with shotguns to see if they do or not. It's always possible that I was missing with a few pellets or something, but given the generally poor performance of shotguns, I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if they took that advantage way from them. That's been my experience with the Talon too. |
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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 6:58:36 GMT
So you say enemies get shield gate INVUL frames (duration ?) .. Not painful for slow firing weapons but nasty for auto weapons , shotguns etc ..
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Post by bjorndadwarf on May 3, 2017 7:04:25 GMT
So you say enemies get shield gate INVUL frames (duration ?) .. Not painful for slow firing weapons but nasty for auto weapons , shotguns etc .. The only time I've noticed this is with the Talon, never felt like there was a delay or invul period with automatic weapons. But since the Talon should act like a shotgun, figured it might apply to those as well if the observation is right and it is getting gated even as a multi-pellet weapon. |
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Post by Arilou on May 3, 2017 7:06:13 GMT
How exactly does shield gate even work in this game? I know that you can oneshot shielded enemies with a high-powered sniper bullet to the head.
In ME3 this wouldn't have been possible without Disruptor Ammo, which works fundamentally different in Andromeda.
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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 7:08:34 GMT
mechanically there is very little difference between a multipellet shotgun and high rof weapon .. maybe the invul duration is too short to visibly hurt anything else .. I think I've gotten talon on SP from strike teams .. I just need to advance playtrough enough to get into a fight with shielded enemies.. until then I could try katana/disciple vs shielded enemy .. which faction has earliest weave shielded enemy guaranteed in lineup ?
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Post by hardcoresalmon on May 3, 2017 7:10:25 GMT
I think we can do more ammo tests on SP where you can reload save after .. And then see how much applies to MP without wasting too much MP consumables Finding an enemy with armor in campaign is quite rare compared to MP, it will work fine if you can save at the point though. |
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Post by Arilou on May 3, 2017 7:12:48 GMT
which faction has earliest weave shielded enemy guaranteed in lineup ? Remnant get Observers in wave 1 even on Bronze. |
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Post by dangaard on May 3, 2017 7:15:44 GMT
Eirochs are quite easy to find in terms of armoured enemies. Difficult to reliably hit weak points though and annoying to fight in general, let alone when you want to minimize variables and running around etc.
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Post by hardcoresalmon on May 3, 2017 7:34:20 GMT
How exactly does shield gate even work in this game? I know that you can oneshot shielded enemies with a high-powered sniper bullet to the head. In ME3 this wouldn't have been possible without Disruptor Ammo, which works fundamentally different in Andromeda. It was completely possible in me3 without disrupter/phasic, those ammo types just made it a lot easier. The Shield gate in this game is almost identical from what I've seen, apart from the reports of shotguns/talon. In ME3 the shieldgate was 75% on Gold/Platinum meaning that only 25% of the remaining damage would pass through to the enemies health Example in ME3: Nemesis Shields: 1940 Health 1180 Javelin X headshot, extended barrel: 1,545.80 * (1 + 0.25) = 1932.25 * 2.5 = 4830.625 4830.625 - 1940 = 2890.625 Damage remaining minus shields 2890.625 * 0.25 = 722.65625 Damage to health Nemesis would have 457.35 health left with an infiltrator you would easily one shot a nemesis in ME3. Example in MEA: Sharpshooter Shields: 1187.5 Health: 2375 Isharay X headshot, barrel X: 1457 * (1 + 0.21) = 1762.97 * 2.1 = 3702.237 3702.237 - 1187.5 = 2514.737 Damage remaining minus shields 2514.737 * 0.5 = 1257.3685 Damage to health Sharpshooter would have 1117.64 health left Disrupter/phasic will just increase the damage to shields in both games meaning more damage will go through to health, making it easier to one shot things. -In ME3 the ammo damage was higher, the health was lower, headshots were 2.5x damage and the shield gate was 75%. -In MEA the ammo damage is lower, the health is higher, headshots are 2.1x (on snipers) and the shield gate is 50%. |
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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 7:35:21 GMT
CONFIRMED 1 hitpoint of shields will EAT A WHOLE SHOTGUN (KATANA) VOLLEY WITH ZERO BLEED-TROUGH damage to Health.
WHY ?tested vs bronze observer. Damaged observer to stop shield regen. Set Shield value to 1 and katana to the face ... ZERO health damage  ( Unleash the dogs of reddit ?  Will retest first to make sure RETESTED viper 2 shield gate test inconclusive (495 - 326.5) / (333 * (1 + 0.5) * (1.4 + 0.7 - 0.25)) = 0.182344 % // cloaked crit viper 2 ???? 2 / 333 = 0.006 % // no crit viper 2 ?????? There is bleed trough to health but I fail to see the formula for it ..
