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Post by fylimar on Jun 9, 2018 8:31:09 GMT
Or he could go because of the events in Val ROyeaux - to take a look at what the templars doing and maybe putting a stop to it. Don't forget, your inqui doesn't know, that s/he can't go after the mages later. In my first playthrough I thought, I could both fractions to work with me and I happened to choose to visit Redcliffe first. After the whole Tevinter chaos, I thought it best, to do that quest first and help Dorian stop ALexius. ANd then I was shocked that CotJ was no longer available. I thought, I did something wrong. What I mean is, you as player know, that you can't get both fractions for the inquisition. But if you never visit Redcliffe and go straight to the templar stronghold, because of their lunatic behavior (after Fionas civil invitation, you could think, all is well with the mages, word of Alexius never reaches you in time, if you go directly after the templars), your actions are justified. The mages - cool for the moment, nothing dramatioc happening there. The templars - oh lords, what went wrong there? What did Lucius and his merry men smoke?
You can still conscript the templars afterwards, it's not that much different as if allying the mages (for example you get the same approvals) But, why did you think you could get both groups to work with you at all? They were the opposite sides of a war. Without getting into whether or not the mages were justified in thinking this way, they believe the group you went to first to be their tyrannical overlords. And without getting into whether or not the templars are justified in thinking this way, they believe the mages at Redcliffe to be irresponsible apostates with a generous number of dangerous maleficarum in the mix. Why would either work with you unless you went to them first? Don't know. I was totally unspoiled in the game and thought, the point was to get mages and templars on one table and to talk. Same as Justinia tried to do. So I thought the game wants me to end this war and then we investigate the explosion at the conclave. Until Cory destroyed Haven. As I said, I was totally unspoiled
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Post by riverdaleswhiteflash on Jun 9, 2018 8:38:45 GMT
But, why did you think you could get both groups to work with you at all? They were the opposite sides of a war. Without getting into whether or not the mages were justified in thinking this way, they believe the group you went to first to be their tyrannical overlords. And without getting into whether or not the templars are justified in thinking this way, they believe the mages at Redcliffe to be irresponsible apostates with a generous number of dangerous maleficarum in the mix. Why would either work with you unless you went to them first? Don't know. I was totally unspoiled in the game and thought, the point was to get mages and templars on one table and to talk. Same as Justinia tried to do. So I thought the game wants me to end this war and then we investigate the explosion at the conclave. Until Cory destroyed Haven. As I said, I was totally unspoiled I'd kind of assumed the entire time we were going to wind up picking a side. (I guess part of that was because I'd imagined the Mage-Templar war was going to be the center of things instead of each side being absorbed by either Inky's or Cory's army, and the original war becoming largely moot in the face of something far worse.)
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Post by fylimar on Jun 9, 2018 10:06:15 GMT
Don't know. I was totally unspoiled in the game and thought, the point was to get mages and templars on one table and to talk. Same as Justinia tried to do. So I thought the game wants me to end this war and then we investigate the explosion at the conclave. Until Cory destroyed Haven. As I said, I was totally unspoiled I'd kind of assumed the entire time we were going to wind up picking a side. (I guess part of that was because I'd imagined the Mage-Templar war was going to be the center of things instead of each side being absorbed by either Inky's or Cory's army, and the original war becoming largely moot in the face of something far worse.) I thought, that this time, we had to find a way to make them work together for eliminating the greater threat, since we had to choose sides already in DA2 and I didn't think, they would do that again. I mean, it was made clear, that no matter who you choose, a few from the other side are working with the inquisition too - most notably of course Cullen and Lysette for the templars and Vivi, Dorian (kind of), the librarian, the elf who does research, Adan for the mages and some no named npcs standing around in Skyhold from both sides. You have the fight between some templars and mages before you travel to Val Royeaux and I thought, that meant, that no matter who you ally with, you will always have some templars and mages around. You see that in the war table missions too, when Cullen for example sends some templars to protect a bunch of mages that are about to join the inquisition or Leli has some mages in her ranks that help with some other missions. So I guess, you always get the levelheaded persons from each side, which kind of make sense, since there were enough people on both sides, that didn't want the war and see the inquisition as an opportunity to get out of it.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 9, 2018 15:24:23 GMT
So I guess, you always get the levelheaded persons from each side, which kind of make sense, since there were enough people on both sides, that didn't want the war and see the inquisition as an opportunity to get out of it. I agree that we do seem to come across people from both sides who either never wanted to be part of the war or have become disillusioned with it. I suppose that is why they didn't ask us to try and mediate between the two figurehead factions because they now comprise the extremists on each side who will not consider working with the other group. As Solas rightly points out, it is hard to understand how Justinia ever thought she could bring them together through the Conclave. However, that is why I don't think she ever seriously thought she could get them to compromise simply through dialogue but was bringing them together so she could then present them with the threat of her newly formed Inquisition in order to force them to compromise.
