Numerical Damage Tests

peddroelm
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 18:15:16 GMT unclemonster likes this

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Post by peddroelm on Jun 5, 2017 18:15:16 GMT

Jun 5, 2017 16:01:57 GMT TheThirdRace said:

Jun 5, 2017 15:04:06 GMT peddroelm said:

The cloaking animation.you need to wait to be fully cloaked before firing if you want the damage bonus.
Most relevant for single shot sniper riles where it can be the difference between 1 shot and multiple shot kills

Does it apply to powers and melee the same way?

Also, could it be the reason so many people says Avenger Strike (Angara Avenger) doesn't work with Stealth Grid? Because they would cloak and immediately use Avenger Strike before the animation is over, thus no bonuses?

While not specifically tested for 99.99 works the same for power and melee bonuses. Had the same thought about angara avenger but no dice. No extra damage for being cloaked

f3rociouspanda N2 Posts: 152 Likes: 291 f3rociouspanda inherit Male 8295 0 Sept 3, 2017 5:37:56 GMT 291 f3rociouspanda 152 N2 May 9, 2017 3:45:54 GMT May 2017 f3rociouspanda	Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 18:32:21 GMT via mobile Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by f3rociouspanda on Jun 5, 2017 18:32:21 GMT So being cloaked gives you a damage boost? I remember reading something about how grenades you throw while cloaked don't get a damage increase

peddroelm
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 19:10:53 GMT capn233, unclemonster, and 2 more like this

Quote

Post by peddroelm on Jun 5, 2017 19:10:53 GMT

Jun 5, 2017 18:32:21 GMT f3rociouspanda said:

So being cloaked gives you a damage boost? I remember reading something about how grenades you throw while cloaked don't get a damage increase

being cloaked provides no damage bonus. Breaking cloak after being cloaked (wait for cloaking animation to complete) with an attack capable of breaking cloak (some powers don't) activates a 0.5 (2 for TC 6b) second damage boost window

TheThirdRace
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 19:11:06 GMT unclemonster, f3rociouspanda, and 1 more like this

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Post by TheThirdRace on Jun 5, 2017 19:11:06 GMT

Jun 5, 2017 18:32:21 GMT f3rociouspanda said:

So being cloaked gives you a damage boost? I remember reading something about how grenades you throw while cloaked don't get a damage increase

To get the bonus from Sticky Grenades, you need 3 things:

Combat Cloak (6b) for that 2 seconds window for bonus damage
Break cloak since Sticky Grenade doesn't break it itself
Sticky Grenade need to explode within 2 seconds after breaking cloak

You need all 3 to make it work. Anything else won't work.

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hanskey
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 20:35:33 GMT unclemonster likes this

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Post by hanskey on Jun 5, 2017 20:35:33 GMT

Hey testers!!

First - thanks for all your work!!

Second in the OP ITT, Widow and Black Widow are not listed in the weakpoint multiplier information. Do they really have a 1.4 multiplier as I'm assuming, or have those not been tested for their weakpoint multiplier?
Actually, here's a list of guns that appear to not yet have been tested for weakpoint multiplier, all of which I've assumed 1.4 multiplier for, but that could be very wrong:

Widow
Black Widow
Valiant
Ruzad
Scattershot
Venom
Crusader
Dhan
Scorpion (maybe no ability to hit weakpoints?)
Ushior
Falcon (maybe no ability to hit weakpoints?)
Halberd
Revenant
Sandstorm
Sweeper
Soned
Valkyrie
Ghost

Last Edit: Jun 5, 2017 20:36:31 GMT by hanskey

f3rociouspanda
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 20:54:43 GMT via mobile

Quote

Post by f3rociouspanda on Jun 5, 2017 20:54:43 GMT

Jun 5, 2017 19:11:06 GMT TheThirdRace said:

Jun 5, 2017 18:32:21 GMT f3rociouspanda said:

So being cloaked gives you a damage boost? I remember reading something about how grenades you throw while cloaked don't get a damage increase

To get the bonus from Sticky Grenades, you need 3 things:

Combat Cloak (6b) for that 2 seconds window for bonus damage
Break cloak since Sticky Grenade doesn't break it itself
Sticky Grenade need to explode within 2 seconds after breaking cloak

You need all 3 to make it work. Anything else won't work.

I also remember reading that you only get a damage boost to the type of attack used to break cloak. Was that just for stealth grid maybe?

TheThirdRace
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 21:22:24 GMT unclemonster and f3rociouspanda like this

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Post by TheThirdRace on Jun 5, 2017 21:22:24 GMT

Jun 5, 2017 20:54:43 GMT f3rociouspanda said:

Jun 5, 2017 19:11:06 GMT TheThirdRace said:

To get the bonus from Sticky Grenades, you need 3 things:

Combat Cloak (6b) for that 2 seconds window for bonus damage
Break cloak since Sticky Grenade doesn't break it itself
Sticky Grenade need to explode within 2 seconds after breaking cloak

You need all 3 to make it work. Anything else won't work.

I also remember reading that you only get a damage boost to the type of attack used to break cloak. Was that just for stealth grid maybe?

The 2 seconds applies to everything within that 2 second window.

