unclemonster
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: unclemonster
Posts: 652 Likes: 1,029
inherit
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0
Jan 25, 2018 17:52:19 GMT
1,029
unclemonster
652
Apr 10, 2017 16:35:18 GMT
April 2017
unclemonster
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
unclemonster
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Post by unclemonster on Aug 31, 2017 12:36:41 GMT
The values for the Shorty are all wrong. Pre-release values maybe? Any idea where to find the correct values? I suppose people are kinda done with this game to invest time to test, anyway. I haven't seen any proper values for shorty. It is ALOT better than those listed though... |
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JulianVerse
197
Jun 30, 2017 17:34:23 GMT
June 2017
julianverse
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Post by JulianVerse on Aug 31, 2017 14:38:19 GMT
Sorry, but I'm dumb and having trouble finding the answer to this and am hoping I can get an answer without being called an idiot who can't search more than twice: Does Offensive Tech's rank 5 anti-armor increase Invasion's debuff or only the initial damage and explosion? Or some other combination of anything? Thanks It does NOT increase the debuff. Shield evo is probably better for this kit to at least increase overload damage. My main build leaves this passive tree at 4, and I also put 4 ranks in overload. Elemental tech is only proc by overload for 2.5 seconds, so those last 2 passives evos aren't that great on this kit. My secondary build leaves overload at 1 rank and max everything else. Awesome, thank you. |
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unclemonster
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: unclemonster
Posts: 652 Likes: 1,029
inherit
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0
Jan 25, 2018 17:52:19 GMT
1,029
unclemonster
652
Apr 10, 2017 16:35:18 GMT
April 2017
unclemonster
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
unclemonster
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Post by unclemonster on Aug 31, 2017 14:44:38 GMT
It does NOT increase the debuff. Shield evo is probably better for this kit to at least increase overload damage. My main build leaves this passive tree at 4, and I also put 4 ranks in overload. Elemental tech is only proc by overload for 2.5 seconds, so those last 2 passives evos aren't that great on this kit. My secondary build leaves overload at 1 rank and max everything else. Awesome, thank you. Support systems Rank 2 and Rank 5A (support systems EVO) both increase the invasion debuff |
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peddroelm
482
Apr 16, 2017 13:06:59 GMT
April 2017
peddroelm
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Post by peddroelm on Sept 1, 2017 7:21:56 GMT
took a look at the remnant armor seems to work as promised (the maximum values) but the formula for getting there doesn't appear to be linear .. The bonuses don't drop at once, they expire in stages like cryo beam debuff . Regardless - high ROF (siphon) weapon seems vastly superior at stacking the bonus compared to (puny damage/slow attack annimation) melee swings or power use (cooldown gated) .. More bricks towards Siphon Hurricane/Rozerad supremacy ..
no dR
SH, 506515, 125, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 361.804, -28.196
SH, 506953, 438, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 369.860, -20.140 // in cover
SH, 603781, 813, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 366.525, -23.475
SH, 603906, 125, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 366.926, -23.074
HP, 603937, 31, 92724F60, 783.750, 783.750, 294.968, -488.782
HP, 605375, 1438, 92724F60, 783.750, 783.750, 278.675, -505.075 // 400 * 1.2627 = 505.08
SH, 607015, 1640, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 368.390, -21.610
SH, 607140, 125, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 368.390, -21.610 // 20.14 * 1.4 /(1 + 0.30471) = 21.6109326977
SH, 1197156, 266, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 363.271, -26.729
SH, 1197296, 140, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 363.271, -26.729 // 1 MELEE
SH, 1180031, 141, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 362.380, -27.620 // 1 BULLET
x = 100*(28.196-27.620)/27.620 = 2.085445 // 24 BULLETS FOR MAX ?
x = 100*(28.196-26.729)/26.729 = 5.48842 // 10 Melee swings for max ?