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Post by Catilina on Jun 9, 2018 15:27:30 GMT
I'd kind of assumed the entire time we were going to wind up picking a side. (I guess part of that was because I'd imagined the Mage-Templar war was going to be the center of things instead of each side being absorbed by either Inky's or Cory's army, and the original war becoming largely moot in the face of something far worse.) I thought, that this time, we had to find a way to make them work together for eliminating the greater threat, since we had to choose sides already in DA2 and I didn't think, they would do that again. I mean, it was made clear, that no matter who you choose, a few from the other side are working with the inquisition too - most notably of course Cullen and Lysette for the templars and Vivi, Dorian (kind of), the librarian, the elf who does research, Adan for the mages and some no named npcs standing around in Skyhold from both sides. You have the fight between some templars and mages before you travel to Val Royeaux and I thought, that meant, that no matter who you ally with, you will always have some templars and mages around. You see that in the war table missions too, when Cullen for example sends some templars to protect a bunch of mages that are about to join the inquisition or Leli has some mages in her ranks that help with some other missions. So I guess, you always get the levelheaded persons from each side, which kind of make sense, since there were enough people on both sides, that didn't want the war and see the inquisition as an opportunity to get out of it.
It's a dream, but I don't have any illusion, this is possible without forcing one group of them. They're enemies. So: I would ally with the mages, and imprison the Templars, forcing them to the cooperation.
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Nightscrawl on Jun 9, 2018 15:53:53 GMT
Don't know. I was totally unspoiled in the game and thought, the point was to get mages and templars on one table and to talk. Same as Justinia tried to do. So I thought the game wants me to end this war and then we investigate the explosion at the conclave. Until Cory destroyed Haven. As I said, I was totally unspoiled This really only works until you get to the war table and it tells you you can only pick one. After you learn that, you have to base your choice around something, whether that is sticking with your roleplay, or meta information.
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Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquisition
Posts: 369 Likes: 1,014
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Post by pavellaning on Jun 9, 2018 15:56:17 GMT
I thought, that this time, we had to find a way to make them work together for eliminating the greater threat, since we had to choose sides already in DA2 and I didn't think, they would do that again. I mean, it was made clear, that no matter who you choose, a few from the other side are working with the inquisition too - most notably of course Cullen and Lysette for the templars and Vivi, Dorian (kind of), the librarian, the elf who does research, Adan for the mages and some no named npcs standing around in Skyhold from both sides. You have the fight between some templars and mages before you travel to Val Royeaux and I thought, that meant, that no matter who you ally with, you will always have some templars and mages around. You see that in the war table missions too, when Cullen for example sends some templars to protect a bunch of mages that are about to join the inquisition or Leli has some mages in her ranks that help with some other missions. So I guess, you always get the levelheaded persons from each side, which kind of make sense, since there were enough people on both sides, that didn't want the war and see the inquisition as an opportunity to get out of it.
It's a dream, but I don't have any illusion, this is possible without forcing one group of them. They're enemies. So: I would ally with the mages, and imprison the Templars, forcing them to the cooperation. I'd ally with the Templars and put the Mages back into their towers.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by fylimar on Jun 9, 2018 20:30:04 GMT
Don't know. I was totally unspoiled in the game and thought, the point was to get mages and templars on one table and to talk. Same as Justinia tried to do. So I thought the game wants me to end this war and then we investigate the explosion at the conclave. Until Cory destroyed Haven. As I said, I was totally unspoiled This really only works until you get to the war table and it tells you you can only pick one. After you learn that, you have to base your choice around something, whether that is sticking with your roleplay, or meta information.
