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Someday a cat will give me magical powers and I'll be married to a werewolf #goals #WerewolfLIforDA4
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nickclark89
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Tekehu's booty on May 13, 2018 19:19:24 GMT
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dmc1001
N7
Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
Prime Posts: 77
Posts: 9,941 Likes: 17,668
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Post by dmc1001 on May 13, 2018 19:26:27 GMT
The main conceptual problem with the dark energy plot was that it doesn't map well onto the Reapers' actions. Their idea of preventing later races from using this destructive power is to give it to them? They're looking for different approaches by giving out the same one to every cycle? I don't think this is insuperable, though; all that really needs to go away is the Reapers deliberately leaving one cycle's ruins around for other races to discover. It's OK for them to not bother to clean up Prothean, etc., ruins in systems without a next-cycle species, since that cycle can't discover such ruins without independently reinventing the mass effect drive. The time between cycles should also be shortened. It's stupid for the Reapers to wait 50,000 years between iterations of their experiment. After suppressing a failed cycle, they should give some basic technologies like agriculture to candidates for the next cycle before withdrawing. It's still not clear why the Reapers wait so long to come back after races discover the mass effect, though. I suppose that depends on what a success-condition for their experiment would look like. I've got nothing. They aren't giving these races the power. It comes about on its own through contact with eezo, a natural phenomena in the universe. I'm not sure where you came up with the idea that the Reapers were giving the ability to manipulate dark energy. Waiting for 50,000 years? Suppose you're waiting to see if, somehow, the new races don't follow the same path or figure out how to stop the problem with dark energy? You wait and watch. Most races can't even manipulate dark energy until they're spacefaring and thus exposed to eezo. The problem with dark energy is that it destroys suns, which makes the entire galaxy unlivable for ANYONE. Therefore, the Reapers prevent that from happening by eliminating those who wield dark energy. Not really such a stretch.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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kabraxal
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Kabraxal on May 14, 2018 0:02:59 GMT
More Andromeda please... the grim dark edge lords can keep that crap in lesser games, thanks.
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kaisershep
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KaiserShep on May 14, 2018 1:02:10 GMT
The main conceptual problem with the dark energy plot was that it doesn't map well onto the Reapers' actions. Their idea of preventing later races from using this destructive power is to give it to them? They're looking for different approaches by giving out the same one to every cycle? I don't think this is insuperable, though; all that really needs to go away is the Reapers deliberately leaving one cycle's ruins around for other races to discover. It's OK for them to not bother to clean up Prothean, etc., ruins in systems without a next-cycle species, since that cycle can't discover such ruins without independently reinventing the mass effect drive. The time between cycles should also be shortened. It's stupid for the Reapers to wait 50,000 years between iterations of their experiment. After suppressing a failed cycle, they should give some basic technologies like agriculture to candidates for the next cycle before withdrawing. It's still not clear why the Reapers wait so long to come back after races discover the mass effect, though. I suppose that depends on what a success-condition for their experiment would look like. I've got nothing. They aren't giving these races the power. It comes about on its own through contact with eezo, a natural phenomena in the universe. I'm not sure where you came up with the idea that the Reapers were giving the ability to manipulate dark energy. Waiting for 50,000 years? Suppose you're waiting to see if, somehow, the new races don't follow the same path or figure out how to stop the problem with dark energy? You wait and watch. Most races can't even manipulate dark energy until they're spacefaring and thus exposed to eezo. The problem with dark energy is that it destroys suns, which makes the entire galaxy unlivable for ANYONE. Therefore, the Reapers prevent that from happening by eliminating those who wield dark energy. Not really such a stretch. But they do give these races power, by creating a vast superhighway that manipulates dark energy on a far larger scale than all biotics combined could with the Mass Relays. How is it that the reapers would be trying to prevent a dark energy problem, by engineering technologies that continually releases it nonstop? I get this feeling that the dark energy plot, if actually followed through those lines from Tali’s recruitment and loyalty missions, would probably have ended much worse than the crappy synthetics vs. organics thing. I’m starting to lean on leaving fans infuriated with leaving the trilogy with an unsolved question regarding the reapers as being the best outcome if they couldn’t be bothered to come up with something good.
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Post by themikefest on May 14, 2018 1:19:32 GMT
Gianna Parasini will mention dark energy when talking with Shepard on Illium
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Post by KaiserShep on May 14, 2018 1:29:25 GMT
Gianna Parasini will mention dark energy when talking with Shepard on Illium Yeah, but the most meaningful stuff is mentioned by the quarians. Altogether the game does introduce the intrigue of it but then goes nowhere. It’s one of those things that I dislike about the trilogy and makes me wish it was all planned out better.
