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Post by garrusfan1 on Sept 12, 2016 23:06:16 GMT
I think it would be cool to do this but difficult as well. You would have to have some of the same characters in it. If your character romanced someone that means you would have to cheat on them,break up with them,or have no romance in DA4 unless that character was with you again. But it would be cool to have him or her again as long as they take care of that
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Post by cardbutton on Sept 12, 2016 23:45:18 GMT
I think it would be cool to do this but difficult as well. Y ou would have to have some of the same characters in it. If your character romanced someone that means you would have to cheat on them,break up with them,or have no romance in DA4 unless that character was with you again. But it would be cool to have him or her again as long as they take care of that LOL I've actually been posting a "little" side project on this subject on a different thread. Dual PC with a Inquisitor and a Tevinter. Regardless, the characters that need to return are heavily dependent on what they actually plan to having the Inquisitor doing as a PC, and what story they are playing out. For example, since my fan concept was heavily based around the Inquisitor going undercover in Tevinter, returning characters were widdled down to the bare essentials to follow that theme; with an interactive letter system made for the Inquisitor PC to keep in contact with their LI's while their away. The characters from previous content I ended up using were: Dorian and Calpernia, both serve as Advisors; Harding since she would be fun to have again as a full party member, or even Romance option; Sten from DA:O since he's the Arishok now; and Marris, Tessa, Maevaris, Titus, and Radonis from the DA comics. But again, thats for my personal concept. When deciding who should come back with an Inquisitor PC, base your decisions on ultimately what they would do in (and for) a story ... rather than what relationship they have with the Inquisitor themselves. Having an LI or character back is great and all, but if they accomplish nothing but merely being present they are a waste of money and resources that could be used for other characters. Function, over form, as it were.
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Post by Sylvius the Mad on Sept 13, 2016 0:02:50 GMT
The Inquisitor could return without any other returning characters. That would also make it much easier to do, as the game wouldn't need to worry about the various possible states of those prior relationships.
The benefit of a returning protagonist is it lets us continue that character's story. The other characters don't matter.
That said, a returning protagonist also locks in the protagonist to one back story. That's why I would prefer they not have retuning protagonists, and instead give us a new blank slate each time.
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Post by cardbutton on Sept 13, 2016 0:07:37 GMT
The Inquisitor could return without any other returning characters. That would also make it much easier to do, as the game wouldn't need to worry about the various possible states of those prior relationships. The benefit of a returning protagonist is it lets us continue that character's story. The other characters don't matter. That said, a returning protagonist also locks in the protagonist to one back story. That's why I would prefer they not have retuning protagonists, and instead give us a new blank slate each time.True, but that being said the last two DA installments have denied us options of Back Story and threw us right into current events. No guarantee we'd get Origins even if we got a new PC. That being said I'm most definitely in the Dual PC camp since both combined would be something special. New and Old combining and all that!
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Post by lynroy on Sept 13, 2016 1:46:23 GMT
You had to create a new thread for this? Change NPC to PC?
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Sept 13, 2016 1:51:44 GMT
Is bring back the Inquisitor as PC the same as bring back the Warden?
*drinks anyway*
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Sept 13, 2016 1:53:31 GMT
I'd be relaxed about it, one way or another, but it's kind of a moot point.
The Inquisitor will - at most - be a quest giving NPC in the next game. They've said repeatedly they (Bioware) want new protagonists for each new installment.
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Post by Ieldra on Sept 13, 2016 11:52:45 GMT
This has been discussed ad infinitum on BSN Prime. There is no consensus. I do NOT want the Inquisitor back in the next DA game, since I want to get away as far as possible from Southern Thedas and its problems, and particularly away from its religious themes. DAI handled this somewhat satisfactorily, but I do not want a repeat.