I was talking about the mage/templar conflict in general, I thought it to be the main topic in the game and then Cory came and crashed the party. I thought, that there might be missions later on, where you can get in touch with members from the other fraction and maybe can bring them together to talk, if certain requirements are met (like certain tasks or some kind of reputation system etc), you know? That the whole game deals with the templar/mage conflict and whit what happened at the conclave.
As I said, totally unspoiled
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lilyonce
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The whole universe is...
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
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The whole universe is...
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Post by lilyonce on Jun 9, 2018 20:47:32 GMT
Templars because Redcliffe Castle is obviously a trap.
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jaerick243
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 209 Likes: 252
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by jaerick243 on Jun 9, 2018 22:02:47 GMT
In terms of in character, it comes down to my inquisitor deciding whether the Redcliffe plot device is important enough to deal with. My inquisitors can see both sides, especially ad a mage from the Ostwick Circle.
Does not really help that all the mages in Redcliffe do is complain that there is nothing they can do. I mean, why do they not even think about just leaving Redcliffe to join up at one of the many inquisition camps dotting the hinterlands?
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Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquisition
Posts: 369 Likes: 1,014
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Post by pavellaning on Jun 9, 2018 22:16:16 GMT
My current Inquisitor, Lyanna chose the Mages due to having gone to Redcliffe and seeing a situation that she couldn't walk away from. Originally, she was planning to go and seek out the Templars but a side-trip to Redcliffe turned out to be a change of heart -- especially after seeing Fiona's despair. She didn't have the heart to pretend she didn't see anything in Redcliffe and didn't want to ignore a Magister enslaving Ferelden citizens. She was thinking of conscripting them but after getting to know Dorian she decided to give the Mages another chance to prove they deserve freedom.
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition
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Post by phoray on Jun 10, 2018 2:23:00 GMT
Don't know. I was totally unspoiled in the game and thought, the point was to get mages and templars on one table and to talk. Same as Justinia tried to do. So I thought the game wants me to end this war and then we investigate the explosion at the conclave. Until Cory destroyed Haven. As I said, I was totally unspoiled This really only works until you get to the war table and it tells you you can only pick one. After you learn that, you have to base your choice around something, whether that is sticking with your roleplay, or meta information. Actually, as someone who doesn't read fine print very often, I also didn't pick up that it was an Either Or on my first PT. I may not have read the screen AT ALL-- I mean, I'd just been briefed through Dialogue, so what was the text going to be except a summary of what I'd just heard?
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 10, 2018 15:17:10 GMT
Does not really help that all the mages in Redcliffe do is complain that there is nothing they can do. I mean, why do they not even think about just leaving Redcliffe to join up at one of the many inquisition camps dotting the hinterlands? That is the strange part. That nice tranquil can come up to you and ask to join up. Whilst it is surprising he is even still alive he can leave with us. The elven healer is able to move her location as well after we talk with her. Yet the mages who don't like being indentured to Tevinter can't simply say they want out and leave with us? Or simply sneak out now the gate is open and go on their merry way? Or take a boat from the docks and row away? I can understand Templar soldiers being reluctant to disobey orders because that is one of the drawbacks of being part of a military unit but these mages wanted their freedom and then surrender it tamely when they quite plainly don't like what Fiona has committed them to. I can only think that the number of Venatori sympathises who infiltrated their ranks were greater in number than the objectors, so they bullied them into staying.