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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 8:27:28 GMT
energy drain's built in damage bonus vs shields is multiplicative. Potential for very high damage vs shields when stacking power bonuses.. Ditto for overload .. (damage vs shields will scale really well with extra power bonuses)
The extra 15% vs syntetics did not manifest vs observer shield. Might be strictly a damage bonus vs syntetic health.
160 * (1 + 1 ) = 320 vs observer shield
160 * (1 + 0.5) * (1 + 1) = 480 cloak vs observer shield
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Post by Kenny Bania on May 3, 2017 9:20:05 GMT
energy drain's built in damage bonus vs shields is multiplicative. Potential for very high damage vs shields when stacking power bonuses.. Ditto for overload .. (damage vs shields will scale really well with extra power bonuses) The extra 15% vs syntetics did not manifest vs observer shield. Might be strictly a damage bonus vs syntetic health. 160 * (1 + 1 ) = 320 vs observer shield 160 * (1 + 0.5) * (1 + 1) = 480 cloak vs observer shield Still not enough to fully strip a Sharpshooter's shields on gold. |
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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 9:29:18 GMT
energy drain's built in damage bonus vs shields is multiplicative. Potential for very high damage vs shields when stacking power bonuses.. Ditto for overload .. (damage vs shields will scale really well with extra power bonuses) The extra 15% vs syntetics did not manifest vs observer shield. Might be strictly a damage bonus vs syntetic health. 160 * (1 + 1 ) = 320 vs observer shield 160 * (1 + 0.5) * (1 + 1) = 480 cloak vs observer shield Still not enough to fully strip a Sharpshooter's shields on gold. lets indulge you 1187.5 shields ; MANDATORY 6a extra 40% to the vs shield multiplier. 160 * (1 + 1 + 0.4) * (1+X) > 1187.5 X > 1187.5 / (2.4 * 160) -1 X > 2.0924 (pretty tall order but maybe not impossible, easier on infiltrator with cloak power damage) IF offensive tech 5a works like I think it does it gets even easier X > 1187.5 / (2.7 * 160) -1 X > 1.7488 cloak up to +1 energy drain up 0.55% passive up to 0.3 % gear & booster doable if you really want it |
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Post by Kenny Bania on May 3, 2017 9:59:20 GMT
Still not enough to fully strip a Sharpshooter's shields on gold. lets indulge you 1187.5 shields ; MANDATORY 6a extra 40% to the vs shield multiplier. 160 * (1 + 1 + 0.4) * (1+X) > 1187.5 X > 1187.5 / (2.4 * 160) -1 X > 2.0924 (pretty tall order but maybe not impossible, easier on infiltrator with cloak power damage) IF offensive tech 5a works like I think it does it gets even easier X > 1187.5 / (2.7 * 160) -1 X > 1.7488 cloak up to +1 energy drain up 0.55% passive up to 0.3 % gear & booster doable if you really want it Whoa! Whoa! Whoa! Easy with the math. On a serious note, we're not gonna cheat an use the cloak damage boost. Imagine it on a non infiltrator kit. Tech Power booster IV gives us 40%, and Engineering kit gives us 15%, leaving us short. |
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Post by kalil on May 3, 2017 10:20:28 GMT
Still not enough to fully strip a Sharpshooter's shields on gold. lets indulge you 1187.5 shields ; MANDATORY 6a extra 40% to the vs shield multiplier. 160 * (1 + 1 + 0.4) * (1+X) > 1187.5 X > 1187.5 / (2.4 * 160) -1 X > 2.0924 (pretty tall order but maybe not impossible, easier on infiltrator with cloak power damage) IF offensive tech 5a works like I think it does it gets even easier X > 1187.5 / (2.7 * 160) -1 X > 1.7488 cloak up to +1 energy drain up 0.55% passive up to 0.3 % gear & booster doable if you really want it Sure. But can it single clip an Atlas? |
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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 10:57:29 GMT
backlash 1 RETURN DAMAGE is * 1.25 NOT *1.75 as advertised.
At bakclash level 1 you will die million times over before you kill 1 attacker even on bronze ..
the 75 frontal damage reduction translated in ..
15423.203, 827A4CB0, 26.786
15423.336, 827A4CB0, 26.786 // damage done by chosen to my health
15423.803, 827A4CB0, 26.786
15423.936, 827A4CB0, 26.786
15424.069, 827A4CB0, 26.786
15424.470, 82846A20, 33.482 // he takes damage back 26.786 * 1.25 NOT *1.75 as advertised
15424.603, 82846A20, 33.482 // NO RETURNED HS OBSERVED BUT I WASN'T AIMING
15424.736, 82846A20, 33.482
15414.136, 827A4CB0, 15.306 // reduced damage 26.786 * (1 / (1 + 0.75))
15414.269, 827A4CB0, 15.306
15414.403, 827A4CB0, 15.306
15414.737, 827A4CB0, 15.306
15414.870, 827A4CB0, 15.306
15415.003, 827A4CB0, 15.306
When does it return ?? When do you take reduced damage instead ??
