Andraste_Reborn
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Post by Andraste_Reborn on Oct 23, 2017 22:19:25 GMT
I think Iron Bull is hot like burning.
(And that is all I have to contribute to this discussion.)
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Post by dmc1001 on Oct 23, 2017 22:20:53 GMT
They retconned Asari lore to add gender pronoun political propaganda into Mass Effect Andromeda. Everything in Mass Effect 1,2,3 shows that Asari have female minds. The lore specifically states they have maternal instincts. Aria says the word patriarch has no meaning to her people. Samara says Asari have no males. The term fathered only means to provide the DNA, that's it. There is no way to justify the pronoun gender usage. It needed to be explained more. If they put some heart & soul behind the explanation I would've accepted it, but they didn't put any effort into it. Leaving aside that concept of a "female mind," which Bio waffled on in the trilogy if they ever believed it, one of the things you're ignoring is that races adopting cultural traits from other races is a thing in ME:A. For instance, a Hyperion crewmember adopts a quarian-style "vas Hyperion" surname. (What would the difference be between an asari with maternal instincts and an asari with paternal instincts?) I would have bought this if 600 years had passed in lived time for those asari. I can imagine newer races on the scene having impact over time. 30 years doesn't cut it.
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Post by nvanfleet on Oct 23, 2017 22:43:10 GMT
<snip> I honestly think if Cassandra had long hair nobody would complain. She has gorgeous sensual eyes. With Josephine I think it's mostly that god awful outfit. It's hideous. Also maybe her personality and very tame romance.</snip> I was just thinking these things. They're both extremely striking women! Josie's outfit is completely f'ing ridiculous, though, which makes it hard to see her that way. Character-wise, though, I think their visual "flaws" are *extremely* fitting for them. Cassandra has no time for Noble BS, she's a warrior and she grooms herself accordingly. Josephine is dressed, one imagines, to some sort of particular (or peculiar, ymmv) fashion - but it also distracts you away from paying attention to her face or her body; she's a diplomat and it's her words that matter -- nevermind the fact that she's trying to maintain her family's estate and, romantic ideation aside, seems to think of anything about her own wants and needs as superfluous.
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Post by river82 on Oct 23, 2017 23:25:30 GMT
Witcher 3 sold 10+ million copies and I'm pretty sure it had a lot to do with how beautiful Yennefer, Triss & Ciri were. I agree sexualization alone isn't enough to sell a game, but it's the icing on the cake that can propel a game into massive sales. I strongly believe this. It completes the formula needed for massive sales. Think it also had an already large built in audience from the books. In Poland maybe, however before the games were released the english audience for the books were almost non-existent. The games made the books more popular, not the other way around (despite what a certain extremely bitter author may think.)
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Post by shinary on Oct 23, 2017 23:29:00 GMT
Is there any evidence that Bioware is politically correct? They retconned Asari lore to add gender pronoun political propaganda into Mass Effect Andromeda. Everything in Mass Effect 1,2,3 shows that Asari have female minds. The lore specifically states they have maternal instincts. Aria says the word patriarch has no meaning to her people. Samara says Asari have no males. The term fathered only means to provide the DNA, that's it. There is no way to justify the pronoun gender usage. It needed to be explained more. If they put some heart & soul behind the explanation I would've accepted it, but they didn't put any effort into it. I hate to burst your bubble, but do you remember Liara's father? She was as burly as a Krogan, when she spoke - and AWESOME! So this masculinity was part of the original series as well.