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Post by Sylvius the Mad on Sept 13, 2016 13:17:39 GMT
True, but that being said the last two DA installments have denied us options of Back Story and threw us right into current events. No guarantee we'd get Origins even if we got a new PC. That being said I'm most definitely in the Dual PC camp since both combined would be something special. New and Old combining and all that! Origins don't guarantee that. In fact, I'd say they hurt. DAO locked us into one of six backstories. DAI hardly limited our backstory at all. What was the Inquisitor doing at the conclave? Why? What was the Inquisitor's life like before that? DAI largely leaves these questions for us to decide. It's the most open BioWare has left the protagonist's backstory since NWN. Backstories are the stuff in your character's background that explain how she got where she is at the start of the game. BioWare has left that for us to define in NWN, KotOR (arguably), and DAI. All of BioWare's other games have limited our backstories.
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Post by cardbutton on Sept 13, 2016 16:17:09 GMT
True, but that being said the last two DA installments have denied us options of Back Story and threw us right into current events. No guarantee we'd get Origins even if we got a new PC. That being said I'm most definitely in the Dual PC camp since both combined would be something special. New and Old combining and all that! Origins don't guarantee that. In fact, I'd say they hurt. DAO locked us into one of six backstories. DAI hardly limited our backstory at all. What was the Inquisitor doing at the conclave? Why? What was the Inquisitor's life like before that? DAI largely leaves these questions for us to decide. It's the most open BioWare has left the protagonist's backstory since NWN. Backstories are the stuff in your character's background that explain how she got where she is at the start of the game. BioWare has left that for us to define in NWN, KotOR (arguably), and DAI. All of BioWare's other games have limited our backstories. OK, you were referring to headcannon Backstories rather than literal backstories that the game provides. Fair enough. Though, why then should that matter in terms of the Inquisitor returning as a playable PC then? The Inquisitor's headcannon backstory that you made for your Inquisitor would still be just as valid, the only difference would be that you have since added a literal backstory (comprised of the decisions that you made) leading them into DA4. Essentially the Backstory you created in your mind is what got your Inquisitor where they needed to be to deal with the events of DA:I, you're decisions in DA:I are then what is adding on to that backstory to get your Inquisitor where they need to deal with the events of DA4. The only real loss then would be that you wouldn't be crafting another headcannon backstory for a brand new PC, and in a Dual PC system even that factor probably wouldn't be lost. Not to mention with the way Solas' personality is and if he actually is going to be an Antagonist in DA4 (which Bioware has eluded to), it would almost be a requirement to have Origin stories for the new PC to get them involved with him, no matter the Game structure. He's not exactly the most obvious or open villain, unlike Cory. He's prone to coming at you from the side if he comes at you at all, he's damned hard to find (especially with the Eluvians at his disposal), and he's infinitely more subtle and secretive with his tactics and goals. The only other option to getting a New solo PC involved in a character like Solas is to (for a second game in a row) give them a "Special Snowflake" power that only they have, that makes them entirely indispensable to defeating Solas. I bought that for one game, but it would be downright shoddy and laughably bad writing to attempt a repeat performance.
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Post by Sylvius the Mad on Sept 13, 2016 19:05:21 GMT
OK, you were referring to headcannon Backstories rather than literal backstories that the game provides. Fair enough. Though, why then should that matter in terms of the Inquisitor returning as a playable PC then? The Inquisitor's headcannon backstory that you made for your Inquisitor would still be just as valid, the only difference would be that you have since added a literal backstory (comprised of the decisions that you made) leading them into DA4. Because that limits us to characters who could have completed the previous game. Some of my favourite characters are failures. I've spoken at length about my favourite Warden, who never got amywhere near the archdemon. Since we know that BioWare is going to assume that that the Inquisitor defeated Corypheus and went through the DLC, that limits us to characters who could have done that. For this design, a dual-PC system would be vital, yes. Without that, we'd basically be stuck with a Shepard-style pre-gen character. Why is it required that the new PC be indispensable? Why can't the PC merely be the person who happened to defeat the antagonist, rather than the only one who could? DAI's approach isn't necessary. It wasn't even necessary in DAI.
