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Post by deadlydwarf on Sept 15, 2016 23:35:41 GMT
First off, Inquisition for PS4 was actually the first Dragon Age game I played. At the time, I really liked it and then backtracked and got the other games. Then I started reading books -- first the Gaider trilogy and just yesterday finished "Masked Empire." The early books helped me appreciate what was going on in the first two games. "Asunder" and "Masked Empire," however, leave me disappointed with what was accomplished in Inquisition.
In DA2, you see the tension between Templars and Mages break into conflict. Asunder takes the conflict further while introducing you to the Orlesian Civil War. So what happens with this conflict in Inquisition? It becomes a training tutorial for your team in the Hinterlands. The mages and Templars you fight are just faceless wild men. And the only character from Asunder to make it to Inquisition is Cole (although I felt was translated into the game very well). Rhy, Evangeline, and villainous Adrian don't make it into Inquisition except in a war table mission.
As to Masked Empire, it made me wish for a game more narrowly focused on Orlais. I also felt disappointed in the very limited way the characters from ME were brought into Inquisition. Briala and Michel Chevin should've been engaged in more of the action, perhaps as temporary companions. I couldn't believe they made Celene so old (she and Briala seemed more or less the same age in ME) and Gaspard seemed much more bigger and brutish in the book. And what of the world of the eluvians? So many missed opportunities...oh well.
So, how did reading the books impact your views of Inquisiton?
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Post by Duke Cameron on Sept 16, 2016 3:12:09 GMT
Fir me? Not at all.
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Playing a lot of Divinity Original Sin 2
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Post by Kantr on Sept 16, 2016 10:12:40 GMT
Yeah, they didn't affect me much, I found that they weren't great reads nor very enjoyable. The only one I enjoyed was Last Flight.
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Post by phoray on Sept 18, 2016 17:28:43 GMT
Played all the games before reading the books.
People said that The Stolen Throne would help you understand Loghain. I did understand him more; now I know, instead of suspect, that he would rather be executed in Origins. It also helps me understand the Fereldan throne responisbilities would make nearly anyone miserable. So, kinda glad my cannon elf let Alistair stay a Warden.
The Last Flight made me feel more angry for the elves by like x a million.
The Masked Empire made me understand that no matter how effed up they are, Briala and Celene love each other. And that Gaspard will never be my canon ruler.
And the one about the Grey Wardens (The Calling) made me cry so hard at the dog scene. But also showed the darker side of the Wardens WAAAAAY better than Adamant ever could. IT also showed the epic side of the Wardens. You could embrace their entire picture. Adamant was kinda one sided and...absurd.
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Trouble-shooting Space Diva
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Post by melbella on Sept 18, 2016 17:45:41 GMT
Impossible to say since I read all the books before playing DAI for the first time. Probably the only impact is in WEWH. If I had no background on any of the 3 stooges, I might be more inclined to favor Briala or Gaspard. As it is, the book made me hate them all. A lot of the shenanigans those two got up to are completely ignored in the game.
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Post by phoray on Sept 18, 2016 18:31:25 GMT
Impossible to say since I read all the books before playing DAI for the first time. Probably the only impact is in WEWH. If I had no background on any of the 3 stooges, I might be more inclined to favor Briala or Gaspard. As it is, the book made me hate them all. A lot of the shenanigans those two got up to are completely ignored in the game. Yep! Also, people seem to really like Michael De chevin to the point they wish he was an LI?
But he doesn't even blink at killing elves during the Chevalier "graduation ceremony". He's awful, and I don't get the appeal at all. I must assume people never read the book. He's also the idiot that released Imshael but he gets all these hero points for trying to clean up a mess he began.
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Sept 18, 2016 19:25:36 GMT
The Masked Empire was essentially the reason I gave a cr@p about the Orlesian civil war, as there was almost no character development among the three contenders.
Asunder had me looking forward to meeting Cole. And made me go "WTF, Who is this pod person?" when I met Fiona.
