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Post by Catilina on Feb 23, 2018 23:37:43 GMT
I can't say that so clearly (I didn't read the book), but really has some honourable moment, and I loved as the father-in-law. In the Inquisition his cameo is great. (And good sacrifice material – sorry.)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2018 23:43:58 GMT
If only Alistair didn't run away... I was just talking to Quartermaster Threnn at Skyhold in my "Loghain is alive" worldstate. Apparently Loghain not only recognized her, but remembered her name. Threnn lauded him to me as the greatest commander in the world. I know, I like Loghain, but not over Alistair though.
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Post by themikefest on Feb 24, 2018 0:05:54 GMT
rras1994 I just find it hard to believe that 5+ years in, she came to that conclusion. She had so much time to think about things that quick illogical decisions make no sense. It would have made sense if she'd done it as soon as Merril had talked to the demon the first time, but years and years of performing blood magic is when she finally has a crazy chicken head cut off moment? Stupid is as stupid does. The same for that stupid little elf Merril. She's too lazy to get lyrium that she decides it would be better to make a deal with a demon.
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Post by phoray on Feb 24, 2018 0:24:10 GMT
If only Alistair didn't run away... I was just talking to Quartermaster Threnn at Skyhold in my "Loghain is alive" worldstate. Apparently Loghain not only recognized her, but remembered her name. Threnn lauded him to me as the greatest commander in the world. I was seriously irritated that in my "Loghain sacrificed himself to kill the Archdemon" world state, that I got the same dialogue as if I'd chopped off his head. I thought it was supposed to be Redemption. Now if I want some sort of "loghain dies for redemption" arc, I gotta drag him into DAI and feed him to a Spider Demon. Then and only then will Varric say some stuff and write a story. I don't even like Loghain alive, but it's these small details that I laud Bioware for so... shame?
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Post by Templar Knight on Feb 24, 2018 0:26:07 GMT
I was just talking to Quartermaster Threnn at Skyhold in my "Loghain is alive" worldstate. Apparently Loghain not only recognized her, but remembered her name. Threnn lauded him to me as the greatest commander in the world. I know, I like Loghain, but not over Alistair though. Yeah, I'm planning to make Alistair king in my next playthrough. Apparently you can do that *and* spare Loghain... but you have to harden Alistair for that, right? I love Alistair. From a utilitarian perspective, "hardening" one person and letting a second person live is a better outcome than sparing the first person's feelings and beheading the second person... But I don't know if I want to harden Alistair.
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Post by Raga on Feb 24, 2018 0:29:39 GMT
The reason I don't like Loghain is actually a really insightful thing that Alistair says. He explains it well. Loghain does love the country and he does want what's best for it. In fact he loves it so much and he fought for it so hard that he's completely convinced that he's the only person on the planet who's capable of defending it and making necessary sacrifices for it. So naturally anybody who disagrees with him or resists him must be a traitor or a coward or some such. A savior complex is a strange form of arrogance, but it is a toxic form of arrogance none the less.
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Post by vertigomez on Feb 24, 2018 0:31:36 GMT
I know, I like Loghain, but not over Alistair though. Yeah, I'm planning to make Alistair king in my next playthrough. Apparently you can do that *and* spare Loghain... but you have to harden Alistair for that, right? I love Alistair. From a utilitarian perspective, "hardening" one person and letting a second person live is a better outcome than sparing the first person's feelings and beheading the second person... But I don't know if I want to harden Alistair. FWIW, this was my plan on my most recent playthrough and it didn't work. I can only guess it was a bug, because I Hardened Alistair, had him and Anora agree to marry, dueled Loghain myself... no dice, Al stormed off when I wouldn't chop a guy's head off in front of his daughter. :sob: But I've always heard that it was possible and it's definitely possible in the Keep, so I dunno.
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Post by Catilina on Feb 24, 2018 0:31:41 GMT
I know, I like Loghain, but not over Alistair though. Yeah, I'm planning to make Alistair king in my next playthrough. Apparently you can do that *and* spare Loghain... but you have to harden Alistair for that, right? I love Alistair. From a utilitarian perspective, "hardening" one person and letting a second person live is a better outcome than sparing the first person's feelings and beheading the second person... But I don't know if I want to harden Alistair. Yes, you have to harden Alistair, or he goes drunk. He runs straight to Kirkwall, to The Hanged Man.
