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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2019 23:42:01 GMT
The Batarians knew who destroyed the relay... we are told as much in ME3 when we encounter Balak or his stand in (if Balak is killed in ME1) and the other wounded Batarian whose life support we can decide to turn off (forget his name). The Batarians were simply not strong enough to challenge even such a horrific act by launching an open attack on the Alliance without the support of the other Citadel races. You mean they knew shepard did it? Well that is why they arrested shepard. 1) It is possible that Shepard didn't do it; that is, if the player does not play the DLC. In that case, an Alliance team did it. Regardless, the Batarians know either way.
2) Shepard was not arrested by the Batarians, if that's what you're thinking. Shepard clearly turned himself/herself into the Alliance (if the DLC has been completed) because Hackett expressly asks thiat he/she show up when called to face the music (with his/her dress blues on). If the Alliance team destroys the Relay, it's a little unclear as to what exactly happens... whether or not Shepard is arrested somehow or whether he/she just shows up not expecting anything to happen or whether or not he/she develops a guilty conscience for working with Cerberus and decides to turn himself/herself in. In either case, Shepard istates that the Alliance grounded him/her and took away his/her ship. If the DLC has been completed, Anderson will say it was because Shepard destroyed the relay. If the DLC was not completed by the player, then Anderson just says that it is "for all the Sh*t" Shepard has done.
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Post by melbella on Mar 31, 2019 0:32:20 GMT
If the DLC was not completed by the player, then Anderson just says that it is "for all the Sh*t" Shepard has done. Yeah, dying and having your body stolen is bad for your career. Apparently so is saving human colonists from being turned into goo.
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Post by dmc1001 on Mar 31, 2019 1:28:11 GMT
Is there anything about Mass Effect that you like, I wonder? I've never seen anything to suggest mike doesn't like ME. What I have mostly seen is a desire for Shepard having more agency. Being able to make more choices, like getting rid of unwanted squadmates or being able to ask more questions. At least, that's how I see things.
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Post by garrusfan1 on Mar 31, 2019 1:46:06 GMT
You mean they knew shepard did it? Well that is why they arrested shepard. 1) It is possible that Shepard didn't do it; that is, if the player does not play the DLC. In that case, an Alliance team did it. Regardless, the Batarians know either way.
2) Shepard was not arrested by the Batarians, if that's what you're thinking. Shepard clearly turned himself/herself into the Alliance (if the DLC has been completed) because Hackett expressly asks thiat he/she show up when called to face the music (with his/her dress blues on). If the Alliance team destroys the Relay, it's a little unclear as to what exactly happens... whether or not Shepard is arrested somehow or whether he/she just shows up not expecting anything to happen or whether or not he/she develops a guilty conscience for working with Cerberus and decides to turn himself/herself in. In either case, Shepard istates that the Alliance grounded him/her and took away his/her ship. If the DLC has been completed, Anderson will say it was because Shepard destroyed the relay. If the DLC was not completed by the player, then Anderson just says that it is "for all the Sh*t" Shepard has done.
When does anderson say that? I always did the dlc so I don't know.
However I wasn't saying that the batarians arrested shepard I know shepard turned himself into the alliance. I agree that if you didn't do the arrival dlc then shepard turning himself in makes no sense. However I always play the dlc so I never realized that. I thought that if you didn't do the arrival dlc then shepard just did it off screen.
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 31, 2019 2:16:41 GMT
Is there anything about Mass Effect that you like, I wonder? So because I mention some things I don't like it causes you to ask that question? If there was nothing I liked, I wouldn't have played the trilogy more than once. Same here.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2019 2:19:34 GMT
Is there anything about Mass Effect that you like, I wonder? I've never seen anything to suggest mike doesn't like ME. What I have mostly seen is a desire for Shepard having more agency. Being able to make more choices, like getting rid of unwanted squadmates or being able to ask more questions. At least, that's how I see things. Recently, everything has been so negative on this thread. I was trying to get things onto a more positive track... speculating about Bioware continuing to do things we like about ME rather than always focusing on what each of us feels Bioware has done wrong. Also, Shepard's story is done... he/she is not getting more agency without a rewrite of the OT. I refuse to believe that a rewrite of the OT is the ONLY ME game the fans will allow Bioware to produce. If that's the bottom line, then the fans are being totally unreasonable IMO... and we have nothing further to discuss.
