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Post by wufiei on Nov 13, 2018 1:46:55 GMT
I'd like some good tips for these two classes. I like using the Raider on both of them (took shotgun evo in passive). Rank 5 lash, 6 singularity/charge and 6 smash (armor and electrical dmg). Thanks in advance.
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Post by MPApr2012 on Nov 13, 2018 2:29:06 GMT
wait. they have shotgun passives evo??? edit: ah, you mean the weight reduction on 6a? don't use it mselefs, damage is a better choice imo. who cares about cooldowns anyway
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Post by Voluptuous Volus on Nov 13, 2018 5:46:39 GMT
Phoenix Adept BuildSlap Singularity on stuff and Smash while abusing Geth Scanner and walls. Smash bosses once for biotic splosion, shoot, smash again for incendiary splosion. Electrical damage is largely pointless. Phoenix Vanguard BuildCharge, heavy melee into Smash. Best on host of course, but will still be worse than Drell/Asari/Slayer/Novaguard/Krogan. He's squishy and SOL since all those other kits have powers or DR melee that are off cooldown (nades, blaster) so they can use them ANYTIME. The only time the CV can use Smash right after Charge is if you pick the Bonus evo and get the lucky 50% roll, but his animations are slow and he has no damage reduction while doing them. Both Phoenixes suffer from short range play style, so on big open maps they can be a major pain. To me they are pretty fun tho and I like the Adept much better cos of options (you can be both the primer and the detonator) and ranged crowd control. He's great at swarmer patrol great at locking down shielded enemies like Marauders or Hunters and you can slap Singularity on Husks/Abombs and just run past without paying any attention.
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mordokai
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Post by mordokai on Nov 13, 2018 8:25:03 GMT
I build adept like this and vanguard like this. For the longest time, I used to skip Lash on the adept, then only went up to four ranks, so I could have more fitness. Then I realized I don't need more shields with him, since he can abuse wallbang for all that's worth and the option to yank shielded enemies across the map is worth more than couple of shields. Power amplifier, to milk Smash for all its worth. Switch PA for cyclonics if playing platinum. Vanguard is flirting with Grim Reaper whole match long. I skip Lash on him, since I'm now of mentality "Whole six ranks or bust". Since he'll be charging and smashing a lot(and will thus be somewhat vulnerable), I prefer extra shields on him, I think for this guy, they actually make the difference. Protocol is usually something like charge-Smash(if you rolled favourably for extra power after charging)-charge again for BE. When you're down to armor, he can do an occasional fire explosion as well and it doesn't throw his rhytm off by much. He eats armor for breakfast and doesn't have much problems with other defenses. He's as high risk/high reward as it gets and not for the faint of heart, but oh so much fun and very effective. But do play him on host only, or it will drive you insane. I can say both of these guys rank very highly for me... the only ones in front of them are asari and both fat turians, but after that, these two are the best. Very mechanically unusual and take some getting used to, but once you do get used to them, they can wreck some serious shit
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Post by Voluptuous Volus on Nov 13, 2018 8:42:45 GMT
Why would you use a Shotgun on a Adept and an AR on a Vanguard? Shouldn't that be the other way around? Harrier on a Vanguard is too heavy, not a lot smashy smashies
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Post by mordokai on Nov 13, 2018 11:52:56 GMT
Why would you use a Shotgun on a Adept and an AR on a Vanguard? Shouldn't that be the other way around? Harrier on a Vanguard is too heavy, not a lot smashy smashies Every other vanguard of mine already uses shoties, I find it refreshing to have a change of pace every now and then It's also lore friendly... ex-Cerberus vanguard using a Cerberus gun.
I don't know about weight, but I make it work pretty perfectly.
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Post by Arkhne on Nov 13, 2018 13:26:38 GMT
Skip Passive. Take Light, High Powered Weapon (I like the Talon, or Collector SMG). Make BoomBooms with Smash. Not a lot to it, really, Adept just plays like a human Adept, but does WAY more damage, particularly to shielded enemies (Lash with Shield Penet. -> Smash will kill them, Warp/Singularity -> Throw wont due to Shield Gate absorbing a large chunk of damage).