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melbella
N6
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
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Post by melbella on Sept 18, 2016 23:46:30 GMT
I was never a big fan of Fiona, and her appearance in Asunder didn't make a lot of sense to me. Anyone could have been Grand Enchanter - why her? As a result, whoever she was in DAI didn't really phase me at all, other than being just one more NPC who ate a bowl full of stupid. Now if Adrian had somehow been in DAI, I would have hated her on sight and wished for a way to kill her immediately.
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Sept 19, 2016 0:30:13 GMT
I was never a big fan of Fiona, and her appearance in Asunder didn't make a lot of sense to me. Anyone could have been Grand Enchanter - why her? As a result, whoever she was in DAI didn't really phase me at all, other than being just one more NPC who ate a bowl full of stupid. Now if Adrian had somehow been in DAI, I would have hated her on sight and wished for a way to kill her immediately. I'd say FIona's personality in DAI was very different from her personality in Asunder. Haven't read The Calling so I can't comment on that.
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Post by deadlydwarf on Sept 19, 2016 4:03:45 GMT
For myself, I liked the away Asunder picked up where DA2 left off regarding the mage-Templar conflict. So it now baffles me that the developers chose to focus Inquisition on Corytheus and red lyrium and relegated the mage-Templar war to a training tutorial in the Hinterlands. At minimum, they could've made Adrian one of the bosses you have to fight in the apostate encampment in the Hinterlands. I liked ME and it was sad to see the Orlesian Civil War also sidetracked by the Cory plot. I would've liked more interaction with Briala, Celene, and Gaspard. (Was anyone surprised they made Celene so old in WEWH? Celene and Bri are Bards and Gaspard a chevalier, but they see no action in WEWH.) I hated Gaspard at first, but came to appreciate his sense of honor while in the world of eluvians and how he chose not to expose Michel de Chevin after finding out he was half elf. Finding out that Celene was ultimately responsible for the death of Briala's parents makes me wonder how they can make reconciling Celene and Briala a solution for WEWH. And as for Michel, at the end of the book, he vows to kill Imshael. So why didn't they involve him in that boss fight? As to Fiona, I actually liked seeing her in Inquisition after having read the Calling. Is there any path that reunites her with Alistair? In Inquisition, she asks about him but doesn't fess up. She's unique in having been a Grey Warden who lost the taint and who also gave birth. I wonder if this means Alistair won't be cursed to die young? Perhaps her notoriety as a former Grey Warden who lost the taint helped her rise to First Enchanter.
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Post by phoray on Sept 19, 2016 6:56:41 GMT
For myself, I liked the away Asunder picked up where DA2 left off regarding the mage-Templar conflict. So it now baffles me that the developers chose to focus Inquisition on Corytheus and red lyrium and relegated the mage-Templar war to a training tutorial in the Hinterlands. At minimum, they could've made Adrian one of the bosses you have to fight in the apostate encampment in the Hinterlands. I liked ME and it was sad to see the Orlesian Civil War also sidetracked by the Cory plot. I would've liked more interaction with Briala, Celene, and Gaspard. (Was anyone surprised they made Celene so old in WEWH? Celene and Bri are Bards and Gaspard a chevalier, but they see no action in WEWH.) I hated Gaspard at first, but came to appreciate his sense of honor while in the world of eluvians and how he chose not to expose Michel de Chevin after finding out he was half elf. Finding out that Celene was ultimately responsible for the death of Briala's parents makes me wonder how they can make reconciling Celene and Briala a solution for WEWH. And as for Michel, at the end of the book, he vows to kill Imshael. So why didn't they involve him in that boss fight? As to Fiona, I actually liked seeing her in Inquisition after having read the Calling. Is there any path that reunites her with Alistair? In Inquisition, she asks about him but doesn't fess up. She's unique in having been a Grey Warden who lost the taint and who also gave birth. I wonder if this means Alistair won't be cursed to die young? Perhaps her notoriety as a former Grey Warden who lost the taint helped her rise to First Enchanter. As far as I can tell from my playing and ithers comments on the matter, there is no way to get Alistair and Fiona jn the dame room.
