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Post by Catilina on Apr 23, 2017 21:19:33 GMT
Then this is my opinion, and perhaps not so popular. I don't care about Varric's reaction, I like him, but not my favorite. I just don't care about the Wardens. The know their purpose well without Alistair/Loghain/Stroud. as I said: these are not a pile of helpless kittens. If they are, then Alistair/Loghain/Stroud can't help. And it's fine to have differing opinions but it's not fine to go back and forth because of someone's opinion. It's fine that you dont agree with what I think, but it's not going to change my way of thinking. Then why you answered? Or what you now wrote, an unpopular opinion? Here is mine: This is a bad writing decision, just for more drama.
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Post by envious on Apr 23, 2017 21:24:35 GMT
And it's fine to have differing opinions but it's not fine to go back and forth because of someone's opinion. It's fine that you dont agree with what I think, but it's not going to change my way of thinking. Then why you answered? Or what you now wrote, an unpopular opinion? Because you keep replying in a way that doesn't make the discussion come to an end.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 23, 2017 21:59:43 GMT
Man I really love this thread, here are some more: I don't think mages should be completly free Loghain is the best character in the series Cassandra is the best Divine choice, the only downside is that she doesn't want the position Champions of the Just is goddamn underrated Calphernia is miles better than Samson
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Post by Domakir on Apr 24, 2017 9:22:49 GMT
Man I really love this thread, here are some more: I don't think mages should be completly free Loghain is the best character in the series Cassandra is the best Divine choice, the only downside is that she doesn't want the position Champions of the Just is goddamn underrated Calphernia is miles better than SamsonI thought those were popular opinions.
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Post by leadintea on Apr 24, 2017 9:39:47 GMT
Inb4 Patrick pulls a unicorn and rainbow ending where they make the world a mix of the spirit and real world and the maker is part of all of us or something. I don't know too much about Weekes' writing but from what he gave us in DAI, I'm very worried that he's going to make DA4 feel even more saccharine than DAI felt. I'm especially worried about how PC he's going to make the game, and I say this as a black and gay male. I seriously hope the rest of the writing team are able to write some more dark, gritty, and realistic stories especially since we're going to Tevinter of all places, and not follow the impossibly idealistic stories in DAI.
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Post by Mark7 on Apr 24, 2017 10:11:32 GMT
At least you can kill off Ali in DAO or DAI, but Morrigan has too much plot armor for my taste. That seems to be more popular than you think, actually. I don't share that opinion, but others here seem to. That's not an opinion that's a fact. Morrigan could have been easly killed in Redclieffe by all those who refused her deal. Once Gaider was asked about why the game forced to let her go no matter what and he had to concede the fact that was just a plot protection,when he was arguing with an user who wanted to add the option via mod in the game.