Mechanically speaking, Stealth Grid works exactly the same way as Tactical Cloak at rank 1. Meaning everything is based on a 0.5 second window and "delayed" things like Sticky Grenade Explosion don't work even if they're within that 0.5 second window.

Last Edit: Jun 5, 2017 21:23:56 GMT by TheThirdRace

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f3rociouspanda
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 22:03:43 GMT via mobile

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Post by f3rociouspanda on Jun 5, 2017 22:03:43 GMT

Will avenger strike get the damage boost if you time it to hit in the 0.5 window? Or is it just completely bugged?

Also, do you guys think the rank 6b of cloak is worth it on most snipers? Because most things die in the first couple of hits, and then your recharge is just delayed

TheThirdRace
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 5, 2017 23:57:56 GMT

Quote

Post by TheThirdRace on Jun 5, 2017 23:57:56 GMT

Jun 5, 2017 22:03:43 GMT f3rociouspanda said:

Will avenger strike get the damage boost if you time it to hit in the 0.5 window? Or is it just completely bugged?

Also, do you guys think the rank 6b of cloak is worth it on most snipers? Because most things die in the first couple of hits, and then your recharge is just delayed

It's impossible to activate Avenger Strike and hit in the next 0.5 second so it's completely bugged at the moment.

As for Combat Cloak (6b), it depends on the sniper. High damage shot snipers like the Isharay won't benefit much from 6b while fast firing one like the Shadow would.

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capn233
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 0:00:57 GMT unclemonster likes this

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Post by capn233 on Jun 6, 2017 0:00:57 GMT

Jun 5, 2017 22:03:43 GMT f3rociouspanda said:

Will avenger strike get the damage boost if you time it to hit in the 0.5 window? Or is it just completely bugged?

Also, do you guys think the rank 6b of cloak is worth it on most snipers? Because most things die in the first couple of hits, and then your recharge is just delayed

I think it isn't supposed to break stealth, which is why it can't get a bonus.

The animation takes too long to fit it into a 500ms damage window. That's why in my data there isn't anything showing a strike in the cloak bonus window since it couldn't be done as far as I could tell.

Last Edit: Jun 6, 2017 0:01:53 GMT by capn233

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capn233
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 0:15:14 GMT unclemonster and peddroelm like this

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Post by capn233 on Jun 6, 2017 0:15:14 GMT

Enemy Damage Values

Added them to the workbook.

Difficulty Scaling

Bronze 1x
Silver ~1.5789x
Gold ~2.3421x

-There is some rounding going on so observed might have been very slightly different.

Base vs Cover

-These were mostly generated out of cover, and so the base is sort of an approximation that should be good within a hundredth or so.
-Some attacks are not scaled for the out of cover penalty. This was weirdness I talked about earlier in the thread a couple times, and Hello_Isaac helped run through attacks to quickly tell which were scaled and which were not.

Health vs Shields

-Most attacks do the same damage to player health and shields. Some do not, and multiplier is noted where applicable.

Grenades

-Raider and Chosen grenades are scaled by distance, and drop rather quickly and dramatically. Listed is the highest value I could find.
-The grenades' "impact" damage value is the damage taken if grenade strikes player when thrown, or player steps on it when it is sitting on the ground.
-Raider and Chosen grenades tended to detonate immediately if stepped on when the player had shields.
-Raider and Chosen grenades would often be kicked slightly if the player stepped on it with no shields.
-Rarely a stepped on grenade would do no damage, which I assume may be a map or geometry error.

Enemy Damage Base

Enemy Damage Out of Cover

If you find anything that seems incorrect, let me know and I will look at it again.

Last Edit: Jun 6, 2017 0:16:02 GMT by capn233

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f3rociouspanda
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 0:25:13 GMT via mobile

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Post by f3rociouspanda on Jun 6, 2017 0:25:13 GMT

If the problem is that avenger strike doesn't break cloak until after your strike hits, then you could try waiting for cloak timer to run out on its own and timing the strike perfectly.

If the problem is that using avenger strike decloaks you immediately so that the strike hits after the 0.5 window, then a teammate with Stealth Grid could try to boost you while you're using avenger strike.

So there has to be a way to get the damage bonus, as impractical as it may be, unless the problem is just that it's broken completely.

capn233
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 0:30:15 GMT unclemonster likes this

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Post by capn233 on Jun 6, 2017 0:30:15 GMT

Not necessarily, just as Stickies cannot get a bonus with base Tactical Cloak, even if it detonates within the 500ms window.

Avenger Strike is also essentially in its own class of powers, so it isn't like breaking Stealth Grid with Throw and getting a bonus on Lance as well. Even if it counted as a melee, you aren't going to break Stealth with a melee then hit the target with AS w/i 500ms due to the animation length.