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eriador117
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Post by eriador117 on Sept 19, 2016 10:21:03 GMT
I read the Masked Empire after I played Inquisition, but after I'd read, I realised the backstory around certain characters that appeared in the game, if only briefly - Michel de Chevin, Mhiris and the desire demon - sorry, choice spirit It would have been interesting to have some of that knowledge within the game itself.
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Post by oyabun on Sept 19, 2016 10:47:42 GMT
I don't read the DA books so yeah many situations were really obscure for me in this game
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Post by deadlydwarf on Sept 19, 2016 16:10:47 GMT
I read the Masked Empire after I played Inquisition, but after I'd read, I realised the backstory around certain characters that appeared in the game, if only briefly - Michel de Chevin, Mhiris and the desire demon - sorry, choice spirit It would have been interesting to have some of that knowledge within the game itself. You can get some of that via some of the Inquisition Perks. For example, if you get "Nobility Knowledge" or however they called it, your Inquisitor will recognize Michel de Chevin and say something about he had been dishonored. Also, if you had brought Vivienne with you, she would've recognized Michel as well. (It's a pity taking Vivienne with you on WEWH doesn't serve to enlighten the Inquisitor on Orlesian politics as much as one might think.) That said, I thought the perk system was pretty lame and more knowledge from the books incorporated to the games. I guess they were concerned about confusing gamers who hadn't read the books.
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Post by xerrai on Sept 21, 2016 3:51:21 GMT
I didn't even have to read the actual book, but upon looking up bare bones synopsis, I felt WAY more informed on certain characters. Which, you know, ok, more metaknowledge for me to pick through and ponder about. Felassan, the eluvians, the reality behind Celene's ascension, Gaspard's racism against elves, that kind of thing.
But then I found out there was information that I actually expected my Inquisitor to be privy to. In fact, it sometimes made no sense as to how certain things were never acknowledged or looked upon in DA:I.
Like how Celene purged an alienage, or how Gaspard has tried to find an excuse to invade Ferelden (why did Cullen support him again?). I mean I got an idea that he was an expansionist but I had no idea who he wanted to expand into. Like geeze, some of this stuff should have been public info that the Inquisitor could have heard about! Or at least read about! But without it I went in blind.
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melbella
N6
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
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Post by melbella on Sept 21, 2016 4:15:12 GMT
My favorite is in Leliana's blurb about assigning Michel, she mentions Briala's eluvian network! Why didn't THAT come up before, especially when Morrigan drags one into Skyhold? I think Cullen is the only one who mentions being worried about it, but only if you click on him in his office at the right time. Otherwise, no one says a word.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion
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Post by Citrus on Sept 21, 2016 5:41:31 GMT
Reading the books both helped me understand the events of DAI better, and make me feel very sad that there wasn't more about specific characters. Like others, I would have been lost in WEWH if I hadn't read the books first. ME helped me gain so much insight into who Celene, Gaspard, and Briala were. I loved all of them in the book, but goodness they made Gaspard entirely unlikable in the game, and even though I was certain I would want to side with Briala, once I met her I felt very unimpressed. I would have loved to see them do more with the three of them. And Michel and Imshael were definitely my favorite characters from the ME. I loved seeing both of them in the game, but was very sad they had such small roles. But at least they made it into the game, unlike Evangeline and Rhys. I loved both of them a ton, so it really sucked not seeing either of them. Don't get me wrong, I loved all the little nods of information for book readers and it was wonderful seeing the characters that made it into the game. I'm just also hopeful that they'll include more book things for the next game.