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Post by alanc9 on May 14, 2018 1:47:38 GMT
The main conceptual problem with the dark energy plot was that it doesn't map well onto the Reapers' actions. Their idea of preventing later races from using this destructive power is to give it to them? They're looking for different approaches by giving out the same one to every cycle? I don't think this is insuperable, though; all that really needs to go away is the Reapers deliberately leaving one cycle's ruins around for other races to discover. It's OK for them to not bother to clean up Prothean, etc., ruins in systems without a next-cycle species, since that cycle can't discover such ruins without independently reinventing the mass effect drive. The time between cycles should also be shortened. It's stupid for the Reapers to wait 50,000 years between iterations of their experiment. After suppressing a failed cycle, they should give some basic technologies like agriculture to candidates for the next cycle before withdrawing. It's still not clear why the Reapers wait so long to come back after races discover the mass effect, though. I suppose that depends on what a success-condition for their experiment would look like. I've got nothing. They aren't giving these races the power. It comes about on its own through contact with eezo, a natural phenomena in the universe. I'm not sure where you came up with the idea that the Reapers were giving the ability to manipulate dark energy. Waiting for 50,000 years? Suppose you're waiting to see if, somehow, the new races don't follow the same path or figure out how to stop the problem with dark energy? You wait and watch. Most races can't even manipulate dark energy until they're spacefaring and thus exposed to eezo. The problem with dark energy is that it destroys suns, which makes the entire galaxy unlivable for ANYONE. Therefore, the Reapers prevent that from happening by eliminating those who wield dark energy. Not really such a stretch. But it's the adoption of mass effect technology which causes the widespread distribution of eezo and thus biotics, isn't it? Asari are an exception because Thessia is special, but other races got the mass effect first and biotics second. As for 50, 000 years, the problem is most of that waiting is just waiting for intelligent organics to discover civilization. They're not going do do anything of any use to the Reapers until they do.
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dmc1001
N7
Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: ferroboy
Prime Posts: 77
Posts: 9,941 Likes: 17,668
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Post by dmc1001 on May 14, 2018 2:39:59 GMT
But they do give these races power, by creating a vast superhighway that manipulates dark energy on a far larger scale than all biotics combined could with the Mass Relays. How is it that the reapers would be trying to prevent a dark energy problem, by engineering technologies that continually releases it nonstop? I get this feeling that the dark energy plot, if actually followed through those lines from Tali’s recruitment and loyalty missions, would probably have ended much worse than the crappy synthetics vs. organics thing. I’m starting to lean on leaving fans infuriated with leaving the trilogy with an unsolved question regarding the reapers as being the best outcome if they couldn’t be bothered to come up with something good. Actually, eezo is used for FTL travel, which is independent of mass relays. But, yes, mass effect fields are used in relays. In any case, I was not at all discussing how it would pan out in the MET. This whole thread talks about a possible reboot and at least I was trying to come up with some viable way it could happen. You?
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deathscepter
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Jade Empire
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Post by Phantom on May 18, 2018 18:16:47 GMT
Dark Citadel if we ever visit it, it show be more of a blend of Tropes of Dark world and Eldritch Location in feel. Enough familar with a darker twist to it and bizarre to cause mild disorientation for the player and the Player Character.
If there is post ME3 Reaper War Mass Effect game, IF Genophage Cured Situation, Krogan's population is reduced by 99% that even with their exploding population would find it diffcult to re-cope their losses in the Reaper war. IF Genophage is Sabotaged, Krogan's population is still quite low due to casulaties but they have a very mild mutation that there might be hope for them. I do want to have a dark feel due to fighting the Reapers.
I would still have Shepard to die in ME3, Having an out of Left Field Player Character like a Cerberus Agent or Iconic Enemy NPC of any stripe to become a New Hero. Yeah I would have him/her to visit Dark Citadel to end the Reaper fully. Due to Fandom and Narrative sense, I would keep Shepard a major hero and the New hero would find something that Shepard did or hide during ME3 and using it to enter Dark Space/Citadel and able to fight Harbringer in his full Eldritch abomination mode.