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Post by Lazarillo on Feb 24, 2018 0:42:35 GMT
FWIW, this was my plan on my most recent playthrough and it didn't work. I can only guess it was a bug, because I Hardened Alistair, had him and Anora agree to marry, dueled Loghain myself... no dice, Al stormed off when I wouldn't chop a guy's head off in front of his daughter. :sob: But I've always heard that it was possible and it's definitely possible in the Keep, so I dunno. Well, prolly too late now, but IIRC, something about the final choices can bug out if you volunteer Dog as a champion before the fight. I can't remember if it was that, specifically, but I do remember there was something I tried to do once, that some option ended up missing after the fight when I did the gag before the battle. Maybe it's that?
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Post by vertigomez on Feb 24, 2018 0:49:45 GMT
FWIW, this was my plan on my most recent playthrough and it didn't work. I can only guess it was a bug, because I Hardened Alistair, had him and Anora agree to marry, dueled Loghain myself... no dice, Al stormed off when I wouldn't chop a guy's head off in front of his daughter. But I've always heard that it was possible and it's definitely possible in the Keep, so I dunno. Well, prolly too late now, but IIRC, something about the final choices can bug out if you volunteer Dog as a champion before the fight. I can't remember if it was that, specifically, but I do remember there was something I tried to do once, that some option ended up missing after the fight when I did the gag before the battle. Maybe it's that? It could've been something similar, though I didn't volunteer Dog as my champion. I fought him myself 'cause I wanted to see Loghain get his ass whupped by a four foot tall ball of metal and rage. Plus he was talking shit about dwarven honor. I had to shame him in front of everyone.
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Post by Catilina on Feb 24, 2018 1:04:09 GMT
Doesn't seem like the best example considering he ran out and did precisely what the Circle was trying to prevent him from doing: blood magic, murder, etc. And it's only after he does that and realizes "oh, wait, this *sucks*" that he wants to undo it and make it right. So, sure, there is some logic in teaching a child not to stick his hand in fires by letting him stick his hand in fires, but I would hardly call someone "immature" because they just believed their parents when they said "don't stick your hand in fires" and never got burned in the first place. You can exercise maturity in two ways: by learning from mistakes and also by recognizing that something is stupid before the fact and just *not* doing it. *Edit* Oops sorry, quoted wrong post. Meant to quote this: "*thinks of Jowan* Umm... love the guy, but he doesn't really grow up until he escapes the Circle. In that way, he finds that courage within,defending peasants in the countryside from Darkspawn! or giving himself over to certain tranquility and death to right his own wrong. but it would never have happened in the circle" Jowan learned the blood magic inside the Circle. (And Uldred was Irving's bait... just for sake of truth) Jowan used the blood magic well: he only pushed the Templars away he didn't kill anyone, just wanted to be free. And yes, Jowan poisoned Eamon Arl, because (the current) hero of Ferelden, regent of Ferelden offered him freedom, and probably said: he serves the good. Jowan, in fact, was a good mage. His only sin is: he wanted to be free, and to protect his love. His tool was questionable – according to the Chantry a sin, according to me: the best tool against the Templars: until the Circles are prisons, the sabotage is acceptable, the blood magic is self-defence. (Uldred was a fool, the foolishness is unacceptable) Jowan able to take the responsibility for his sin (I like to let him run, he doesn't deserve Tranquility for Loghain's sin).
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Post by phoray on Feb 24, 2018 1:36:16 GMT
Apparently you can do that *and* spare Loghain. Hardened and Has to marry Anora. And even if you let Loghain die to kill the AD, he barely relents on his hatred for you. I think he won't even speak to you if he still lives. vertigomezI fought Loghain. Put him in Gripping prison? Electrocuted him? Fastest duel yet. Al married Anora just fine.
