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Post by colfoley on Jun 12, 2024 7:39:40 GMT
Lets just appreciate the irony for a second of saying someone 'deserves to die'...for also killing people. No one deserves to die. The only death that is justified is always in cases of self defense or iminent threat, but if there is always a better way to do so then that should be done.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Gileadan on Jun 12, 2024 7:45:02 GMT
Lets just appreciate the irony for a second of saying someone 'deserves to die'...for also killing people. No one deserves to die. The only death that is justified is always in cases of self defense or iminent threat, but if there is always a better way to do so then that should be done. There may be people whose death might make the world safer and better for everyone else, but "deserves" is a whole different thing.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 12, 2024 7:46:29 GMT
Then they personally hang out with the new protagonist by accompanying him/her on their quest to stop Solas. Initially it was probably more a case of getting the person to see if they could come up with any leads on where to find Solas and the more the merrier where that was concerned because presumably they knew he must be close to completing his ritual, having been working on it for years now. Going forward it would seem to some extent our motivation is that in stopping his ritual from completely we inadvertently released the gods on the world, so it is partly our fault, even if it would never have happened but for his ritual. To be honest, though, there were hints back in DAI that the old magic was weakening as the Crossroads were breaking down (our Inquisitor can sense this if they are the right class/race). Solas orb in the hands of Corypheus did damage the Veil, even if we mostly fixed it, because in Trespasser there was still a bright crack in the sky to remind us of the Breach. Anyway, depending on what happened to Solas after the release of the other two, all that really matters now is that we are opposed to them and anyone who supports them, so keeping our identity secret from him isn't really so important as it was (other people may be a different matter). Also, I imagine we may still have another conversation with Solas regarding what Rook did to disrupt his ritual because those words from the Behind the Scenes video make sense now. "They call me the Dread Wolf (for what he did back in ancient Arlathan in imprisoning the gods), what will they call you? (for releasing them).
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Post by colfoley on Jun 12, 2024 7:46:31 GMT
Lets just appreciate the irony for a second of saying someone 'deserves to die'...for also killing people. No one deserves to die. The only death that is justified is always in cases of self defense or iminent threat, but if there is always a better way to do so then that should be done. There may be people whose death might make the world safer and better for everyone else, but "deserves" is a whole different thing. Much better way of putting it to and yeah I agree. Every human life taken is a tragedy/ an evil. It might be neccessary, but always an evil...or in this case sentient God-Elf.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 12, 2024 7:49:38 GMT
Then they personally hang out with the new protagonist by accompanying him/her on their quest to stop Solas. Initially it was probably more a case of getting the person to see if they could come up with any leads on where to find Solas and the more the merrier where that was concerned because presumably they knew he must be close to completing his ritual, having been working on it for years now. Going forward it would seem to some extent our motivation is that in stopping his ritual from completely we inadvertently released the gods on the world, so it is partly our fault, even if it would never have happened but for his ritual. To be honest, though, there were hints back in DAI that the old magic was weakening as the Crossroads were breaking down (our Inquisitor can sense this if they are the right class/race). Solas orb in the hands of Corypheus did damage the Veil, even if we mostly fixed it, because in Trespasser there was still a bright crack in the sky to remind us of the Breach. Anyway, depending on what happened to Solas after the release of the other two, all that really matters now is that we are opposed to them and anyone who supports them, so keeping our identity secret isn't really so important as it was. Also, I imagine we may still have another conversation with Solas regarding what Rook did to disrupt his ritual because those words from the Behind the Scenes video make sense now. "They call me the Dread Wolf (for what he did back in ancient Arlathan in imprisoning the gods), what will they call you? (for releasing them). That's another interesting point. I still wonder if this will still go into shadow wars and what this says about the overall mission statement from the 2020 trailer. Like it could easily lead to a situation of the Evanuris go off, Solas goes off, and then the ritual obviously stops so all the authorities in Tevinter and Antiva are like 'OK our citizens this magical stuff has been stopped...now lets get back to the war with the Qunari!'. Meanwhile its up to our crew to investigate the real threat behind the scenes and start tracking down anything mysterious which could be related to them. While also potentially dealing with some of these higher level issues.