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Post by Domakir on Apr 24, 2017 10:33:31 GMT
Oghren is way better than Varric. Sera is awesome and it's easy to understand what she says.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 13:14:19 GMT
Man I really love this thread, here are some more: I don't think mages should be completly free Loghain is the best character in the series Cassandra is the best Divine choice, the only downside is that she doesn't want the position Champions of the Just is goddamn underrated Calphernia is miles better than SamsonI thought those were popular opinions. I made a poll about which one is the best Divine and Leliana won like 60% and since many people go with mages Calphernia is not so popular
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Post by Catilina on Apr 24, 2017 13:57:37 GMT
I thought those were popular opinions. I made a poll about which one is the best Divine and Leliana won like 60% and since many people go with mages Calphernia is not so popular Leliana the best not only in the mage viewpoint, but even elf, dwarf and qunari. She is the reformation. Cassandra's not bad, but not even enough. The Chantry's rebuild from the ashes has untapped potential, Cassandra too conservative to use. But if Leliana become Divine, Cassandra support her, despite their opposite views on many things. I like Cassandra rebuild Seekers, and she and the Inquisition support Leliana. I think, this not about Calpernia, it's about rather the Templars. And the fact, that (the fake) Lod Seeker Lucius refused the Inquisitor's offer, and Ser Barris follows him, instead to join. After this, and Fiona's warning, there are no much reason to follow the Templars. And mages have more potencial with the veil. And someone wants to give a chance to mages to get respect.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 14:07:44 GMT
I made a poll about which one is the best Divine and Leliana won like 60% and since many people go with mages Calphernia is not so popular Leliana the best not only in the mage viewpoint, but even elf, dwarf and qunari. She is the reformation. Cassandra's not bad, but not even enough. The Chantry's rebuild from the ashes has untapped potential, Cassandra too conservative to use. But if Leliana become Divine, Cassandra support her, despite their opposite views on many things. I like Cassandra rebuild Seekers, and she and the Inquisition support Leliana. I think, this not about Calpernia, it's about rather the Templars. And the fact, that (the fake) Lod Seeker Lucius refused the Inquisitor's offer, and Ser Barris follows him, instead to join. After this, and Fiona's warning, there are no much reason to follow the Templars. And mages have more potencial with the veil. And someone wants to give a chance to mages to get respect. Leliana is the best in mage point until a major posession happens and abominations destroy an entire village or something, after that everyone including mages will blame Leliana for dissolving circles, Everyone will start hating mages and then mages themselves will blame her for making them unprotected. Elves, dwarves and qunari as priests? It is bound to cause racial problems and more death. Cassandra is more realistic and is the more logical choice for peace imo. I really like Leliana, she is my only romance choice in origins but she is just too sunshine and rainbows.
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Post by Catilina on Apr 24, 2017 14:09:10 GMT
Leliana the best not only in the mage viewpoint, but even elf, dwarf and qunari. She is the reformation. Cassandra's not bad, but not even enough. The Chantry's rebuild from the ashes has untapped potential, Cassandra too conservative to use. But if Leliana become Divine, Cassandra support her, despite their opposite views on many things. I like Cassandra rebuild Seekers, and she and the Inquisition support Leliana. I think, this not about Calpernia, it's about rather the Templars. And the fact, that (the fake) Lod Seeker Lucius refused the Inquisitor's offer, and Ser Barris follows him, instead to join. After this, and Fiona's warning, there are no much reason to follow the Templars. And mages have more potencial with the veil. And someone wants to give a chance to mages to get respect. Leliana is the best in mage point until a major posession happens and abominations destroy an entire village or something, after that everyone including mages will blame Leliana for dissolving circles, Everyone will start hating mages and then mages themselves will blame her for making them unprotected. Elves, dwarves and qunari as priests? It is bound to cause racial problems and more death. Cassandra is more realistic and is the more logical choice for peace imo. 1. The abominations are very rare also about the Codex. 2. So: the best way to eliminate the racism to maintain the racism... Ti eliminate the fear to maintain the fear... interesting method!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 14:18:36 GMT
