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Post by phoray on Sept 23, 2016 21:43:52 GMT
I voted DAI, and unit recently, would have voted Origins (see predicament below if you want.) Do you feel that it is only stereotypes thats are supported by dialogue choices?
I've played DAI twice, DA2 x3, Origins twice and have started two others of Origins.
I consider all 3 of my Hawke's to have pretty much been exactly as I wished to have portrayed.
Classic hero rogue-> pro circle mage -> "Dexter" Vex Hawke, the serial Killer.
Both my Inquisitors have been exactly what I wanted to portray.
Classic hero mage -> A trouble making , yet self doubting, noble-black-sheep rogue that grows up over the game into being a strong leader that loves the organization and home she's built.
When it comes to Origins, my first two runs went great.
Classic hero rogue city elf-> power hungry vengeful Cousland Queen.
But my 2nd 2 runs have been a struggle. I wanted to play an apathetic depressed Dalish Elf who doesn't want to be a leader and thinks the world to be alien. But you can't be "in a wonder" about the new world you're seeing. You can only be like, "all this is normal" or "hate all the shems." And you can't seem to mourn Tamlen past the prologue. Haven't finished this one.
And now I've been trying to be a Circle/templar/chantry hating elven mage who is totally okay with blood magic. And you can't annul the Circle without sounding like you're Pro Templar or that you're afraid/hate blood magic. (and I tried all the conversations three times). This just happened.
Is it that only stereotypes are supported by dialogue choices and I've managed to just randomly play those so far or what? Because I feel less supported by Origins at the moment and people on the forums have gone on about how free Origins was compared to the other two.[\spoiler]
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Sept 23, 2016 21:52:51 GMT
Tough one. I voted Origins, but only by a hair over Inquisition. There is just more room for head-canonning with the silent protagonist, in my opinion.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2016 0:58:57 GMT
I voted DAI, and unit recently, would have voted Origins (see predicament below if you want.) Do you feel that it is only stereotypes thats are supported by dialogue choices?
I've played DAI twice, DA2 x3, Origins twice and have started two others of Origins. I consider all 3 of my Hawke's to have pretty much been exactly as I wished to have portrayed. Classic hero rogue-> pro circle mage -> "Dexter" Vex Hawke, the serial Killer. Both my Inquisitors have been exactly what I wanted to portray. Classic hero mage -> A trouble making , yet self doubting, noble-black-sheep rogue that grows up over the game into being a strong leader that loves the organization and home she's built. When it comes to Origins, my first two runs went great. Classic hero rogue city elf-> power hungry vengeful Cousland Queen. But my 2nd 2 runs have been a struggle. I wanted to play an apathetic depressed Dalish Elf who doesn't want to be a leader and thinks the world to be alien. But you can't be "in a wonder" about the new world you're seeing. You can only be like, "all this is normal" or "hate all the shems." That's just one of the problems with RPG games, you only have a narrow scope of how you can play a character. In DA:I one of the gripes people have when talking to Sera is that they really don't have an option to comfort her, you are more of stuck between dismissing her as crazy or calling her stupid. Same with DA:O, I can't really disagree with Wynne's "advice" without sounding like a bratty kid. I would say Origins over Inquisition, mostly for one reason that is one of my biggest gripes of that game: the side quests. In DA:O, you have plenty of side quests that I feel help flesh out your character. When you meet the Dwarf in Dust Town who's father abandon her because she married a Castless and had a child with him, what does your character do? Do they tell her to abandon the kid, or yell at her father and tell him to them both back? In DA:I, you don't really have much of that outside of the main quests. But both have their pros and cons: some people dislike the warden since they don't display emotions, some people called the Quizz a bland protag, and some people didn't feel like Hawke belonged to them.
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Post by Duke Cameron on Sept 24, 2016 1:47:44 GMT
DA2. Hawke is everything i wanted in a character.