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Post by vertigomez on Feb 24, 2018 1:46:34 GMT
Apparently you can do that *and* spare Loghain. Hardened and Has to marry Anora. And even if you let Loghain die to kill the AD, he barely relents on his hatred for you. I think he won't even speak to you if he still lives. vertigomez I fought Loghain. Put him in Gripping prison? Electrocuted him? Fastest duel yet. Al married Anora just fine. Mage vs. Loghain used to be my go-to strategy. I'd sic Morrigan on him and she just whacked him with Paralyze and Cone of Cold and a bunch of nasty offensive spells. Fun, but it always felt like cheating. I think I must've hit some kind of bug with Alistair leaving 'cause I'm sure I did everything right.
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Post by themikefest on Feb 24, 2018 1:46:35 GMT
Jowan was a pathetic little weakling. So he thought dabbing in blood magic would make him a better mage. Fool. And to think Lilly, The Silly, Initiate was attracted to a goober like him. Its too bad my mage couldn't apply the walking bomb spell on the Joke Jowan. I do like that Bioware gave the player the option to kill him when first seeing him in prison in Recliffe castle. excellent.
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Post by phoray on Feb 24, 2018 1:50:16 GMT
Mage vs. Loghain used to be my go-to strategy. I thought I wouldn't be allowed to fight Loghain at all, being a mage. Lore of the world states a mage would obliterate you in single combat unless you're a Templar. Course no one blinked an eye as I volunteered, especially Loghain
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Post by themikefest on Feb 24, 2018 2:21:58 GMT
I had Leliana fight Loghain once. He was so mesmerized by her red hair and singing, he surrendered
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by TheodoricFriede on Feb 24, 2018 2:31:21 GMT
I turned into bee's.
He didn't like that.
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Post by vertigomez on Feb 24, 2018 2:31:58 GMT
I had Leliana fight Loghain once. He was so mesmerized by her red hair and singing, he surrendered Loghain's fear of the wily Orlesians lead to his defeat at the hands of a wily Orlesian. Poetic.
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Post by phoray on Feb 24, 2018 2:35:03 GMT
So many good ways to defeat loghain.
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Post by Catilina on Feb 24, 2018 2:48:58 GMT
So many good ways to defeat loghain. First I did it with a shapeshifter (how I miss that druid-kind magic! The shapeshifter and the keeper.)
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Post by Raga on Feb 24, 2018 3:17:11 GMT
I usually just let Alistair fight him. Solves the problem of what to do with him after the fight too.
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Post by vertigomez on Feb 24, 2018 4:19:02 GMT
It's a surprisingly easy fight. I like kicking him with my rogue. First time I fought him he scared me with his speech, though no way could I beat the Loghain. Its a fun fight. My S&S warrior got her ass kicked. That fight was harder than the Archdemon. :DD:
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2018 4:24:26 GMT
It's a surprisingly easy fight. I like kicking him with my rogue. First time I fought him he scared me with his speech, though no way could I beat the Loghain. Its a fun fight. It's easy to beat him, if your a warrior with the champion trait to re-shout him down if necessary . Saved me so many deaths in doing that tactic against him Also, it'll make you immune to his shouts too, and I was wearing extremely good armor I found down in the deep roads doing that quest, so I was fine.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2018 4:59:39 GMT
It's easy to beat him, if your a warrior with the champion trait to re-shout him down if necessary . Saved me so many deaths in doing that tactic against him Also, it'll make you immune to his shouts too, and I was wearing extremely good armor I found down in the deep roads doing that quest, so I was fine. The war cry? Thanks I'm playing a warrior elf, I'll use it. Not sure If I have before. Yeah, as my Amell, he had the upper advantage considering I kept on being knocked down by his Champion shout (I think it's the war cry) so yeah my Cousland had the upper advantage as she was immune to it, and that allowed the battle to happen quickly
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Post by vertigomez on Feb 24, 2018 5:10:13 GMT
My S&S warrior got her ass kicked. That fight was harder than the Archdemon. Whats S&S? The build up to the Loghain duel was done really well, my Cousland didn't think she could beat such a great soldier, the whole thing psyched me out, and was surprised I could beat him. I loved the archdemon fight and they way he kept moving around and the darkspawn kept coming. Died so many times. First time the elves were with me. Templars and wolves were the best though. Sword-and-shield. Loghain and I had a tank vs. tank battle. It was mostly a lot of yelling and slamming into each other.
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