Leliana is the best in mage point until a major posession happens and abominations destroy an entire village or something, after that everyone including mages will blame Leliana for dissolving circles, Everyone will start hating mages and then mages themselves will blame her for making them unprotected. Elves, dwarves and qunari as priests? It is bound to cause racial problems and more death. Cassandra is more realistic and is the more logical choice for peace imo. 1. The abominations are very rare also about the Codex. 2. So: the best way to eliminate the racism to maintain the racism... Ti eliminate the fear to maintain the fear... interesting method! 1-If they are so rare why did we fight abominations at every step in Kirkwall 2- Allow me to put it this way; if all the countries in the world decieded to open borders to everyone do you think everybody will live happily ever after? Of course not, there are shitload of extremist out there who will start wars. In a perfect world it is a good idea but not a realistic one
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Apr 24, 2017 14:20:33 GMT
Inb4 Patrick pulls a unicorn and rainbow ending where they make the world a mix of the spirit and real world and the maker is part of all of us or something. I don't know too much about Weekes' writing but from what he gave us in DAI, I'm very worried that he's going to make DA4 feel even more saccharine than DAI felt. I'm especially worried about how PC he's going to make the game, and I say this as a black and gay male. I seriously hope the rest of the writing team are able to write some more dark, gritty, and realistic stories especially since we're going to Tevinter of all places, and not follow the impossibly idealistic stories in DAI. Unfortunately I think he's going to. It's just the way his style is. He can write dark things and there's plenty of nuance in his writing but he always ends up leaning towards the optimistic or "the feels". The way he described the process of making certain moments in Trespasser he, albeit jokingly, said they wanted to "bring the feels" and they used an Avengers movie as their razor (for ref. they use all sorts of movies. For ME3 it was prim. WW2 movies) but I think it goes to show where their aspirations lie. I can't remember if it was a blog post or a tweet, or maybe an interview, but Patrick talked about when he started writing he'd always get told "don't try to impress the reader" and he's been working on that the more he's learned I think but it still shows that it's part of his writer DNA I think that he can't help but try a bit too hard. Think Solas or Cole and certain passages of pure text that I suspected was his work, it's very beautiful prose but also slightly overdone. Not exactly purple prose but as you say it's just a tad saccharine and I think it's inevitably going to be part of DA4. As for PC, there's going to be some. On national trans-day he wrote "we love you and we will fight for you" and several other leads on the DA team go to LGBT conventions and proudly announce themselves as "social justice warriors" so there's no way it's not going to influence the game which doesn't necessarily mean it's going to hurt the story itself. But as a replacement for Gaider I'm not sure how bad it is because Gaider watches Sense8 and loves it lol, but that aside he always did strike me as a more moderate and sometimes cynical writer which I consider a good thing. From Dorian to Cassandra, Aveline, Morrigan etc. he always wounds up writing some of my favorite characters just by their character traits. There's a lot of him in those characters and I think it usually lends itself to pretty sharp and witty writing. I tend to drift off a bit when talking to Solas or Cole in Inquisition by contrast and... controversial opinion, but I never really was invested in the Quarians in MET even if Tali's Loyalty mission was pretty good. I'll still take Patrick as lead any day over a hack like Mac Walters who can barely even write one simple coherent story (check his comics), who's just there because his colleagues wrongfully assumed that he was smart because that's what he's trying to be like Damon Lindelof ("blablabla deep, meaningful, I'm an artist, buzzwords, buzzwords, buzzwords, btw my stories never make sense in the end").
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Post by Catilina on Apr 24, 2017 14:28:11 GMT
1. The abominations are very rare also about the Codex. 2. So: the best way to eliminate the racism to maintain the racism... Ti eliminate the fear to maintain the fear... interesting method! 1-If they are so rare why did we fight abominations at every step in Kirkwall 2- Allow me to put it this way; if all the countries in the world decieded to open borders to everyone do you think everybody will live happily ever after? Of course not, there are shitload of extremist out there who will start wars. In a perfect world it is a good idea but not a realistic one Because over Kirkwall the veil was extremely weak, and the Circle was extremely cruel. All Templars and Mages was damaged, who better who less. I did not write about the borders, I wrote about the equal treatment of people.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 14:31:50 GMT
1-If they are so rare why did we fight abominations at every step in Kirkwall 2- Allow me to put it this way; if all the countries in the world decieded to open borders to everyone do you think everybody will live happily ever after? Of course not, there are shitload of extremist out there who will start wars. In a perfect world it is a good idea but not a realistic one Because over Kirkwall the veil was extremely weak, and the Circle was extremely cruel. All Templars and Mages was damaged, who better who less. I did not write about the borders, I wrote about the equal treatment of people. So is the veil only weak in Kirkwall and it cannot happen anywhere else, or even in kirkwall again? It's the closest example I can give that relates to real life and it's a pretty close example imo