Last Edit: Jun 6, 2017 0:31:26 GMT by capn233

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peddroelm
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 8:21:19 GMT akots and unclemonster like this

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Post by peddroelm on Jun 6, 2017 8:21:19 GMT

hanskey

Widow // 1911.14 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 4013.394
Black Widow // 1003.52 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 2107.392
Valiant // 803 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 1686.3
Ruzad // 285.95 * 1.4 = 400.33
Scattershot // 111.54 * 1.4 = 156.156
Venom // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 25
Crusader // 999.57 * 1.4 = 1399.398
Dhan // I don't have it
Scorpion // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 10 ; 10 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 16.5
Ushior // 1023 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 1687.95
Falcon // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 20 ; 20 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 33
Halberd // 246.6 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 406.89
Revenant // 89.05 * 1.4 = 124.67
Sandstorm // 226.05 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 372.9825
Sweeper // 152.07 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 250.9155
Soned // I don't have it
Valkyrie // 224.68 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 370.722
Ghost // 71.24 * 1.4 = 99.736

Last Edit: Jun 6, 2017 10:01:49 GMT by peddroelm

N7Mith
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 9:49:05 GMT

Quote

Post by N7Mith on Jun 6, 2017 9:49:05 GMT

Jun 5, 2017 23:57:56 GMT TheThirdRace said:

Jun 5, 2017 22:03:43 GMT f3rociouspanda said:

Will avenger strike get the damage boost if you time it to hit in the 0.5 window? Or is it just completely bugged?

Also, do you guys think the rank 6b of cloak is worth it on most snipers? Because most things die in the first couple of hits, and then your recharge is just delayed

It's impossible to activate Avenger Strike and hit in the next 0.5 second so it's completely bugged at the moment.

As for Combat Cloak (6b), it depends on the sniper. High damage shot snipers like the Isharay won't benefit much from 6b while fast firing one like the Shadow would.

I don't think you're meant to get dmg bonus on AS. It doesn't break cloak after all.

I delivered a Pizza and all I got was a lousy backpack.

N7Mith
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 9:55:33 GMT

Quote

Post by N7Mith on Jun 6, 2017 9:55:33 GMT

Jun 6, 2017 8:21:19 GMT peddroelm said:

hanskey

Widow // 1911.14 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 4013.394
Black Widow // 1003.52 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 2107.392
Valiant // 803 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 1686.3
Ruzad // 285.95 * 1.4 = 400.33
Scattershot // 111.54 * 1.4 = 156.156
Venom // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 25
Crusader // 999.57 * 1.4 = 1399.398
Dhan // I don't have it
Scorpion // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 10 ; 10 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 16.5
Ushior // 1023 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 1687.95
Falcon // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 10 ; 20 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 33
Halberd // 246.6 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 406.89
Revenant // 89.05 * 1.4 = 124.67
Sandstorm // 226.05 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 372.9825
Sweeper // 152.07 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 250.9155
Soned // I don't have it
Valkyrie // 224.68 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 370.722
Ghost // 71.24 * 1.4 = 99.736

Really, the falcon doesn't get headshot mods? I could swear I got a lot more dmg on them, with every kit I ever used it with. Pre-106 though, maybe they 'fixed' that.

I delivered a Pizza and all I got was a lousy backpack.

peddroelm
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Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 11:02:34 GMT akots and unclemonster like this

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Post by peddroelm on Jun 6, 2017 11:02:34 GMT

some "measured" ROF data samples

no script clicking (significant source of user input error, manually clicking with average mouse)

443.076 // equivalent hornet RPM (approximately half UI ?)
587.8510 RPM // equivalent Hornet turbocharged *1.4 ROF

276.426 RPM // equivalent Valkyrie RPM (approximately half UI ?)
352 RPM // approximate Valkyrie *1.4 turbocharge ROF

910.384 RPM // ~ 900 ramped up ROF rozerad
1288.1915 RPM //measured ROF for turbocharged ramped up rozerad 900 * 1.4

at first look burst weapons seem to get less equivalent ROF bonus from turbocharge skill than the auto weapons (might still be "operator" error - me not clicking fast enough)

SPOILER: Click to show

Hornet
OB, 15180578, 5938, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13861.121, 14020.841, 159.720
OB, 15180640, 62, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13701.401, 13861.121, 159.720
OB, 15180718, 78, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13541.682, 13701.401, 159.720
OB, 15181046, 328, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13381.962, 13541.682, 159.720
OB, 15181125, 79, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13222.242, 13381.962, 159.720
OB, 15181171, 46, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13062.522, 13222.242, 159.720
OB, 15181609, 438, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12902.803, 13062.522, 159.720
OB, 15181671, 62, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12743.083, 12902.803, 159.720
OB, 15181750, 79, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12583.363, 12743.083, 159.720
OB, 15182078, 328, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12423.644, 12583.363, 159.720
OB, 15182140, 62, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12263.924, 12423.644, 159.720
OB, 15182203, 63, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12104.204, 12263.924, 159.720
60000/ ((15182203 - 15180578)/ 12) = 443.076 // equivalent hornet RPM

