Gileadan
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Post by Gileadan on Dec 5, 2018 14:51:12 GMT
Well, in my opinion it has been a while... Then that confirms shit-stirring is all you're here for and all the reasoning in the world won't budge you from opinions you never reasoned yourself into. Wow. Thank you for this enlightening discussion. And welcome to the forum, you certainly bring a fresh perspective to it.
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Post by Heimdall on Dec 5, 2018 14:55:52 GMT
Guys, don't look too much into it. I've stopped seeing "secret messages" on everything a while back, and for good reason. Most of the time there's no secret message to begin with. He just mentions DA, and the legacy part is just a way of saying the franchise ain't dead or otherwise. The only important part is the one that mentions more information soon. An actual announcement for a proper game? Rare, it's too soon I feel if the reports of the game being 3 years away are to be believed. But who knows. I agree that tomorrow seems a bit too soon for an announcement for a game three years out. Which is why I believe this is either going to be some sort of spin off product or the skeleton crew development that has been going on for years has made a lot more progress than we expect, maybe a 2020 release.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Dec 5, 2018 15:03:38 GMT
with the exception of "not being on par with previous installments ( which bioware themselves said, was not going to be ME4 but rather it's own installment), when any of those rumors turned out to be true? while playing amdromeda i saw nothing that suggest "trouble with development". honestly, just because you don't like a game doesn't means it was poorly managed. There was confirmation that the project was a mess and Anthem developers helped getting the game out. Wasn't that the reason Anthem got delayed? What are you on about? The question how good the end result was to you or me doesn't negate that the development was messy.
I did not expect people to get their knickers in a bunch over Andromeda's development. If the mere mention of confirmed development issues is not allowed anymore, I'm out.
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Post by ArcadiaGrey on Dec 5, 2018 15:08:23 GMT
MODERATOR POST
I'm sure we can discuss Dragon Age without making it personal. Let's give it a go shall we?
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Post by Blaze on Dec 5, 2018 15:12:05 GMT
with the exception of "not being on par with previous installments ( which bioware themselves said, was not going to be ME4 but rather it's own installment), when any of those rumors turned out to be true? while playing amdromeda i saw nothing that suggest "trouble with development". honestly, just because you don't like a game doesn't means it was poorly managed. There was confirmation that the project was a mess and Anthem developers helped getting the game out. Wasn't that the reason Anthem got delayed? What are you on about? The question how good the end result was to you or me doesn't negate that the development was messy.
I did not expect people to get their knickers in a bunch over Andromeda's development. If the mere mention of confirmed development issues is not allowed anymore, I'm out.
i was not aware there was such confirmation, would you mind sharing a link please? =) also i do recall the official reason for anthem being delayed was that they wanted to make sure the story is complete, at least that's what the spokesman at the time claimed. though anthem being delayed is a different matter anyway.
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Post by midnight tea on Dec 5, 2018 15:12:18 GMT
Guys, don't look too much into it. I've stopped seeing "secret messages" on everything a while back, and for good reason. Most of the time there's no secret message to begin with. He just mentions DA, and the legacy part is just a way of saying the franchise ain't dead or otherwise. The only important part is the one that mentions more information soon. An actual announcement for a proper game? Rare, it's too soon I feel if the reports of the game being 3 years away are to be believed. But who knows. I agree that tomorrow seems a bit too soon for an announcement for a game three years out. Which is why I believe this is either going to be some sort of spin off product or the skeleton crew development that has been going on for years has made a lot more progress than we expect, maybe a 2020 release. I'd say not expecting much when there aren't many other sources of info is a reasonable stance. ....I just can't help but think about certain someone lurking on this forum, leaving likes on comments with speculations that we will likely get a title and a year or that they're further along than we may think or directly telling us how surprised we'd be at the amount of work a skeleton crew can do ... I mean, unless that someone is just trolling. That's a possibility too.
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Post by natetrace on Dec 5, 2018 15:22:20 GMT
The evidence all points to a DA4 announcement. Between dev tweets and rumors. If it wasn't I'm sure BioWare would do what Naughty Dog and others have done and release a statement saying their game won't be at the game awards. I'm not saying it'll be anything major, just confirmation it's coming. I know they are focused on Anthem, but I'm sure they are seeing Dragon Age can grab more attention with a tweet, sentence or word.