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Post by Fredward on Jun 12, 2024 8:17:20 GMT
Lets just appreciate the irony for a second of saying someone 'deserves to die'...for also killing people. No one deserves to die. The only death that is justified is always in cases of self defense or iminent threat, but if there is always a better way to do so then that should be done. Er, no, some people definitely deserve to die (again, from my moral framework). Being responsible for deaths where it stops being 'murder' and swaps over to statistics (ie Solas) being one of several categories deserving of death, especially if you're mistaken about the necessity of such an action. Anyway, not something I want to get too into in the Twitter thread.
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Post by SofaJockey on Jun 12, 2024 8:25:12 GMT
Can I share something that's really irking me right now on YouTube? There are a lot of "DA: Veilguard; should you be concerned? I'm concerned but you should hear me out "- type of videos. I haven't watched any of them because they reek of click baity desperation for views. There are about a dozen videos on YouTube pretty angry at Veilguard, made by channels who also have videos about women having ruined Star Wars. Those channels are best avoided as rational thought appears to be largely absent. As for 'concerned' I've seen a few: Mr Matty. Big Dan, Mr Hulthern (I'm sure there are more) who seem troubled by it not being close enough to DA Origins' tactics. It's been 15 years though, perhaps enjoy what it actually is (and we've only seen the tactics of a level one character).
Yes and also wondering, will we have a non-spoiler section? The short answer is 'yes'. The long answer is that before launch almost any promotional material is potentially spoilery. After launch day (actually 3-4 days before launch) the whole forum should act as a non-spoiler zone except specific threads allowing spoilers. Any significant spoiler should be spoiler tagged across the forum, except in spoiler threads. And we need a thread which is a total spoiler-free zone where people can hide when they want to go dark.
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Post by TabithaTH on Jun 12, 2024 8:47:04 GMT
As for 'concerned' I've seen a few: Mr Matty. Big Dan, Mr Hulthern (I'm sure there are more) who seem troubled by it not being close enough to DA Origins' tactics. It's been 15 years though, perhaps enjoy what it actually is (and we've only seen the tactics of a level one character). Imho, if you want to compare it to another DA game, compare it to DAI. There is no reason to complain that it’s not similar enough to DAO or DA2, since the game(s) between have also not been similar in many ways. At this point it really shouldn’t be a surprise that the game is not like DAO, at least not mechanically. Edit: Fixed
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Post by fairdragon on Jun 12, 2024 8:47:09 GMT
ANother strong possibility on the plot trajectory is that the Evanuris will instantly peace out and poof away to various parts of the map so part of the opening of the game will be to go to the places where weird stuff is happening to see if its related to these two, recruit companions who can help us fight, and find ways of stopping them. Goodness I am so surprised that THIS is how they are starting the game. Like we were discussing the possibility for years but the Chutz'pah to actually see them do it. Amazing. I don't feel amazing after seeing gameplay. The plot is after 10 years all over the place and not newcomer friendly. Would have been better, if the scene we saw would been end Act 1 or beginning Act 2. And not dumb Inquisition approach. The characters are good writing i think, but it feels like for the story wasn't enough time.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 12, 2024 8:50:09 GMT
ANother strong possibility on the plot trajectory is that the Evanuris will instantly peace out and poof away to various parts of the map so part of the opening of the game will be to go to the places where weird stuff is happening to see if its related to these two, recruit companions who can help us fight, and find ways of stopping them. Goodness I am so surprised that THIS is how they are starting the game. Like we were discussing the possibility for years but the Chutz'pah to actually see them do it. Amazing. I don't feel amazing after seeing gameplay. The plot is after 10 years all over the place and not newcomer friendly. Would have been better, if the scene we saw would been end Act 1 or beginning Act 2. And not dumb Inquisition approach. The characters are good writing i think, but it feels like for the story wasn't enough time.
one of the reactions I watched was from a newcomer (playing Origins, haven't gotten to Inquisition yet) who said they actually appreciated how newcomer friendly it was for being straight forward.