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Post by cardbutton on Sept 13, 2016 21:52:37 GMT
Because that limits us to characters who could have completed the previous game. Some of my favourite characters are failures. I've spoken at length about my favourite Warden, who never got amywhere near the archdemon. Since we know that BioWare is going to assume that that the Inquisitor defeated Corypheus and went through the DLC, that limits us to characters who could have done that. For this design, a dual-PC system would be vital, yes. Without that, we'd basically be stuck with a Shepard-style pre-gen character. Why is it required that the new PC be indispensable? Why can't the PC merely be the person who happened to defeat the antagonist, rather than the only one who could? DAI's approach isn't necessary. It wasn't even necessary in DAI. Sorry I really suck with this forum system still so I don't know how to do all the fancyness that you did with your post formatting, but I'll try to comment in order of response. First, while yes the characters you loved but didn't finish the game with may be amazing, those sort of toons are extremely tough to write around. It may simply be a matter of omission (I never got to that content with this character so it never happened sort of thing), but those characters are as a result locked in a strange sub-universe of their own in which either events are stalled perpetually ... or they outright lost and the world was forever altered by Corypheus. In either case the events of DA4 would never occur, because the progression of very world itself is halted just as the PC is. Those type of characters who never made it to the end of their first journey wouldn't narratively be in a state to ever move on to the next, not much anyone could do to plan around it. Second, LOL! Like Hawke?! I meant Origins as in like how they did Origins in DA:O, rather than DA2. Those merely started the player at the events in which their character was put into a position to get involved in the overarching story, rather than defining their entire backstory. I felt that style of formatting was enough to give a viable reason for the PC's inclusion in these massive world altering events, but left enough open for interpretation about who they were before all of it began for the player to play around. A nice mix, unlike what they did with Hawke. As for the Inquisitor coming back as a playable PC ... oddly enough I agree. As much of a longshot of the next game being Dual PC, the Inquisitor shouldn't return as playable unless that actually is the format. I don't actually agree with a second solo game for them. /sagenod. Finally, the indispensable portion isn't a problem with the PC, but more a problem with Solas as a character. He's not as obvious as Cory, he's not as prone to random acts of aggression, he might not even need to openly attack anyone at this point. The dude is intelligent, subtle, and above all stealthy. He's also pretty damned quiet personality wize. I guess essentially what I'm saying is that unless they plan on altering who he is, he's the kind of character that's stupidly hard to get a new solo PC involved in naturally. Hell if we really are going to Tevinter, most people there won't even believe he actually exists. In a Dual PC setup I can think of any number of ways to get the new PC involved in the issues of Solas by using the Inquisitor PC (as well as simultaneously getting the Inquisitor involved in the issues of Tevinter more naturally by using the New PC), but I can't think of too many things that could get a solo new PC involved in the Solas issue without them having something that makes them irreplaceable to the story. Think of it this way. If the Inquisitor doesn't have a hand in the efforts of the new PC, then the new PC needs a huge reason to even get involved in Solas, despite how unlikely it is for Solas to actually do something to arbitrarily antagonize and create a new PC. If a non PC Inquisitor is involved, then the game needs a viable reason why the Inquisitor isn't just doing everything the new PC is doing, themselves. If Solas isn't in the game at all ... then there is no point to the discussion lol!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2016 22:04:12 GMT
Nope. I don't think so.
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Post by rawgrim on Sept 13, 2016 22:47:24 GMT
I doubt it. New protagonist for each game seems to be the thing.
Are we even sure there will be another DA game, though? I think one of the Bioware people said a new DA game wasn't planned, not long ago.