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Post by river82 on Oct 23, 2017 23:43:16 GMT
In Poland maybe, however before the games were released the english audience for the books were almost non-existent. The games made the books more popular, not the other way around (despite what a certain extremely bitter author may think.) Thanks. Huh, I didn't know that I thought the games were made because the books were so popular. Even when W3 came out though? By W3 I so wanted to see Yennifer in game because of the books and was happy she was finally in W3. Well, his books weren't even released in English until 2008. Now if you go to novelrank, which is a site that purports to track the sale figures of books on Amazon, and you paste in the Amazon URL to the 2008 novel "the last wish", you get a chart something like this: 2015 was when the Witcher 3 was released. This chart might not be 100% accurate but I think the trend tells the story, book sales shot up based on the game
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Post by river82 on Oct 23, 2017 23:53:20 GMT
OK thanks, I wasn't doubting you. I was surprised that's all. After W3 came out I think is when I got the last 2 books in English. I still haven't read any of the books I've been meaning too, just haven't had the time. Too much to play/read/watch, so little time to do it all
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Post by shinary on Oct 23, 2017 23:58:38 GMT
<snip> I honestly think if Cassandra had long hair nobody would complain. She has gorgeous sensual eyes. With Josephine I think it's mostly that god awful outfit. It's hideous. Also maybe her personality and very tame romance.</snip> I was just thinking these things. They're both extremely striking women! Josie's outfit is completely f'ing ridiculous, though, which makes it hard to see her that way. Character-wise, though, I think their visual "flaws" are *extremely* fitting for them. Cassandra has no time for Noble BS, she's a warrior and she grooms herself accordingly. Josephine is dressed, one imagines, to some sort of particular (or peculiar, ymmv) fashion - but it also distracts you away from paying attention to her face or her body; she's a diplomat and it's her words that matter -- nevermind the fact that she's trying to maintain her family's estate and, romantic ideation aside, seems to think of anything about her own wants and needs as superfluous. It also has something to do with how the antivans view women and their roles from what I remember. As I recall antivan noble women are expected to be very modest in their appearance. Josephines outfit is horrible though, but I think it is largely the colours that does it.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Oct 24, 2017 0:20:41 GMT
With Josephine I think it's mostly that god awful outfit. It's hideous. Also maybe her personality and very tame romance. Meanwhile I loved all those things. <snip> I honestly think if Cassandra had long hair nobody would complain. She has gorgeous sensual eyes. With Josephine I think it's mostly that god awful outfit. It's hideous. Also maybe her personality and very tame romance.</snip> I was just thinking these things. They're both extremely striking women! Josie's outfit is completely f'ing ridiculous, though, which makes it hard to see her that way. Character-wise, though, I think their visual "flaws" are *extremely* fitting for them. Cassandra has no time for Noble BS, she's a warrior and she grooms herself accordingly. Josephine is dressed, one imagines, to some sort of particular (or peculiar, ymmv) fashion - but it also distracts you away from paying attention to her face or her body; she's a diplomat and it's her words that matter -- nevermind the fact that she's trying to maintain her family's estate and, romantic ideation aside, seems to think of anything about her own wants and needs as superfluous. I agree with your reasoning for why it fits the characters. It also has something to do with how the antivans view women and their roles from what I remember. As I recall antivan noble women are expected to be very modest in their appearance. Josephines outfit is horrible though, but I think it is largely the colours that does it. From the wiki: Women have strictly defined roles in Antiva. They are considered pure and delicate and not allowed to participate in combat, among other things. However it's fairer to say this is an Antivan ideal of femininity which does not always match up well with the reality.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Oct 24, 2017 7:09:18 GMT
With Josephine I think it's mostly that god awful outfit. It's hideous. Also maybe her personality and very tame romance. Meanwhile I loved all those things. I like Josephine a lot too. Never found her boring. And the outfit is fitting for her role and personality. But she's not the kind of love interest that turns heads that's for sure.
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Post by alanc9 on Oct 24, 2017 15:32:34 GMT
Leaving aside that concept of a "female mind," which Bio waffled on in the trilogy if they ever believed it, one of the things you're ignoring is that races adopting cultural traits from other races is a thing in ME:A. For instance, a Hyperion crewmember adopts a quarian-style "vas Hyperion" surname. (What would the difference be between an asari with maternal instincts and an asari with paternal instincts?) I would have bought this if 600 years had passed in lived time for those asari. I can imagine newer races on the scene having impact over time. 30 years doesn't cut it. Agreed. I'm just saying that he was talking about the wrong problem. (I actually wasn't too happy with ME1's world-building in this regard either, but ME:A made it worse.)
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2017 15:49:27 GMT
Both Cullen and Solas suffer from exactly same issue as Cassandra. The Frostbight’s making skin texture way too shiny to bring up the shine in cloth and metal, and the inexplicably bad chosen skin tones and overal faded look of characters as well as terryfing hair texture. Just like Cassandra, Solas and Cullen both become attractive looking by the moders simply retexturing the skin on exact same model to eliminate the stupid shine and brighten up the colours. And, well, give Solas skull stubble. I am sure the same applies to Sera. Those tiny changes -which are the same for both sexes of NPCs- make all companions better looking.