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Post by Tuchanka Love on Sept 24, 2016 1:55:18 GMT
Origins. More dialogue options you can choose from. He/she says exactly what you chose. You can imagine how he/she sounds when saying stuff, instead of being forced to hear them say in a certain tone you don't agree with it. for example, you chose a sarcastic response but instead of sounding playful like you want to, with the voice actor he comes across as a conceited douche. More choices.
Basically, the Warden is 99% what you imagine him/her to be. It's your character completely.
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Post by Tuchanka Love on Sept 24, 2016 2:02:58 GMT
I voted DAI, and unit recently, would have voted Origins (see predicament below if you want.) Do you feel that it is only stereotypes thats are supported by dialogue choices?
I've played DAI twice, DA2 x3, Origins twice and have started two others of Origins. I consider all 3 of my Hawke's to have pretty much been exactly as I wished to have portrayed. Classic hero rogue-> pro circle mage -> "Dexter" Vex Hawke, the serial Killer. Both my Inquisitors have been exactly what I wanted to portray. Classic hero mage -> A trouble making , yet self doubting, noble-black-sheep rogue that grows up over the game into being a strong leader that loves the organization and home she's built. When it comes to Origins, my first two runs went great. Classic hero rogue city elf-> power hungry vengeful Cousland Queen. But my 2nd 2 runs have been a struggle. I wanted to play an apathetic depressed Dalish Elf who doesn't want to be a leader and thinks the world to be alien. But you can't be "in a wonder" about the new world you're seeing. You can only be like, "all this is normal" or "hate all the shems." That's just one of the problems with RPG games, you only have a narrow scope of how you can play a character. In DA:I one of the gripes people have when talking to Sera is that they really don't have an option to comfort her, you are more of stuck between dismissing her as crazy or calling her stupid. Same with DA:O, I can't really disagree with Wynne's "advice" without sounding like a bratty kid. I would say Origins over Inquisition, mostly for one reason that is one of my biggest gripes of that game: the side quests. In DA:O, you have plenty of side quests that I feel help flesh out your character. When you meet the Dwarf in Dust Town who's father abandon her because she married a Castless and had a child with him, what does your character do? Do they tell her to abandon the kid, or yell at her father and tell him to them both back? In DA:I, you don't really have much of that outside of the main quests. But both have their pros and cons: some people dislike the warden since they don't display emotions, some people called the Quizz a bland protag, and some people didn't feel like Hawke belonged to them. Um, my warden displayed emotions. It's actually much more deep than all the other two instalments. Human noble when meeting her father in The Gauntlet. Talking to Wynne you have various choices when describing how you feel about the current situation and the death of your family. You can be angry, dismissive or resigned to being a grey warden. It's much much more complex. And the dialogue actually carries on on the subject for more than one dialogue choice. In DAI for instance, you are asked once about your family, has one dialogue choice to describe your relationship and the subject is dead and buried. And it's never digged deep, just barely scratched the surface of the matter. In short, you have to headcanon the fuck out of DAI so you can feel more connected to your character because the game itself doesn't give you enough tools to do what.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 24, 2016 2:03:22 GMT
I said Inquisition, though Origins is a close second. The thing that made Origins not my choice is ironically the origins. With DAI, your past was left very vague and what little was brought up you had a variety of ways to reply about it. Meanwhile in DAO the origins established your backstory more leaving less RP possibilities.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2016 2:09:16 GMT
Origins. More dialogue options you can choose from. He/she says exactly what you chose. You can imagine how he/she sounds when saying stuff, instead of being forced to hear them say in a certain tone you don't agree with it. for example, you chose a sarcastic response but instead of sounding playful like you want to, with the voice actor he comes across as a conceited douche. More choices. Basically, the Warden is 99% what you imagine him/her to be. It's your character completely. My thoughts exactly!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2016 3:00:39 GMT