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.5 / 9.11500)) = 26.729
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.5 / 24)) = 27.620
20.14* 1.4 /(1 + 0.5) = 18.7973 // OK ROZERAD FIRED A LOT
600 // 400 * 1.5
// had 50 max in fitness
// next test 50 Fortify DR
and max 90 DR in passive
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + 0.9) = 14.84 // max passive dr forti off
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + 0.9 + 0.5) = 11.748 // max DR passive + forti
25.662 - melee / (20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.9 / 9.11500)) = 25.6621
26.074 - snap freeze
27.177 - shockwave & bullet
// (20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.9 / 24)) = 27.1768
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.9 / 11.06)) = 26.074
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + 2*(0.9 / 24)) = 26.2288 // 2 bullets // doesn't match linear formula ..
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Nov 28, 2017 15:18:56 GMT
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N7Mith
To troll or not to pug, that's the question
1,178
Feb 16, 2017 16:17:11 GMT
February 2017
n7mith
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Mith0810
N7Mith
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Post by N7Mith on Sept 1, 2017 18:47:52 GMT
took a look at the remnant armor seems to work as promised (the maximum values) but the formula for getting there doesn't appear to be linear .. The bonuses don't drop at once, they expire in stages like cryo beam debuff . Regardless - high ROF (siphon) weapon seems vastly superior at stacking the bonus compared to (puny damage/slow attack annimation) melee swings or power use (cooldown gated) .. More bricks towards Siphon Hurricane/Rozerad supremacy ..
no dR
SH, 506515, 125, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 361.804, -28.196
SH, 506953, 438, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 369.860, -20.140 // in cover
SH, 603781, 813, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 366.525, -23.475
SH, 603906, 125, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 366.926, -23.074
HP, 603937, 31, 92724F60, 783.750, 783.750, 294.968, -488.782
HP, 605375, 1438, 92724F60, 783.750, 783.750, 278.675, -505.075 // 400 * 1.2627 = 505.08
SH, 607015, 1640, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 368.390, -21.610
SH, 607140, 125, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 368.390, -21.610 // 20.14 * 1.4 /(1 + 0.30471) = 21.6109326977
SH, 1197156, 266, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 363.271, -26.729
SH, 1197296, 140, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 363.271, -26.729 // 1 MELEE
SH, 1180031, 141, 8F4D9180, 390.000, 390.000, 362.380, -27.620 // 1 BULLET
x = 100*(28.196-27.620)/27.620 = 2.085445 // 24 BULLETS FOR MAX ?
x = 100*(28.196-26.729)/26.729 = 5.48842 // 10 Melee swings for max ?
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.5 / 9.11500)) = 26.729
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.5 / 24)) = 27.620
20.14* 1.4 /(1 + 0.5) = 18.7973 // OK ROZERAD FIRED A LOT
600 // 400 * 1.5
// had 50 max in fitness
// next test 50 Fortify DR
and max 90 DR in passive
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + 0.9) = 14.84 // max passive dr forti off
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + 0.9 + 0.5) = 11.748 // max DR passive + forti
25.662 - melee / (20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.9 / 9.11500)) = 25.6621
26.074 - snap freeze
27.177 - shockwave & bullet
// (20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.9 / 24)) = 27.1768
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + (0.9 / 11.06)) = 26.074
(20.14 * 1.4) / (1 + 2*(0.9 / 24)) = 26.2288 // 2 bullets // doesn't match linear formula ..