I'm not dumping on Anthem, I've already pre ordered it, just saying I think they see the hype for DA4 is real
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Post by arcanistranger on Dec 5, 2018 15:24:45 GMT
I know they are focused on Anthem, but I'm sure they are seeing Dragon Age can grab more attention with a tweet, sentence or word. If anything, they're announcing it to shut up the people who whine, "One multiplayer-focused game? BIOWARE DOESN'T CARE ABOUT STORY ANYMOAR PPPFFFFFFFFFFTTTTT" (and other fart noises)
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Post by natetrace on Dec 5, 2018 15:40:15 GMT
I know they are focused on Anthem, but I'm sure they are seeing Dragon Age can grab more attention with a tweet, sentence or word. If anything, they're announcing it to shut up the people who whine, "One multiplayer-focused game? BIOWARE DOESN'T CARE ABOUT STORY ANYMOAR PPPFFFFFFFFFFTTTTT" (and other fart noises) In that case, yes, the DA4 announcement will be like taking some gas-x lol
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Post by samhain444 on Dec 5, 2018 15:49:45 GMT
There was confirmation that the project was a mess and Anthem developers helped getting the game out. Wasn't that the reason Anthem got delayed? What are you on about? The question how good the end result was to you or me doesn't negate that the development was messy.
I did not expect people to get their knickers in a bunch over Andromeda's development. If the mere mention of confirmed development issues is not allowed anymore, I'm out.
i was not aware there was such confirmation, would you mind sharing a link please? =) also i do recall the official reason for anthem being delayed was that they wanted to make sure the story is complete, at least that's what the spokesman at the time claimed. though anthem being delayed is a different matter anyway. Jason Schreier did a comprehensive article on "ME:A's" development for Kotaku in June 2017. Essentially, BioWare Montreal, whose main production at that point was SP DLC for ME3, was given full control to develop the game. The emphasis of the new game was going to be exploration sp they initially started with trying to get procedurally generated planets to work so that your Pathfinder would touch down on a new planet and uncover its mysteries. Problem was, despite being able to create planets, they found that the exploration was not as interesting as they hoped and, as they went along, they found they had to narrow their focus from hundreds of planets to dozens of planets to even less. After 3 1/2 years of trying to get this to work, the projects momentum was pretty much stalled and they brought in Mac Walters to put it back on course. Within 18 months, he reduced the number of planets to 5, focused the narrative and essentially was the reason the game got released at all. The rest you know...reception was mixed, BioWare Montreal was absorbed by EA Motive to help launch Battlefront II and the next "Mass Effect" is in cryo-sleep.
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Post by arcanistranger on Dec 5, 2018 15:54:39 GMT
Jason Schreier did a comprehensive article on "ME:A's" development for Kotaku in June 2017. And by "comprehensive" you mean "some scumbag who knows jack shit about the game inventing garbage to incite further psychotic abuse towards the developers."
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Post by samhain444 on Dec 5, 2018 16:03:54 GMT
Jason Schreier did a comprehensive article on "ME:A's" development for Kotaku in June 2017. And by "comprehensive" you mean "some scumbag who knows jack shit about the game inventing garbage to incite further psychotic abuse towards the developers." I guess... We know the facts - the reaction was indeed mixed, though, per EA's quarterly reports that followed, the game was a financial success. Additionally, BioWare Montreal was absorbed and it's producers, leads, animators, QA peeps, etc were all redeployed to Motive. Even though it made money, it sounds like BioWare Montreal's management structure was broken and continued existence untenable as a result. As for Jason Schreier, regardless of your opinion of what he reported, he has published a book on game development (with another supposedly on the way) and seems pretty well connected in terms of his contacts. I give him more credence than, say, someone writing for Venturebeat
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 5, 2018 16:11:22 GMT
Let's deal with facts. There are clear hints from Casey that something is being shared about Dragon Age this month. blog.bioware.com/2018/11/29/november-update/Mass Effect Andromeda was 'title announced' 21 months before launch. However, it had been conceptually trailered one year earlier, 33 months before launch. Anthem was teased in that same video, nearly 5 years before its launch, but that was a new IP. The Anthem name reveal was 21 months before launch, a consistent pattern, yes? Now we can speculate, but based on those facts. Given recent events, a 'big announcement' of a mobile game seems unlikely. If the tease that drops this month is Dragon Age 4, but announced as 'work in progress' with no title, then we're about 3 years out - a launch of Fall 2021. If the tease that drops this month is Dragon Age 4, announced with a title and a 'here it comes' attitude, then we're about 2 years out - a launch of Fall 2020. Either is good, we want a great game, not a rushed game.