Hornet Turbo charge *1.4 ROF
OB, 15190875, 8672, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11902.134, 12104.204, 202.070
OB, 15190937, 62, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11700.063, 11902.134, 202.070
OB, 15190984, 47, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11497.993, 11700.063, 202.070
OB, 15191250, 266, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11295.923, 11497.993, 202.070
OB, 15191312, 62, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11093.853, 11295.923, 202.070
OB, 15191343, 31, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10891.782, 11093.853, 202.070
OB, 15191578, 235, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10689.712, 10891.782, 202.070
OB, 15191640, 62, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10487.642, 10689.712, 202.070
OB, 15191687, 47, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10285.571, 10487.642, 202.070
OB, 15191890, 203, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10083.501, 10285.571, 202.070
OB, 15191953, 63, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9881.431, 10083.501, 202.070
OB, 15192015, 62, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9679.360, 9881.431, 202.070
OB, 15192250, 235, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9477.290, 9679.360, 202.070
OB, 15192296, 46, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9275.220, 9477.290, 202.070
OB, 15192343, 47, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9073.149, 9275.220, 202.070
OB, 15192578, 235, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 8871.079, 9073.149, 202.070
OB, 15192609, 31, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 8669.009, 8871.079, 202.070
OB, 15192640, 31, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 8466.938, 8669.009, 202.070
OB, 15192875, 235, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 8264.868, 8466.938, 202.070
OB, 15192937, 62, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 8062.798, 8264.868, 202.070
OB, 15192984, 47, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7860.729, 8062.798, 202.070
OB, 15193218, 234, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7658.659, 7860.729, 202.070
OB, 15193281, 63, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7456.589, 7658.659, 202.070
OB, 15193312, 31, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7254.519, 7456.589, 202.070
OB, 15193546, 234, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7052.449, 7254.519, 202.070
OB, 15193578, 32, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 6850.379, 7052.449, 202.070
OB, 15193609, 31, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 6648.310, 6850.379, 202.070
OB, 15193875, 266, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 6446.240, 6648.310, 202.070
OB, 15193906, 31, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 6244.170, 6446.240, 202.070
OB, 15193937, 31, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 6042.100, 6244.170, 202.070
60 000 / ((15 193 937 - 15 190 875) / 30) =
587.8510 RPM // equivalent Hornet turbocharged *1.4 ROF

valkyrie
OB, 15345421, 151484, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 14275.320, 14500.000, 224.680
OB, 15345546, 125, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 14050.641, 14275.320, 224.680
OB, 15345921, 375, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13825.961, 14050.641, 224.680
OB, 15346015, 94, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13601.281, 13825.961, 224.680
OB, 15346390, 375, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13376.602, 13601.281, 224.680
OB, 15346484, 94, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 13151.922, 13376.602, 224.680
OB, 15346859, 375, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12927.242, 13151.922, 224.680
OB, 15346953, 94, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12702.563, 12927.242, 224.680
OB, 15347328, 375, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12477.883, 12702.563, 224.680
OB, 15347421, 93, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12253.203, 12477.883, 224.680
OB, 15347781, 360, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 12028.523, 12253.203, 224.680
OB, 15347921, 140, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11803.844, 12028.523, 224.680
OB, 15348250, 329, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11579.164, 11803.844, 224.680
OB, 15348390, 140, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11354.484, 11579.164, 224.680
OB, 15348718, 328, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 11129.805, 11354.484, 224.680
OB, 15348859, 141, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10905.125, 11129.805, 224.680
OB, 15349187, 328, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10680.445, 10905.125, 224.680
OB, 15349328, 141, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10455.766, 10680.445, 224.680
60 000 / ((15 349 328 - 15 345 421) / 18) =
276.426 // equivalent Valkyrie RPM

turbo charge valkyrie *1.4 ROF
OB, 15357859, 8531, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 10173.686, 10455.766, 282.080
OB, 15357968, 109, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9891.605, 10173.686, 282.080
OB, 15358453, 485, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9609.525, 9891.605, 282.080
OB, 15358546, 93, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9327.445, 9609.525, 282.080
OB, 15358828, 282, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 9045.365, 9327.445, 282.080
OB, 15358953, 125, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 8763.285, 9045.365, 282.080
OB, 15359281, 328, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 8481.205, 8763.285, 282.080
OB, 15359390, 109, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 8199.125, 8481.205, 282.080
OB, 15359687, 297, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7917.045, 8199.125, 282.080
OB, 15359781, 94, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7634.965, 7917.045, 282.080
OB, 15360046, 265, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7352.885, 7634.965, 282.080
OB, 15360125, 79, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 7070.805, 7352.885, 282.080
OB, 15360390, 265, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 6788.725, 7070.805, 282.080
OB, 15360453, 63, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 6506.645, 6788.725, 282.080
OB, 15360718, 265, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 6224.564, 6506.645, 282.080
OB, 15360781, 63, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 5942.484, 6224.564, 282.080
OB, 15361046, 265, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 5660.404, 5942.484, 282.080
OB, 15361125, 79, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 5378.324, 5660.404, 282.080
OB, 15361390, 265, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 5096.244, 5378.324, 282.080
OB, 15361453, 63, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 4814.164, 5096.244, 282.080
OB, 15361718, 265, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 4532.084, 4814.164, 282.080
OB, 15361781, 63, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 4250.004, 4532.084, 282.080
OB, 15362046, 265, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 3967.924, 4250.004, 282.080
OB, 15362156, 110, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 3685.844, 3967.924, 282.080
OB, 15362390, 234, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 3403.764, 3685.844, 282.080
OB, 15362484, 94, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 3121.684, 3403.764, 282.080
OB, 15362718, 234, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 2839.604, 3121.684, 282.080
OB, 15362828, 110, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 2557.523, 2839.604, 282.080
OB, 15363046, 218, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 2275.443, 2557.523, 282.080
OB, 15363156, 110, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 1993.363, 2275.443, 282.080
OB, 15363359, 203, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 1711.283, 1993.363, 282.080
OB, 15363484, 125, 15A4C9E0, 525.000, 1429.203, 1711.283, 282.080
60 000 / ((15 363 484 - 15 357 859) / 33) =
352 RPM // equivalent valkyrie *1.4 turbocharge ROF