There is, however, one REALLY big tip: Learn to Smashcancel.
As to the Vanguard, I couldn't tell you, I hate him, never clicked with him. Adept is amazing though.
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Post by DistigousForest on Nov 13, 2018 14:31:01 GMT
Skip Passive. Take Light, High Powered Weapon (I like the Talon, or Collector SMG). Make BoomBooms with Smash. Not a lot to it, really, Adept just plays like a human Adept, but does WAY more damage, particularly to shielded enemies (Lash with Shield Penet. -> Smash will kill them, Warp/Singularity -> Throw wont due to Shield Gate absorbing a large chunk of damage). There is, however, one REALLY big tip: Learn to Smashcancel. As to the Vanguard, I couldn't tell you, I hate him, never clicked with him. Adept is amazing though. Also, he's the only other Adept (besides the Justicar) that chain BEs back to back without having to re-prime a target.
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Post by mordokai on Nov 13, 2018 15:30:31 GMT
Skip Passive. Take Light, High Powered Weapon (I like the Talon, or Collector SMG). Make BoomBooms with Smash. Not a lot to it, really, Adept just plays like a human Adept, but does WAY more damage, particularly to shielded enemies (Lash with Shield Penet. -> Smash will kill them, Warp/Singularity -> Throw wont due to Shield Gate absorbing a large chunk of damage). There is, however, one REALLY big tip: Learn to Smashcancel. As to the Vanguard, I couldn't tell you, I hate him, never clicked with him. Adept is amazing though. Also, he's the only other Adept (besides the Justicar) that chain BEs back to back without having to re-prime a target.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Nov 13, 2018 15:38:18 GMT
Raider on Adept? Why gimp yourself like that?
You like shotguns. Use shotgun pistol. Talon, AP/Drill ammo, Power Amp and HDB.
66644 build, his melee is too good to not give it extra oomph.
AP/Drill doesn't interfere with Biotics, and if you are using Geth Scanner you can add bullets to your wallhax.
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Vanguard - need lighter shotgun. Wraith, Smart Choke + OmniBlade. Also AP ammo, skip Lash. Bonus Power on Charge.
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Post by Arkhne on Nov 13, 2018 15:53:39 GMT
Also, he's the only other Adept (besides the Justicar) that chain BEs back to back without having to re-prime a target. Uh, no. The specific examples in question are Justicar Bubble, which detonates and primes with different aspects (Bubble down stagger is the detonator, Bubble Warp procs are the primers), so the ONE cooldown trigger both detonates and primes (likely just a BioVar oversight). Depending on Evos, Smash and Lash have similar effects, due to the priming and detonating being caused by different aspects of the powers (Hit detonates, DoT primes). Singularity, Warp, and Throw don't have these dual-aspect properties. Closest is Singularity's detonation, but this is not something one can reliably use, it's a "nice to have" for "when the stars align" (IE: Something HAPPENS to be Primed by something other than Singularity AND within range when the Sigularity Expires, but not when it is replaced), not consistent like Bubble (Reave->Bubble->Reave will ALWAYS be double explosion for two Cooldowns).
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Post by DistigousForest on Nov 13, 2018 16:19:23 GMT
Depending on Evos, Smash and Lash have similar effects, due to the priming and detonating being caused by different aspects of the powers (Hit detonates, DoT primes). Since Smash primes/detonates in the same cast you can do also Singularity>Lash>Smash>Singularity Explosion for 4 BEs in three casts.
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Post by Arkhne on Nov 13, 2018 16:22:00 GMT
Depending on Evos, Smash and Lash have similar effects, due to the priming and detonating being caused by different aspects of the powers (Hit detonates, DoT primes). Since Smash primes/detonates in the same cast you can do also Singularity>Lash>Smash>Singularity Explosion for 4 BEs in three casts. Yes, the creative ways of utilizing multi-aspect priming/detonating is endless. Just wanted to point out the difference between Singularity's dual-aspect, and the more reliable ones, and why they're more reliable/useful.