I don't know how to read these numbers. But your comment about rapid fire weapons says it's hit-based, not damage dealt. Have you determined the number of hits to max the bonus? And does it drop linearly on the intervals, or respective to prior accumulation? IE if you put out 10 hits in the first 0.5 sec, then 0.5 none, then 10 hits again. Do you see the drop in DR reflecting that? |
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Asker of Questions
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Aug 27, 2024 17:27:08 GMT
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JRandall0308
4,276
August 2016
jrandall0308
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by JRandall0308 on Sept 1, 2017 18:55:17 GMT
I tried to post this before but failed apparently -- all these situations where rapid-fire weapons are waaaaay better than single-shot weapons makes me wonder if... (a) Bioware designed it this way deliberately (i.e., "We want single-shot weapons to suck, therefor this is the design.") (  this is an unforeseen consequence of the design (i.e., "We designed it this way, therefor single-shot weapons suck.") |
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peddroelm
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Apr 16, 2017 13:06:59 GMT
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peddroelm
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Post by peddroelm on Sept 1, 2017 19:27:27 GMT
I don't know how to read these numbers. But your comment about rapid fire weapons says it's hit-based, not damage dealt. Have you determined the number of hits to max the bonus? And does it drop linearly on the intervals, or respective to prior accumulation? IE if you put out 10 hits in the first 0.5 sec, then 0.5 none, then 10 hits again. Do you see the drop in DR reflecting that? I did not test enough for more precise conclusions. And hard to measure current DR since the tutorial enemies don't shoot at your 100% of the time. Figured with the tests I did plus a bit of game files reading magic from Hello_Isaac I wouldn't have to. But he hasn't been on discord for a while .. Guess the easiest to do future test would be melee attack - this way we capture the damage increase per each swing up to max precisely and perhaps figure something out .. JRandall0308 rapid fire weapons are theoretically worse off vs 20/25 gold/plat DR but in practice .. |
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Nov 28, 2017 15:18:56 GMT
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N7Mith
To troll or not to pug, that's the question
1,178
Feb 16, 2017 16:17:11 GMT
February 2017
n7mith
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Mith0810
N7Mith
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Post by N7Mith on Sept 1, 2017 19:53:16 GMT
JRandall0308 rapid fire weapons are theoretically worse off vs 20/25 gold/plat DR but in practice .. Wait, are you saying that, after all this time and all these balance-changes... It's still unbalanced?   |
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vanelsa
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 905 Likes: 1,826
inherit
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0
1,826
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905
August 2016
vanelsa
Top
Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by vanelsa on Sept 1, 2017 23:03:08 GMT
Juggernaut’s Remnant Armor Rank 5B (Evasion) says +50% DR while Airborne and +100% DR while evading. Is this based off of base max DR (50) or does it account for the accumulated DR from Fortify?
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Nov 28, 2017 15:18:56 GMT
1,571
N7Mith
To troll or not to pug, that's the question
1,178
Feb 16, 2017 16:17:11 GMT
February 2017
n7mith
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Mith0810
N7Mith
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Post by N7Mith on Sept 1, 2017 23:58:04 GMT
Juggernaut’s Remnant Armor Rank 5B (Evasion) says +50% DR while Airborne and +100% DR while evading. Is this based off of base max DR (50) or does it account for the accumulated DR from Fortify? It stacks with other DR in place. It's not X% though. 100DR = 50%, 200 = 66.67%. As stupid as they present it, I get why they went for a formula instead of raw numbers. |
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The Joe-Man
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: BloodRed Thorne
Posts: 539 Likes: 1,414
inherit
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1,414
The Joe-Man
539
Sept 7, 2016 23:13:13 GMT
September 2016
thejoeman
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
BloodRed Thorne
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Post by The Joe-Man on Sept 2, 2017 8:55:28 GMT
The values for the Shorty are all wrong. Pre-release values maybe? Any idea where to find the correct values? I suppose people are kinda done with this game to invest time to test, anyway. Damage is 310 x 3 at I and 360 x 3 at level X. The rest of the values are correct. |
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toast
N2
Origin: toastmasta
Posts: 212 Likes: 225
inherit
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toast
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Apr 15, 2017 19:24:30 GMT
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toast
toastmasta
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Post by toast on Sept 2, 2017 17:19:42 GMT
Any idea where to find the correct values? I suppose people are kinda done with this game to invest time to test, anyway. Damage is 310 x 3 at I and 360 x 3 at level X. The rest of the values are correct. Cool, thanks |
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Jan 14, 2018 13:51:10 GMT
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zerkul
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Jun 24, 2017 19:51:08 GMT
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Post by zerkul on Oct 5, 2017 19:36:31 GMT
Can anyone test if Artificier's Defensive Drone triggers elemental tech debuff?