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Post by dazk on Mar 31, 2019 3:00:22 GMT
1) It is possible that Shepard didn't do it; that is, if the player does not play the DLC. In that case, an Alliance team did it. Regardless, the Batarians know either way.
2) Shepard was not arrested by the Batarians, if that's what you're thinking. Shepard clearly turned himself/herself into the Alliance (if the DLC has been completed) because Hackett expressly asks thiat he/she show up when called to face the music (with his/her dress blues on). If the Alliance team destroys the Relay, it's a little unclear as to what exactly happens... whether or not Shepard is arrested somehow or whether he/she just shows up not expecting anything to happen or whether or not he/she develops a guilty conscience for working with Cerberus and decides to turn himself/herself in. In either case, Shepard istates that the Alliance grounded him/her and took away his/her ship. If the DLC has been completed, Anderson will say it was because Shepard destroyed the relay. If the DLC was not completed by the player, then Anderson just says that it is "for all the Sh*t" Shepard has done.
When does anderson say that? I always did the dlc so I don't know.
However I wasn't saying that the batarians arrested shepard I know shepard turned himself into the alliance. I agree that if you didn't do the arrival dlc then shepard turning himself in makes no sense. However I always play the dlc so I never realized that. I thought that if you didn't do the arrival dlc then shepard just did it off screen.
Anderson says it as he is taking Shepard to see the military council at the start of ME3, he says and I have to paraphrase, that he was locked up and the ship taken away for his own safety after blowing up the relay basically to placate the Batarians.
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Post by dmc1001 on Mar 31, 2019 4:18:02 GMT
I've never seen anything to suggest mike doesn't like ME. What I have mostly seen is a desire for Shepard having more agency. Being able to make more choices, like getting rid of unwanted squadmates or being able to ask more questions. At least, that's how I see things. Recently, everything has been so negative on this thread. I was trying to get things onto a more positive track... speculating about Bioware continuing to do things we like about ME rather than always focusing on what each of us feels Bioware has done wrong. Also, Shepard's story is done... he/she is not getting more agency without a rewrite of the OT. I refuse to believe that a rewrite of the OT is the ONLY ME game the fans will allow Bioware to produce. If that's the bottom line, then the fans are being totally unreasonable IMO... and we have nothing further to discuss. Nah, I don't expect a rewrite. Don't really want one. Overall enjoyed the game. Only have issues with Liara when I think about it too much. That said, I also enjoy "what if" scenarios and so I can imagine some things I'd like to change. I have this tendency to take ideas and run with them. I also RP my playthroughs because it makes it more fun for me. Like I once RP'd a Twin Shepards run. It was interesting how I did it - I even took screenshots in ME1 but making use of gender swap.
For me, it's fun to imagine how the game could be different. I only really want tweaks. I've never in my life played games as enjoyable as the MET. Any complaints I have are from that perspective.
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Post by griffith82 on Mar 31, 2019 4:34:24 GMT
No, but you are forced to take his tank on board. You can't just kill him. Tell me who else was forced into FOUR ME games. Who, that was in all three games, can't be killed until the very last bit of the MET? You have no case here. It's not a matter of single incidents but her presence and immortality everywhere. She's a Mary Sue. No she's not. She's a genuinely good character who I completely adore. You don't but that doesn't make her a Mary Sue.