rozerad
OB, 15847640, 40484, D9FE170, 525.000, 14392.080, 14500.000, 107.920
OB, 15847781, 141, D9FE170, 525.000, 14284.160, 14392.080, 107.920
OB, 15847906, 125, D9FE170, 525.000, 14176.240, 14284.160, 107.920
OB, 15848015, 109, D9FE170, 525.000, 14068.320, 14176.240, 107.920
OB, 15848109, 94, D9FE170, 525.000, 13960.400, 14068.320, 107.920
OB, 15848203, 94, D9FE170, 525.000, 13852.480, 13960.400, 107.920
OB, 15848281, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 13744.561, 13852.480, 107.920
OB, 15848375, 94, D9FE170, 525.000, 13636.641, 13744.561, 107.920
OB, 15848437, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 13528.721, 13636.641, 107.920
OB, 15848515, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 13420.801, 13528.721, 107.920
OB, 15848609, 94, D9FE170, 525.000, 13312.881, 13420.801, 107.920
OB, 15848656, 47, D9FE170, 525.000, 13204.961, 13312.881, 107.920
OB, 15848750, 94, D9FE170, 525.000, 13097.041, 13204.961, 107.920
OB, 15848828, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 12989.121, 13097.041, 107.920
OB, 15848859, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 12881.201, 12989.121, 107.920
OB, 15848937, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 12773.281, 12881.201, 107.920
OB, 15849015, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 12665.361, 12773.281, 107.920
OB, 15849078, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 12557.441, 12665.361, 107.920
OB, 15849140, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 12449.521, 12557.441, 107.920
OB, 15849203, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 12341.602, 12449.521, 107.920
OB, 15849281, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 12233.682, 12341.602, 107.920
OB, 15849312, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 12125.762, 12233.682, 107.920
OB, 15849406, 94, D9FE170, 525.000, 12017.842, 12125.762, 107.920
OB, 15849484, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 11909.922, 12017.842, 107.920
OB, 15849546, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 11802.002, 11909.922, 107.920
OB, 15849609, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 11694.082, 11802.002, 107.920
OB, 15849671, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 11586.162, 11694.082, 107.920
OB, 15849750, 79, D9FE170, 525.000, 11478.242, 11586.162, 107.920
OB, 15849812, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 11370.322, 11478.242, 107.920
OB, 15849875, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 11262.402, 11370.322, 107.920
OB, 15849937, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 11154.482, 11262.402, 107.920
OB, 15850015, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 11046.563, 11154.482, 107.920
OB, 15850078, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 10938.643, 11046.563, 107.920
OB, 15850109, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 10830.723, 10938.643, 107.920
OB, 15850218, 109, D9FE170, 525.000, 10722.803, 10830.723, 107.920
OB, 15850281, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 10614.883, 10722.803, 107.920
OB, 15850312, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 10506.963, 10614.883, 107.920
60000 / ((15850312 - 15848203) / 32) =
910.384 // ~ 900 ramped up ROF rozerad