Also how does Sovoa works?
Z.
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iakona
N1
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: iakona1983
Posts: 13 Likes: 37
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iakona
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Aug 26, 2017 18:41:45 GMT
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iakona
Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
iakona1983
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Post by iakona on Oct 6, 2017 6:11:08 GMT
Can anyone test if Artificier's Defensive Drone triggers elemental tech debuff? Also how does Sovoa works? Z. Elemental Tech is triggered for the duration of the stun (1.5-3.3sec, depending on skill point allocation), but is cancelled on detonations. Sovoa fires a straight-line projectile which triggers a 3m radius spherical explosion from the point of impact that deals the listed damage (and applicable ammo primers) to all targets within the radius. |
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Evil
N3
Lurkin' since 24/02/2011
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Evil Mastered
PSN: Evil_Rurouni
Prime Posts: 2400
Prime Likes: 298
Posts: 464 Likes: 1,050
inherit
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0
Nov 23, 2024 22:42:55 GMT
1,050
Evil
Lurkin' since 24/02/2011
464
August 2016
evil
Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Evil Mastered
Evil_Rurouni
2400
298
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Post by Evil on Oct 6, 2017 21:15:43 GMT
Can anyone test if Artificier's Defensive Drone triggers elemental tech debuff? Also how does Sovoa works? Z. Elemental Tech is triggered for the duration of the stun (1.5-3.3sec, depending on skill point allocation), but is cancelled on detonations. Sovoa fires a straight-line projectile which triggers a 3m radius spherical explosion from the point of impact that deals the listed damage (and applicable ammo primers) to all targets within the radius. If memory serves at launch some of the AoE guns had issues with certain elemental ammo types, but I can't recall the specifics. I was expecting the Sovoa to be released with the same issues and never have them fixed because Biower. Am I going to be pleasantly surprised by it working as intended instead of "working as intended™" if I ever manage to unlock the damn thing? |
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Deerber
N3
Claymore & Drell
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
Origin: Deerber
Prime Posts: 16,870
Prime Likes: 7098
Posts: 594 Likes: 2,352
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2,352
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Claymore & Drell
594
August 2016
deerber
Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
Deerber
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Post by Deerber on Oct 19, 2017 1:33:47 GMT
Nice to see Peddro still fighting the good ol' number fight alongside some old names too. Keep up the good work guys, you rock!  |
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JulianVerse
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Jun 30, 2017 17:34:23 GMT
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Post by JulianVerse on Nov 7, 2017 23:55:43 GMT
Do ammo powers cancel out the debuff by warp?
TIA =)
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Apr 16, 2017 13:06:59 GMT
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Post by peddroelm on Nov 14, 2017 9:02:23 GMT
warp test results: 5b expose is broken - does nothing 6a escalation adds an additive bonus of 5 * (1 - CurHP/MaxHP) to the DOT ticks at the time the DOT tick is applied. Target needs to be at 0 HP to get the full 5 bonus. The vsarmor debuff works .. Detonator multiplier = 1  hurricane 2 66 base
gear 0.1 WD ; 0.2 BD
add-on 0.21 WD
Warp:
260 base_Impact
32 base_DPS
0.2 Armor debuff
-50% vs shields ..
detonator multiplier ?