Damage reduction formula * (1 / (1+ sum damage reduction sources)) ;
NON-linear
* 0.8 at 25 damage reduction
* 0.66 at 50 damage reduction
* 0.5714.. at 75 damage reduction
* 0.5 at 100 Damage reduction
* 0.33 at 200 Damage reduction
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Post by tyrion26 on May 3, 2017 11:11:31 GMT
backlash 1 RETURN DAMAGE is * 1.25 NOT *1.75 as advertised.
At bakclash level 1 you will die million times over before you kill 1 attacker even on bronze ..
the 75 frontal damage reduction translated in .. 15423.203, 827A4CB0, 26.786 15423.336, 827A4CB0, 26.786 // mee take damage 15423.803, 827A4CB0, 26.786 15423.936, 827A4CB0, 26.786 15424.069, 827A4CB0, 26.786 15424.470, 82846A20, 33.482 // he takes damage back 26.786 * 1.25 NOT *1.75 as advertised 15424.603, 82846A20, 33.482 15424.736, 82846A20, 33.482 15414.136, 827A4CB0, 15.306 // reduced damage 26.786 * (1 / (1 + 0.75)) 15414.269, 827A4CB0, 15.306 15414.403, 827A4CB0, 15.306 15414.737, 827A4CB0, 15.306 15414.870, 827A4CB0, 15.306 15415.003, 827A4CB0, 15.306 When does it return ?? When do you take reduced damage instead ??
Damage reduction formula * (1 / (1+ sum damage reduction sources)) ;
NON-linear
* 0.8 at 25 damage reduction
* 0.66 at 50 damage reduction
* 0.5714.. at 75 damage reduction
* 0.5 at 100 Damage reduction
* 0.33 at 200 Damage reduction So you're saying backlash only reflects 1.25 damage instead of 1.75 and is also not receiving damage reduction from its frontal 75 DR? Was ANYTHING tested before release!?!? |
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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 11:16:22 GMT
the damage reduction is there and works as per presented formula.
Some projectiles get reflected back, some do reduced damage as per the formula. I cannot give a formula on how the game decides what/how many gets reflected and what damages you (with reduction) . Maybe the angle of attack matters (better chance to reflect frontal attacks ?)
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Post by Arilou on May 3, 2017 11:46:59 GMT
Disrupter/phasic will just increase the damage to shields in both games meaning more damage will go through to health, making it easier to one shot things. -In ME3 the ammo damage was higher, the health was lower, headshots were 2.5x damage and the shield gate was 75%. -In MEA the ammo damage is lower, the health is higher, headshots are 2.1x (on snipers) and the shield gate is 50%. Not quite. Ammo powers in ME3 work a little bit differently in that they add a large amount of bonus damage that counts as a seperate source before the actual bullet hits. Which means that if the Disruptor bonus damage can knock down the shields by itself then you don't have to deal with shield gate at all. That means that almost all high-powered weapons are capable of oneshots while probably only the Jav can do it without Disruptor. I don't think that mechanic is still in place in ME:A though and even if it was the ammo bonus damage is way too low now. The lower shield gate DR explains why onehots are still possible tough. |
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TormDK
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"No Fear! No Pity! NO REMORSE!"
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Post by TormDK on May 3, 2017 11:58:44 GMT
the damage reduction is there and works as per presented formula. Some projectiles get reflected back, some do reduced damage as per the formula. I cannot give a formula on how the game decides what/how many gets reflected and what damages you (with reduction) . Maybe the angle of attack matters (better chance to reflect frontal attacks ?) The angle does matter, you have to aim at whatever it is you want to do damage to. You can see this very clearly if you backlash an observers beam, or a Nullifiers bolt shot. (Since it's a huge slow ball so you can see where it goes) |
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Post by tyrion26 on May 3, 2017 12:12:53 GMT
The reflected shots are hit scan. As long as you are aiming at an enemy they will get reflected back. If you aren't aiming at anything the shield will just eat the projectiles.
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Post by lennybusker on May 3, 2017 12:17:27 GMT
Not that I'm arguing with the math or anything, but...Overload damage, fully specced for shields:
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Post by JRandall0308 on May 3, 2017 12:26:59 GMT
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Post by peddroelm on May 3, 2017 12:28:37 GMT
3562.5 (destined gold ) that's a bit much. But with *3 multiplier vs shields any additional power bonus (consumable / gear) will have significant impact ..
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(
Will retest first to make sure 