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Post by fairdragon on Jun 12, 2024 8:51:04 GMT
Found that old comment, so I'll just paste the relevant part: I suspected that rook does that. "What will they call you, when this is over?" Solas
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by TabithaTH on Jun 12, 2024 8:55:51 GMT
'▪️Fully offline single player, no EA account linking, no micro-transactions'
Has anyone commented on this? Does it mean no need for EA Play?
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Post by Kappa Neko on Jun 12, 2024 9:04:12 GMT
Lets just appreciate the irony for a second of saying someone 'deserves to die'...for also killing people. No one deserves to die. The only death that is justified is always in cases of self defense or iminent threat, but if there is always a better way to do so then that should be done. Er, no, some people definitely deserve to die (again, from my moral framework). Being responsible for deaths where it stops being 'murder' and swaps over to statistics (ie Solas) being one of several categories deserving of death, especially if you're mistaken about the necessity of such an action. Anyway, not something I want to get too into in the Twitter thread. I'll back you up on this. There are vile creatures out there I would happily watch being killed very very slowly like somebody running a child sex trafficking ring. Nothing tragic about that. I call that getting what they deserve. Maybe even karma. The world is a better place without them. I used to be very anti death penalty and I still don't advocate for it but when you see how many people slip through the justice system to rape and murder again it really makes you want see these people just put down and be done with it. It's a difficult subject because every justice system is flawed. In a video game it's a lot easier because evil can be punished without worrying about collateral damage of a flawed system like all the people who are on death row who are in innocent. If I see a vile person in a game who has done incredibly evil things and feels no remorse like Whoreson Junior in Witcher 3 I kill them and don't feel bad about it. They brought that on themselves. There is absolutely no benefit to society to let them live. If a bad person repents and can be useful for a good cause I let them live. No doubt Solas will get his redemption arc. He's a willing mass murderer though and he won't get to walk away. He needs to pay in some way for what he's done. Doesn't necessarily have to be death but death would not seem unreasonable to me either.
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Post by fairdragon on Jun 12, 2024 9:08:29 GMT
And even in the world of Thedas, anyone who tries to destroy the world are portrayed as villains. Because some things aren’t morally they, some things are just good and some things are just evil. As weary I am of DA's current writers, a small part of me hopes there is something, anything else going on with Solas' plan. Because if he's been completely honest with the Inquisition (and by proxy, us) about his plans, it is objectively stupid writing. If he truly wants to bring down the Veil, wouldn't it have been easier to say nothing or lie? Does he want to be stopped? Is it a false flag operation for something else? I realize I could be giving the writers too much credit, but whadda ya gonna do? I think he want that somebody show him another way. That you can clearly see at the scene with him and flemeth. He behave like a child that doesn't want to eat the food that was give to him. Even when he chose it the day before.
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Post by fairdragon on Jun 12, 2024 9:28:07 GMT
I am not a fan of him. But i also don't think he is a mass murderer. Solas is more complicated then that. And to understand we need psychological understanding. In short i think he have mental problems. He is a child at heart and is forced to do things he don't want to. That doesn't make the things he do better. You have to protect him and the world from himself. And i hope we can do that by 1. kill him or 2. to put him in house arrest.
Disagree on this. This sounds like trying to make him into a woobie who doesn't have full control over his actions. Solas isn't a child and isn't forced to do things he doesn't want to. He is a perfectly mature person who understands the consequences of his actions, yet is still going through with them. It's one thing to make him complicated and add a level of regret to his motivations, and a completely different thing to absolve him of any responsibility for the horrors he ends up inflicting, either directly or indirectly. The latter is not something you want to portray. Go to a psychiatric hospital and then say that again.
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Post by Rascoth on Jun 12, 2024 9:29:50 GMT
'▪️Fully offline single player, no EA account linking, no micro-transactions' Has anyone commented on this? Does it mean no need for EA Play? My understanding was that while on PC you'll need EA app (because EA is *fun* like that), you won't have to log into your EA account in-game. Most likely because it was mainly used to update the Keep (or get your world state in case of DAI) and since we're apparently not using it, it's not needed to log in in-game.