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Post by Catilina on Apr 24, 2017 14:46:52 GMT
Because over Kirkwall the veil was extremely weak, and the Circle was extremely cruel. All Templars and Mages was damaged, who better who less. I did not write about the borders, I wrote about the equal treatment of people. So is the veil only weak in Kirkwall and it cannot happen anywhere else, or even in kirkwall again? It's the closest example I can give that relates to real life and it's a pretty close example imo Yes, in Kirkwall the veil was extremely weak, and the oppression (the stress on Mages) was extremely big. (And for a counterpoint to cruel Templars needed crazy Mages... ) Okay, rather let's talk about the elves ... And: Andrastian elves (dwarves, "qunari"), who can be Chantry sister/mother. They are people and even their religion same as the Andrastian humans, what's the problem? Cowardice can not be a reason for repression and discrimination.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 15:07:33 GMT
So is the veil only weak in Kirkwall and it cannot happen anywhere else, or even in kirkwall again? It's the closest example I can give that relates to real life and it's a pretty close example imo Yes, in Kirkwall the veil was extremely weak, and the oppression (the stress on Mages) was extremely big. (And for a counterpoint to cruel Templars needed crazy Mages... ) Okay, rather let's talk about the elves ... And: Andrastian elves (dwarves, "qunari"), who can be Chantry sister/mother. They are people and even their religion same as the Andrastian humans, what's the problem? Cowardice can not be a reason for repression and discrimination. Templars aren't the only ones who can oppress mages, it can be some angry mob or even their families. There is no problem with me here, but if you think everyone will accept it because lady pope says so you would be very wrong. Should innocents die in order to give people a chance to be priests?
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Post by Catilina on Apr 24, 2017 15:26:39 GMT
Yes, in Kirkwall the veil was extremely weak, and the oppression (the stress on Mages) was extremely big. (And for a counterpoint to cruel Templars needed crazy Mages... ) Okay, rather let's talk about the elves ... And: Andrastian elves (dwarves, "qunari"), who can be Chantry sister/mother. They are people and even their religion same as the Andrastian humans, what's the problem? Cowardice can not be a reason for repression and discrimination. Templars aren't the only ones who can oppress mages, it can be some angry mob or even their families. There is no problem with me here, but if you think everyone will accept it because lady pope says so you would be very wrong. Should innocents die in order to give people a chance to be priests? Oh, great, this is what I always say: Anders was right, that he blew up the Chantry. Because of the Chantry's fault the institutionalized fear. But just hear Bethany (she also say, that the people MUST to learn to live together with the free mages. Everyone know, that Bethany is the soberest mage ever): The non-human races treatment in the Chantry and their chance to be full member is is not about the priest position, this is about the rights. Always innocents dying for every cause. The people are idiots (mostly). Oh, we already have exhausted the subject. So: In Cassandra's case, not all Mages joined to the Circles willingly and peacefully. Vivienne forced to release those who are not willing to join the Circle. (I agree that Vivienne is a joke as Divine, but not because she is a mage) All new divine's appointment involves risks, in this light, the reformer is the best.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 16:03:22 GMT
Templars aren't the only ones who can oppress mages, it can be some angry mob or even their families. There is no problem with me here, but if you think everyone will accept it because lady pope says so you would be very wrong. Should innocents die in order to give people a chance to be priests? Oh, great, this is what I always say: Anders was right, that he blew up the Chantry. Because of the Chantry's fault the institutionalized fear. But just hear Bethany (she also say, that the people MUST to learn to live together with the free mages. Everyone know, that Bethany is the soberest mage ever): The non-human races treatment in the Chantry and their chance to be full member is is not about the priest position, this is about the rights. Always innocents dying for every cause. The people are idiots (mostly). Oh, we already have exhausted the subject. So: In Cassandra's case, not all Mages joined to the Circles willingly and peacefully. Vivienne forced to release those who are not willing to join the Circle. (I agree that Vivienne is a joke as Divine, but not because she is a mage) All new divine's appointment involves risks, in this light, the reformer is the best. Btw although I was arguing with you Leliana is Divine in my canon world state I just don't like to see everything black and white and point out the faults in every desicion I make. I don't agree with you about Anders being right because he was not imo, and like with everything in DA world there is no easy answer to that nor to anything else this is what makes this game great. I kept arguing with you because I always liked a good debate.