// vs health
HP, 4297812, 16625, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 471.750, -312.000
// 260 * (1 + 0.2) = 312
HP, 4298312, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
(32/2) * (1 + 0.2) = 19.2
HP, 4298812, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4299312, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4299812, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4300312, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4300812, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4301312, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4301812, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4302453, 641, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4302937, 484, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4303453, 516, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4303937, 484, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4304437, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4304953, 516, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4305437, 484, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4305937, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4306437, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4306937, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4307437, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4307937, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4342781, 63, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 697.290, -86.460 // gun
// 66 * (1 + 0.1 + 0.21) = 86.46
-------------
add 35% impact and DOT damage evo
add vs armor multiplier 0.6
add 15% debuff vs all
vs health
HP, 5459187, 1116406, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 784.500, -403.000
// 260 * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) = 403
HP, 5459687, 500, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 1162.700, -24.800
// (32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) = 24.8
HP, 5460187, 500, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 1162.700, -24.800
HP, 5460687, 500, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 1162.700, -24.800
HP, 5461187, 500, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 1162.700, -24.800
// EXPOSE NOT APPLIED TO WARP's OWN DOT !
vs shields
SH, 5695296, 2609, 9952B6A0, 2375.000, 2375.000, 2173.500, -201.500
// 260 * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) * (1 - 0.5) = 201.5
SH, 5695781, 485, 9952B6A0, 2375.000, 2173.500, 2161.100, -12.400
// (32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) * (1 - 0.5) = 12.4
SH, 5696281, 500, 9952B6A0, 2375.000, 2161.100, 2148.700, -12.400
SH, 5696781, 500, 9952B6A0, 2375.000, 2148.700, 2136.300, -12.400
The -50% vs_Shields is a big deal .. Ends up beeing *0.5 vs shields multiplier for both impact and DOT ..
Test gun vs health (15% debuff)
HP, 6084046, 7031, 95002C20, 2375.000, 2375.000, 1972.000, -403.000
HP, 6084546, 500, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1972.000, 1947.200, -24.800
HP, 6085046, 500, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1947.200, 1922.400, -24.800
HP, 6085250, 204, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1922.400, 1835.940, -86.460
HP, 6085312, 62, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1835.940, 1749.480, -86.460
HP, 6085375, 63, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1749.480, 1663.020, -86.460
YUP! EXPOSE IS BROKEN (does nothing )
test warp and then warp + gun vs armor
HP, 6169093, 62, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 6007.131, 5940.671, -66.460
// gun -20 armor DR
HP, 6169171, 78, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 5940.671, 5874.211, -66.460
HP, 6169234, 63, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 5874.211, 5807.751, -66.460
// warp vs armor
HP, 6251734, 11969, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 7600.000, 6955.200, -644.800
// 260 * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) * (1 + 0.6) = 644.8
HP, 6252234, 500, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 7600.000, 7552.384, -47.616
// (32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2 ) * (1 + 0.6) * (1 + 0.2) = 47.616
HP, 6252734, 500, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 7600.000, 7552.384, -47.616
// gun vs warp debuffed armor
HP, 6180765, 62, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3889.802, 3806.050, -83.752
HP, 6180828, 63, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3806.050, 3722.298, -83.752
HP, 6180906, 78, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3722.298, 3638.546, -83.752
HP, 6180968, 62, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3638.546, 3554.794, -83.752
HP, 6181031, 63, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3554.794, 3471.042, -83.752
// 66 * (1 + 0.1 + 0.21) * (1 + 0.2 ) - 20 = 83.752
==========================
Moving on to the good stuff
healing between ticks - no bonus
HP, 7343859, 473297, 94445EC0, 783.750, 783.750, 380.750, -403.000
HP, 7344359, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 783.750, 758.950, -24.800
HP, 7344859, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 783.750, 758.950, -24.800
HP, 6868062, 224922, 9A105F80, 783.750, 783.750, 380.750, -403.000 // curhp/total hp damage bonus
HP, 6868562, 500, 9A105F80, 783.750, 380.750, 314.814, -65.936 // 0.4858
HP, 6869062, 500, 9A105F80, 783.750, 314.814, 242.149, -72.666 // 0.4016 // 2.9915
HP, 6869562, 500, 9A105F80, 783.750, 242.149, 162.066, -80.083 // 0.309 // ~ 3.5
HP, 6870062, 500, 9A105F80, 783.750, 162.066, 73.808, -88.257 // 0.2067 //
HP, 7816875, 72797, 94445EC0, 783.750, 598.938, 195.938, -403.000
HP, 7817375, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 195.938, 111.137, -84.800 // 0.25
HP, 7817875, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 111.137, 17.682, -93.456
HP, 7818375, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 17.682, 0.000, -17.682
(32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2 + 5 * (1 - 0.25)) = 84.8
(32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2 + (5 * (1 - (111.13700 / 783.75)))) = 93.4558 |
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inherit
Ohm's Law Compels You
207
0
19,211
Qui-Gon GlenN7
In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. In practice there is.