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Post by Sylvius the Mad on Sept 14, 2016 2:10:08 GMT
Sorry I really suck with this forum system still so I don't know how to do all the fancyness that you did with your post formatting, but I'll try to comment in order of response. When you reply, do you see the quote tags in the message? They work like HTML tags, but in square rather than angle brackets. quote opens the tag. /quote closes it. Don't forget the brackets. I just scroll up into the body of the message to which I'm replying and manually add the tags wherever I want my response to appear. And that's my complaint. I could start the first game with a character like that, but I can't start the second game with a character like that. As such, I would prefer not to have a returning protagonist. Undoubtedly, the Origins were better than just being saddled with Hawke (especially since if there was an origin you didn't like you could just not play that one - I did that with the human noble). But having a blank slate like NWN would, I think, be better still. Remember how NWN started. You're a student at an Academy that just recently invited basically everyone to come study there. Then bad things happen. What you were doing before you came to the Academy and why you came are entirely up to the player. While some of DAO's origins were sort of like that (Mage, especially), some of them were quite restrictive (city elf, dwarf noble). Oddly, though, my favourite Warden was a city elf. But my canon Warden is a mage, because that gives me more storytelling freedom. Incidentally, DA2's unreliable narrative is really helpful with this, as well. Sadly, it doesn't make the game any more dun to play, but it really helps with world-state building in the Keep. My canon Hawke blew up the chantry and set up Anders as the patsy. Varric helped with the cover-up. The new PC doesn’t even need to know who he is for much of the game. While it has become BioWare's style of late to hand us an obvious villain right near the start of the game, there's no requirement that they do so. NWN disguised the villain. BG disguised the whole plot. And if we're willing to look back through CRPG history, there are many examples of the villain not being known to the protagonist for much of the game. The villain in Bard's Tale II wasn't real. The villain in Ultima VI turned out to be an ally. Ultima IV didn't have a villain at all, and never pretended to. Solas will be doing that needs to be stopped; otherwise he's not much of a villain. This could be uncovered by a magical researcher and revealed as a threat without anyone really knowing what it was or who was doing it. Think of it like the plot of a hard science fiction novel. Some scientist discovers something weird, figures out what it is, and tries to convince others that it matters. There are lots of plots available. They don't all require an indispensable protagonist.
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Post by misterjb on Sept 14, 2016 2:13:24 GMT
I'm quite certain they maimed the Inquisitor precisely so they could have a justification as to why s/he doesn't fight anymore.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 14, 2016 5:17:54 GMT
I'm quite certain they maimed the Inquisitor precisely so they could have a justification as to why s/he doesn't fight anymore. Patrick Weekes tweeted that wasn't the reason for it, saying there are plenty of amputee heroes.
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Post by cardbutton on Sept 14, 2016 11:37:47 GMT
I'm quite certain they maimed the Inquisitor precisely so they could have a justification as to why s/he doesn't fight anymore. God wouldn't that be just the worst reason ever if it were. Ignoring for the moment the mechanical prosthetics that we're originally designed for Bull (that never made the cut for Bull, but we still have yet to see whether or not they made the cut for the Qun setting itself), we've actually seen a long lost limb being grown back in the original " Dragon Age Comic"before. Yeah it was an accident when the Mage was attempting to heal a new wound on the character in question, but it has occurred, which means it remains a possibility in the setting still. I mean narratively I would think it a shame if they were to ret-con the impact the loss of the arm could have with the latter choice so I would prefer they go with a prosthetic of some kind, but still options remain in a world of magic.
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Post by Andraste_Reborn on Sept 14, 2016 12:08:37 GMT
God wouldn't that be just the worst reason ever if it were. Ignoring for the moment the mechanical prosthetics that we're originally designed for Bull (that never made the cut for Bull, but we still have yet to see whether or not they made the cut for the Qun setting itself), we've actually seen a long lost limb being grown back in the original " Dragon Age Comic"before. Yeah it was an accident when the Mage was attempting to heal a new wound on the character in question, but it has occurred, which means it remains a possibility in the setting still. I mean narratively I would think it a shame if they were to ret-con the impact the loss of the arm could have with the latter choice so I would prefer they go with a prosthetic of some kind, but still options remain in a world of magic. I'm not sure that those comics are actually canon. It's one of the few things not written by the usual writing team, and has a number of elements that don't seem to fit. Stuff like the spell to determine a child's paternity and Gleam's powers don't feel like they belong in the setting, and Gregoir feels really out of character given what we now know about his relationship with Wynne. I don't think that means anything one way or the other about whether the Inquisitor should come back, mind you, but nowhere else have we seen any indication that limbs can be magically regrown. They should just get a badass prosthetic instead!
