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Hope for the best, plan for the worst
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Post by griffith82 on Jan 12, 2019 15:50:37 GMT
I love Andromeda but I see both sides of it. However some weapons should have been on the ship, but at the same time wouldn't have given the best first impression. As long as I didn't have weapons pointed at them, I'd risk having them over potentially being destroyed. I would think any sentient species we might encounter would understand that. Yeah you have a point.
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You'll be peeling goddamn potatoes for the rest of your miserable excuse for a military career!
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Post by General Mahad on Jan 26, 2019 5:11:21 GMT
Here’s a question, do you trust that slaver/terrorist/pirate/Geth ship is not going to board you and enslave/kidnap/rape/summarily execute everyone on board?
Also nowadays, cruise ships and merchant ships have none-lethal counter measures like LRADs and high pressure water hoses.
Also they have security personnel equipped with flashbangs, traumatic pistols, and batons.
There’s a massive gap between unarmed civilians and military/police they can be filled with non-lethal armament.
In the Mass Effect universe, passenger ships and merchants might not have any ship borne weapons in citadel space but passengers/crew would have omni tools capable of dealing tech damage and biotics in addition to their civilian firearms like the M-22 Eviscerator, M-92 Mantis, M-5 Phalanx/M-3 Predator.
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Basquemercat117
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ajew8887
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
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Post by Basquemercat117 on Jan 31, 2019 20:20:52 GMT
Here’s a question, do you trust that slaver/terrorist/pirate/Geth ship is not going to board you and enslave/kidnap/rape/summarily execute everyone on board? Also nowadays, cruise ships and merchant ships have none-lethal counter measures like LRADs and high pressure water hoses. Also they have security personnel equipped with flashbangs, traumatic pistols, and batons. There’s a massive gap between unarmed civilians and military/police they can be filled with non-lethal armament. In the Mass Effect universe, passenger ships and merchants might not have any ship borne weapons in citadel space but passengers/crew would have omni tools capable of dealing tech damage and biotics in addition to their civilian firearms like the M-22 Eviscerator, M-92 Mantis, M-5 Phalanx/M-3 Predator. in the realm of small arms/ anti personal weapons it seems to be that if someone knows they are going into a dangerous area they do seem to be prepared in that regard, includin the AI. but my issue is ship to ship weapons and anti fighter weapons. your assault rifle doesnt do anything when your target is miles away in space.
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KrrKs
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Post by KrrKs on Feb 1, 2019 22:08:45 GMT
[...] In the Mass Effect universe, passenger ships and merchants might not have any ship borne weapons in citadel space but passengers/crew would have omni tools capable of dealing tech damage and biotics in addition to their civilian firearms like the M-22 Eviscerator, M-92 Mantis, M-5 Phalanx/M-3 Predator. in the realm of small arms/ anti personal weapons it seems to be that if someone knows they are going into a dangerous area they do seem to be prepared in that regard, includin the AI. but my issue is ship to ship weapons and anti fighter weapons. your assault rifle doesnt do anything when your target is miles away in space. It's mass effect, though. The single universe were ground forces >> space superiority.
I mean Sheppard downed a Wraith dart with a hand held weapon once. Shepard downed multiple fighters using hand held weapons! And most pirates, (or at least the ones encountered or heard about) prefer actually boarding their intended victim's ship. As seen by the fate of Cpt. Wilhelm of the MSV Majesty, the biotic terrorist (not pirates in this case), Wrex's work for Saren, and iirc a story told by Samara.
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ahglock
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: ShinobiKillfist
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Post by ahglock on Feb 1, 2019 22:19:48 GMT
in the realm of small arms/ anti personal weapons it seems to be that if someone knows they are going into a dangerous area they do seem to be prepared in that regard, includin the AI. but my issue is ship to ship weapons and anti fighter weapons. your assault rifle doesnt do anything when your target is miles away in space. It's mass effect, though. The single universe were ground forces >> space superiority.
I mean Sheppard downed a Wraith dart with a hand held weapon once. Shepard downed multiple fighters using hand held weapons! And most pirates, (or at least the ones encountered or heard about) prefer actually boarding their intended victim's ship. As seen by the fate of Cpt. Wilhelm of the MSV Majesty, the biotic terrorist (not pirates in this case), Wrex's work for Saren, and iirc a story told by Samara.
I always assumed it was because it’s hard to target a ship and damage it just enough to kill the crew but not destroy the goods, especially when the crew and passengers are the goods. So you kind of have to board while they are still alive at some point. Also given that pirate ships probably aren’t military dreadnoughts or something even lightly armed vessels might be able to defend themselves against them while not being a threat to citadel forces. So I’m not sure why people wouldn’t want their ship armed.
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KrrKs
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Origin: KrrKs
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Post by KrrKs on Feb 1, 2019 22:40:40 GMT
[...] most pirates [...] prefer actually boarding their intended victim's ship. I always assumed it was because it’s hard to target a ship and damage it just enough to kill the crew but not destroy the goods, especially when the crew and passengers are the goods. So you kind of have to board while they are still alive at some point. Also given that pirate ships probably aren’t military dreadnoughts or something even lightly armed vessels might be able to defend themselves against them while not being a threat to citadel forces. So I’m not sure why people wouldn’t want their ship armed. That's certainly correct. Though I believe that none of the Kowloon freighters encountered, and also not the freighter Wrex' group boarded were armed. So, in theory, even a lightly armed make-shift pirate vessel would way better armed than its prey. At that point, why board (or even shoot, if all goes well) at all? Just demand that the freighter jettison its cargo or it be destroyed. From the pirates pov there would be almost no risk involved, unlike when personally boarding a ship.
