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0
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5,622
SirSourpuss
7,694
Oct 16, 2017 16:19:07 GMT
October 2017
sirpetrakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 15:23:28 GMT
CDPR, at least, said they are committed to making to making the workload more bearable, with the development of Cyberpunk, in the game's remaining development period and they sound like they are really do mean it. As did Casey, after the Schreier article about Anthem's troubled development.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by samhain444 on May 21, 2019 16:12:58 GMT
CDPR, at least, said they are committed to making to making the workload more bearable, with the development of Cyberpunk, in the game's remaining development period and they sound like they are really do mean it. As did Casey, after the Schreier article about Anthem's troubled development. Man, I hope so. I know a lot of gamers don't seem to care how they get their fix but I'm certainly conflicted - do I not buy the game I'm interested in because of "crunch" devs went through but, by not buying, do I essentially render their effort meaningless and make their employment vulnerable? Obviously, I, personally, don't have that power but just thinking in terms of my own individual contribution. Reading the industry response to CDPR's mention of "Non-obligatory crunch" it borders from cynical ("yeah, right...") to hostile ("What a load of BS!"). The devs I follow on Twitter appear skeptical saying "Yeah, no one puts a gun to your head but the expectation - and your internalized pressure - is you join your team and ship the game together". It would be nice if CDPR encouraged a culture of self-care and can rotate their devs so they can decompress but I'm not sure how realistic or economically viable that is in regards to creating a massive undertaking like "Cyberpunk". As for Casey and BioWare, when he came back as GM in 7/2017, "Anthem" had floundered for years and was coming to it's make-or-break point. You hate to lay the blame at one person's feet but Aaryn Flynn was BioWare's GM from mid-2010 to July 2017 in a time that saw Dragon Age 2's rushed development, Mass Effect 3's controversy, "Dragon Age Inquisition's" crunch, and the mis-management of both "Mass Effect Andromeda" and "Anthem's" development, including the much-discussed 2017 EA Play reveal. He also made the call to have the studio switch to "Frostbite" although Patrick Soderland may have implied it was in the studio's best interest to do so. With Casey and Mark Darrah both coming on board, it appeared "Anthem" began to take shape but they didn't much time to get the game out in EA's 2018 Q4 (Jan 1 - Mar 31 2019). I think, for the continued viability of the studio, it was essential they release the game in the most complete form they could and go from there. I am hoping that, with Casey's commitment to minimize crunch, that "DA4" is given the time it needs to be developed at a reasonable pace. As for "Anthem", the same people I see blistering BioWare for their devs treatment are the same ones criticizing them for not creating new content quicker. I don't you can have both at this point.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by samhain444 on May 21, 2019 16:17:47 GMT
Just my hunch, but, based on the timing, I'm guessing "Cataclysm" starts building up in late May (28th?) and continues to build with live events leading up to a big reveal of the roadmap going forward at EA Play June 8th/9th.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 21, 2019 16:19:50 GMT
Just my hunch, but, based on the timing, I'm guessing "Cataclysm" starts building up in late May (28th?) and continues to build with live events leading up to a big reveal of the roadmap going forward at EA Play June 8th/9th. Seems a reasonable hunch. Though I don't think the future 'Acts' will be as prescribed as they were for Act One.
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October 2017
sirpetrakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 16:35:57 GMT
Man, under Aaryn Flynn, Bioware has released every single title of theirs I was not fond of. As for Anthem, I do understand people's problems with it and the need to produce content, but ... if you're going to make a "live service" game, it has to, you know, be "live". It's the promise you gave your audience, your customers. The only real solution to that, is to come out, in all honestly and say "we need to put the health of our developers as our top priority, so we are cancelling our support for Anthem". Which will definitely not earn them any points, but it is a stance I can support, at this point.