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Post by deadlydwarf on Sept 21, 2016 18:52:20 GMT
Reading the books both helped me understand the events of DAI better, and make me feel very sad that there wasn't more about specific characters. Like others, I would have been lost in WEWH if I hadn't read the books first. ME helped me gain so much insight into who Celene, Gaspard, and Briala were. I loved all of them in the book, but goodness they made Gaspard entirely unlikable in the game, and even though I was certain I would want to side with Briala, once I met her I felt very unimpressed. I would have loved to see them do more with the three of them. And Michel and Imshael were definitely my favorite characters from the ME. I loved seeing both of them in the game, but was very sad they had such small roles. But at least they made it into the game, unlike Evangeline and Rhys. I loved both of them a ton, so it really sucked not seeing either of them. Don't get me wrong, I loved all the little nods of information for book readers and it was wonderful seeing the characters that made it into the game. I'm just also hopeful that they'll include more book things for the next game. Ditto on pretty much everything! The books made the world of DA richer and DAI -- despite its immensity -- barely scratched the surface or focused on the wrong things. I did like the way Briala was depicted; she was easily the prettiest elf in DAI even with the mask! (Starting with DA2, in trying to make elves a more distinctly different species of people, they made most of the them rather homely. Briala and Merril being key exceptions.) As to Celene, they made her an old woman? From ME, I expected her and Briala to be about the same age. I would've expected Celene to be mature (she was a possible marriage prospect for Cailan after all) but not elderly. As to Gaspard, a lot smaller than the big brute I imagined in the book.
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Post by deadlydwarf on Sept 21, 2016 19:00:52 GMT
I didn't even have to read the actual book, but upon looking up bare bones synopsis, I felt WAY more informed on certain characters. Which, you know, ok, more metaknowledge for me to pick through and ponder about. Felassan, the eluvians, the reality behind Celene's ascension, Gaspard's racism against elves, that kind of thing. But then I found out there was information that I actually expected my Inquisitor to be privy to. In fact, it sometimes made no sense as to how certain things were never acknowledged or looked upon in DA:I. Like how Celene purged an alienage, or how Gaspard has tried to find an excuse to invade Ferelden (why did Cullen support him again?). I mean I got an idea that he was an expansionist but I had no idea who he wanted to expand into. Like geeze, some of this stuff should have been public info that the Inquisitor could have heard about! Or at least read about! But without it I went in blind. Regardless of background, unless your Inquisitor had been living in cave prior to the conclave, you would expect them to have some idea of what's going on in Orlais. The game is at its most awkward when trying to fill gamers in on subjects they wouldn't know about without reading the books.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 21, 2016 20:17:25 GMT
Reading Asunder made me get to know Cole's background story and his friendships with Rhys and Evangeline more. I wish we got to see Rhys and Evangeline reunite with Cole in the game instead of just having a war table mission. Also, the part about reversing the rite of tranquility, that had connection to Cassandra's personal quest when she finds the missing Seekers. I also read Masked Empire and doing the WEWH main story quest, I can't stand Celene, Gaspard and Briala. They were stupid enough to not only cause the civil war in Orlais, but they didn't notice Florianne took advantage of them to plot her machinations. I forced all three to work together. They deserve each other. As for Michel and Imshael, at least you help Michel destroy the demon. But in a war table mission where Celene attempted to reconcile with him, Leliana had a good point that if Celene wished to reconcile, she would've done it publicly instead of sending a messenger to meet with Michel in secret. As for Mihris, in one of my runs, my Necromancer told her off and Mihris was like, "Fool! May the Dread Wolf take you!" Solas was in the party and I'm sitting there going, 'He's standing right next to you!'
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Post by deadlydwarf on Sept 22, 2016 6:05:05 GMT
Reading Asunder made me get to know Cole's background story and his friendships with Rhys and Evangeline more. I wish we got to see Rhys and Evangeline reunite with Cole in the game instead of just having a war table mission. Also, the part about reversing the rite of tranquility, that had connection to Cassandra's personal quest when she finds the missing Seekers. I also read Masked Empire and doing the WEWH main story quest, I can't stand Celene, Gaspard and Briala. They were stupid enough to not only cause the civil war in Orlais, but they didn't notice Florianne took advantage of them to plot her machinations. I forced all three to work together. They deserve each other. As for Michel and Imshael, at least you help Michel destroy the demon. But in a war table mission where Celene attempted to reconcile with him, Leliana had a good point that if Celene wished to reconcile, she would've done it publicly instead of sending a messenger to meet with Michel in secret. As for Mihris, in one of my runs, my Necromancer told her off and Mihris was like, "Fool! May the Dread Wolf take you!" Solas was in the party and I'm sitting there going, 'He's standing right next to you!' Interesting, you caught some things I missed. In Inquisition, was Mihris the elf you run into near that cave in the Hinterlands? Regarding Michel, when does Celene try to reconcile with him? After Michel joins the Inquisition, there's a war table mission where you are asked what to do with him. Have him join the Army or work with the eluvians. Nothing about Celene though.