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Post by sil on Mar 31, 2019 9:33:56 GMT
Tell me who else was forced into FOUR ME games. Who, that was in all three games, can't be killed until the very last bit of the MET? You have no case here. It's not a matter of single incidents but her presence and immortality everywhere. She's a Mary Sue. No she's not. She's a genuinely good character who I completely adore. You don't but that doesn't make her a Mary Sue. I liked ME1 Liara, but she changed far too much between 1 and 2 for it to be plausible. She went from a somewhat shy but excitable xenoarchaeologist that loves anything Prothean, to a "badass" information broker who just acted composed the entire time and who lacked any sense of wonder. I imagine most people would like Liara more if her plot-line had been more believable (for example, she could've been on the run from the Shadow Broker, which would have helped make her more resourceful) and if her personality hadn't changed so much that she is like two entirely different characters. There's nothing wrong with loving the character, we all have our favourites, but she is definitely Mac Walters favourite character who gained more prominence as he took the reins of the series. Which many found unjustified, probably because her career trajectory across the games doesn't match up. Let's look at the other ME1 squad members: Ashley & Kaidan:ME1 = Both individuals are talented but ostracised within the military (one due to family history, the other his biotics). ME2 = The survivor is finally recognised for their abilities, remaining loyal to the service they have dedicated their lives to. ME3 = They achieve the ultimate honour of becoming a Spectre, the second human Spectre, showing that their skills and dedication have truly been accepted. Tali:ME1 = Is on her pilgrimage that will allow her to become viewed as an adult in her society. She must prove her worth to return to the fleet, in a galaxy that hates her people. ME2 = Skills gained during her pilgrimage and the fight against Saren have led her into a position of rank, she is no longer a child but trusted to lead others. ME3 = She rises to the rank of Admiral, and if the quarians survive, she (and her species) is accepted by those that would have once trod down on them (turian in ME3 she speaks to) Garrus:ME1 = A police officer that is tired of lawbreakers avoiding justice due to rules and regulations, who gets mentored by a Spectre that is above them. ME2 = Takes the law into his own hands in a bid to make the galaxy a safer place, even if only on one space station. ME3 = Tries to save as many people as possible by warning his skeptical leadership of the Reapers before they arrive, and then fighting on any battlefield he is taken to do so. Wrex:ME1 = A hopeless krogan that believes his people are going to slip away into nothing because of their aggression and lack of forethought. ME2 = After being involved in saving the galaxy and seeing once again how his people were almost turned into pawns, he seeks to restore his people and has fought to secure a safe zone for many clans including the female clan. ME3 = Can cure his people and give them the hope they need to become better than they were, even fighting alongside ancient foes for the greater good. Liara:ME1 = An inexperienced xenobiologist who is an expert in the Protheans, whose abilities help to uncover the truth of Saren's goals and the Reapers. ME2 = Becomes an information agent devoted to hunting down the Shadow Broker, someone she didn't interact with prior to ME2. ME3 = Is the Shadow Broker and is involved in recovering the Crucible plans. Her progression doesn't feel right. If anything, in ME2 she should've been ostracised by the scientific community as she delved deeper into her theories about Reapers and Protheans while trying to find a way to defeat them, which leads to her discovering the Crucible plans at the beginning of ME3.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2019 10:32:16 GMT
No she's not. She's a genuinely good character who I completely adore. You don't but that doesn't make her a Mary Sue. I liked ME1 Liara, but she changed far too much between 1 and 2 for it to be plausible. She went from a somewhat shy but excitable xenoarchaeologist that loves anything Prothean, to a "badass" information broker who just acted composed the entire time and who lacked any sense of wonder. I imagine most people would like Liara more if her plot-line had been more believable (for example, she could've been on the run from the Shadow Broker, which would have helped make her more resourceful) and if her personality hadn't changed so much that she is like two entirely different characters. There's nothing wrong with loving the character, we all have our favourites, but she is definitely Mac Walters favourite character who gained more prominence as he took the reins of the series. Which many found unjustified, probably because her career trajectory across the games doesn't match up. Let's look at the other ME1 squad members: Ashley & Kaidan:ME1 = Both individuals are talented but ostracised within the military (one due to family history, the