But, it doesn’t even matter, because apparently Witcher 3 as you guys say it uglified Getalt’s waifus and apparently it did not reflect negatively on its popularity.
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Post by phoray on Oct 24, 2017 15:55:31 GMT
Thanks. Huh, I didn't know that I thought the games were made because the books were so popular. Even when W3 came out though? By W3 I so wanted to see Yennifer in game because of the books and was happy she was finally in W3. Well, his books weren't even released in English until 2008. Now if you go to novelrank, which is a site that purports to track the sale figures of books on Amazon, and you paste in the Amazon URL to the 2008 novel "the last wish", you get a chart something like this: 2015 was when the Witcher 3 was released. This chart might not be 100% accurate but I think the trend tells the story, book sales shot up based on the game Amazon is American based? Definitely not polish. Unless you're only arguing about American popularity of the books. The Geralt series of books were popular in Poland the way the Tolkien books were popular here. CDPR original owners and writer's were big fans of the books. Bought rights. Made a game. Which renewed the books popularity.
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Post by fylimar on Oct 24, 2017 17:37:09 GMT
Well, his books weren't even released in English until 2008. Now if you go to novelrank, which is a site that purports to track the sale figures of books on Amazon, and you paste in the Amazon URL to the 2008 novel "the last wish", you get a chart something like this: 2015 was when the Witcher 3 was released. This chart might not be 100% accurate but I think the trend tells the story, book sales shot up based on the game Amazon is American based? Definitely not polish. Unless you're only arguing about American popularity of the books. The Geralt series of books were popular in Poland the way the Tolkien books were popular here. CDPR original owners and writer's were big fans of the books. Bought rights. Made a game. Which renewed the books popularity. Not only in Poland. The author of the witcher books has a huge fanbase in Germany and some other european countries - before the games and some Geralt novels got translated before the games came out. I knew the books (haven't read them yet though), but not the games, until a friend got me the first two TW games as a birthday gift. I didn't get too far into the game, since I hate playing a character, I can't create (apart from Sherlock Holmes, I love playing Sherlock Holmes mysteries - and Guybrush Threepwood of course ... oh and Rincewind, but that's it )
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Post by phoray on Oct 24, 2017 17:41:13 GMT
Amazon is American based? Definitely not polish. Unless you're only arguing about American popularity of the books. The Geralt series of books were popular in Poland the way the Tolkien books were popular here. CDPR original owners and writer's were big fans of the books. Bought rights. Made a game. Which renewed the books popularity. Not only in Poland. The author of the witcher books has a huge fanbase in Germany and some other european countries - before the games. I knew the books (haven't read them yet though), but not the games, until a friend got me the first two TW games as a birthday gift. I didn't get too far into the game, since I hate playing a character, I can't create (apart from Sherlock Holmes, I love playing Sherlock Holmes mysteries - and Guybrush Threepwood of course ... oh and Rincewind, but that's it ) Amazon didn't exist until 1994. The Witcher Book Series started in the mid 80s That graph can't cover all the sales of the books is all I'm saying.
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Post by fylimar on Oct 24, 2017 17:50:39 GMT
Not only in Poland. The author of the witcher books has a huge fanbase in Germany and some other european countries - before the games. I knew the books (haven't read them yet though), but not the games, until a friend got me the first two TW games as a birthday gift. I didn't get too far into the game, since I hate playing a character, I can't create (apart from Sherlock Holmes, I love playing Sherlock Holmes mysteries - and Guybrush Threepwood of course ... oh and Rincewind, but that's it ) Amazon didn't exist until 1994. The Witcher Book Series started in the mid 80s That graph can't cover all the sales of the books is all I'm saying. Oh, I wasn't looking at the graph, it might be, that I did quote the wrong post - it was about the statement, that the author and fandom was only known in Poland - sorry for the confusion
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Post by alanc9 on Oct 24, 2017 18:33:47 GMT
river82 specifically was talking about how, for English versions only, games drove book sales rather than the other way around. Pre-2008 doesn't enter into that since there weren't any translations
Those Canadian sales are huge, aren't they?