turbo charged rozerad
OB, 15878078, 27766, D9FE170, 525.000, 10372.443, 10506.963, 134.520
OB, 15878171, 93, D9FE170, 525.000, 10237.924, 10372.443, 134.520
OB, 15878281, 110, D9FE170, 525.000, 10103.404, 10237.924, 134.520
OB, 15878343, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 9968.885, 10103.404, 134.520
OB, 15878437, 94, D9FE170, 525.000, 9834.365, 9968.885, 134.520
OB, 15878515, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 9699.846, 9834.365, 134.520
OB, 15878578, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 9565.326, 9699.846, 134.520
OB, 15878640, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 9430.807, 9565.326, 134.520
OB, 15878671, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 9296.287, 9430.807, 134.520
OB, 15878750, 79, D9FE170, 525.000, 9161.768, 9296.287, 134.520
OB, 15878812, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 9027.248, 9161.768, 134.520
OB, 15878875, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 8892.729, 9027.248, 134.520
OB, 15878906, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 8758.209, 8892.729, 134.520
OB, 15878984, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 8623.689, 8758.209, 134.520
OB, 15879015, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 8489.170, 8623.689, 134.520
OB, 15879078, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 8354.650, 8489.170, 134.520
OB, 15879109, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 8220.131, 8354.650, 134.520
OB, 15879171, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 8085.611, 8220.131, 134.520
OB, 15879218, 47, D9FE170, 525.000, 7951.091, 8085.611, 134.520
OB, 15879250, 32, D9FE170, 525.000, 7816.571, 7951.091, 134.520
OB, 15879312, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 7682.051, 7816.571, 134.520
OB, 15879343, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 7547.531, 7682.051, 134.520
OB, 15879406, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 7413.011, 7547.531, 134.520
OB, 15879453, 47, D9FE170, 525.000, 7278.491, 7413.011, 134.520
OB, 15879515, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 7143.971, 7278.491, 134.520
OB, 15879546, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 7009.451, 7143.971, 134.520
OB, 15879578, 32, D9FE170, 525.000, 6874.931, 7009.451, 134.520
OB, 15879640, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 6740.411, 6874.931, 134.520
OB, 15879671, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 6605.891, 6740.411, 134.520
OB, 15879750, 79, D9FE170, 525.000, 6471.371, 6605.891, 134.520
OB, 15879781, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 6336.851, 6471.371, 134.520
OB, 15879843, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 6202.331, 6336.851, 134.520
OB, 15879890, 47, D9FE170, 525.000, 6067.811, 6202.331, 134.520
OB, 15879906, 16, D9FE170, 525.000, 5933.291, 6067.811, 134.520
OB, 15879984, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 5798.771, 5933.291, 134.520
OB, 15880015, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 5664.250, 5798.771, 134.520
OB, 15880078, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 5529.730, 5664.250, 134.520
OB, 15880109, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 5395.210, 5529.730, 134.520
OB, 15880187, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 5260.690, 5395.210, 134.520
OB, 15880218, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 5126.170, 5260.690, 134.520
OB, 15880250, 32, D9FE170, 525.000, 4991.650, 5126.170, 134.520
OB, 15880312, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 4857.130, 4991.650, 134.520
OB, 15880343, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 4722.610, 4857.130, 134.520
OB, 15880406, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 4588.090, 4722.610, 134.520
OB, 15880453, 47, D9FE170, 525.000, 4453.570, 4588.090, 134.520
OB, 15880515, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 4319.050, 4453.570, 134.520
OB, 15880546, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 4184.530, 4319.050, 134.520
OB, 15880578, 32, D9FE170, 525.000, 4050.010, 4184.530, 134.520
OB, 15880656, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 3915.490, 4050.010, 134.520
OB, 15880671, 15, D9FE170, 525.000, 3780.970, 3915.490, 134.520
OB, 15880750, 79, D9FE170, 525.000, 3646.450, 3780.970, 134.520
OB, 15880781, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 3511.930, 3646.450, 134.520
OB, 15880843, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 3377.410, 3511.930, 134.520
OB, 15880875, 32, D9FE170, 525.000, 3242.890, 3377.410, 134.520
OB, 15880906, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 3108.370, 3242.890, 134.520
OB, 15880984, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 2973.850, 3108.370, 134.520
OB, 15881015, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 2839.330, 2973.850, 134.520
OB, 15881093, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 2704.810, 2839.330, 134.520
OB, 15881109, 16, D9FE170, 525.000, 2570.290, 2704.810, 134.520
OB, 15881171, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 2435.770, 2570.290, 134.520
OB, 15881218, 47, D9FE170, 525.000, 2301.250, 2435.770, 134.520
OB, 15881250, 32, D9FE170, 525.000, 2166.730, 2301.250, 134.520
OB, 15881281, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 2032.210, 2166.730, 134.520
OB, 15881343, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 1897.690, 2032.210, 134.520
OB, 15881406, 63, D9FE170, 525.000, 1763.170, 1897.690, 134.520
OB, 15881437, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 1628.650, 1763.170, 134.520
OB, 15881515, 78, D9FE170, 525.000, 1494.130, 1628.650, 134.520
OB, 15881546, 31, D9FE170, 525.000, 1359.610, 1494.130, 134.520
OB, 15881578, 32, D9FE170, 525.000, 1225.090, 1359.610, 134.520
OB, 15881640, 62, D9FE170, 525.000, 1090.570, 1225.090, 134.520
15881640 - 15879218 = 2422 seconds 52 hits
60000 / ((15881 640 - 15879218) / 52) =
1288.1915 measured ROF for turbocharged rozerad

Last Edit: Jun 6, 2017 11:18:51 GMT by peddroelm

hanskey
N3

Posts: 509 Likes: 855

Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 16:48:34 GMT

Quote

Post by hanskey on Jun 6, 2017 16:48:34 GMT

Jun 6, 2017 8:21:19 GMT peddroelm said:

hanskey

Widow // 1911.14 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 4013.394
Black Widow // 1003.52 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 2107.392
Valiant // 803 * (1.4 + 0.7) = 1686.3
Ruzad // 285.95 * 1.4 = 400.33
Scattershot // 111.54 * 1.4 = 156.156
Venom // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 25
Crusader // 999.57 * 1.4 = 1399.398
Dhan // I don't have it
Scorpion // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 10 ; 10 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 16.5
Ushior // 1023 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 1687.95
Falcon // AOE Doesn't care about chosen weakspot ; impact is flat 20 ; 20 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 33
Halberd // 246.6 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 406.89
Revenant // 89.05 * 1.4 = 124.67
Sandstorm // 226.05 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 372.9825
Sweeper // 152.07 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 250.9155
Soned // I don't have it
Valkyrie // 224.68 * (1.4 + 0.25) = 370.722
Ghost // 71.24 * 1.4 = 99.736

Awwww YEAH!! Thanks bro!!!