other his biotics). ME2 = The survivor is finally recognised for their abilities, remaining loyal to the service they have dedicated their lives to. ME3 = They achieve the ultimate honour of becoming a Spectre, the second human Spectre, showing that their skills and dedication have truly been accepted. Tali:ME1 = Is on her pilgrimage that will allow her to become viewed as an adult in her society. She must prove her worth to return to the fleet, in a galaxy that hates her people. ME2 = Skills gained during her pilgrimage and the fight against Saren have led her into a position of rank, she is no longer a child but trusted to lead others. ME3 = She rises to the rank of Admiral, and if the quarians survive, she (and her species) is accepted by those that would have once trod down on them (turian in ME3 she speaks to) Garrus:ME1 = A police officer that is tired of lawbreakers avoiding justice due to rules and regulations, who gets mentored by a Spectre that is above them. ME2 = Takes the law into his own hands in a bid to make the galaxy a safer place, even if only on one space station. ME3 = Tries to save as many people as possible by warning his skeptical leadership of the Reapers before they arrive, and then fighting on any battlefield he is taken to do so. Wrex:ME1 = A hopeless krogan that believes his people are going to slip away into nothing because of their aggression and lack of forethought. ME2 = After being involved in saving the galaxy and seeing once again how his people were almost turned into pawns, he seeks to restore his people and has fought to secure a safe zone for many clans including the female clan. ME3 = Can cure his people and give them the hope they need to become better than they were, even fighting alongside ancient foes for the greater good. Liara:ME1 = An inexperienced xenobiologist who is an expert in the Protheans, whose abilities help to uncover the truth of Saren's goals and the Reapers. ME2 = Becomes an information agent devoted to hunting down the Shadow Broker, someone she didn't interact with prior to ME2. ME3 = Is the Shadow Broker and is involved in recovering the Crucible plans. Her progression doesn't feel right. If anything, in ME2 she should've been ostracised by the scientific community as she delved deeper into her theories about Reapers and Protheans while trying to find a way to defeat them, which leads to her discovering the Crucible plans at the beginning of ME3. The problem is really in ME2. The place for Liara within the framework of ME2 should have actually been as the scientist aboard Normandy researching the collectors, who were in fact modified Protheans. The Shadow Broker should have just been introduced as a new character. However, had that been done, we would have lost one of the series most beloved characters... Mordin. What Mac did in ME3, was to find some excuse to bring Liara back on board the ship since she was a LI from ME1. I believe this was done because they were in need of a strong biotic on the main squad and she was the one character who could not have died during the ME2 SM (simply because she had been effectively shunted aside in ME2). I think we would have wound up with Miranda on the ship if they had made so that she could not possibly die on the SM.. but they didn't do that. It was hard to get Miranda killed, but not impossible. There they should have written the SM such that Miranda and Shepard would always survive regardless... but imposing such a restriction would have diminished the fun of playing the SM... so it was a compilation of tough choices that resulted in the break in Liara's character.
I honestly don't buy into the "Liara was forced into the story because she was Mac's favorite" line. As for her cameo in ME:A... it was somewhat unnecessary and, I think, just amounts to a little trolling by the devs. In the original endings to ME3, Liara could be killed during the beam run with low EMS, so I think Bioware would only bring her back into a post-reaper MW (if it was their plan to have the Initiative return to the Milky Way) if they were planning to declare only the high EMS endings as canon (or select one of the high EMS endings as canon).
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Post by themikefest on Mar 31, 2019 11:55:30 GMT
Was t'soni needed for ME1? If Saren was able to find Ilos without t'soni, why couldn't Shepard? Having her involved with finding Shepard doesn't make sense. Throughout ME1 she says I've been studying the the protheans for however long. All of sudden the protheans are completely forgotten so she can chase the broker and have her overkill obsession with Shepard by displaying her/his armor and having they're dna placed throughout her apartment. I had to laugh when she said, after the broker was killed, that now she can help Shepard find a way to stop the reapers. There was nothing stopping her. In ME3 she is forced to show up after the first two dreams. Why? After the first dream she tells Shepard the same thing that Shepard already knew. The second dream she tells Shepard the salarian councilor wants to talk. Was it that hard to use the intercom? I guess so. Why couldn't edi or Sam inform Shepard?