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Post by DistigousForest on Nov 13, 2018 16:24:18 GMT
Since Smash primes/detonates in the same cast you can do also Singularity>Lash>Smash>Singularity Explosion for 4 BEs in three casts. Yes, the creative ways of utilizing multi-aspect priming/detonating is endless. Just wanted to point out the difference between Singularity's dual-aspect, and the more reliable ones, and why they're more reliable/useful. I get that; Singularity explosion works well when there's Atlases and other slow enemies clogging up tight corridors. That can be hard to do on bigger maps with more open areas.
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Post by mordokai on Nov 13, 2018 17:47:47 GMT
Uh, no. The specific examples in question are Justicar Bubble, which detonates and primes with different aspects (Bubble down stagger is the detonator, Bubble Warp procs are the primers), so the ONE cooldown trigger both detonates and primes (likely just a BioVar oversight). Depending on Evos, Smash and Lash have similar effects, due to the priming and detonating being caused by different aspects of the powers (Hit detonates, DoT primes). Singularity, Warp, and Throw don't have these dual-aspect properties. Closest is Singularity's detonation, but this is not something one can reliably use, it's a "nice to have" for "when the stars align" (IE: Something HAPPENS to be Primed by something other than Singularity AND within range when the Sigularity Expires, but not when it is replaced), not consistent like Bubble (Reave->Bubble->Reave will ALWAYS be double explosion for two Cooldowns). I have no idea what you're talking about... seems like I've misunderstood DF So with that in mind, lets be a little facetious
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Nov 13, 2018 18:58:41 GMT
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Post by TheNightSlasher on Nov 13, 2018 19:15:37 GMT
If you're putting points into lash, go all the way. I feel that lash is kinda useless without shield penetration. I prefer biotic combo evolution in smash, especially on the adept. Helps create BEs with singularity detonation since smash biotically primes the target. On the vanguard, elec evo is fine, I guess but I prefer biotic evolution. Bonus power on charge is very nice on the vanguard. And there is no need to take shotgun weight evo in passives - go with weapon damage in rank 6 and just equip a lighter weapons. Get used to smash-cancelling and spam smash through walls. I definitely have the most fun with these characters. They're so amazing.
Edit: Also I take warp ammo on both characters. Don't want anything interfering with my lovely BEs.
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Post by docsteely on Nov 13, 2018 19:35:07 GMT
Some very nice advice above, especially the part about full Lash points and the biotic effect on Smash. I personally like to use Bonus Power on the Vanguard as you can use it to detonate multiple booms... mordokai , love u man, but why are u using pistol amps on shotguns and assault rifles?
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Post by mordokai on Nov 14, 2018 7:19:53 GMT
mordokai , love u man, but why are u using pistol amps on shotguns and assault rifles? It's all Voluptuous Volus fault. Fucker posted his builds before me, without having the foresight of knowing that I would be too lazy to go to kalence and just edited my build over his own, but forgot to fix weapon amps!
So yeah, it's all his fault!
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Post by NinjaSuperiority on Nov 15, 2018 4:38:53 GMT
Adept just plays like a human Adept, but does WAY more damage, particularly to shielded enemies (Lash with Shield Penet. -> Smash will kill them, Warp/Singularity -> Throw wont due to Shield Gate absorbing a large chunk of damage). No (way(more)). Vanilla adept is a biotic beast, on both cqc and ranged enemies whereas Smashdept suffers big on open maps. Singularity detonation is mandatory on him, works almost always and leads to heavy damage especially on bosses. Oh and hes not using throw but shockwave which helps so much situational (don't imply its good as smash) No misunderstanding, i like both of them phoenix'es. Going melee with em is funnier than most of the rest specialists characters!!!
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Post by Jeremiah12LGeek on Nov 19, 2018 21:47:15 GMT
Important tip: Smash is worth more points the farther you send the target.
Double points if you can send them between any two upright objects that you can claim are goalposts.
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