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Post by shechinah on Oct 24, 2017 18:41:19 GMT
It also has something to do with how the antivans view women and their roles from what I remember. As I recall antivan noble women are expected to be very modest in their appearance. Josephines outfit is horrible though, but I think it is largely the colours that does it. From the wiki: Women have strictly defined roles in Antiva. They are considered pure and delicate and not allowed to participate in combat, among other things. However it's fairer to say this is an Antivan ideal of femininity which does not always match up well with the reality. Oriana: "In Antiva, a woman fighting in battle would be ... unthinkable." Fergus: "Is that so? I always heard Antivan women were dangerous." Oriana: "With kind words and poison only, my husband." Fergus: "This from the woman who serves me my tea." It's the Silk Hiding Steel trope, basically.
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Post by nvanfleet on Oct 24, 2017 19:18:30 GMT
Oriana: "In Antiva, a woman fighting in battle would be ... unthinkable." Fergus: "Is that so? I always heard Antivan women were dangerous." Oriana: "With kind words and poison only, my husband." Fergus: "This from the woman who serves me my tea." It's the Silk Hiding Steel trope, basically. ... Damn I miss the Couslands.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Oct 24, 2017 22:11:51 GMT
From the wiki: Women have strictly defined roles in Antiva. They are considered pure and delicate and not allowed to participate in combat, among other things. However it's fairer to say this is an Antivan ideal of femininity which does not always match up well with the reality. Oriana: "In Antiva, a woman fighting in battle would be ... unthinkable." Fergus: "Is that so? I always heard Antivan women were dangerous." Oriana: "With kind words and poison only, my husband." Fergus: "This from the woman who serves me my tea." It's the Silk Hiding Steel trope, basically. I remember Bioware even used that trope when describing Josephine before release in the interview: [DA]: As a noblewoman, she seems to bring a different set of skills to the Inquisition. What is her primary area of expertise? [SF]: Diplomacy. Josephine has worked for years as an ambassador in the royal courts in Thedas. She’s very familiar with Orlesian politics, which comes in handy. She’s an excellent mediator and speaker. Crucially, she knows just how hard it can be to change people’s minds, and how much someone’s ego is tangled up in being “right”. Josephine prefers to gently steer people into agreement whenever possible, but she’ll take a stand when needed. There’s occasionally an iron fist beneath that velvet glove.
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Post by nvanfleet on Oct 24, 2017 22:38:05 GMT
Hell, she even intimates as such - mentioning her prior history as a Bard who only turned away from getting her hands dirty in the Great Game because of accidentally killing someone she thought was a friend.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Oct 24, 2017 22:44:58 GMT
Hell, she even intimates as such - mentioning her prior history as a Bard who only turned away from getting her hands dirty in the Great Game because of accidentally killing someone she thought was a friend. Yeah, though her career as a bard was vastly different than Leliana's. According to Cole and clarified by her writer, Josephine as a bard utilized dancing, playing a musical instrument, and making polite conversation whereas Leliana used those as well as seduction and murder.
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Post by nvanfleet on Oct 24, 2017 22:48:52 GMT
Hell, she even intimates as such - mentioning her prior history as a Bard who only turned away from getting her hands dirty in the Great Game because of accidentally killing someone she thought was a friend. Yeah, though her career as a bard was vastly different than Leliana's. According to Cole and clarified by her writer, Josephine as a bard utilized dancing, playing a musical instrument, and making polite conversation whereas Leliana used those as well as seduction and murder. For sure - the way she describes the one fight she was in that lead to that guy's death, she sounded like she was so unhappy about it even getting into a physical fight in the first place. I wish Leliana's hardening/softening from DAO actually had any impact on DAI, instead of having to go through the whole process again. At least she's over all, in comparison, better written than Liara. Leliana is at least consistently inconsistent and kinda crazy.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Oct 24, 2017 22:54:30 GMT
Yeah, though her career as a bard was vastly different than Leliana's. According to Cole and clarified by her writer, Josephine as a bard utilized dancing, playing a musical instrument, and making polite conversation whereas Leliana used those as well as seduction and murder. For sure - the way she describes the one fight she was in that lead to that guy's death, she sounded like she was so unhappy about it even getting into a physical fight in the first place. I wish Leliana's hardening/softening from DAO actually had any impact on DAI, instead of having to go through the whole process again. At least she's over all, in comparison, better written than Liara. Leliana is at least consistently inconsistent and kinda crazy. "Don't question me. I am a woman, and I reserve the right to be inconsistent." - Leliana in DAO. As for Josephine, yeah. She never liked violence in the first place, but that incident is what motivated her to become a pacifist and always try to find peaceful solutions thus part of what made her a great ambassador.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2017 21:32:54 GMT
nice warfare you got here.
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