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Post by themikefest on Mar 31, 2019 12:02:09 GMT
Is there anything about Mass Effect that you like, I wonder? I've never seen anything to suggest mike doesn't like ME. What I have mostly seen is a desire for Shepard having more agency. Being able to make more choices, like getting rid of unwanted squadmates or being able to ask more questions. At least, that's how I see things. Had I not liked the trilogy, I would not have played it more than once. There are a lot of things I like, and of course a lot of things I don't like. Some of what I like I would be in the minority. For example, I like Wreav. I like Udina. My number one pet peeve is Shepard not able to ask questions or rather more questions than what he/she was able to ask, throughout the trilogy.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2019 12:56:56 GMT
I've never seen anything to suggest mike doesn't like ME. What I have mostly seen is a desire for Shepard having more agency. Being able to make more choices, like getting rid of unwanted squadmates or being able to ask more questions. At least, that's how I see things. Had I not liked the trilogy, I would not have played it more than once. There are a lot of things I like, and of course a lot of things I don't like. Some of what I like I would be in the minority. For example, I like Wreav. I like Udina. My number one pet peeve is Shepard not able to ask questions or rather more questions than what he/she was able to ask, throughout the trilogy. Well there's a start towards some positivity... even though you're avoiding answering me... I like Wreav too and Udina. They add some depth to the game by giving us some more minor adversaries who are "allies" to play off of. Having Wreav in ME3 dramatically changes the way the Krogan genophage issue plays out making it interesting to have varied playthroughs... some with Wrex and some with Wreav. It's one "death substitution" that makes a difference when most of the others don't make much difference at all.
As for Shepard being able to ask more questions, I also would have liked that... but I'm a realist. I honestly think they gave use as many dialogue options as the could within their budget. There are places where redundant dialogue options oculd have been eliminated to make budgetary room for others than were more cogent to the game's story as it actually turned out. These redundant lines are most evident in ME1... where you, for example, ask Pressley how he got to be aboard the Normandy twice or where you essentially ask the VI on Feros about the size of the size of the Thorian twice (if you go through all the Investigate options). I think some of the problem there is a lack of mapping out the full Trilogy in their own minds before releasing the first game. I saw fewer of those sorts of redundancies in ME:A... but Ryder was still not able to ask several pertinent questions. Seeing the silver lining a bit though, it's some of those holes that allow for some imaginative head canon that can, again, add some variety into the game.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2019 13:06:35 GMT
I've never seen anything to suggest mike doesn't like ME. What I have mostly seen is a desire for Shepard having more agency. Being able to make more choices, like getting rid of unwanted squadmates or being able to ask more questions. At least, that's how I see things. Had I not liked the trilogy, I would not have played it more than once. There are a lot of things I like, and of course a lot of things I don't like. Some of what I like I would be in the minority. For example, I like Wreav. I like Udina. My number one pet peeve is Shepard not able to ask questions or rather more questions than what he/she was able to ask, throughout the trilogy. She was your Asari squad mate. Sure, it would have been more balanced if they had written things such that you could take any three of the four alien squad mates... but to make that sort of choice clear to the player, it would have meant eliminating Therum entirely as a mission. We know that it was intended to be a much bigger mission than was released so that might have filled in some of those gaps and better explained Liara's purpose in the game. I honestly don't think it should have been mandatory to bring Tali onto the squad. Once she turned over the evidence, there was really no need to bring her on board and she's the one with the least combat experience of the squad mates found on the Citadel. She doesn't actually contribute any additional insights into the geth. She says so herself when Shepard asks when she says directly that she can't tell him/her anything that he/she doesn't already know... and certainly, those sorts of questions about the geth should have been asked by Shepard or Udina or Anderson while they were still on the Citadel (and her skill set is almost completely redundant with Garrus). What need is there to recruit either Garrus or Wrex, for that matter? A C-Sec officer who failed to nail Saren and a mercenary who just wants to be near the action? Not really a strong reason to take on either one of them, IMO. Of the group, Liara actually has the most reason to want to come along since Shepard tells her that Saren is allied with her mother. It's probably natural that she wants to find out why.
