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Post by Deleted on Aug 31, 2019 23:17:31 GMT
I think the way it would play out would be this if Shepard tried to say the Asari hid things without definitive proof (which he/she no longer has because, as I said, the temple was destroyed, Vendetta removed). Are you sure about Vendetta? It was taken from Thessia to Cronos. It talked with Shepard. Shepard leaves with Vendetta just standing there. I would say Vendetta is still around on Cronos. After Thessia, edi tells T'soni that the penalty for withholding prothean artifacts is severe.
The question will not fall on humans, but on the asari for breaking a council law, a law they made. Is it because they believe they're above the law? I would say yes after what the replacement asari councilor said. Extorts? Shepard had to help the other species solve their problems before they would give any help. And if the humans didn't show up, that so-called peaceful galaxy you call would have been harvested. And who are fans of the nosy reporters? You guessed it, the other species. Vendetta is not on Thessia, though; so he's not visibly connected to the Temple of Athane. He was not activated by the Asari, so he's not familiar with their alleged cover-up of the artifact. We know this because the first thing he does when activated is confirm what cycle the galaxy is in. Had the Asari activated and talked with him beforehand, he would not have needed to verify that. Furthermore, the Alliance fleet is under orders to take Cerberus down. Shepard allows them to open fire while he's on the base because he's headed to the most protected part, but that doesn't mean that once he leaves, the Alliance doesn't finish the job and destroy the entire base. Given Shepard's history, either of destroying such abominations or based on past experience over what happens when he/she doesn't destroy them, I'm pretty sure the Alliance destroys the base on Chronos.
As for the rest, it's not about what's true or right, it's all about how it can be spun by the Asari to the other species. IMO, the Asari would have an easy time of it considering their 2,000 years of history with the Salarians and Turians running a galaxy that was free from the Reaper threat, as far as any of the species knew. The humans come along and boom... there goes the neighborhood... all of a sudden, because of Shepard and his wild tales, the humans set themselves up to be heros. They get on the council or they are the council and the Reapers show up. It isn't reapers that attack the Citadel, it's Cerberus, etc. The Asari councillor (regardless of which one) only spoke with Shepard, so anything in that conversation would just be Shepard's word against hers... and she'll deny telling him/her about the artifact and she'll deny even knowing about it. She'll say that Shepard must have seen it in one of his/her visions from the other Prothean beacons. Also, if the penalty is so severe... why wasn't that borught up in ME1 when Shepard asked Anderson why they were bothering to share the Eden Prime find with the Council? Anderson just answers that they were doing it to cement positive relations and because they needed the Council's expertise. There is not mention of a severe penalty for withholding it.
Furthermore, the Alliance knew about the Mars Archives for years... Why isn't there a severe penalty for not divulging the plans for the Crucible sooner (i.e. sharing the Archives with all the other species, instead of just calling in the Shadow Broker).
As I said, justice isn't always served... sometimes it isn't even on the menu.
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Post by griffith82 on Sept 1, 2019 5:39:33 GMT
Prefer they not do this. First any remnants of non Reaperized Cerberus would likely be hunted by the council. Second they'd never partner with Cerberus after what they did in the war. This would make no sense. I trust Cerberus more than I do the asari after failing to reveal an artifact that could have ended the war earlier leading to the possibility of saving many lives. With Cerberus taken care of by Shepard in ME3, the other species will turn to the asari for them to explain about not revealing that artifact. Depending on the results, bad things could happen to the asari. I'll never trust them after ME2. It was clear he had an agenda then and ME3? Just hell no.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 1, 2019 6:16:06 GMT
I trust Cerberus more than I do the asari after failing to reveal an artifact that could have ended the war earlier leading to the possibility of saving many lives. With Cerberus taken care of by Shepard in ME3, the other species will turn to the asari for them to explain about not revealing that artifact. Depending on the results, bad things could happen to the asari. I'll never trust them after ME2. It was clear he had an agenda then and ME3? Just hell no. Not to mention that the “Cerberus” crew we had weren’t even really Cerberus but specifically chosen by TIM to make Shepard believe that’s hpw all of Cerberus was.