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Post by riverdaleswhiteflash on Apr 24, 2017 16:07:54 GMT
That seems to be more popular than you think, actually. I don't share that opinion, but others here seem to. That's not an opinion that's a fact. Morrigan could have been easly killed in Redclieffe by all those who refused her deal. Once Gaider was asked about why the game forced to let her go no matter what and he had to concede the fact that was just a plot protection,when he was arguing with an user who wanted to add the option via mod in the game. I don't know if anyone except a mage or a templar could have killed her "easily," even if we assume she hadn't learned how to reassemble herself after a stabbing yet. She can turn into a bird. A bird flying intelligently isn't going to get hit with a sword and can make themselves difficult to put an arrow in. The only way to kill her is to make that not an option. Though I'll grant that maybe the Warden should at least have been allowed to try, and that a mage or templar maybe should have been able to succeed..
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Post by Catilina on Apr 24, 2017 16:27:00 GMT
Oh, great, this is what I always say: Anders was right, that he blew up the Chantry. Because of the Chantry's fault the institutionalized fear. But just hear Bethany (she also say, that the people MUST to learn to live together with the free mages. Everyone know, that Bethany is the soberest mage ever): The non-human races treatment in the Chantry and their chance to be full member is is not about the priest position, this is about the rights. Always innocents dying for every cause. The people are idiots (mostly). Oh, we already have exhausted the subject. So: In Cassandra's case, not all Mages joined to the Circles willingly and peacefully. Vivienne forced to release those who are not willing to join the Circle. (I agree that Vivienne is a joke as Divine, but not because she is a mage) All new divine's appointment involves risks, in this light, the reformer is the best. Btw although I was arguing with you Leliana is Divine in my canon world state I just don't like to see everything black and white and point out the faults in every desicion I make. I don't agree with you about Anders being right because he was not imo, and like with everything in DA world there is no easy answer to that nor to anything else this is what makes this game great. I kept arguing with you because I always liked a good debate. I think it's hard to explain with "gray morality". The oppression and abuse of power are BLACK, no doubt. Everything else can only be started from this point of view. Anders destroyed the symbol of the 1000 years oppression, and took away the possibility of compromise, and started a necessary revolution. The peaceful solution didn't exist, Fiona also tried, but failed. The Chantry needed the purge for the new start. Leliana and possibly Cassandra able to it (I suppose, Cassandra is too naive, she even trusted in Varric! She is a good person, but she needs to be more careful, to keep away the corruption). Leliana's reforms also good. The Mages know their danger, and the conclave able to handle it, and as I said: Leliana has Cassandra's and her seekers' support. The Chantry also good, if the other races can join as equal part. I also enjoy a good debate
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 16:39:35 GMT
Btw although I was arguing with you Leliana is Divine in my canon world state I just don't like to see everything black and white and point out the faults in every desicion I make. I don't agree with you about Anders being right because he was not imo, and like with everything in DA world there is no easy answer to that nor to anything else this is what makes this game great. I kept arguing with you because I always liked a good debate. I think it's hard to explain with "gray morality". The oppression and abuse of power are BLACK, no doubt. Everything else can only be started from this point of view. Anders destroyed the symbol of the 1000 years oppression, and took away the possibility of compromise, and started a necessary revolution. The peaceful solution didn't exist, Fiona also tried, but failed. The Chantry needed the purge for the new start. Leliana and possibly Cassandra able to it (I suppose, Cassandra is too naive, she even trusted in Varric! She is a good person, but she needs to be more careful, to keep away the corruption). Leliana's reforms also good. The Mages know their danger, and the conclave able to handle it, and as I said: Leliana has