It's also evident from the outset that the Asari were meant to be the most prominent alien species in the game. That's why they were monogendered and why the prominent spokesperson on the council was Asari and why Saren's second in command was also Asari. Since Drew Karpyshyn was lead writer for ME1 and not Mac Walters, I'm pretty confident that it was Drew's decision to make the Asari in ME1 so prominent and to make Liara a mandatory squad mate.
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Post by griffith82 on Mar 31, 2019 14:40:42 GMT
No she's not. She's a genuinely good character who I completely adore. You don't but that doesn't make her a Mary Sue. I liked ME1 Liara, but she changed far too much between 1 and 2 for it to be plausible. She went from a somewhat shy but excitable xenoarchaeologist that loves anything Prothean, to a "badass" information broker who just acted composed the entire time and who lacked any sense of wonder. I imagine most people would like Liara more if her plot-line had been more believable (for example, she could've been on the run from the Shadow Broker, which would have helped make her more resourceful) and if her personality hadn't changed so much that she is like two entirely different characters. There's nothing wrong with loving the character, we all have our favourites, but she is definitely Mac Walters favourite character who gained more prominence as he took the reins of the series. Which many found unjustified, probably because her career trajectory across the games doesn't match up. Let's look at the other ME1 squad members: Ashley & Kaidan:ME1 = Both individuals are talented but ostracised within the military (one due to family history, the other his biotics). ME2 = The survivor is finally recognised for their abilities, remaining loyal to the service they have dedicated their lives to. ME3 = They achieve the ultimate honour of becoming a Spectre, the second human Spectre, showing that their skills and dedication have truly been accepted. Tali:ME1 = Is on her pilgrimage that will allow her to become viewed as an adult in her society. She must prove her worth to return to the fleet, in a galaxy that hates her people. ME2 = Skills gained during her pilgrimage and the fight against Saren have led her into a position of rank, she is no longer a child but trusted to lead others. ME3 = She rises to the rank of Admiral, and if the quarians survive, she (and her species) is accepted by those that would have once trod down on them (turian in ME3 she speaks to) Garrus:ME1 = A police officer that is tired of lawbreakers avoiding justice due to rules and regulations, who gets mentored by a Spectre that is above them. ME2 = Takes the law into his own hands in a bid to make the galaxy a safer place, even if only on one space station. ME3 = Tries to save as many people as possible by warning his skeptical leadership of the Reapers before they arrive, and then fighting on any battlefield he is taken to do so. Wrex:ME1 = A hopeless krogan that believes his people are going to slip away into nothing because of their aggression and lack of forethought. ME2 = After being involved in saving the galaxy and seeing once again how his people were almost turned into pawns, he seeks to restore his people and has fought to secure a safe zone for many clans including the female clan. ME3 = Can cure his people and give them the hope they need to become better than they were, even fighting alongside ancient foes for the greater good. Liara:ME1 = An inexperienced xenobiologist who is an expert in the Protheans, whose abilities help to uncover the truth of Saren's goals and the Reapers. ME2 = Becomes an information agent devoted to hunting down the Shadow Broker, someone she didn't interact with prior to ME2. ME3 = Is the Shadow Broker and is involved in recovering the Crucible plans. Her progression doesn't feel right. If anything, in ME2 she should've been ostracised by the scientific community as she delved deeper into her theories about Reapers and Protheans while trying to find a way to defeat them, which leads to her discovering the Crucible plans at the beginning of ME3. See I much prefer the more refined Liara. I like her in ME1 but I prefer her more mature. The way I see it my Shep and her were always friends so when she finds out I can be brought back she wastes no time. 2 years passed and she found she was good at something other than research.