From a merchants perspective, the cost of arming and shielding the ship, the increased maintenance, and loss of cargo space are probably not worth the slightly better security. At least in citadel space those measures are likely not needed. And anywhere else you ran the risk of encountering even more fierce, heavier armed pirates which makes the investment useless. Of course at that point, loosing cargo space to accommodate armed guards is also not a sensible choice....
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ahglock
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: ShinobiKillfist
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Post by ahglock on Feb 1, 2019 23:29:50 GMT
Yeah without some kind of economy it’s hard to guess if it is logical or not to arm/shield a ship. I suspect yes in council space it’s safe enough where you don’t bother.
Out of council space where it’s not just your cargo but slaver assholes to worry about I can’t fathom being unarmed. Hell I’d expect you’d be reasonably well armed. Now the pirate ships as you say might be stronger out there as well. But there is a point of diminishing returns. Cost of maintenance/purchase to expected haul. Also there comes a point where why bother being a pirate sell the ship and retire.
Maybe the missions we do are all about the people who gambled and lost by not being armed so they became more tempting targets.
They don’t really detail how risky it is or any of the others details you’d need to make s good guess on what people would do. My impression was it was dangerous enough that civilian ships would be armed outside council space. But we have a fairly narrow perspective on it.
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Post by Polka Dot on Feb 18, 2019 3:06:28 GMT
Space is vast, yo. The chance of randomly encountering another vessel is infinitesimal. I'd assume most vessels travel at FTL speeds most of the time, which makes them undetectable and impossible to target. It does beg the question, so what the heck happened to the MSV Majesty? The Majesty is a Kowloon class modular conveyor of human design. The ship is a derelict. All compartments are exposed to space, and the fusion plant is leaking. The damage is consistant [sic] with ship-mounted mass accelerator fire.Based on that description, it must have been attacked by another ship. You'd think it would be a fairly sophisticated operation, that they had knowledge of its cargo and travel plans, and possibly even planted stowaways or sabotaged it when it was in port... in which case better security at the port may be a better solution than arming cargo ships.
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ahglock
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: ShinobiKillfist
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ahglock
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Shattered Steel, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
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Post by ahglock on Feb 18, 2019 4:22:55 GMT
Space is vast, yo. The chance of randomly encountering another vessel is infinitesimal. I'd assume most vessels travel at FTL speeds most of the time, which makes them undetectable and impossible to target. It does beg the question, so what the heck happened to the MSV Majesty? The Majesty is a Kowloon class modular conveyor of human design. The ship is a derelict. All compartments are exposed to space, and the fusion plant is leaking. The damage is consistant [sic] with ship-mounted mass accelerator fire.Based on that description, it must have been attacked by another ship. You'd think it would be a fairly sophisticated operation, that they had knowledge of its cargo and travel plans, and possibly even planted stowaways or sabotaged it when it was in port... in which case better security at the port may be a better solution than arming cargo ships.
In different setting the vastness of space has more or less meaning. It depends on how FTL works. In mass effect there is limited FTL without needing the relay. The relays give pirates a point to find and track you from. They generally only attack out in the nowhere ville where once you come through a relay you have a fairly limited range of options on where you will head.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: KrrKs
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Post by KrrKs on Feb 18, 2019 21:49:40 GMT
Also the drive cores need to be discharged. So any planet with strong magnetic field in the vicinity of 'trade lanes' will often see such merchant ships stopping by. Meaning that these are also great for pirates to spot potential targets.
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ajew8887
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Post by Basquemercat117 on Feb 19, 2019 21:11:53 GMT
Space is vast, yo. The chance of randomly encountering another vessel is infinitesimal. I'd assume most vessels travel at FTL speeds most of the time, which makes them undetectable and impossible to target. It does beg the question, so what the heck happened to the MSV Majesty? The Majesty is a Kowloon class modular conveyor of human design. The ship is a derelict. All compartments are exposed to space, and the fusion plant is leaking. The damage is consistant [sic] with ship-mounted mass accelerator fire.Based on that description, it must have been attacked by another ship. You'd think it would be a fairly sophisticated operation, that they had knowledge of its cargo and travel plans, and possibly even planted stowaways or sabotaged it when it was in port... in which case better security at the port may be a better solution than arming cargo ships. fair with an operation where you are infiltrating or sabotaging a ship in dock to make it an easier target the guns the ship has become meaningless. but that is a very well planned out deal. in a ambush of a random cargo ship i feel the ship have some sort of counter measure or anti ship armament would play a larger key role.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Polka Dot on Feb 20, 2019 22:15:13 GMT
Also the drive cores need to be discharged. So any planet with strong magnetic field in the vicinity of 'trade lanes' will often see such merchant ships stopping by. Meaning that these are also great for pirates to spot potential targets. I guess what I'm imagining would involve hitting a relay, then dropping into FTL toward the pick-up/delivery site. So - the only time they'd be vulnerable is when they're shifting into or out of FTL, and of course when they're docked. The Citadel as well as other space stations have discharge facilities. I would assume the ships would make use of them when they are loading/unloading their cargo. Shrug.
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