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Post by xerrai on Jun 10, 2018 22:21:56 GMT
Does not really help that all the mages in Redcliffe do is complain that there is nothing they can do. I mean, why do they not even think about just leaving Redcliffe to join up at one of the many inquisition camps dotting the hinterlands? That is the strange part. That nice tranquil can come up to you and ask to join up. Whilst it is surprising he is even still alive he can leave with us. The elven healer is able to move her location as well after we talk with her. Yet the mages who don't like being indentured to Tevinter can't simply say they want out and leave with us? Or simply sneak out now the gate is open and go on their merry way? Or take a boat from the docks and row away? I can understand Templar soldiers being reluctant to disobey orders because that is one of the drawbacks of being part of a military unit but these mages wanted their freedom and then surrender it tamely when they quite plainly don't like what Fiona has committed them to. I can only think that the number of Venatori sympathises who infiltrated their ranks were greater in number than the objectors, so they bullied them into staying. I think the answer is actually much simpler than that. From that Fiona told us, the venatori made the mages believe that a templar attack was imminent, and not only that, the areas outside Redcliffe was essentially an active war zone. Unlike Therinfall which is located further away, the mage-templar war was primarily being held and fought in the Hinterlands. Power-hungry mages, genocidal templars and other malicious elements lie just outside of Redcliffe's gates and they know it. So I think the mages were just scared. Cowardly. And in that that fear they either submit themselves to inaction or turn to old familiarity--namely by following the lead of thier brethren leader(s). For all of thier bravery in attempting to rebel, the majority of the mages there only know the life of the Circle Towers. Circle Towers that, despite the differences in each Circle, holds regimented routine as a given since they are essentially a means of containing/controlling mages. The fear of annihilation should have lessened when the Inquisition (a powerful force that might have been willing to shield them) showed up, but I can chunk that up to the mages either not knowing the Inquisition's merit since Redcliffe was cut off from the world, or they are much more prone to cowardice than I realized. Or more loyal to old chains of command than I realized. One of the two.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 209 Likes: 252
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Post by jaerick243 on Jun 10, 2018 23:03:46 GMT
That is the strange part. That nice tranquil can come up to you and ask to join up. Whilst it is surprising he is even still alive he can leave with us. The elven healer is able to move her location as well after we talk with her. Yet the mages who don't like being indentured to Tevinter can't simply say they want out and leave with us? Or simply sneak out now the gate is open and go on their merry way? Or take a boat from the docks and row away? I can understand Templar soldiers being reluctant to disobey orders because that is one of the drawbacks of being part of a military unit but these mages wanted their freedom and then surrender it tamely when they quite plainly don't like what Fiona has committed them to. I can only think that the number of Venatori sympathises who infiltrated their ranks were greater in number than the objectors, so they bullied them into staying. I think the answer is actually much simpler than that. From that Fiona told us, the venatori made the mages believe that a templar attack was imminent, and not only that, the areas outside Redcliffe was essentially an active war zone. Unlike Therinfall which is located further away, the mage-templar war was primarily being held and fought in the Hinterlands. Power-hungry mages, genocidal templars and other malicious elements lie just outside of Redcliffe's gates and they know it. So I think the mages were just scared. Cowardly. And in that that fear they either submit themselves to inaction or turn to old familiarity--namely by following the lead of thier brethren leader(s). For all of thier bravery in attempting to rebel, the majority of the mages there only know the life of the Circle Towers. Circle Towers that, despite the differences in each Circle, holds regimented routine as a given since they are essentially a means of containing/controlling mages. The fear of annihilation should have lessened when the Inquisition (a powerful force that might have been willing to shield them) showed up, but I can chunk that up to the mages either not knowing the Inquisition's merit since Redcliffe was cut off from the world, or they are much more prone to cowardice than I realized. Or more loyal to old chains of command than I realized. One of the two. I establish camps, mop up both the apostates not with the rebels and the templars, and they still are too afraid to leave? Why did they agree to rebelling again? Sounds to me that the mages are just idiots who need the circles to even function.
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Post by Catilina on Jun 10, 2018 23:50:10 GMT
I think the answer is actually much simpler than that. From that Fiona told us, the venatori made the mages believe that a templar attack was imminent, and not only that, the areas outside Redcliffe was essentially an active war zone. Unlike Therinfall which is located further away, the mage-templar war was primarily being held and fought in the Hinterlands. Power-hungry mages, genocidal templars and other malicious elements lie just outside of Redcliffe's gates and they know it.
So I think the mages were just scared. Cowardly. And in that that fear they either submit themselves to inaction or turn to old familiarity--namely by following the lead of thier brethren leader(s). For all of thier bravery in attempting to rebel, the majority of the mages there only know the life of the Circle Towers. Circle Towers that, despite the differences in each Circle, holds regimented routine as a given since they are essentially a means of containing/controlling mages.