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Hope for the best, plan for the worst
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Post by griffith82 on May 19, 2018 3:28:30 GMT
Dark Citadel if we ever visit it, it show be more of a blend of Tropes of Dark world and Eldritch Location in feel. Enough familar with a darker twist to it and bizarre to cause mild disorientation for the player and the Player Character. If there is post ME3 Reaper War Mass Effect game, IF Genophage Cured Situation, Krogan's population is reduced by 99% that even with their exploding population would find it diffcult to re-cope their losses in the Reaper war. IF Genophage is Sabotaged, Krogan's population is still quite low due to casulaties but they have a very mild mutation that there might be hope for them. I do want to have a dark feel due to fighting the Reapers. I would still have Shepard to die in ME3, Having an out of Left Field Player Character like a Cerberus Agent or Iconic Enemy NPC of any stripe to become a New Hero. Yeah I would have him/her to visit Dark Citadel to end the Reaper fully. Due to Fandom and Narrative sense, I would keep Shepard a major hero and the New hero would find something that Shepard did or hide during ME3 and using it to enter Dark Space/Citadel and able to fight Harbringer in his full Eldritch abomination mode. Dark Citadel? What is that?
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Post by alanc9 on May 19, 2018 20:39:28 GMT
I think the "Dark Citadel" is an old fan idea from before ME3 shipped. The idea was that, since the Reapers couldn't be defeated if it actually came to warfare, there would have to be some sort of command/control point to stop the Reapers in their tracks. (Like ME1 and ME2, people figured that ME3 would turn out to be all about getting Shepard to the "We win" button. That much, at least, was correct.) Most people figured that this central base would be out in dark space someplace, and "Dark Citadel" stuck.
Not a great fit with how Sovereign described the Reapers, but not a terrible idea either.
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Post by Phantom on May 19, 2018 22:55:45 GMT
I think the "Dark Citadel" is an old fan idea from before ME3 shipped. The idea was that, since the Reapers couldn't be defeated if it actually came to warfare, there would have to be some sort of command/control point to stop the Reapers in their tracks. (Like ME1 and ME2, people figured that ME3 would turn out to be all about getting Shepard to the "We win" button. That much, at least, was correct.) Most people figured that this central base would be out in dark space someplace, and "Dark Citadel" stuck. Not a great fit with how Sovereign described the Reapers, but not a terrible idea either. Well You are right about that The Dark Citadel is a fandom idea. what is floating in my head that Dark Space where Dark Citadel exist, is a Eldritch Location that exist outside of time how we look at time itself but can be access thru a trans-dimensonal device that is on the Citadel in Normal Space and Vanguard Reaper Like Sovereign and other reapers. A Trait I would add to the Reapers is a passive connection to the Dark Space via Dark Citadel gateway. I would have the new PC cutting off the Reapers from rest of the universe and keeping them in Dark Space in which I would treat it as a Pocket Universe.
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Party like it's 2023!
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kaisershep
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KaiserShep on May 20, 2018 1:56:53 GMT
I think the "Dark Citadel" is an old fan idea from before ME3 shipped. The idea was that, since the Reapers couldn't be defeated if it actually came to warfare, there would have to be some sort of command/control point to stop the Reapers in their tracks. (Like ME1 and ME2, people figured that ME3 would turn out to be all about getting Shepard to the "We win" button. That much, at least, was correct.) Most people figured that this central base would be out in dark space someplace, and "Dark Citadel" stuck. Not a great fit with how Sovereign described the Reapers, but not a terrible idea either. Honestly it would have made the most sense in consideration to what Sovereign was actually trying to accomplish. Before the events of Arrival and ME3, I had always assumed that there would have been a hidden relay or conduit of some sort deep out in dark space that’s paired with the Citadel. Otherwise, how would they immediately begin to bumrush the galaxy from its central point? I would’ve preferred some sort of dark space mission that has us destroy it somehow. After Arrival, we know it’d be a heck of a light show that no one would be around to enjoy.