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lynroy
N6
Thief
Current Location: Washington DC
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Post by lynroy on Sept 22, 2016 7:33:53 GMT
Interesting, you caught some things I missed. In Inquisition, was Mihris the elf you run into near that cave in the Hinterlands? Regarding Michel, when does Celene try to reconcile with him? After Michel joins the Inquisition, there's a war table mission where you are asked what to do with him. Have him join the Army or work with the eluvians. Nothing about Celene though. Yes, that was Mhiris. Celene will attempt to reconcile via war table mission after completing WEWH and recruiting Michel. The war table mission is only available if Celene rules alone.
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Thief
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Post by lynroy on Sept 22, 2016 7:38:59 GMT
I didn't even have to read the actual book, but upon looking up bare bones synopsis, I felt WAY more informed on certain characters. Which, you know, ok, more metaknowledge for me to pick through and ponder about. Felassan, the eluvians, the reality behind Celene's ascension, Gaspard's racism against elves, that kind of thing. But then I found out there was information that I actually expected my Inquisitor to be privy to. In fact, it sometimes made no sense as to how certain things were never acknowledged or looked upon in DA:I.Like how Celene purged an alienage, or how Gaspard has tried to find an excuse to invade Ferelden (why did Cullen support him again?). I mean I got an idea that he was an expansionist but I had no idea who he wanted to expand into. Like geeze, some of this stuff should have been public info that the Inquisitor could have heard about! Or at least read about! But without it I went in blind. Word. I don't think they did a good job taking info from the book and putting it in the game. You're really thrown in knowing nothing.
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Post by deadlydwarf on Sept 22, 2016 15:21:29 GMT
Interesting, you caught some things I missed. In Inquisition, was Mihris the elf you run into near that cave in the Hinterlands? Regarding Michel, when does Celene try to reconcile with him? After Michel joins the Inquisition, there's a war table mission where you are asked what to do with him. Have him join the Army or work with the eluvians. Nothing about Celene though. Yes, that was Mhiris. Celene will attempt to reconcile via war table mission after completing WEWH and recruiting Michel. The war table mission is only available if Celene rules alone. Mhiris was rather homely in the Hinterlands! lol I appreciate that they wanted the elves to be more distinctive as a race, but did they have to make so many of them so ugly? (Key exception being Briala.) Interesting that Celene immediately reaches for Michel when she can't have Briala. In my run-throughs, I always did the "make them all work together" solution or the "lesbian love connection" solution of reuniting Celene and Briala. I never did Celene alone. For myself, I did not come away from the book thinking Gaspard was particularly racist, at least by Orlesian standards. Yes, he does arrange a particularly racist theater production to manipulate Celene into trashing the alienage of Halamshiral, but he did that so he could ambush Celene and her forces in his effort to take the throne. (One of his few attempts at playing "the Game.") I was impressed by the fact that after being beaten by Michel and then having Michel's dark secret revealed to him, he let Michel go free with no strings attached. It demonstrated one of the key themes of the books was to compare the code of the chevaliers with the practitioners of the game. Chevaliers are honest and direct and honorable but they forever seek to prove themselves in martial activities including war. The Game is a chess match where the player is ready at all times to sacrifice pawns to achieve a greater end. Celene has some progressive inclinations, but is quick to sacrifice others if it is in her self-interest. Think the purging of the alienage and the much earlier death of Briala's parents. As to which one is better, reasonable people may differ...
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2016 17:14:48 GMT
Gaspard also knew about Celene and Briala's love affair, so the whole thing with the civil war and alienage purging was a mess. That's why I hated having to choose who's going to rule Orlais in WEWH. I almost didn't recruit Michel as an Inquisition agent as well, but despite all the bad stuff that happened, he's useful to mentor the soldiers if you go with Cullen's suggestion in a war table mission.
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