5,762
August 2016
quigonglenn
Bottom
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Jade Empire
qui_gon_glenn
2108
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Nov 14, 2017 18:48:51 GMT
I tried to post this before but failed apparently -- all these situations where rapid-fire weapons are waaaaay better than single-shot weapons makes me wonder if... (a) Bioware designed it this way deliberately (i.e., "We want single-shot weapons to suck, therefor this is the design.") ( this is an unforeseen consequence of the design (i.e., "We designed it this way, therefor single-shot weapons suck.") It has to be B. A would require planning. |
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Evil
N3
Lurkin' since 24/02/2011
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Evil Mastered
PSN: Evil_Rurouni
Prime Posts: 2400
Prime Likes: 298
Posts: 464 Likes: 1,050
inherit
181
0
Nov 23, 2024 22:42:55 GMT
1,050
Evil
Lurkin' since 24/02/2011
464
August 2016
evil
Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Evil Mastered
Evil_Rurouni
2400
298
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Post by Evil on Nov 14, 2017 22:07:20 GMT
warp test results: 5b expose is broken - does nothing 6a escalation adds an additive bonus of 5 * (1 - CurHP/MaxHP) to the DOT ticks at the time the DOT tick is applied. Target needs to be at 0 HP to get the full 5 bonus. The vsarmor debuff works .. Detonator multiplier = 1 hurricane 2 66 base
gear 0.1 WD ; 0.2 BD
add-on 0.21 WD
Warp:
260 base_Impact
32 base_DPS
0.2 Armor debuff
-50% vs shields ..
detonator multiplier ?
// vs health
HP, 4297812, 16625, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 471.750, -312.000
// 260 * (1 + 0.2) = 312
HP, 4298312, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
(32/2) * (1 + 0.2) = 19.2
HP, 4298812, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4299312, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4299812, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4300312, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4300812, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4301312, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4301812, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4302453, 641, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4302937, 484, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4303453, 516, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4303937, 484, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4304437, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4304953, 516, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4305437, 484, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4305937, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4306437, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4306937, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4307437, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4307937, 500, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 764.550, -19.200
HP, 4342781, 63, 98AB1CB0, 783.750, 783.750, 697.290, -86.460 // gun
// 66 * (1 + 0.1 + 0.21) = 86.46
-------------
add 35% impact and DOT damage evo
add vs armor multiplier 0.6
add 15% debuff vs all
vs health
HP, 5459187, 1116406, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 784.500, -403.000
// 260 * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) = 403
HP, 5459687, 500, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 1162.700, -24.800
// (32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) = 24.8
HP, 5460187, 500, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 1162.700, -24.800
HP, 5460687, 500, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 1162.700, -24.800
HP, 5461187, 500, 8C52E9C0, 1187.500, 1187.500, 1162.700, -24.800
// EXPOSE NOT APPLIED TO WARP's OWN DOT !
vs shields
SH, 5695296, 2609, 9952B6A0, 2375.000, 2375.000, 2173.500, -201.500
// 260 * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) * (1 - 0.5) = 201.5
SH, 5695781, 485, 9952B6A0, 2375.000, 2173.500, 2161.100, -12.400
// (32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) * (1 - 0.5) = 12.4
SH, 5696281, 500, 9952B6A0, 2375.000, 2161.100, 2148.700, -12.400
SH, 5696781, 500, 9952B6A0, 2375.000, 2148.700, 2136.300, -12.400
The -50% vs_Shields is a big deal .. Ends up beeing *0.5 vs shields multiplier for both impact and DOT ..