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Post by themikefest on May 20, 2018 2:28:01 GMT
Honestly it would have made the most sense in consideration to what Sovereign was actually trying to accomplish. Before the events of Arrival and ME3, I had always assumed that there would have been a hidden relay or conduit of some sort deep out in dark space that’s paired with the Citadel. Otherwise, how would they immediately begin to bumrush the galaxy from its central point? I would’ve preferred some sort of dark space mission that has us destroy it somehow. After Arrival, we know it’d be a heck of a light show that no one would be around to enjoy. That's something I've been saying for the past few years. If the trilogy were to get a reboot, make the main mission in ME2 be focused on getting to darkspace. Have the colleecors as a long side mission. Here's a suggestion on how the relay could be destroyed. It takes place after the events of ME3
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Arcian
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: GVArcian
XBL Gamertag: GVArcian
Prime Posts: 2473
Prime Likes: 2168
Posts: 928 Likes: 1,354
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Arcian on May 21, 2018 19:25:42 GMT
I think the "Dark Citadel" is an old fan idea from before ME3 shipped. The idea was that, since the Reapers couldn't be defeated if it actually came to warfare, there would have to be some sort of command/control point to stop the Reapers in their tracks. (Like ME1 and ME2, people figured that ME3 would turn out to be all about getting Shepard to the "We win" button. That much, at least, was correct.) Most people figured that this central base would be out in dark space someplace, and "Dark Citadel" stuck. Not a great fit with how Sovereign described the Reapers, but not a terrible idea either. People assumed this was a thing because Mass Relays come in pairs and the regular Citadel is a Mass Relay leading to Dark Space - hence, Dark Citadel.
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Hope for the best, plan for the worst
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Post by griffith82 on May 21, 2018 21:04:28 GMT
I think the "Dark Citadel" is an old fan idea from before ME3 shipped. The idea was that, since the Reapers couldn't be defeated if it actually came to warfare, there would have to be some sort of command/control point to stop the Reapers in their tracks. (Like ME1 and ME2, people figured that ME3 would turn out to be all about getting Shepard to the "We win" button. That much, at least, was correct.) Most people figured that this central base would be out in dark space someplace, and "Dark Citadel" stuck. Not a great fit with how Sovereign described the Reapers, but not a terrible idea either. People assumed this was a thing because Mass Relays come in pairs and the regular Citadel is a Mass Relay leading to Dark Space - hence, Dark Citadel. Hmm well yeah there has to be a second relay but it wouldn’t need to be a Citadel. They’d have no need for something like that in Darkspace.
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Iakus
N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,879 Likes: 49,335
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Post by Iakus on May 21, 2018 22:31:01 GMT
The main conceptual problem with the dark energy plot was that it doesn't map well onto the Reapers' actions. Their idea of preventing later races from using this destructive power is to give it to them? They're looking for different approaches by giving out the same one to every cycle? I don't think this is insuperable, though; all that really needs to go away is the Reapers deliberately leaving one cycle's ruins around for other races to discover. It's OK for them to not bother to clean up Prothean, etc., ruins in systems without a next-cycle species, since that cycle can't discover such ruins without independently reinventing the mass effect drive. The time between cycles should also be shortened. It's stupid for the Reapers to wait 50,000 years between iterations of their experiment. After suppressing a failed cycle, they should give some basic technologies like agriculture to candidates for the next cycle before withdrawing. It's still not clear why the Reapers wait so long to come back after races discover the mass effect, though. I suppose that depends on what a success-condition for their experiment would look like. I've got nothing. They aren't giving these races the power. It comes about on its own through contact with eezo, a natural phenomena in the universe. I'm not sure where you came up with the idea that the Reapers were giving the ability to manipulate dark energy. Waiting for 50,000 years? Suppose you're waiting to see if, somehow, the new races don't follow the same path or figure out how to stop the problem with dark energy? You wait and watch. Most races can't even manipulate dark energy until they're spacefaring and thus exposed to eezo. The problem with dark energy is that it destroys suns, which makes the entire galaxy unlivable for ANYONE. Therefore, the Reapers prevent that from happening by eliminating those who wield dark energy. Not really such a stretch. One thing's for sure: if the trilogy was ever rebooted, they should have a clear-cut idea of what they're doing and where the story is going from the start.
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Post by griffith82 on May 22, 2018 13:00:21 GMT
They aren't giving these races the power. It comes about on its own through contact with eezo, a natural phenomena in the universe. I'm not sure where you came up with the idea that the Reapers were giving the ability to manipulate dark energy. Waiting for 50,000 years? Suppose you're waiting to see if, somehow, the new races don't follow the same path or figure out how to stop the problem with dark energy? You wait and watch. Most races can't even manipulate dark energy until they're spacefaring and thus exposed to eezo. The problem with dark energy is that it destroys suns, which makes the entire galaxy unlivable for ANYONE. Therefore, the Reapers prevent that from happening by eliminating those who wield dark energy. Not really such a stretch. One thing's for sure: if the trilogy was ever rebooted, they should have a clear-cut idea of what they're doing and where the story is going from the start. I’ve seen that argument before and I’m not sure I 100% agree with it. The only “evidence” I’ve seen as a departure from what was planned was the Dark Energy plot and the Shepard as an alien thing. Which imo is terrible.