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Post by N7eezo on Sept 1, 2019 6:47:17 GMT
Not likely it's gonna happen but reading this discussion: MET+ game idea
- after the Reaper war you can have the Milky Way Galaxy in turmoil, full of internal conflict
- with the new protagonist, a small ship and crew of outlaws (ignoring the synthesis and control ending or hand waving them away)
- all the races we love, all with shades of grey and splinter groups.
- Geth/Quarians could still be part with a small game state difference (some combined, some deciding to remain individual)
- even a few astray Batarians that were somewhere else when the Reapers hit their home world(s).
Thoughts?
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 1, 2019 7:08:12 GMT
Not likely it's gonna happen but reading this discussion: MET+ game idea
- after the Reaper war you can have the Milky Way Galaxy in turmoil, full of internal conflict
- with the new protagonist, a small ship and crew of outlaws (ignoring the synthesis and control ending or hand waving them away)
- all the races we love, all with shades of grey and splinter groups.
- Geth/Quarians could still be part with a small game state difference (some combined, some deciding to remain individual)
- even a few astray Batarians that were somewhere else when the Reapers hit their home world(s).
Thoughts? I don't think Bioware would really have to worry about explaining the Batarians since we saw how widespread they were in the Terminus Systems. So yeah their homeworlds were lost but there can still easily be millions if not billions of them in the galaxy. At worst they are now in a situation similar to the Quarians.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2019 7:28:29 GMT
Not likely it's gonna happen but reading this discussion: MET+ game idea
- after the Reaper war you can have the Milky Way Galaxy in turmoil, full of internal conflict
- with the new protagonist, a small ship and crew of outlaws (ignoring the synthesis and control ending or hand waving them away)
- all the races we love, all with shades of grey and splinter groups.
- Geth/Quarians could still be part with a small game state difference (some combined, some deciding to remain individual)
- even a few astray Batarians that were somewhere else when the Reapers hit their home world(s).
Thoughts? Destroy canon ending... modified to fit in the geth/quarians and batarians... No. If people aren't happy with the outcome of destroy as it was in the game completely, then don't push it as a viable ending solution while recommending "handwaving away synthesis and control. If they choose destroy as canon, I don't want to see a single geth in the franchise beyond that point. Destroy destroyed the geth along with the Reapers.
If it's acceptable to modify destroy to bring geth back; then it's acceptable to modify synthesis so that the DNA isn't changed... that is, the organics and synthetics effectively reach a negotiated peace and agree to behave cooperatively with each other. It would also be easy to rewrite control then as well to suggest that Shepard just becomes the mortal ruler of the Reapers, reprogramming them to serve the organics in the galaxy.
The point here is that if you can change destroy, you can change any one of them to work... depends entirely on what sort of story Bioware wants to tell going forward.
I'd rather Bioware break the timeline somewhere else and rewrite towards a totally new and different ending to ME3 (with Shepard finding away to keep the Reapers from invading in the first place)... or, better yet, let Bioware just continue in the Andromeda Galaxy... let us know who the Benefactor is, who killed Jien Garson, who sabotaged the Quarian Ark, what sort of traitorous villain Primus turns out to be, who are the Jardaan and who attacked them, etc.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 2, 2019 11:55:33 GMT
What if it's Miranda who brings them back to their greatness? That'd be an interesting idea. I'd expect, post war, that the Alliance would get a lot of flack for not having cracked down enough on Cerberus, because that led to the coop, which would have otherwise been prevented. I'm guessing someone really high up, like Hackett, would have an active interest in taking Cerberus down and there's probably no better candidate to lead that charge than a former Cerberus agent. Like Jacob. I'm kidding, I'm kidding, of course not Jacob. Miranda would of course be the most prominent candidate for that job. Miranda wouldn't be averse to usurping Cerberus, but the alliance wouldn't want or allow for Cerberus to exist. At least, not with the M.O. that it use to operate under, during the Reaper war. Would the Alliance encourage the existence of Cerberus after that? Would they just rebrand it?