The fear of annihilation should have lessened when the Inquisition (a powerful force that might have been willing to shield them) showed up, but I can chunk that up to the mages either not knowing the Inquisition's merit since Redcliffe was cut off from the world, or they are much more prone to cowardice than I realized. Or more loyal to old chains of command than I realized. One of the two. I establish camps, mop up both the apostates not with the rebels and the templars, and they still are too afraid to leave? Why did they agree to rebelling again? Sounds to me that the mages are just idiots who need the circles to even function. No. Then they never learn to live. The Circles must be destroyed. The first times will be hard – but the freedom is hard. Many slaves also can't live freely at first, then must send to back to their master? If Hawke doesn't give work to Oranna, she will sell herself in the Rose...
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Post by xerrai on Jun 11, 2018 0:00:34 GMT
I establish camps, mop up both the apostates not with the rebels and the templars, and they still are too afraid to leave? Why did they agree to rebelling again? Sounds to me that the mages are just idiots who need the circles to even function. Well its not clear how much the rebel mages know by the time you reach them. Before Fiona meets you in Val Royeux, Redcliffe had already closed its gates to everyone (Inquisition included). The only people allowed to go outside were guards for the gate and presumably scouts, though I have yet to see evidence of the former. And by the time Alexius comes around, he used time magic to have him and his forces arrive at Redcliffe not too long after the Conclave (which means, long before the Inquisition arrived) and even then its still not clear if Redcliffe was open enough to permit outside information to reach them. Granted, I find it hard to believe that they had no idea what was happening outside thier walls, but I can't ignore the signs that they were isolating themselves in Redcliffe either. But the point is, its very possible that the rebel mages knew nothing of the Inquisition's recent accomplishments in the Hinterlands even if you did wipe out the dangerous elements. They knew of the Inquisition as a new orginization, but I don't think it was ever confirmed if they knew anything else at that time. But even if they did know of these accomplishments, would it really matter all that much? All clearing the malicious elements did was prove that the Inquisition could beat these elements, nothing more. It did not approve or express which side or you were on, it just confirmed that the Inquisition was powerful enough to end them. Unless an open announcement came with it, there was no way to discern the Inquisition's intent for the mages. Hell, the entire game is set up so the Inquisitor can approach either side while ultimately leaving the choice to help or conscript up until the end of thier given quest line. As for why they are rebelling? Well...some of them don't want to (there's even a loyalist mage in their ranks who didn't mind the Circles). The vote to rebel only passed by a small margin, remember? After that it basically chaos. Some fled to noble sponsors, some fled into the wilderness, and some were left with nowhere else to go (which is to say nothing of the mages fighting amongst themselves). All while the templars either started chasing them if they weren't guarding towers (like Hasmal's templars) or serving the Chantry. The main rebellion host offered help for these mages so long as they did not fight against them. In fact, part of the reason of why the Venatori infiltrated so effectively is because the mages thought they were stragglers; Mages from other Circles who either needed a place to stay or mages fleeing an otherwise hostile environment. As for the mages being idiots...well I can only really say Fiona and that pissy Ostwick mage in the Inn are idiots. The grand majority of the mages that we meet don't understand the Grand Enchanter's decision, let alone agree with it. Most are against it. So they are not idiots on that front. And I can't really call them idiots for staying put either when the alternatives that they can see are of dubious quality at best. So...not too sure where you were going with that one. Incompetent? Sure. Idiots? Not so much except for Fiona and a few others.