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samhain444
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by samhain444 on May 21, 2019 16:59:17 GMT
Man, under Aaryn Flynn, Bioware has released every single title of theirs I was not fond of. As for Anthem, I do understand people's problems with it and the need to produce content, but ... if you're going to make a "live service" game, it has to, you know, be "live". It's the promise you gave your audience, your customers. The only real solution to that, is to come out, in all honestly and say "we need to put the health of our developers as our top priority, so we are cancelling our support for Anthem". Which will definitely not earn them any points, but it is a stance I can support, at this point. Well, you can continue support for "Anthem" but still put it out at a reasonable pace...I don't think the two are mutually exclusive. Just like "Apex Legends", they don't have to have an Epic Games-like sweat shop, just commit to dropping the content when it is ready and just roll with the up-and-down engagement between content drops. They've sold at least 4+ million copies of the game on a commitment to future content so, while they can push back the overall roadmap, I don't think abandoning "Anthem" is even an option they are entertaining at this point.
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SirSourpuss
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Oct 16, 2017 16:19:07 GMT
October 2017
sirpetrakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 17:16:39 GMT
They've sold at least 4+ million copies of the game Inside Gaming have been following it and narrowed it to around 3-3,6 million copies. Doesn't make it any better, sure and as I already said, it wouldn't earn them any points from anyone, but keeping people occupied on a game that requires so much rework, while at least trying to maintain the facade of a "Live Service" is impossible under the specified framework. Maybe try relaunching it again as a f2p/EA Access game in a year from today, with a complete overhaul, like Diablo 3 did more or less, or just keep the silence indefinitely, until the staff is in condition to work again i.e. after a 1-3 month stress leave, and then start communicating as things start rolling out.
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midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,093 Likes: 16,583
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midnight tea
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August 2016
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Post by midnight tea on May 21, 2019 17:18:11 GMT
Bioware devs have long told us that events like Cataclysm start slow and build up over time. I'm fairly sure that even if the event technically 'starts' in May there will be still a lot before us, information-wise.
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samhain444
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by samhain444 on May 21, 2019 17:32:53 GMT
They've sold at least 4+ million copies of the game Inside Gaming have been following it and narrowed it to around 3-3,6 million copies. Doesn't make it any better, sure and as I already said, it wouldn't earn them any points from anyone, but keeping people occupied on a game that requires so much rework, while at least trying to maintain the facade of a "Live Service" is impossible under the specified framework. Maybe try relaunching it again as a f2p/EA Access game in a year from today, with a complete overhaul, like Diablo 3 did more or less, or just keep the silence indefinitely, until the staff is in condition to work again i.e. after a 1-3 month stress leave, and then start communicating as things start rolling out. With all due respect to "Inside Gaming", NPD has it pegged as the third best selling game of the year at the end of April, outselling "Resident Evil 2" which was at 4 least million. Until BioWare/EA comes out direct and says it, though, we only know for sure it didn't meet EA's "expectation" of 6 million units sold by March 31st. Also, unless you have some inside information, I'm not sure how the situation can be painted as dire as a "so much rework" is "impossible under the specified framework". The game works now, I play it daily. What it needs is more content and a reworked loot system. Checking out BioWare's career page, that "Loot System Designer" entry is gone so they either found who they looking for externally or hired internally. Same with the "Item Creator" entry. Additionally, after stopping post-release development on "Mass Effect Andromeda" only a few months after release, I don't think ending post-lease content of "Anthem" is even an option at this point from a company PR perspective. You just crunched relentlessly for 12 months just to get it out the door only to drop it? I don't see it happening anytime soon.