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Post by kali073 on Jun 12, 2024 9:31:09 GMT
I just caught up on the Solas discussion and just want to throw in my two cents. We don't know everything Solas knows so there's no way to say he is 100% right or wrong for what he's doing. Even if many innocents are dying at the moment. The thing is, maybe the Veil is coming down regardless if he does or doesn't bring it down himself? Maybe bringing it down a little earlier will save the world because he can control it in a way that it naturally failing wouldn't do? Like if it came down naturally maybe everything dies or suffers a fate worse than death but if he brings it down with his "precautions" some will be restored to what they were? That is to say, it's the problem of 90 000 people dying to save 10 000 because if they didn't then all 100 000 would die. So incidental mass murder vs complete extinction. Or like Commander Shepard in the Arrival DLC. Commander Shepard in the Arrival DLC. She/He let an entire system of Batarians die because they deemed it the lesser evil rather then let the Reapers arrive early to an unprepared galaxy. If Solas is convinced there are only two options. He will pick the lesser of two evils. The lesser evil in his mind at least. The problem with Solas is that he's convinced only he can do something (his name does mean Pride after all) about it. No one knows more about the Veil than he does. The better option would have been to have been open about why he thinks this is the only option. Since this is a video game, there will probably be a third option (or at least a way to avert the worst) that our protagonists will discover during the course of the game. Good people or (misguided people) can do evil things if they believe it's for the greater good. Just like someone who's evil can do something good without intending to.
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Post by Grog Muffins on Jun 12, 2024 9:40:49 GMT
Disagree on this. This sounds like trying to make him into a woobie who doesn't have full control over his actions. Solas isn't a child and isn't forced to do things he doesn't want to. He is a perfectly mature person who understands the consequences of his actions, yet is still going through with them. It's one thing to make him complicated and add a level of regret to his motivations, and a completely different thing to absolve him of any responsibility for the horrors he ends up inflicting, either directly or indirectly. The latter is not something you want to portray. Go to a psychiatric hospital and then say that again. Solas is not mentally ill. I don't know what causes you to have that read on him. His mental faculties are perfectly intact, he just makes terrible decisions. He is egotistical and has a martyr complex but he is perfectly capable of understanding what he does and what the consequences are.
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Post by The Loyal Nub on Jun 12, 2024 9:43:10 GMT
Can I share something that's really irking me right now on YouTube? There are a lot of "DA: Veilguard; should you be concerned? I'm concerned but you should hear me out "- type of videos. I haven't watched any of them because they reek of click baity desperation for views. There are about a dozen videos on YouTube pretty angry at Veilguard, made by channels who also have videos about women having ruined Star Wars. Those channels are best avoided as rational thought appears to be largely absent. As for 'concerned' I've seen a few: Mr Matty. Big Dan, Mr Hulthern (I'm sure there are more) who seem troubled by it not being close enough to DA Origins' tactics. It's been 15 years though, perhaps enjoy what it actually is (and we've only seen the tactics of a level one character).
Yes and also wondering, will we have a non-spoiler section? The short answer is 'yes'. The long answer is that before launch almost any promotional material is potentially spoilery. After launch day (actually 3-4 days before launch) the whole forum should act as a non-spoiler zone except specific threads allowing spoilers. Any significant spoiler should be spoiler tagged across the forum, except in spoiler threads. And we need a thread which is a total spoiler-free zone where people can hide when they want to go dark. Matty liked the gameplay trailer so he has done a 180.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Jun 12, 2024 9:45:26 GMT
The CC is so far the thing that's getting me the most excited, I do wish it could be released before the game comes out as I'll likely be stuck there for days before actually playing. Can't say for sure which factions I'll go for as I think it will depend on any stat bonuses that might be linked to them as well as the image I create of my PC and what their motivations are. Probably not a Grey Warden though (already done that) and probably not the Mournwatch (I'm just not into the necro stuff).