That's just one of the problems with RPG games, you only have a narrow scope of how you can play a character. In DA:I one of the gripes people have when talking to Sera is that they really don't have an option to comfort her, you are more of stuck between dismissing her as crazy or calling her stupid. Same with DA:O, I can't really disagree with Wynne's "advice" without sounding like a bratty kid. I would say Origins over Inquisition, mostly for one reason that is one of my biggest gripes of that game: the side quests. In DA:O, you have plenty of side quests that I feel help flesh out your character. When you meet the Dwarf in Dust Town who's father abandon her because she married a Castless and had a child with him, what does your character do? Do they tell her to abandon the kid, or yell at her father and tell him to them both back? In DA:I, you don't really have much of that outside of the main quests. But both have their pros and cons: some people dislike the warden since they don't display emotions, some people called the Quizz a bland protag, and some people didn't feel like Hawke belonged to them. Um , my warden displayed emotions. It's actually much more deep than all the other two instalments. Human noble when meeting her father in The Gauntlet. Talking to Wynne you have various choices when describing how you feel about the current situation and the death of your family. You can be angry, dismissive or resigned to being a grey warden. It's much much more complex. And the dialogue actually carries on on the subject for more than one dialogue choice. In DAI for instance, you are asked once about your family, has one dialogue choice to describe your relationship and the subject is dead and buried. And it's never digged deep, just barely scratched the surface of the matter. In short, you have to headcanon the fuck out of DAI so you can feel more connected to your character because the game itself doesn't give you enough tools to do what. Yeah, I know, I'm just parroting what I have heard other people complain about when it comes to the warden.
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Current Location: Washington DC
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: The3tWits
PSN: The3tWits
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Post by lynroy on Sept 24, 2016 4:09:37 GMT
I said Inquisition, though Origins is a close second. The thing that made Origins not my choice is ironically the origins. With DAI, your past was left very vague and what little was brought up you had a variety of ways to reply about it. Meanwhile in DAO the origins established your backstory more leaving less RP possibilities. This.
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Post by Element Zero on Sept 24, 2016 5:06:17 GMT
I said Inquisition, though Origins is a close second. The thing that made Origins not my choice is ironically the origins. With DAI, your past was left very vague and what little was brought up you had a variety of ways to reply about it. Meanwhile in DAO the origins established your backstory more leaving less RP possibilities. This is a good point. I chose Inquisition, though it really was a tough choice. All things considered, I feel like I'm given a suitable amount of influence over my character in each game. There is always something I don't like, RP-wise, or some option I feel is missing. There is so much content and story presented, though, that I can't say I've ever been truly let down. My current gripe is with some of the DAI Specializations. I'm not a fan of many of them from either a mechanical or roleplaying standpoint. It's a minor gripe, though, and is swiftly handled, pushed past and mostly ignored in favor of more pleasing content. There is always additional good content waiting whenever some element disappoints.
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Post by Duke Cameron on Sept 24, 2016 7:18:21 GMT
For me, all i need is the ability to change their appearance to make me feel like the character is mine. I don't feel the need to have to make up a backstory, etc. I change their look and control their actions going foward. I don't care what they did before i got them.
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Post by Catilina on Sept 24, 2016 9:20:41 GMT
I like all, but my choice is Hawke. I don't feel, that warden and inquisitor have more (deeper) RP-opportunities, just maybe due to the length of the game, numerically. Hawke a good character, his/her personalities are fun.
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Post by our_lady_of_darkness on Sept 24, 2016 9:32:03 GMT
Hmm, can't really decide between DAO and DAI - in DAO we have origins which could be seen as potentially limiting (but it also adds a lot to the story), whereas in DAI the clean-slate (sort of) beginning lets me create my own background (which nevertheless has no real impact on the gameplay later on, unless you're an elf).
On the other hand, the dialogue options in DAO were more varied and I missed them a lot in DAI.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 24, 2016 10:07:18 GMT
I can't decide between DAO and DAI. I love both my Wardens and Inquistors equally; all of them are such unique characters I can't decide which one is more RPable...
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Post by Ravenfeeder on Sept 24, 2016 12:07:02 GMT
It's very difficult to choose between DAO and DAI. The various Origins gave me a basis and background to build on, but there's something about the Inquisitor that I just keep on wanting to explore in different ways. The problem with DAI is that certain personalities aren't given any lines after Here Lies the Abyss. If you believed that it had been Andraste who threw you out of the rift at the start there were no dialogue options to cover your disabusement of that position. The character sort of lost something without that.