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Oct 16, 2017 16:19:07 GMT
October 2017
sirpetrakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 18:08:20 GMT
outselling "Resident Evil 2" which was at 4 least million. Resident Evil 2 has shipped 4 million copies, according to pretty much every article I seem to come across. Which is quite different from sold. Putting a PR spin on news is not something unique to Activision, Ubisoft or EA. Capcom does it, too. No doubt, though, RE2 was a success for them, both critically and financially. I can't imagine it being in development for 7 years, like Anthem was. I'm not sure how the situation can be painted as dire as a "so much rework" is "impossible under the specified framework". Well, besides the fact that they need to work on proper implementation of features in the engine, that they had to hack around, in order to get them work in the first place, while trying to break as less dependencies as possible and also supporting the game with new content, to justify the "live service" part of the game description, all the while, they have staff on stress leave. I'm assuming that now, three months after the release, the staff that was on leave has returned and will not be working on fixing the game and working on designing new content/finishing content that was left out on release because it wasn't quite polished. So, if anything, the real work on Anthem's post launch content should have started now. The game works now, I play it daily. What it needs is more content and a reworked loot system. Indeed, it works. It has many features missing still, some that don't quite work as intended and others that, well, simply don't, but the game itself is perfectly playable. Additionally, after stopping post-release development on "Mass Effect Andromeda" only a few months after release, I don't think ending post-lease content of "Anthem" is even an option at this point from a company PR perspective. Absolutely. They could, though and while it wouldn't have helped them from a PR standpoint, I would absolutely respect them for putting their employees first. You just crunched relentlessly for 12 months just to get it out the door only to drop it? I don't see it happening anytime soon. I think that the staff working on it, by the sound of the Schreier article, where just fed up with Frostbyte's bullshit and just wanted the game out, regardless, so they could be done with it. At their state of mind, at the time, I doubt they cared.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 21, 2019 19:51:13 GMT
The game works now, I play it daily. What it needs is more content and a reworked loot system. Pretty much this, rebooting the game makes as much sense as remaking the last season of Game of Thrones, or The Last Jedi.
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sirpetrakus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 19:56:36 GMT
Nobody said anything about rebooting. Re-launch is what I said. Make a little promotion, with a big patch that adds content, loot etc. and advertise it either through EA Access or as f2p. It'd attract people back, out of sheer curiosity.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 21, 2019 20:08:51 GMT
Nobody said anything about rebooting. Re-launch is what I said. Make a little promotion, with a big patch that adds content, loot etc. and advertise it either through EA Access or as f2p. It'd attract people back, out of sheer curiosity. I've seen it suggested. EA Access (Xbox/PS4) would be more viable than F2P, but I don't think it should involve stopping the game (like FFIV).
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 20:21:47 GMT
EA Access (Xbox/PS4) would be more viable than F2P, but I don't think it should involve stopping the game (like FFIV). Not talking about taking it offline, just making an announcement that "x" things will be implemented in "y" amount of time, at which point the game will be on EA Access. Bioware would still have to do some "under the table" favours to the people that paid full price for the game, let alone spent the extra dough on the special edition. I don't know what I'd need to be okay with it, though, at that point. Early Access to a new Javelin type, maybe?
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by samhain444 on May 21, 2019 20:28:32 GMT
Nobody said anything about rebooting. Re-launch is what I said. Make a little promotion, with a big patch that adds content, loot etc. and advertise it either through EA Access or as f2p. It'd attract people back, out of sheer curiosity. I've seen it suggested. EA Access (Xbox/PS4) would be more viable than F2P, but I don't think it should involve stopping the game (like FFIV). The F2P stuff is rather humorous...at least for the near future. I mean, why would they? They dropped the price to $29.99 in a lot of places and they are going to try that for a bit before even adding it to the EA Access vault. Once they release they release the new content, and see how its received, maybe they move it to the vault then but F2P? Nah.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 21, 2019 20:33:06 GMT
Not talking about taking it offline, just making an announcement that "x" things will be implemented in "y" amount of time, at which point the game will be on EA Access. Bioware would still have to do some "under the table" favours to the people that paid full price for the game, let alone spent the extra dough on the special edition. I don't know what I'd need to be okay with it, though, at that point. Early Access to a new Javelin type, maybe? Why would favors have to be offered when Anthem drops free into EA Access? That happens with all EA games after 7-10 months?
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 20:53:29 GMT
Why would favors have to be offered when Anthem drops free into EA Access? A lot of people might feel, you know, reneged, for buying the game at full price. Reading the anthem subreddit, it seems to be a common feeling.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 21, 2019 20:56:45 GMT
A lot of people might feel, you know, reneged, for buying the game at full price. Reading the anthem subreddit, it seems to be a common feeling. But this happens to every single EA game. People pay a subscription to access games approaching a year old in the access vault. It's not being given away for free.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, SWTOR
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 21:16:23 GMT
People pay a subscription to access games approaching a year old in the access vault. Well, I am simply conveying the feelings people over at the anthem subreddit seem to be expressing. Since it seems to be common enough, I'd probably like to address it in some satisfactory manner.