As for race... I have a tendency to go with elves, and I want to try to not do it this time... but humans are not very spicy, and with dwarfs I rule out mages for class, which leaves qunari... but while I really like tieflings the qunari aren't quite doing it for me aesthetically (but guess I won't know for sure until I see the CC).
With class I'm not sure, I tend to pick whatever looks most fun to play, which traditionally has been mages (although I had fun with my rogue in DAI). I really don't like "twitchy" game play, so maybe I'll try to make myself run warrior this time, but in general I don't really enjoy them (think I only really liked them in DAO, and that was because I could dual wield).
As for looks, I try to make my PC look different from the ones before, which leaves me with a combination of either black/white/ginger/dark brown hair and light gray/purple/amber/hazel eyes. This one I think will come down to what will look best with my race choice and what's the most flattering in the CC. Super happy we will get different lighting to try it out! Hoping for some nice long haired hairstyles this time around, I've usually had to default to ponytails, but what I saw in the gameplay trailer looks promising.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 12, 2024 9:49:14 GMT
I just caught up on the Solas discussion and just want to throw in my two cents. We don't know everything Solas knows so there's no way to say he is 100% right or wrong for what he's doing. Even if many innocents are dying at the moment. The thing is, maybe the Veil is coming down regardless if he does or doesn't bring it down himself? Maybe bringing it down a little earlier will save the world because he can control it in a way that it naturally failing wouldn't do? Like if it came down naturally maybe everything dies or suffers a fate worse than death but if he brings it down with his "precautions" some will be restored to what they were? That is to say, it's the problem of 90 000 people dying to save 10 000 because if they didn't then all 100 000 would die. So incidental mass murder vs complete extinction. Or like Commander Shepard in the Arrival DLC. Commander Shepard in the Arrival DLC. She/He let an entire system of Batarians die because they deemed it the lesser evil rather then let the Reapers arrive early to an unprepared galaxy. If Solas is convinced there are only two options. He will pick the lesser of two evils. The lesser evil in his mind at least. The problem with Solas is that he's convinced only he can do something (his name does mean Pride after all) about it. No one knows more about the Veil than he does. The better option would have been to have been open about why he thinks this is the only option. Since this is a video game, there will probably be a third option (or at least a way to avert the worst) that our protagonists will discover during the course of the game. Good people or (misguided people) can do evil things if they believe it's for the greater good. Just like someone who's evil can do something good without intending to.
Exactly my thoughts. The CC is so far the thing that's getting me the most excited, I do wish it could be released before the game comes out as I'll likely be stuck there for days before actually playing. Can't say for sure which factions I'll go for as I think it will depend on any stat bonuses that might be linked to them as well as the image I create of my PC and what their motivations are. Probably not a Grey Warden though (already done that) and probably not the Mournwatch (I'm just not into the necro stuff). As for race... I have a tendency to go with elves, and I want to try to not do it this time... but humans are not very spicy, and with dwarfs I rule out mages for class, which leaves qunari... but while I really like tieflings the qunari aren't quite doing it for me aesthetically (but guess I won't know for sure until I see the CC). With class I'm not sure, I tend to pick whatever looks most fun to play, which traditionally has been mages (although I had fun with my rogue in DAI). I really don't like "twitchy" game play, so maybe I'll try to make myself run warrior this time, but in general I don't really enjoy them (think I only really liked them in DAO, and that was because I could dual wield). As for looks, I try to make my PC look different from the ones before, which leaves me with a combination of either black/white/ginger/dark brown hair and light gray/purple/amber/hazel eyes. This one I think will come down to what will look best with my race choice and what's the most flattering in the CC. Super happy we will get different lighting to try it out! Hoping for some nice long haired hairstyles this time around, I've usually had to default to ponytails, but what I saw in the gameplay trailer looks promising. Honestly if I were you and didn't like the twitch stuff I'd try and stick to playing as someone who can stay at range as much as you can and let your team handle the close fighting as much as possible. Either a support class or mage in general. Granted we just don't know if mages will also be limited like in the Rogue only being able to carry at least eight arrows into battle in the demo but that is always what I try and do every time I think I don't want to get up and get personal...just stay at range and rain in shots.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Jun 12, 2024 9:53:31 GMT
Honestly if I were you and didn't like the twitch stuff I'd try and stick to playing as someone who can stay at range as much as you can and let your team handle the close fighting as much as possible. Either a support class or mage in general. Granted we just don't know if mages will also be limited like in the Rogue only being able to carry at least eight arrows into battle in the demo but that is always what I try and do every time I think I don't want to get up and get personal...just stay at range and rain in shots. The thought has occurred to me, but then 3 out of 4 games would have a mage canon PC, and that feels a bit boring ngl. I know I should see every new game as new start and play what I like the most, but I can't stop obsessing over the "overall story" I'm creating (if that makes any sense). I'd really like to play a dwarf too for variety, but that means no magic and likely an awkward angle in cut-scenes (which reminds me, do we know if the zoomed out camera from DAI is back? Hope it's gone!).