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 5, 2018 16:16:31 GMT
And by "comprehensive" you mean "some scumbag who knows jack shit about the game inventing garbage to incite further psychotic abuse towards the developers." Jason can certainly be undiplomatic when he has an urge to be, he treated some BSNers quote poorly here a couple of years back. Nevertheless, his contacts and journalism remain extensive and credible. He called the situation in Montreal correctly, even if some might not like the way he put it.
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Post by samhain444 on Dec 5, 2018 16:18:15 GMT
Let's deal with facts. There are clear hints from Casey that something is being shared about Dragon Age this month. blog.bioware.com/2018/11/29/november-update/Mass Effect Andromeda was 'title announced' 21 months before launch. However, it had been conceptually trailered one year earlier, 33 months before launch. Anthem was teased in that same video, nearly 5 years before its launch, but that was a new IP. The Anthem name reveal was 21 months before launch, a consistent pattern, yes? Now we can speculate, but based on those facts. Given recent events, a 'big announcement' of a mobile game seems unlikely. If the tease that drops this month is Dragon Age 4, but announced as 'work in progress' with no title, then we're about 3 years out - a launch of Fall 2021. If the tease that drops this month is Dragon Age 4, announced with a title and a 'here it comes' attitude, then we're about 2 years out - a launch of Fall 2020. Either is good, we want a great game, not a rushed game. Yep, all of this...solid timeline as well. I loved "Dragon Age II" but it had it's issues which were born from a 16 month development cycle (per Mike Laidlaw). They were looking into doing the "Exalted March expansion but decided to put all their efforts into mastering Frostbite 3 and working on "Inquisition"...they even delayed "DAI" an additional year to add more races and other touches. The lesson is its better to allow the time necessary to create something memorable than to rush it out the door.
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Post by biggydx on Dec 5, 2018 16:26:30 GMT
I'm kinda surprised so many people are upset that the games still 3 years out.
1) I thought it was generally understood that a developer should take their time with a game, rather than rushing a mediocre product out the door (ex. Dragon Age II & Andromeda). I've seen plenty of Shigeru Miyamoto quotes about, "a delayed game is a good game..." in the past because of how many games (in 2017/2018) were released unpolished, or with a lack of content. It'd be better for the franchise if BioWare took their time with it, especially since Dragon Age: Inquisition seems to have polarizing opinions, and they have to compete against other Open-world/RPG giants like CDPR and Rockstar.
2) The writing was already on the wall that this game was likely going to take till at least 2021 before being released. Mike Laidlaw mentioned that it was a mistake for BioWare to release DA:I on both last-gen and current-gen consoles. Considering that Sony is likely to have a new console out by 2021, with Microsoft likely being 2020, if BioWare wants to capitalize on next-gen, they're going to wait until both next-gen platforms have released.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Dec 5, 2018 16:26:35 GMT
Well, in my opinion it has been a while... Then that confirms shit-stirring is all you're here for and all the reasoning in the world won't budge you from opinions you never reasoned yourself into. This is absurd. Gileadan is one of the more reasonable people on this forum. His post was on the money. No where did he say that BioWare can't do better.
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 5, 2018 16:30:05 GMT
One additional thought, EA has little lined up in the barrel for its shareholders. - With Battlefield V having a mixed launch,
- all of the eggs being in Anthem's basket for FY 18/19.
- EA stock has lost 40% of its value in 6 months
I can see a strong argument for EA wanting a good news story on the horizon to share in their end of the quarter update.
And 'Dragon Age 4' the successor to the hugely successful GOTY DAI is just the sort of story that they might hope will play well to investors. So why sit on the news for 6 months when they can publicize a new shiny tomorrow (Anthem) and another new shiny in the pipeline (DA4).
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Post by samhain444 on Dec 5, 2018 16:41:41 GMT
One additional thought, EA has little lined up in the barrel for its shareholders. - With Battlefield V having a mixed launch,
- all of the eggs being in Anthem's basket for FY 18/19.
- EA stock has lost 40% of its value in 6 months
I can see a strong argument for EA wanting a good news story on the horizon to share in their end of the quarter update.
And 'Dragon Age 4' the successor to the hugely successful GOTY DAI is just the sort of story that they might hope will play well to investors. So why sit on the news for 6 months when they can publicize a new shiny tomorrow (Anthem) and another new shiny in the pipeline (DA4).
One thing that Mark Darrah mentioned on his Twitter profile under "So reasons why we nay not answer your question:" is "3. The information would trigger a revenue recognition issue" (google 'revenue recognition' to understand the principle). While they may be a couple of years off at least, they are obviously close enough to announce "something"...what that "something" is,and how much is revealed, should tell you how far in development they are in relation to point "3".