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Post by burningcherry on Sept 2, 2019 12:43:54 GMT
What if it's Miranda who brings them back to their greatness? That'd be an interesting idea. I'd expect, post war, that the Alliance would get a lot of flack for not having cracked down enough on Cerberus, because that led to the coop, which would have otherwise been prevented. I'm guessing someone really high up, like Hackett, would have an active interest in taking Cerberus down and there's probably no better candidate to lead that charge than a former Cerberus agent. Like Jacob. I'm kidding, I'm kidding, of course not Jacob. Miranda would of course be the most prominent candidate for that job. Miranda wouldn't be averse to usurping Cerberus, but the alliance wouldn't want or allow for Cerberus to exist. At least, not with the M.O. that it use to operate under, during the Reaper war. Would the Alliance encourage the existence of Cerberus after that? Would they just rebrand it? You know what's the most basic problem with this idea? She can be dead at the end of ME3.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 2, 2019 12:59:33 GMT
You know what's the most basic problem with this idea? She can be dead at the end of ME3. It was an illusion.
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Post by Ascend on Sept 2, 2019 13:49:08 GMT
Everything that happened after the intro of ME2 is an illusion. Hm.... Come to think of it, that's not a bad idea to 'reboot' the series. Have Shepard survive the beginning of ME2.
All those Shepard addicts get Shepard back, the ones that hate the ME2 and ME3 story get another one, it's still in the Milky Way, beloved characters like Liara, Garrus and Tali will still be there... Yeah. Sounds like a plan.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Sept 2, 2019 14:17:39 GMT
Everything that happened after the intro of ME2 is an illusion That would be a dream, not an illusion. Or a hallucination. But yeah, you could do that.
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Post by Hrungr on Sept 3, 2019 0:15:36 GMT
Interesting ideas aside, I can only see three realistic options. 1. Continue with the Andromeda storyline. 2. Hard reboot the entire franchise. 3. Put on indefinite "hiatus" and focus efforts elsewhere. Obviously, none would be universally loved, but no option would be. There's really no clear path to success. Another issue, one which I don't see touched on very often, is BioWare's current studio size. With the loss of the Montreal studio, they're just not large enough to carry the Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Anthem and Star Wars franchises in a timely fashion. I have a feeling something will have to give. I'm just hoping that given ME:A's & Anthem's reception, they won't be quietly downsized some more. I know that the Edmonton studio was at one point ~450 employees, then down to ~300 in 2017. I don't know how many now though. They may have grown some, or not, but I haven't seen any big hiring sprees. Given where the bar is set for AAA RPGs these days, the time and $$$ to produce, I think BW's got some tough calls to make ahead. Fortunately, the GM of BW happens to be a big fan of ME...
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Post by dazk on Sept 3, 2019 1:44:33 GMT
Interesting ideas aside, I can only see three realistic options. 1. Continue with the Andromeda storyline. Fortunately, the GM of BW happens to be a big fan of ME... We can only hope!!!!
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 3, 2019 2:00:23 GMT
Interesting ideas aside, I can only see three realistic options. 1. Continue with the Andromeda storyline. 2. Hard reboot the entire franchise. 3. Put on indefinite "hiatus" and focus efforts elsewhere. Obviously, none would be universally loved, but no option would be. There's really no clear path to success. Another issue, one which I don't see touched on very often, is BioWare's current studio size. With the loss of the Montreal studio, they're just not large enough to carry the Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Anthem and Star Wars franchises in a timely fashion. I have a feeling something will have to give. I'm just hoping that given ME:A's & Anthem's reception, they won't be quietly downsized some more. I know that the Edmonton studio was at one point ~450 employees, then down to ~300 in 2017. I don't know how many now though. They may have grown some, or not, but I haven't seen any big hiring sprees. Given where the bar is set for AAA RPGs these days, the time and $$$ to produce, I think BW's got some tough calls to make ahead. Fortunately, the GM of BW happens to be a big fan of ME... If any of those properties should give it should be SWTOR. They have an entire studio supporting almost exclusively it for a decade now.
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Post by Phantom on Sept 3, 2019 2:12:27 GMT
Interesting ideas aside, I can only see three realistic options. 1. Continue with the Andromeda storyline. 2. Hard reboot the entire franchise. 3. Put on indefinite "hiatus" and focus efforts elsewhere. Obviously, none would be universally loved, but no option would be. There's really no clear path to success. Another issue, one which I don't see touched on very often, is BioWare's current studio size. With the loss of the Montreal studio, they're just not large enough to carry the Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Anthem and Star Wars franchises in a timely fashion. I have a feeling something will have to give. I'm just hoping that given ME:A's & Anthem's reception, they won't be quietly downsized some more. I know that the Edmonton studio was at one point ~450 employees, then down to ~300 in 2017. I don't know how many now though. They may have grown some, or not, but I haven't seen any big hiring sprees. Given where the bar is set for AAA RPGs these days, the time and $$$ to produce, I think BW's got some tough calls to make ahead. Fortunately, the GM of BW happens to be a big fan of ME... If any of those properties should give it should be SWTOR. They have an entire studio supporting almost exclusively it for a decade now. Well I do think SWTOR is coming to its natural end. As much as I would love a Kotor remake right now, Bioware needs to take a breather from everything and see what they want in developing in games.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 3, 2019 2:29:00 GMT
Everything that happened after the intro of ME2 is an illusion That would be a dream, not an illusion. Or a hallucination. But yeah, you could do that.