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Post by phoray on Sept 24, 2016 13:36:28 GMT
It's very difficult to choose between DAO and DAI. The various Origins gave me a basis and background to build on, but there's something about the Inquisitor that I just keep on wanting to explore in different ways. The problem with DAI is that certain personalities aren't given any lines after Here Lies the Abyss. If you believed that it had been Andraste who threw you out of the rift at the start there were no dialogue options to cover your disabusement of that position. The character sort of lost something without that. The closest to dealing with your thoughts about learning the truth is a discussion you have with Mother Giselle in the Garden. But you don't even get a zoomed up face of the event, so it feels a lot emptier than it could have been. But yeah, I think that's the end of that subject going forward, other than bits going forward as to whether you're still religious or not.
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Post by Tuchanka Love on Sept 24, 2016 14:07:32 GMT
It's very difficult to choose between DAO and DAI. The various Origins gave me a basis and background to build on, but there's something about the Inquisitor that I just keep on wanting to explore in different ways. The problem with DAI is that certain personalities aren't given any lines after Here Lies the Abyss. If you believed that it had been Andraste who threw you out of the rift at the start there were no dialogue options to cover your disabusement of that position. The character sort of lost something without that. The closest to dealing with your thoughts about learning the truth is a discussion you have with Mother Giselle in the Garden. But you don't even get a zoomed up face of the event, so it feels a lot emptier than it could have been. But yeah, I think that's the end of that subject going forward, other than bits going forward as to whether you're still religious or not. Agree. My canon Inquisitor was very devout (my Warden wasn't at all) and it bothers how the game doesn't really explore your PC's faith/change of faith/whatever more. It's like after a point, the game forgets about your character you just stand aside watching things unfold without your input.
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Post by cardbutton on Sept 24, 2016 14:21:52 GMT
Love Inquisition, but Origin wins by a hair's breath. Don't get me wrong as I never want to go back to that, but the Unvoiced PC actually did allow for a little bit more headcannon roleplaying than DA:I's PC did. If we're talking on a purely RP basis, Origin wins out slightly over DA:I.
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 24, 2016 18:41:31 GMT
Whilst the origins could be seen as limiting, they at least meant the writers followed through on your background. With my Dalish elf, when we got to Zathrian's clan, the storekeeper comments about your father (and Velanna recognised you in DAA). With my City elf, it was meaningful when we went back to investigate the alienage because I had a connection (and I totally surprised my companions with the revelation that I had been married). With my Cousland noble I spent much of the game wondering what had happened to Fergus, was irritated with Alistair for not being more sympathetic to my loss, and then right at the end at the celebrations, there was Fergus! I didn't complete my dwarf run through but I could see how different the whole Orzammar section would be for you if you are. It made me feel I was really part of the world.
The disappointing thing about DAI was the lack of referencing of your race and background. Much of the dialogue felt as if it had been written for a human Inquisitor and didn't feel right for other races (particularly Dorian's comments about your knowledge of what it is like to struggle in life with regard to slavery). Playing an elf I could potentially mess up the War Table quest involving my clan and get them all killed but there was absolutely no acknowledgement of that in the game. At least in DA2 your LI/Aveline comes to comfort you on losing your mother. So whilst having a lack of background origin story left it more open for role playing, that was really all in your head and not reflected in the game.
I like playing mages but the choices available for spell schools have become increasingly less varied as we have progressed through games. The specialisations for all classes have become increasingly limited. I also dislike how the warrior can no longer use ranged weapons and the rogue is limited to just dual wielding daggers. Nor is it possible to switch between daggers and bow once an enemy has been sighted, even if the other weapon type would be more appropriate. I also liked how origins split the dialogue options between romance and general, so you didn't have to miss asking something just because you were worried you would miss out on the romance if you ignored the heart icon (This turned out to not be the case but I only discovered this after playing DAI for the first time and in fact for certain PCs like Solas you would miss out if you didn't take the heart icon). So on the basis of all these things I preferred Origins.