Test gun vs health (15% debuff)
HP, 6084046, 7031, 95002C20, 2375.000, 2375.000, 1972.000, -403.000
HP, 6084546, 500, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1972.000, 1947.200, -24.800
HP, 6085046, 500, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1947.200, 1922.400, -24.800
HP, 6085250, 204, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1922.400, 1835.940, -86.460
HP, 6085312, 62, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1835.940, 1749.480, -86.460
HP, 6085375, 63, 95002C20, 2375.000, 1749.480, 1663.020, -86.460
YUP! EXPOSE IS BROKEN (does nothing )
test warp and then warp + gun vs armor
HP, 6169093, 62, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 6007.131, 5940.671, -66.460
// gun -20 armor DR
HP, 6169171, 78, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 5940.671, 5874.211, -66.460
HP, 6169234, 63, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 5874.211, 5807.751, -66.460
// warp vs armor
HP, 6251734, 11969, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 7600.000, 6955.200, -644.800
// 260 * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2) * (1 + 0.6) = 644.8
HP, 6252234, 500, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 7600.000, 7552.384, -47.616
// (32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2 ) * (1 + 0.6) * (1 + 0.2) = 47.616
HP, 6252734, 500, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 7600.000, 7552.384, -47.616
// gun vs warp debuffed armor
HP, 6180765, 62, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3889.802, 3806.050, -83.752
HP, 6180828, 63, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3806.050, 3722.298, -83.752
HP, 6180906, 78, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3722.298, 3638.546, -83.752
HP, 6180968, 62, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3638.546, 3554.794, -83.752
HP, 6181031, 63, 9BFA7DF0, 7600.000, 3554.794, 3471.042, -83.752
// 66 * (1 + 0.1 + 0.21) * (1 + 0.2 ) - 20 = 83.752
==========================
Moving on to the good stuff
healing between ticks - no bonus
HP, 7343859, 473297, 94445EC0, 783.750, 783.750, 380.750, -403.000
HP, 7344359, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 783.750, 758.950, -24.800
HP, 7344859, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 783.750, 758.950, -24.800
HP, 6868062, 224922, 9A105F80, 783.750, 783.750, 380.750, -403.000 // curhp/total hp damage bonus
HP, 6868562, 500, 9A105F80, 783.750, 380.750, 314.814, -65.936 // 0.4858
HP, 6869062, 500, 9A105F80, 783.750, 314.814, 242.149, -72.666 // 0.4016 // 2.9915
HP, 6869562, 500, 9A105F80, 783.750, 242.149, 162.066, -80.083 // 0.309 // ~ 3.5
HP, 6870062, 500, 9A105F80, 783.750, 162.066, 73.808, -88.257 // 0.2067 //
HP, 7816875, 72797, 94445EC0, 783.750, 598.938, 195.938, -403.000
HP, 7817375, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 195.938, 111.137, -84.800 // 0.25
HP, 7817875, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 111.137, 17.682, -93.456
HP, 7818375, 500, 94445EC0, 783.750, 17.682, 0.000, -17.682
(32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2 + 5 * (1 - 0.25)) = 84.8
(32 / 2) * (1 + 0.35 + 0.2 + (5 * (1 - (111.13700 / 783.75)))) = 93.4558 There is one final test to do if you're feeling machocistic. Does 5B duration increase the total damage done, thus keeping the DPS the same, or does it keep the total damage done the same, thus lowering the DPS? Duration actually lowered warps DPS in me3mp IIRC, making it a self inflicted nerf on people who used it. If it's the same in meAmp I'd rather use the non-functioning evo. |
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KrrKs
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: KrrKs
Posts: 781 Likes: 2,233
inherit
678
0
Nov 23, 2024 18:50:14 GMT
2,233
KrrKs
781
August 2016
krrks
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
KrrKs
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Post by KrrKs on Nov 14, 2017 22:51:21 GMT