Evil
N3

Lurkin' since 24/02/2011

Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Evil Mastered
PSN: Evil_Rurouni
Prime Posts: 2400
Prime Likes: 298
Posts: 464 Likes: 1,050

Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 21:30:31 GMT unclemonster likes this

Quote

Post by Evil on Jun 6, 2017 21:30:31 GMT

Jun 6, 2017 11:02:34 GMT peddroelm said:

at first look burst weapons seem to get less equivalent ROF bonus from turbocharge skill than the auto weapons (might still be "operator" error - me not clicking fast enough)

As you may well recall back in me3 burst fire weapons had a refire delay that gave them a fixed gap between bursts that couldn't be shortened by any known means.
RoF boosts only reduced the delay between the first, second and third shots, with the gap between the third and fourth being unaltered.
This made them significantly weaker than non-burst weapons when used on RoF kits.

I'm willing to wager Andromeda burst fire weapons have the same design flaw as their predecessors, given that Biower clearly haven't learnt much from their other failures over the past few years. :banghead:

I for one would appreciate it it this can be confirmed/debunked by yourself and/or some of the other testers just to be sure, but I'll be very surprised if this is not the case.

AKA: Evil Mastered on XBL and Evil_Rurouni on PSN. My theme tune.™

What weapon mods NOT to use on certain guns.

hanskey
N3

Posts: 509 Likes: 855

Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 22:00:47 GMT Evil, unclemonster, and 1 more like this

Quote

Post by hanskey on Jun 6, 2017 22:00:47 GMT

Jun 6, 2017 21:30:31 GMT Evil said:

Jun 6, 2017 11:02:34 GMT peddroelm said:

at first look burst weapons seem to get less equivalent ROF bonus from turbocharge skill than the auto weapons (might still be "operator" error - me not clicking fast enough)

As you may well recall back in me3 burst fire weapons had a refire delay that gave them a fixed gap between bursts that couldn't be shortened by any known means.
RoF boosts only reduced the delay between the first, second and third shots, with the gap between the third and fourth being unaltered.
This made them significantly weaker than non-burst weapons when used on RoF kits.

I'm willing to wager Andromeda burst fire weapons have the same design flaw as their predecessors, given that Biower clearly haven't learnt much from their other failures over the past few years. :banghead:

I for one would appreciate it it this can be confirmed/debunked by yourself and/or some of the other testers just to be sure, but I'll be very surprised if this is not the case.

Actually burst fire weapons work pretty well in ME:A, because the refire delay counter begin counting upon firing of the first round in the burst, not the last round. Based on the numerical analysis, it typically expires about 0.1 seconds after firing the final round of a given burst, meaning that the time between bursts is actually shorter than the time between rounds within a burst. See the effective fire-rate and the DPs numbers (which take this mechanic into account) here:
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1d_YezAcp3z1BN4jnXd-mqvyPrsKMFqrzyLnFz7N99vA/edit#gid=2144877432
I've used Hornet and TurboCharge with max fire rate and I'm not sure I ever hit "Fire" fast enough to be game limited. The Hornet is ridiculously effective, especially with 1.65 HS multiplier.

In actual fact, non-burst single fire weapons in ME:A are the one whose RoF is NOT achievable because if you pull the trigger too fast, the game penalizes your RoF, unlike with burst-fire weapons, which do not penalize you for hitting the "Fire" button too quickly. Abramsrunner was the first to note this that I saw, but it's been noted by several people.

Last Edit: Jun 6, 2017 22:05:12 GMT by hanskey

Evil
N3

Lurkin' since 24/02/2011

Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Evil Mastered
PSN: Evil_Rurouni
Prime Posts: 2400
Prime Likes: 298
Posts: 464 Likes: 1,050

Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 22:31:05 GMT unclemonster and hanskey like this

Quote

Post by Evil on Jun 6, 2017 22:31:05 GMT

Jun 6, 2017 22:00:47 GMT hanskey said:

Actually burst fire weapons work pretty well in ME:A, because the refire delay counter begin counting upon firing of the first round in the burst, not the last round. Based on the numerical analysis, it typically expires about 0.1 seconds after firing the final round of a given burst, meaning that the time between bursts is actually shorter than the time between rounds within a burst. See the effective fire-rate and the DPs numbers (which take this mechanic into account) here:
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1d_YezAcp3z1BN4jnXd-mqvyPrsKMFqrzyLnFz7N99vA/edit#gid=2144877432
I've used Hornet and TurboCharge with max fire rate and I'm not sure I ever hit "Fire" fast enough to be game limited. The Hornet is ridiculously effective, especially with 1.65 HS multiplier.

In actual fact, non-burst single fire weapons in ME:A are the one whose RoF is NOT achievable because if you pull the trigger too fast, the game penalizes your RoF, unlike with burst-fire weapons, which do not penalize you for hitting the "Fire" button too quickly. Abramsrunner was the first to note this that I saw, but it's been noted by several people.