I also found it annoying in DAI that in order to find out about aspects of your companions' character you had to have both them and Cole in the party. I prefer being able to chat to the character and encourage them to talk to me willingly, rather than have some third party blurt out their secrets and then like as not miss them anyway because the moment they start talking a bear attacks us. For interaction between companions I liked DA2 because I could take them on a shopping trip around Kirkwall and hear them chatting without any danger of being interrupted. Then in DAI the one place we could have done this safely, Val Royeaux, they didn't talk. Also in Origins you could even stop to chat about general subjects whilst out in the field if you wished, which was helpful to break up long journeys. How I longed for that option in the Hissing Wastes!
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Sept 24, 2016 18:48:07 GMT
You've heard of the Bechdel Test? Well, I've come up with the Toll Test for the degrees of freedom a player has in an RPG, as a touchstone for scope of roleplay. It's one dimensional, to be sure, but I've yet to see anything better. The Toll Test is simple: The more NPCs you can kill (or cause to die) and still complete the game, the more scope you have for roleplaying. The "Toll" is short for death toll. By this metric, Origins wins hands down.
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Post by LFS on Sept 25, 2016 1:56:32 GMT
My current gripe is with some of the DAI Specializations. I'm not a fan of many of them from either a mechanical or roleplaying standpoint. It's a minor gripe, though, and is swiftly handled, pushed past and mostly ignored in favor of more pleasing content. There is always additional good content waiting whenever some element disappoints. This is a problem for me as well. None of the specializations for my archer rogue really excited me over much, and of the three, the one that seemed the most overall useful/complementary to my preferred style of play was the assassin, which felt completely at odds with my Inquisitor's personality/POV. Like you said, it's not major, and if i'm so inclined could concoct a rationalisation for it, but still an annoying niggle. On the topic, I also went with the Inquisitor mainly for the reasons stated above RE: the blanker canvas, and that allowing me to connect, create and imagine her on a level that I just didn't feel that strongly in the previous two games. I've never really been troubled by things like the paraphrase system or the voiced protagonist--I hear my own crap voice in my head 24/7; I'm happy to hear a better one come out of my character's facehole. ;p
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Post by Element Zero on Sept 25, 2016 3:06:57 GMT
My current gripe is with some of the DAI Specializations. I'm not a fan of many of them from either a mechanical or roleplaying standpoint. It's a minor gripe, though, and is swiftly handled, pushed past and mostly ignored in favor of more pleasing content. There is always additional good content waiting whenever some element disappoints. This is a problem for me as well. None of the specializations for my archer rogue really excited me over much, and of the three, the one that seemed the most overall useful/complementary to my preferred style of play was the assassin, which felt completely at odds with my Inquisitor's personality/POV. Like you said, it's not major, and if i'm so inclined could concoct a rationalisation for it, but still an annoying niggle. On the topic, I also went with the Inquisitor mainly for the reasons stated above RE: the blanker canvas, and that allowing me to connect, create and imagine her on a level that I just didn't feel that strongly in the previous two games. I've never really been troubled by things like the paraphrase system or the voiced protagonist--I hear my own crap voice in my head 24/7; I'm happy to hear a better one come out of my character's facehole. ;p I had the same issue, also with an Archer this time. I likewise chose Assassin, deciding it at least somewhat fit the stealthy hunter vibe of my Dalish Archer. I was at least thankful for the "I won't actually be killing people for money," and "The skills should prove useful" lines that were options with Dorian and Leliana, respectively (IIRC). I'm not a huge fan of many of the Specializations, and the Archer really gets the short end of the stick in this regard, in my opinion. Still, at least the Specializations are mostly effective mechanically, I guess. I do appreciate that they tried to build some RP into the process. I just don't like the array of choices themselves, nor the resulting RP choices, in many cases. Had I liked them better, though, I'd probably be pretty pleased. That much, at least, bodes well for future games.
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