[snip] Does 5B duration increase the total damage done, thus keeping the DPS the same, or does it keep the total damage done the same, thus lowering the DPS? Duration actually lowered warps DPS in me3mp IIRC, making it a self inflicted nerf on people who used it. If it's the same in meAmp I'd rather use the non-functioning evo. Wasn't that the Collector's Annihilation sphere with the bugged duration evo? Anyway, looking at the files right now, the warp duration evo is applied at the same spot where all biotic duration modifiers (from passives and such) are applied, while the DPS part is applied as 'DamagePerSecond' statement. Unless that is interpreted vastly differently than it should, the DPS stays the same while duration increases. |
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Evil
N3
Lurkin' since 24/02/2011
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
XBL Gamertag: Evil Mastered
PSN: Evil_Rurouni
Prime Posts: 2400
Prime Likes: 298
Posts: 464 Likes: 1,050
inherit
181
0
Nov 23, 2024 22:42:55 GMT
1,050
Evil
Lurkin' since 24/02/2011
464
August 2016
evil
Mass Effect Trilogy, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda
Evil Mastered
Evil_Rurouni
2400
298
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Post by Evil on Nov 15, 2017 2:29:33 GMT
[snip] Does 5B duration increase the total damage done, thus keeping the DPS the same, or does it keep the total damage done the same, thus lowering the DPS? Duration actually lowered warps DPS in me3mp IIRC, making it a self inflicted nerf on people who used it. If it's the same in meAmp I'd rather use the non-functioning evo. Wasn't that the Collector's Annihilation sphere with the bugged duration evo? Anyway, looking at the files right now, the warp duration evo is applied at the same spot where all biotic duration modifiers (from passives and such) are applied, while the DPS part is applied as 'DamagePerSecond' statement. Unless that is interpreted vastly differently than it should, the DPS stays the same while duration increases. This wasn't a bug in me3mp's warp per se, just bad design. It had a damage value that was divided by the duration to work out the DPS. Increasing the total damage by 40% and increasing the duration by 60% had the overall effect of reducing the DPS if you took the 5b lasting damage warp. Sounds like meAmp has DPS as the default stat with total damage the derived stat unlike me3mp, so duration should be working properly as opposed to "working as intended"™. |
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inherit
7709
0
1,423
peddroelm
482
Apr 16, 2017 13:06:59 GMT
April 2017
peddroelm
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Post by peddroelm on Nov 15, 2017 2:52:21 GMT
extra duration is VERY good damage wise in two conditions :
1) target still alive and at lower HP to boot
2) warp hasn't been detonated ? (haven't tested - none of the new kits have detonators ?) but remember - detonating incinerate and incendiary CANCELs their DOT s ..
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inherit
7709
0
1,423
peddroelm
482
Apr 16, 2017 13:06:59 GMT
April 2017
peddroelm
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Post by peddroelm on Nov 15, 2017 8:30:41 GMT
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inherit
115
0
2,714
capn233
1,708
August 2016
capn233
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by capn233 on Jan 21, 2019 2:06:48 GMT
I was looking at SP ammos and ran across something interesting with Cryo Ammo. The SP consumable does in fact apply a 1.5x multiplier for weapon damage against armor, but it is not applied to the weapon while Cryo Ammo is active. So basically you have to switch to another weapon or let the Cryo Ammo expire (3 mags). Also interestingly, it seemed to apply a 1.5x multiplier for powers and melee against chilled armor. Used Nova, Overload and Omniblade.
Both multipliers increased with Brittle Freeze evolution of Cryo Beam amusingly enough. 1.5x base was there with no points in CB.
May need to test CA in MP with party weapons if it wasn't done way back when. Oh and it didn't cancel Cryo Beam debuff there either, but the weapon with Cryo Ammo could not take advantage of it (until CA expired). |
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this is an unforeseen consequence of the design (i.e., "We designed it this way, therefor single-shot weapons suck.")