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Post by themikefest on Mar 31, 2019 16:09:29 GMT
Well there's a start towards some positivity... Positive? In this thread, you posted this yesterday Your post is not very positive. Saying MEA haters are being unreasonable. Saying a bunch of disgruntled ME3 types? What do you mean by that? Why should I? You know I've played the trilogy numerous times. That should tell you I like ME. And if you've read some of my posts in the other section, you would have read some of the things I like about the trilogy.
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Post by melbella on Mar 31, 2019 16:24:51 GMT
It was hard to get Miranda killed, but not impossible. Yet somehow I managed to do it in my first game playing blind. I think because, like any sane, non-meta-gaming person, I sided with Jack in their argument and that got Miranda's panties in a bunch.
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Post by themikefest on Mar 31, 2019 16:29:48 GMT
She was your Asari squad mate. I'm going to assume your answer is for the other post that I made that you didn't quote?
So Liara is my asari squadmate' Is that suppose to mean something? Tali is my quarian squadmate. Grunt is my krogan squadmate. Mordin is my salarian squadmate. Thane is my drell squadmate. Ashley is my human squadmate. I never heard of that. Can you provide a link to where Therum was suppose to be a bigger mission than what is seen in game? Yet she can be rescued at the last possible moment in the game long after her mother has been dealt with.
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Post by ahglock on Mar 31, 2019 16:58:00 GMT
No she's not. She's a genuinely good character who I completely adore. You don't but that doesn't make her a Mary Sue. I liked ME1 Liara, but she changed far too much between 1 and 2 for it to be plausible. She went from a somewhat shy but excitable xenoarchaeologist that loves anything Prothean, to a "badass" information broker who just acted composed the entire time and who lacked any sense of wonder. I imagine most people would like Liara more if her plot-line had been more believable (for example, she could've been on the run from the Shadow Broker, which would have helped make her more resourceful) and if her personality hadn't changed so much that she is like two entirely different characters. There's nothing wrong with loving the character, we all have our favourites, but she is definitely Mac Walters favourite character who gained more prominence as he took the reins of the series. Which many found unjustified, probably because her career trajectory across the games doesn't match up. Let's look at the other ME1 squad members: Ashley & Kaidan:ME1 = Both individuals are talented but ostracised within the military (one due to family history, the other his biotics). ME2 = The survivor is finally recognised for their abilities, remaining loyal to the service they have dedicated their lives to. ME3 = They achieve the ultimate honour of becoming a Spectre, the second human Spectre, showing that their skills and dedication have truly been accepted. Tali:ME1 = Is on her pilgrimage that will allow her to become viewed as an adult in her society. She must prove her worth to return to the fleet, in a galaxy that hates her people. ME2 = Skills gained during her pilgrimage and the fight against Saren have led her into a position of rank, she is no longer a child but trusted to lead others. ME3 = She rises to the rank of Admiral, and if the quarians survive, she (and her species) is accepted by those that would have once trod down on them (turian in ME3 she speaks to) Garrus:ME1 = A police officer that is tired of lawbreakers avoiding justice due to rules and regulations, who gets mentored by a Spectre that is above them. ME2 = Takes the law into his own hands in a bid to make the galaxy a safer place, even if only on one space station. ME3 = Tries to save as many people as possible by warning his skeptical leadership of the Reapers before they arrive, and then fighting on any battlefield he is taken to do so. Wrex:ME1 = A hopeless krogan that believes his people are going to slip away into nothing because of their aggression and lack of forethought. ME2 = After being involved in saving the galaxy and seeing once again how his people were almost turned into pawns, he seeks to restore his people and has fought to secure a safe zone for many clans including the female clan. ME3 = Can cure his people and give them the hope they need to become better than they were, even fighting alongside ancient foes for the greater good. Liara:ME1 = An inexperienced xenobiologist who is an expert in the Protheans, whose abilities help to uncover the truth of Saren's goals and the Reapers. ME2 = Becomes an information agent devoted to hunting down the Shadow Broker, someone she didn't interact with prior to ME2. ME3 = Is the Shadow Broker and is involved in recovering the Crucible plans. Her progression doesn't feel right. If anything, in ME2 she should've been ostracised by the scientific community as she delved deeper into her theories about Reapers and Protheans while trying to find a way to defeat them, which leads to her discovering the Crucible plans at the beginning of ME3. That actually makes her changes seem more plausible. I felt her personality shift was abrupt but dedicated researcher becomes a broker of information is less of a leap than dumb ass kid becomes a admiral at age 20, or random merc settles down and effectively takes over his planet. Ash/Kaiden and Garus have the most reasonable progression. Liara is next and is actually somewhat reasonable. then who the fuck knows they are both insanely implausible.