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Post by arcanistranger on Dec 5, 2018 16:57:35 GMT
Dragon Age: Inquisition seems to have polarizing opinions I'm sure no one at BioWare cares about the people who refuse to accept Inquisition being the most successful game in the series.
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 5, 2018 17:04:13 GMT
I'm sure no one at BioWare cares about the people who refuse to accept Inquisition being the most successful game in the series. Hmmm. Kind of depends on how you define success. - Origins was arguably the most successful in terms of story and RPG elements.
- Dragon Age II, whilst resource poor, was a cracking story with cracking characters.
- Inquisition was remarkably successfully critically, although in a year with fewer AAA peak competitors.
Your post seems a little simplistic about what hundreds of BioWare devs might think about their customers.
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Post by Heimdall on Dec 5, 2018 17:09:23 GMT
One additional thought, EA has little lined up in the barrel for its shareholders. - With Battlefield V having a mixed launch,
- all of the eggs being in Anthem's basket for FY 18/19.
- EA stock has lost 40% of its value in 6 months
I can see a strong argument for EA wanting a good news story on the horizon to share in their end of the quarter update.
And 'Dragon Age 4' the successor to the hugely successful GOTY DAI is just the sort of story that they might hope will play well to investors. So why sit on the news for 6 months when they can publicize a new shiny tomorrow (Anthem) and another new shiny in the pipeline (DA4).
I wonder if the EA higher ups are realizing that the fewer but longer lived games GAAS strategy they want to try means each game is a bigger risk.
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Post by arcanistranger on Dec 5, 2018 17:09:46 GMT
Hmmm. Kind of depends on how you define success. - Origins was arguably the most successful in terms of story and RPG elements.
- Dragon Age II, whilst resource poor, was a cracking story with cracking characters.
- Inquisition was remarkably successfully critically, although in a year with fewer AAA peak competitors.
Your post seems a little simplistic about what hundreds of BioWare devs might think about their customers. "Success" as in "the best-selling game in the series and usual fan pick for favorite game in the series." Also, I'm sure BioWare devs care more about their customers -- the people who buy, play, love, and talk about their games -- than the people who have no interest in them the moment BioWare doesn't anything other than exactly what those people want.
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Post by thats1evildude on Dec 5, 2018 17:11:52 GMT
I'm kinda surprised so many people are upset that the games still 3 years out. 1) I thought it was generally understood that a developer should take their time with a game, rather than rushing a mediocre product out the door (ex. Dragon Age II & Andromeda). I've seen plenty of Shigeru Miyamoto quotes about, "a delayed game is a good game..." in the past because of how many games (in 2017/2018) were released unpolished, or with a lack of content. It'd be better for the franchise if BioWare took their time with it, especially since Dragon Age: Inquisition seems to have polarizing opinions, and they have to compete against other Open-world/RPG giants like CDPR and Rockstar. It’s been four fucking years since the release of DAI. Add a MINIMUM of three years on to that and you have a wait of seven fucking years. And this isn’t all development time either. The first four years was “Let’s push Dragon Age to the side so we can work on other properties!” NOW we're into the three-plus years of development time, with what little work that had been done up until this point tossed out the goddamn window because it didn't fit with EA's new LIIIIIIIVE SEEEEEERVICES mandate.
I think a little anger is warranted.
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Post by biggydx on Dec 5, 2018 17:15:22 GMT
I'm kinda surprised so many people are upset that the games still 3 years out. 1) I thought it was generally understood that a developer should take their time with a game, rather than rushing a mediocre product out the door (ex. Dragon Age II & Andromeda). I've seen plenty of Shigeru Miyamoto quotes about, "a delayed game is a good game..." in the past because of how many games (in 2017/2018) were released unpolished, or with a lack of content. It'd be better for the franchise if BioWare took their time with it, especially since Dragon Age: Inquisition seems to have polarizing opinions, and they have to compete against other Open-world/RPG giants like CDPR and Rockstar. It’s been four fucking years since the release of DAI. Add a MINIMUM of three years on to that and you have a wait of seven fucking years. And this isn’t all development time; this is “let’s shuttle Dragon Age to the side so we can work on other properties!” I think a little anger is warranted. Can't say if the final product will be as good, but people waited 7 years for Red Dead Redemption 2. Hell, you've got Kingdom Hearts fans waiting 12+ years for the next numbered game in the series.
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