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Post by opuspace on Jun 11, 2018 0:02:40 GMT
I establish camps, mop up both the apostates not with the rebels and the templars, and they still are too afraid to leave? Why did they agree to rebelling again? Sounds to me that the mages are just idiots who need the circles to even function. Their situation is one where someone who's lived their entire life indoors, being watched closely with so little privacy, being taught to self loathe and that their opinions do not matter if their guardians abuse them, are now forced to leave the only place they ever knew because the alternative is death to an unknown world where mages and templars are killing each other across the land. They've been actively discouraged from critical thinking for survival and learning useful skills like swords according to codices. Added to that, they claim they have children and Tranquils among them so that ups their responsibilities. The end result is a paralyzed citizen who had learned helplessness blocking their confidence in trying to make decisions that won't get them killed. With the Inquisitor also killing any rogue mages along with the templars, that adds to the stress of how are they going to prove their innocence if they're caught by soldiers and that if you get uppity in fighting back, that gets you killed faster. News does not travel fast as a text message in Thedas. There are places who are days behind in knowing that the Inquisitor is taking care of things or that the mages are under protection. It's a case of damned if you do, damned if you don't. Fiona is the only one they know who has had experience outside their Circle so that explains why they haven't left her.
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jaerick243
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 209 Likes: 252
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Post by jaerick243 on Jun 11, 2018 0:04:40 GMT
I establish camps, mop up both the apostates not with the rebels and the templars, and they still are too afraid to leave? Why did they agree to rebelling again? Sounds to me that the mages are just idiots who need the circles to even function. Well its not clear how much the rebel mages know by the time you reach them. Before Fiona meets you in Val Royeux, Redcliffe had already closed its gates to everyone (Inquisition included). The only people allowed to go outside were guards for the gate and presumably scouts, though I have yet to see evidence of the former. And by the time Alexius comes around, he used time magic to have him and his forces arrive at Redcliffe not too long after the Conclave (which means, long before the Inquisition arrived) and even then its still not clear if Redcliffe was open enough to permit outside information to reach them. Granted, I find it hard to believe that they had no idea what was happening outside thier walls, but I can't ignore the signs that they were isolating themselves in Redcliffe either. But the point is, its very possible that the rebel mages knew nothing of the Inquisition's recent accomplishments in the Hinterlands even if you did wipe out the dangerous elements. They knew of the Inquisition as a new orginization, but I don't think it was ever confirmed if they knew anything else at that time. The healer in Redcliffe you can recruit to help the crossroads does not know much else either, but she ends up leaving for helping the Inquisition. Why do the mages not even ask if they can join? All they do is complain that they have to stay, but are pathetic excuses for mages who simply are not willing to chance it.
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Post by xerrai on Jun 11, 2018 0:14:38 GMT
Well its not clear how much the rebel mages know by the time you reach them. Before Fiona meets you in Val Royeux, Redcliffe had already closed its gates to everyone (Inquisition included). The only people allowed to go outside were guards for the gate and presumably scouts, though I have yet to see evidence of the former. And by the time Alexius comes around, he used time magic to have him and his forces arrive at Redcliffe not too long after the Conclave (which means, long before the Inquisition arrived) and even then its still not clear if Redcliffe was open enough to permit outside information to reach them. Granted, I find it hard to believe that they had no idea what was happening outside thier walls, but I can't ignore the signs that they were isolating themselves in Redcliffe either. But the point is, its very possible that the rebel mages knew nothing of the Inquisition's recent accomplishments in the Hinterlands even if you did wipe out the dangerous elements. They knew of the Inquisition as a new orginization, but I don't think it was ever confirmed if they knew anything else at that time. The healer in Redcliffe you can recruit to help the crossroads does not know much else either, but she ends up leaving for helping the Inquisition. Why do the mages not even ask if they can join? All they do is complain that they have to stay, but are pathetic excuses for mages who simply are not willing to chance it. And i'm not denying that. It's just that I don't see why a mage not choosing to take a chance with an upstart organization like the Inquisition should instantly prove that they are idiots. Or put another way, I don't see why a mage complaining and/or pathetic should instantly make them an idiot or less intelligent.