Cassandra's and her seekers' support. The Chantry also good, if the other races can join as equal part. I also enjoy a good debate But think about Quentin and other mad mages, it's easy to forget mages are just people, and like every person they have their normal ones and lunatics and a mage lunatic can be more dangerous. As much as you'd like to think so it's not all black. I don't believe under any circumstance killing huge amount of people is wrong no matter how noble your intentions are. Just like Solas, he wants to restore his people which is good but he almost destroyed the world and will try again which is bad. Also as Vivienne points out not all circles were oppressive we saw only Ferelen and Kikwall it's 2/14 (I think), so there was no need for a bloody war
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 17:06:02 GMT
I thought those were popular opinions. I made a poll about which one is the best Divine and Leliana won like 60% and since many people go with mages Calphernia is not so popular You're not the first to make that poll. There were plenty of polls about who was the best Divine right after the game first came out in the official forums and Cassandra consistently won because she represented the middle ground between Vivienne and Leliana. I believe those polls are more accurate than yours simply because they were more timely and in a larger forum.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 24, 2017 17:18:11 GMT
I made a poll about which one is the best Divine and Leliana won like 60% and since many people go with mages Calphernia is not so popular You're not the first to make that poll. There were plenty of polls about who was the best Divine right after the game first came out in the official forums and Cassandra consistently won because she represented the middle ground between Vivienne and Leliana. I believe those polls are more accurate than yours simply because they were more timely and in a larger forum. Really? I searched for it but I saw Leliana win generally
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Catilina on Apr 24, 2017 17:19:35 GMT
I think it's hard to explain with "gray morality". The oppression and abuse of power are BLACK, no doubt. Everything else can only be started from this point of view. Anders destroyed the symbol of the 1000 years oppression, and took away the possibility of compromise, and started a necessary revolution. The peaceful solution didn't exist, Fiona also tried, but failed. The Chantry needed the purge for the new start. Leliana and possibly Cassandra able to it (I suppose, Cassandra is too naive, she even trusted in Varric! She is a good person, but she needs to be more careful, to keep away the corruption). Leliana's reforms also good. The Mages know their danger, and the conclave able to handle it, and as I said: Leliana has Cassandra's and her seekers' support. The Chantry also good, if the other races can join as equal part. I also enjoy a good debate But think about Quentin and other mad mages, it's easy to forget mages are just people, and like every person they have their normal ones and lunatics and a mage lunatic can be more dangerous. As much as you'd like to think so it's not all black. I don't believe under any circumstance killing huge amount of people is wrong no matter how noble your intentions are. Just like Solas, he wants to restore his people which is good but he almost destroyed the world and will try again which is bad. Also as Vivienne points out not all circles were oppressive we saw only Ferelen and Kikwall it's 2/14 (I think), so there was no need for a bloody war Because of an ax killer, you do not have to lock all the loggers into jail and ban the use of the axes. Quentin was a madman. Because of the Starkhaven Circle? Don't exluded. The Starkhaven Circle was cruel too, I'm not surprised, that the mages rebelled. Probably the Starkhaven Circle was subordinate to Kirkwall Chantry, because Kirkwall was the Templar Centre. Vivienne was a Circle mage from her childhood. I think she wasn't normal. Just as Wynne. She also damaged, when the Chantry had take away her child (with her lover's agree – if Gregoir was the father of Wynne's son.) Huon also lost his mind, I didn't saw any totally sane mage – AND Templar... True. the Circles wasn't same: there were cruel Circles and more cruel Circles. Unfortunately, people have to pay now ... for the Chantry's cruelty. The Chantry has played a dangerous game for hundreds of years and, now failed. That happen: the patience is running out.
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