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N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,879 Likes: 49,335
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Post by Iakus on May 22, 2018 13:02:43 GMT
One thing's for sure: if the trilogy was ever rebooted, they should have a clear-cut idea of what they're doing and where the story is going from the start. I’ve seen that argument before and I’m not sure I 100% agree with it. The only “evidence” I’ve seen as a departure from what was planned was the Dark Energy plot and the Shepard as an alien thing. Which imo is terrible. They've specifically said the Suicide Mission at the end of ME2 was a bad idea in retrospect since it left so many characters potentially alive or dead.
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Post by themikefest on May 22, 2018 13:52:59 GMT
They've specifically said the Suicide Mission at the end of ME2 was a bad idea in retrospect since it left so many characters potentially alive or dead. Did they say what they would have done differently?
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N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,879 Likes: 49,335
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Post by Iakus on May 22, 2018 14:17:40 GMT
They've specifically said the Suicide Mission at the end of ME2 was a bad idea in retrospect since it left so many characters potentially alive or dead. Did they say what they would have done differently? Honestly I don't remember. It was an interview with Mac Walters between ME2 and ME3, where he admits that ending the game on a mission where everyone including Shepard could die, turned out to be a "What the hell were we thinking?" moment.
Ironic, given what they did with ME3...
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Post by griffith82 on May 22, 2018 16:24:42 GMT
Did they say what they would have done differently? Honestly I don't remember. It was an interview with Mac Walters between ME2 and ME3, where he admits that ending the game on a mission where everyone including Shepard could die, turned out to be a "What the hell were we thinking?" moment.
Ironic, given what they did with ME3...
Not really. To me it was good motivation to do the mission right and learn. Regarding ME3 imo anyone who expected a happy ending without sacrifice was deluding themselves. I knew he/she would die in the end way back from ME1.
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N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,879 Likes: 49,335
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Post by Iakus on May 22, 2018 16:31:16 GMT
Honestly I don't remember. It was an interview with Mac Walters between ME2 and ME3, where he admits that ending the game on a mission where everyone including Shepard could die, turned out to be a "What the hell were we thinking?" moment.
Ironic, given what they did with ME3...
Not really. To me it was good motivation to do the mission right and learn. Regarding ME3 imo anyone who expected a happy ending without sacrifice was deluding themselves. I knew he/she would die in the end way back from ME1. Too bad the player didn't get more of a say as to what the sacrifice was, given this was a series that supposedly celebrated choice.
But that's a years-old debate, and I at least have learned to be less trusting of Bioware's promises.
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Post by griffith82 on May 22, 2018 16:34:18 GMT
Not really. To me it was good motivation to do the mission right and learn. Regarding ME3 imo anyone who expected a happy ending without sacrifice was deluding themselves. I knew he/she would die in the end way back from ME1. Too bad the player didn't get more of a say as to what the sacrifice was, given this was a series that supposedly celebrated choice.
But that's a years-old debate, and I at least have learned to be less trusting of Bioware's promises.
Well imo we did but I know you don’t agree and that’s fine.
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Princess Trejo
N3
A new hope, fool!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Posts: 457 Likes: 407
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Nov 15, 2016 21:25:56 GMT
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Princess Trejo
A new hope, fool!
457
November 2016
halfdanthemenace
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Princess Trejo on May 22, 2018 19:39:00 GMT
I think the "Dark Citadel" is an old fan idea from before ME3 shipped. The idea was that, since the Reapers couldn't be defeated if it actually came to warfare, there would have to be some sort of command/control point to stop the Reapers in their tracks. (Like ME1 and ME2, people figured that ME3 would turn out to be all about getting Shepard to the "We win" button. That much, at least, was correct.) Most people figured that this central base would be out in dark space someplace, and "Dark Citadel" stuck. Not a great fit with how Sovereign described the Reapers, but not a terrible idea either. Well You are right about that The Dark Citadel is a fandom idea. what is floating in my head that Dark Space where Dark Citadel exist, is a Eldritch Location that exist outside of time how we look at time itself but can be access thru a trans-dimensonal device that is on the Citadel in Normal Space and Vanguard Reaper Like Sovereign and other reapers. A Trait I would add to the Reapers is a passive connection to the Dark Space via Dark Citadel gateway. I would have the new PC cutting off the Reapers from rest of the universe and keeping them in Dark Space in which I would treat it as a Pocket Universe. Make sense, the place where the Reapers hibernate in dark space after each harvest. You know they could pull the Catalyst thing again.
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