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Apr 15, 2017 17:34:16 GMT
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by NotN7 on May 21, 2019 21:44:57 GMT
A lot of people might feel, you know, reneged, for buying the game at full price. Reading the anthem subreddit, it seems to be a common feeling. But this happens to every single EA game. People pay a subscription to access games approaching a year old in the access vault. It's not being given away for free <iframe width="23.96" height="5.72" id="MoatPxIOPT1_88823011" scrolling="no" style="border-style: none; left: 15px; top: -5px; width: 23.96px; height: 5.72px; position: absolute; z-index: -9999;"></iframe> <iframe width="23.96" height="5.72" id="MoatPxIOPT1_59445040" scrolling="no" style="border-style: none; left: 1138px; top: -5px; width: 23.96px; height: 5.72px; position: absolute; z-index: -9999;"></iframe> <iframe width="23.96" height="5.72" id="MoatPxIOPT1_98036948" scrolling="no" style="border-style: none; left: 15px; top: 224px; width: 23.96px; height: 5.72px; position: absolute; z-index: -9999;"></iframe> <iframe width="23.96" height="5.72" id="MoatPxIOPT1_94121295" scrolling="no" style="border-style: none; left: 1138px; top: 224px; width: 23.96px; height: 5.72px; position: absolute; z-index: -9999;"></iframe> Ummmm? those games are not, as far as I know are "LIVE SERVICE" games, so your saying were going back to subscription based games? If so then a lot of us got screwed buying the game in the first place, sorry but Bioware has at least let me down so I'm at the point of prove it before I buy it.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 21, 2019 22:07:24 GMT
Well, I am simply conveying the feelings people over at the anthem subreddit seem to be expressing. Nothing wrong with sharing it. I guess I'd hoped to see this concern quoted from a credible rational source.
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midnight tea
Twitter Guru
gateway beverage
Posts: 7,093 Likes: 16,583
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Post by midnight tea on May 21, 2019 22:08:38 GMT
But this happens to every single EA game. People pay a subscription to access games approaching a year old in the access vault. It's not being given away for free Ummmm? those games are not, as far as I know are "LIVE SERVICE" games, so your saying were going back to subscription based games? If so then a lot of us got screwed buying the game in the first place, sorry but Bioware has at least let me down so I'm at the point of prove it before I buy it. Which games? Most of the ones released in last few years are indeed live service or have live service features. Also - all of the games from EA Origins can be unlocked permanently by buying them from the Origins storefront. Only those who aren't interested with permanent unlock or want to have access to more than one game for a price of 5/15$ a month pay for subscription, after which they have access to anything that is in the Vault/Premier Vault.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by samhain444 on May 21, 2019 22:14:35 GMT
By buying the game, at whatever price you paid for it, you got/get access to all current and future content. BioWare/EA has not gone back on this so, despite whatever salty reddit echo chamber F2P was conceived, they don't have a case for it. New content is incoming and you will get it if you bought the game.
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 21, 2019 22:23:10 GMT
By buying the game, at whatever price you paid for it, you got/get access to all current and future content. BioWare/EA has not gone back on this so, despite whatever salty reddit echo chamber F2P was conceived, they don't have a case for it. New content is incoming and you will get it if you bought the game. They feel like they paid full price for an early access game, which others might get for a fraction of that. They feel a little cheated.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 21, 2019 23:39:58 GMT
They feel like they paid full price for an early access game, which others might get for a fraction of that. They feel a little cheated. They would have fair cause to feel annoyed by the launch bugs, though those were addressed in patches 1.0.3/4. They got the advertised critical path and a game very easy to throw many hours into. If you want to play on day one, the price is higher, there's nothing unusual there.
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