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Post by ahglock on Mar 31, 2019 17:00:31 GMT
It was hard to get Miranda killed, but not impossible. Yet somehow I managed to do it in my first game playing blind. I think because, like any sane, non-meta-gaming person, I sided with Jack in their argument and that got Miranda's panties in a bunch. Same. She died in the final fight under a piece of metal. Until I understood the stupid mechanics behind the arguments I sided with jack without a red/blue backup speech.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2019 18:43:42 GMT
Well there's a start towards some positivity... Positive? In this thread, you posted this yesterday Your post is not very positive. Saying MEA haters are being unreasonable. Saying a bunch of disgruntled ME3 types? What do you mean by that? Why should I? You know I've played the trilogy numerous times. That should tell you I like ME. And if you've read some of my posts in the other section, you would have read some of the things I like about the trilogy. I've been told on these boards several times that there was content cut from Therum. On June 26, 2017, AnDromedary mentions cut content involving a mining settlement. (I don't know how to link to specific posts on these boards).
Sorry, if I'm not feeling to positive about my own health situation ATM. Please continue with your anti-Liara ranting then. It suits you... and ME:A "haters" (note the quotes and consider what that generally means in conversations) are being unreasonable in my opinion (note this also - I'm being clear that is it only my opinion). You've called poor Liara and other ME characters more names than I can count ... to the point that I'm no longer sure what your point really is in doing so - since you obviously have no interest in discussing the matter short of continually just re-iterating that you dislike those characters.. and continually calling them names just leaves the impression that you hate the game more than you claim you love it.
I am of the opinion that a good many of the OT's various flaws, including the changes to Liara, resulted from Bioware changing their minds and their story plan mid-stream... often in response to fan reaction. I am of the opinion that sticking to whatever their original story plan for Andromeda is still the way we will get the most cohesive story we can out of them... and I believe that original plan involves eventually taking us back to the Milky Way. It may involve them declaring a canon ending... I hope it doesn't... but even so, I still hope they just stick to whatever their original plan was.
ETA: Therum was originally called Caleston and this quote is from the Wiki page on Calleston:
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Post by themikefest on Apr 1, 2019 1:59:57 GMT
Please continue with your anti-Liara ranting then. It suits you Just as it seems to suit you to bash people who don't like what you like.. Aren't you being unreasonable by calling some a bunch of disgruntled ME3 types, whatever that means?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 1, 2019 3:07:25 GMT
Please continue with your anti-Liara ranting then. It suits you Just as it seems to suit you to bash people who don't like what you like.. Aren't you being unreasonable by calling some a bunch of disgruntled ME3 types, whatever that means? Disgruntled literally means "angry or dissatisfied." (these quotes are here because I'm actually quoting a dictionary, they are not air quotes... just in case you're having trouble telling the difference). With respect to ME3, I believe you admitted to being both of those up thread; so, to directly answer your question, no, I don't feel I'm being "unreasonable" (again, quoting you, not air quotes) by identifying you and others on this site as "disgruntled ME3 types" (quoting myself) at all. I'm simply stating it as I see it. You're welcome to say I'm wrong... but that would be now saying that you're satisfied with ME3... and as I indicated up thread... "I don't want you to be angry at all." I believe calling the NPC's various names with a derogatory intent doesn't generally indicate satisfaction with the game... but again, I could be wrong.
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Post by themikefest on Apr 1, 2019 3:58:18 GMT
You're going to have to come up with an answer as to why I would waste all my time doing all the playthroughs I've done if you believe I don't like ME.
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