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Post by Phantom on Sept 3, 2019 2:32:43 GMT
That would be a dream, not an illusion. Or a hallucination. But yeah, you could do that. Just curious, would you and others like to fight against a Crazy Shepard as a main villain?.....I will not be surprised there will be salt either way.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Sept 3, 2019 2:41:28 GMT
Just curious, would you and others like to fight against a Crazy Shepard as a main villain?.....I will not be surprised there will be salt either way. I fully support a Crazy Shepard villain. But how crazy? Like the Joker kind of crazy?
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Post by Phantom on Sept 3, 2019 2:45:54 GMT
Just curious, would you and others like to fight against a Crazy Shepard as a main villain?.....I will not be surprised there will be salt either way. I fully support a Crazy Shepard villain. But how crazy? Like the Joker kind of crazy? batshit insane that overflowing with charisma that you don't realize that he is batshit insane until it is too late.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Sept 3, 2019 2:47:28 GMT
I fully support a Crazy Shepard villain. But how crazy? Like the Joker kind of crazy? batshit insane that overflowing with charisma that you don't realize that he is batshit insane until it is too late. *insert Picard "make it so" pic here*
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2019 2:48:45 GMT
Just curious, would you and others like to fight against a Crazy Shepard as a main villain?.....I will not be surprised there will be salt either way. Nope, I don't think Shepard would make a particularly good villain... too variable a backstory based on whatever choices players made.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Sept 3, 2019 2:56:12 GMT
Just curious, would you and others like to fight against a Crazy Shepard as a main villain?.....I will not be surprised there will be salt either way. Nope, I don't think Shepard would make a particularly good villain... too variable a backstory based on whatever choices players made. Sooo..... You don't want to know how Crazy Shepard got those scars? Or why the PC is so serious?
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Post by Phantom on Sept 3, 2019 2:56:57 GMT
Just curious, would you and others like to fight against a Crazy Shepard as a main villain?.....I will not be surprised there will be salt either way. Nope, I don't think Shepard would make a particularly good villain... too variable a backstory based on whatever choices players made. Well I was joking of an AU Shepard that went insane and playing off Hanako's Extreme Indoctrination Theory Post. For more serious characters I have moderately develop is Dutch a N7 Fury that is secretly working for the Reapers and he has a reputation of being the Dreaded before joining the Reapers and a new faction(named Black Talons and i have posted about my ideas for them in different threads) personally recruited him into their ranks. If there is a MW Mass effect game, he can be used against Shepard or any New Player Characters. In short, he is a tough to kill boss that has several useful abilities that gives players nightmares.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2019 3:13:50 GMT
Nope, I don't think Shepard would make a particularly good villain... too variable a backstory based on whatever choices players made. Sooo..... You don't want to know how Crazy Shepard got those scars? Or why the PC is so serious? I'm saying I wouldn't like to fight against a villain based on Shepard... with 3 + 3 permutations of backstories out of the gate varying from ruthless gang member to Mama's boy/girl war hero. If they're going to set up a complex villain, I'd rather they start fresh and with a character whose only proper diagnosis can be multiple personality disorder.
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Post by griffith82 on Sept 3, 2019 3:14:23 GMT
Everything that happened after the intro of ME2 is an illusion. Hm.... Come to think of it, that's not a bad idea to 'reboot' the series. Have Shepard survive the beginning of ME2. All those Shepard addicts get Shepard back, the ones that hate the ME2 and ME3 story get another one, it's still in the Milky Way, beloved characters like Liara, Garrus and Tali will still be there... Yeah. Sounds like a plan. Uh no sounds terrible.
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