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luketrevelyan
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Post by luketrevelyan on Jun 12, 2024 9:57:16 GMT
Honestly if I were you and didn't like the twitch stuff I'd try and stick to playing as someone who can stay at range as much as you can and let your team handle the close fighting as much as possible. Either a support class or mage in general. Granted we just don't know if mages will also be limited like in the Rogue only being able to carry at least eight arrows into battle in the demo but that is always what I try and do every time I think I don't want to get up and get personal...just stay at range and rain in shots. The thought has occurred to me, but then 3 out of 4 games would have a mage canong PC, and that feels a bit boring ngl. I know I should see every new game as new start and play what I like the most, but I can't stop obsessing over the "overall story" I'm creating (if that makes any sense). I'd really like to play a dwarf too for variety, but that means no magic and likely an awkward angle in cut-scenes (which reminds me, do we know if the zoomed out camera from DAI is back? Hope it's gone!). Yeah I've had a dagger rogue dwarf planned out for years but I feel like after seeing the combat I might be better off being a mage so I can stand back more. So now I am rethinking my whole character lol.
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Post by colfoley on Jun 12, 2024 9:58:32 GMT
Honestly if I were you and didn't like the twitch stuff I'd try and stick to playing as someone who can stay at range as much as you can and let your team handle the close fighting as much as possible. Either a support class or mage in general. Granted we just don't know if mages will also be limited like in the Rogue only being able to carry at least eight arrows into battle in the demo but that is always what I try and do every time I think I don't want to get up and get personal...just stay at range and rain in shots. The thought has occurred to me, but then 3 out of 4 games would have a mage canong PC, and that feels a bit boring ngl. I know I should see every new game as new start and play what I like the most, but I can't stop obsessing over the "overall story" I'm creating (if that makes any sense). I'd really like to play a dwarf too for variety, but that means no magic and likely an awkward angle in cut-scenes (which reminds me, do we know if the zoomed out camera from DAI is back? Hope it's gone!). It makes perfect sense. But don't really mind per se last two canon characters have been rogues and while we won't know for sure until I play my 'first' Rook and then any of the subsequent Rooks which one I will like the most to be 'canon' right now I am putting an awful lot of time planning out my first Rook so he will likely end up being canon...which means that three games in a row will be rogue. Though last two of my canon runs have been female and this is my first male potential canon character since Origins so there is that...all humans to. So in other words if its a consideration do something but ultimatley do what you think is right but also what you think is fun. Especially for a first playthrough. Maybe if you get used to the game you can then do subsequent playthroughs of different classes then enjoy that and they will become canon. Something else just occured to me too I do tend to gaslight myself and 'think' that my second character tends to be my canon ones to...but not always universal as the first two DA games my first character ended up being canon. But then my second character was canon in Inquisition. ANd my second Ryder to.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Jun 12, 2024 10:01:12 GMT
Maybe if you get used to the game you can then do subsequent playthroughs of different classes then enjoy that and they will become canon. I'm not actually autistic, but I'm way too autistic to make something not my first run canon. But I'll take what you said regarding everything else into consideration, thanks!.
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