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Post by MarilynRobert on Jun 11, 2018 3:55:13 GMT
Does not really help that all the mages in Redcliffe do is complain that there is nothing they can do. I mean, why do they not even think about just leaving Redcliffe to join up at one of the many inquisition camps dotting the hinterlands? That is the strange part. That nice tranquil can come up to you and ask to join up. Whilst it is surprising he is even still alive he can leave with us. The elven healer is able to move her location as well after we talk with her. Yet the mages who don't like being indentured to Tevinter can't simply say they want out and leave with us? Or simply sneak out now the gate is open and go on their merry way? Or take a boat from the docks and row away? I can understand Templar soldiers being reluctant to disobey orders because that is one of the drawbacks of being part of a military unit but these mages wanted their freedom and then surrender it tamely when they quite plainly don't like what Fiona has committed them to. I can only think that the number of Venatori sympathises who infiltrated their ranks were greater in number than the objectors, so they bullied them into staying. It's people like him that make me want to help the mages, well, I want to help the mages anyway but he's one of the many people I want to help. And to think so many of the tranquil have been killed for such horrible reasons. That shack with the skulls is so sad.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 11, 2018 11:07:32 GMT
That shack with the skulls is so sad. It is not only sad but an outrage for which no one is ever called properly to account. It is something I would have like to have quizzed Fiona about. Where did she think all the tranquil had gone to? Whilst you can argue that the nearest you can get is punishing Alexius, there is no mention made of the tranquil in any of the charges brought against him. It is as though the writers consider the tranquil sub-human and so not deserving of having specific justice brought in their name. Then they force you to look through those wretched skulls to complete a major side-quest that appears in the Keep. I only did it once for the sake of full completion. Every other run I steadfastly ignore them and when I hear the ringing noise in my ears, simply yell "shut up."
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Post by jaerick243 on Jun 11, 2018 15:27:57 GMT
That is the strange part. That nice tranquil can come up to you and ask to join up. Whilst it is surprising he is even still alive he can leave with us. The elven healer is able to move her location as well after we talk with her. Yet the mages who don't like being indentured to Tevinter can't simply say they want out and leave with us? Or simply sneak out now the gate is open and go on their merry way? Or take a boat from the docks and row away? I can understand Templar soldiers being reluctant to disobey orders because that is one of the drawbacks of being part of a military unit but these mages wanted their freedom and then surrender it tamely when they quite plainly don't like what Fiona has committed them to. I can only think that the number of Venatori sympathises who infiltrated their ranks were greater in number than the objectors, so they bullied them into staying. It's people like him that make me want to help the mages, well, I want to help the mages anyway but he's one of the many people I want to help. And to think so many of the tranquil have been killed for such horrible reasons. That shack with the skulls is so sad. That is another thing. We know that shack exists, why didn't any of the mages stand up for the Tranquil? Why did they just let them get slaughtered for those ocularum? It is just dumb.
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Post by Catilina on Jun 11, 2018 17:04:08 GMT
It's people like him that make me want to help the mages, well, I want to help the mages anyway but he's one of the many people I want to help. And to think so many of the tranquil have been killed for such horrible reasons. That shack with the skulls is so sad. That is another thing. We know that shack exists, why didn't any of the mages stand up for the Tranquil? Why did they just let them get slaughtered for those ocularum? It is just dumb. I can give one explanation: the Mages fears the Tranquils, and many of them want to be dead instead of being a Tranquil. The Tranquils are their embodied nightmare. And I suppose, they think, better to let them die – for them. Perhaps. I can't imagine other explanation. But I'm not sure about, just a theory. Anders killed Karl without hesitation – for Karl. Still sad. Update: they knew, the "cure" exists – so still weird. True, they don't know the method of the cure.
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Post by jaerick243 on Jun 11, 2018 17:27:42 GMT
That is another thing. We know that shack exists, why didn't any of the mages stand up for the Tranquil? Why did they just let them get slaughtered for those ocularum? It is just dumb. I can give one explanation: the Mages fears the Tranquils, and many of them want to be dead instead of being a Tranquil. The Tranquils are their embodied nightmare. And I suppose, they think, better to let them die – for them. Perhaps. I can't imagine other explanation. But I'm not sure about, just a theory. Anders killed Karl without hesitation – for Karl. Still sad. Update: they knew, the "cure" exists – so still weird. True, they don't know the method of the cure. Didn't Karl ask to be killed when spirit power made him temporarily normal again? I highly doubt the Tranquil are asking to be turned into devices for finding magical artifacts, so that is not an excuse. They are still either idiots, or just plain terrible people. Best to conscript the inquisition mages or leave them to their fate. Again, for me, it comes down to whether my inquisitors find the plot device of IHW important to deal with.
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