That's an important change, thanks for pointing that out.

As for the semi-auto thing you mentioned, guess that explains why the phalanx and carnifex always felt "off" when I tried using them as a ranged backup gun to the revenant on my HSol.

Is that a new Andromeda ~~design flaw~~ "feature" to go with the burst fire change?
I don't remember having issues like that with semi's back in me3.

Either I'm wearing rose tilted shades, or Biower took one step forward and one step back.

AKA: Evil Mastered on XBL and Evil_Rurouni on PSN. My theme tune.™

What weapon mods NOT to use on certain guns.

hanskey
N3

Posts: 509 Likes: 855

Numerical Damage Tests Jun 6, 2017 22:37:05 GMT

Quote

Post by hanskey on Jun 6, 2017 22:37:05 GMT

Jun 6, 2017 22:31:05 GMT Evil said:

Jun 6, 2017 22:00:47 GMT hanskey said:

Actually burst fire weapons work pretty well in ME:A, because the refire delay counter begin counting upon firing of the first round in the burst, not the last round. Based on the numerical analysis, it typically expires about 0.1 seconds after firing the final round of a given burst, meaning that the time between bursts is actually shorter than the time between rounds within a burst. See the effective fire-rate and the DPs numbers (which take this mechanic into account) here:
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1d_YezAcp3z1BN4jnXd-mqvyPrsKMFqrzyLnFz7N99vA/edit#gid=2144877432
I've used Hornet and TurboCharge with max fire rate and I'm not sure I ever hit "Fire" fast enough to be game limited. The Hornet is ridiculously effective, especially with 1.65 HS multiplier.

In actual fact, non-burst single fire weapons in ME:A are the one whose RoF is NOT achievable because if you pull the trigger too fast, the game penalizes your RoF, unlike with burst-fire weapons, which do not penalize you for hitting the "Fire" button too quickly. Abramsrunner was the first to note this that I saw, but it's been noted by several people.

That's an important change, thanks for pointing that out.

As for the semi-auto thing you mentioned, guess that explains why the phalanx and carnifex always felt "off" when I tried using them as a ranged backup gun to the revenant on my HSol.

Is that a new Andromeda ~~design flaw~~ "feature" to go with the burst fire change?
I don't remember having issues like that with semi's back in me3.

Either I'm wearing rose tilted shades, or Biower took one step forward and one step back.

I'm pretty sure that's exactly the situation ~~and, as the testers have noted, even full-auto weapons don't achieve their stated RoF~~.

~~RoF efficiency is easiest to achieve with burst-fire weapons in ME:A.~~

Edited to reflect the below.

Last Edit: Jun 7, 2017 15:12:46 GMT by hanskey

peddroelm
N3

Posts: 482 Likes: 1,423

Numerical Damage Tests Jun 7, 2017 4:42:41 GMT unclemonster and hanskey like this

Quote

Post by peddroelm on Jun 7, 2017 4:42:41 GMT

Jun 6, 2017 22:37:05 GMT hanskey said:

.. as the testers have noted, even full-auto weapons don't achieve their stated RoF.

we didn't say this. The "measured" rof seems to match the listed ROF for most auto weapons, its just that the measuring process is a bit wookie with the delays between shots being variable at constant rof.

There's probably some algorithm at work that makes it that way but I doubt ROF measurement obfuscation is its primary role (collateral effect).

hanskey
N3

Posts: 509 Likes: 855

Numerical Damage Tests Jun 7, 2017 15:06:17 GMT

Quote

Post by hanskey on Jun 7, 2017 15:06:17 GMT

Jun 7, 2017 4:42:41 GMT peddroelm said:

Jun 6, 2017 22:37:05 GMT hanskey said:

.. as the testers have noted, even full-auto weapons don't achieve their stated RoF.

we didn't say this. The "measured" rof seems to match the listed ROF for most auto weapons, its just that the measuring process is a bit wookie with the delays between shots being variable at constant rof.

There's probably some algorithm at work that makes it that way but I doubt ROF measurement obfuscation is its primary role (collateral effect).

My bad.

I concluded RoF was lower in-game than stated, precisely because the time between bullets is variable and therefore (I assumed) RoF must be lower on aggregate in-game than stated.

Sorry that conclusion was incorrect!

Any idea when Hello_Isaac might be updating the weapons stat sheet, for 1.08 changes?

Last Edit: Jun 7, 2017 15:07:13 GMT by hanskey

peddroelm N3 Posts: 482 Likes: 1,423 peddroelm inherit Male 7709 0 Nov 2, 2022 4:08:33 GMT 1,423 peddroelm 482 N3 Apr 16, 2017 13:06:59 GMT April 2017 peddroelm	Numerical Damage Tests Jun 7, 2017 15:17:20 GMT hanskey likes this Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by peddroelm on Jun 7, 2017 15:17:20 GMT Jun 7, 2017 15:06:17 GMT hanskey said: Any idea when Hello_Isaac might be updating the weapons stat sheet, for 1.08 changes? they would have to release 1.08 first

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