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Post by cardbutton on Sept 14, 2016 12:15:07 GMT
God wouldn't that be just the worst reason ever if it were. Ignoring for the moment the mechanical prosthetics that we're originally designed for Bull (that never made the cut for Bull, but we still have yet to see whether or not they made the cut for the Qun setting itself), we've actually seen a long lost limb being grown back in the original " Dragon Age Comic"before. Yeah it was an accident when the Mage was attempting to heal a new wound on the character in question, but it has occurred, which means it remains a possibility in the setting still. I mean narratively I would think it a shame if they were to ret-con the impact the loss of the arm could have with the latter choice so I would prefer they go with a prosthetic of some kind, but still options remain in a world of magic. I'm not sure that those comics are actually canon. It's one of the few things not written by the usual writing team, and has a number of elements that don't seem to fit. Stuff like the spell to determine a child's paternity and Gleam's powers don't feel like they belong in the setting, and Gregoir's feels really out of character given what we now know about his relationship with Wynne. I don't think that means anything one way or the other about whether the Inquisitor should come back, mind you, but nowhere else have we seen any indication that limbs can be magically regrown. They should just get a badass prosthetic instead! Well, to be fair we've never seen a non Qun citizen that was missing even as something as small as a finger lol! Could that because Bioware has thus far been to lazy to create the character models for such people? Entirely! Could that be because with Magic the loss of a limb isn't really that big of an issue, just a simple issue of going to you're nearest Mage-Mart and buying one that fits you? Probobly not, but still a funny concept to believe. That being said, considering the setting and the tech we've actually seen being available I don't truly believe a prosthetic (even one that had magic components) is out of the realms of possibility ... even if it does turn out to be somewhat rudimentary.
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Post by opuspace on Sept 14, 2016 13:26:59 GMT
I think it would be cool to do this but difficult as well. You would have to have some of the same characters in it. If your character romanced someone that means you would have to cheat on them,break up with them,or have no romance in DA4 unless that character was with you again. But it would be cool to have him or her again as long as they take care of that The romance options were one of the things that made me wonder if people would still play the Inquisitor if their LI was potentially dead. I don't think the Inquisitor will have the role some would wish in the next game but damn if I didn't wish for in depth exploration of moving on, infidelity or mourning a lost love if they did. It's not as important as finishing the storyline with Solas and whether they can stop or change his actions, so probably for the best not to get hopes up.
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Post by misterjb on Sept 14, 2016 17:32:50 GMT
I'm quite certain they maimed the Inquisitor precisely so they could have a justification as to why s/he doesn't fight anymore. Patrick Weekes tweeted that wasn't the reason for it, saying there are plenty of amputee heroes. He wasn't going to say on Tweeter "amputees can't fight."
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Post by Prince on Sept 14, 2016 17:44:38 GMT
DA4 as far as we are concerned does not exist yet and by that i mean that BioWare has not revealed if they are working on it or no.So i do think this kind of debate is not relevant for now.
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Post by roselavellan on Sept 14, 2016 18:11:42 GMT
I think it would be cool to do this but difficult as well. You would have to have some of the same characters in it. If your character romanced someone that means you would have to cheat on them,break up with them,or have no romance in DA4 unless that character was with you again. But it would be cool to have him or her again as long as they take care of that I imagine this would be one of the bigger reasons why a returning PC would be a problem in DA. I would think an Inquisitor who romanced Solas or even Dorian would have loose ends to tie up romance-wise in DA4, but perhaps not the other Inquisitors. Unless they intended to have all the LIs back in DA4 - with the exception of a deceased Blackwall or IB, which would be unfair. I've always wondered, would it be too much work for them to give you an option to choose your DAI hero or a new protag? I assume it would involve writing practically 2 different stories, or could it be done, do you think? Patrick Weekes tweeted that wasn't the reason for it, saying there are plenty of amputee heroes. He wasn't going to say on Tweeter "amputees can't fight." Well, he wouldn't, because it wouldn't be true.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 14, 2016 19:08:06 GMT
Patrick Weekes tweeted that wasn't the reason for it, saying there are plenty of amputee heroes. He wasn't going to say on Tweeter "amputees can't fight." Of course not, since that is objectively false. We have real life examples of soldiers fighting and fighting well with prosthetic limbs since the Roman times. And we didn't have the engineering prowess of Dwarves and Qunari or of course magic.
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