flauntyquill
N2
May you always suck the jelly out of life's doughnut.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: Faeryia
XBL Gamertag: flauntyQuill
Posts: 117 Likes: 226
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Post by flauntyquill on May 10, 2019 9:08:54 GMT
Why did BioWare make everything away from Javelin in first person perspective? Has the devs explained what they were thinking or what they hoped it would bring to the game? Does anyone know?
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Post by aglomeracja on May 10, 2019 9:14:10 GMT
Why did BioWare make everything away from Javelin in first person perspective? Has the devs explained what they were thinking or what they hoped it would bring to the game? Does anyone know?
I don't think they did, but my guess would be that they wanted to avoid creating facial and movement animations for PC.
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Post by PillarBiter on May 10, 2019 10:06:06 GMT
Why did BioWare make everything away from Javelin in first person perspective? Has the devs explained what they were thinking or what they hoped it would bring to the game? Does anyone know?
I believe they wanted to create a more immersive, personal story while in fort tarsis. I like bashing anthem as much as the next guy, but the animation bit just makes no sense. They have TONS of animation by NPCs, enemies, javelin, ... adding just player animation (which exists, by the way, your character can walk, you just can't see it) is a very small percentage compared to that in terms of effort, and a very unlikely reason not to do it.
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Post by Pounce de León on May 10, 2019 10:09:16 GMT
Why did BioWare make everything away from Javelin in first person perspective? Has the devs explained what they were thinking or what they hoped it would bring to the game? Does anyone know?
I believe they wanted to create a more immersive, personal story while in fort tarsis. I like bashing anthem as much as the next guy, but the animation bit just makes no sense. They have TONS of animation by NPCs, enemies, javelin, ... adding just player animation (which exists, by the way, your character can walk, you just can't see it) is a very small percentage compared to that in terms of effort, and a very unlikely reason not to do it. Creating a customised face doesn't make much sense neither when you can't see it. I think it's a story of a mighty untold cut.
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N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
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Post by Thrombin on May 10, 2019 10:45:23 GMT
I believe they wanted to create a more immersive, personal story while in fort tarsis. I like bashing anthem as much as the next guy, but the animation bit just makes no sense. They have TONS of animation by NPCs, enemies, javelin, ... adding just player animation (which exists, by the way, your character can walk, you just can't see it) is a very small percentage compared to that in terms of effort, and a very unlikely reason not to do it. Creating a customised face doesn't make much sense neither when you can't see it. I think it's a story of a mighty untold cut.
I seem to remember something about it requiring more processing power or effort to enable third person in Fort Tarsis?
Certainly the NPC conversations would take more work if you had to render your own, customizable, character into the scene and not just have a view that would essentially be the same for everyone.
Maybe they felt they would have to compromise the amount of things or level of detail going on in the fort if they supported third person.
I would certainly prefer third person but you get used to it!
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Post by SirSourpuss on May 10, 2019 11:18:00 GMT
but my guess would be that they wanted to avoid creating facial and movement animations for PC. Exactly. Otherwise, you can just watch an episode of Pingu. From my experience with, pre-patched at least, Andromeda, is the same.
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Post by shinobiwan on May 10, 2019 11:58:43 GMT
Why did BioWare make everything away from Javelin in first person perspective? Has the devs explained what they were thinking or what they hoped it would bring to the game? Does anyone know?
I don't think they did, but my guess would be that they wanted to avoid creating facial and movement animations for PC. No, it's not that, you can see there actually are movement animations by looking at your shadow. It was just a bad artistic decision.
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Post by Son of Dorn on May 10, 2019 12:23:29 GMT
Because something, something, reasons.
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Post by PillarBiter on May 10, 2019 12:59:25 GMT
I don't think they did, but my guess would be that they wanted to avoid creating facial and movement animations for PC. No, it's not that, you can see there actually are movement animations by looking at your shadow. It was just a bad artistic decision. "Bad" = opinion. I like the 1st person in Tarsis.
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cypherj
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by cypherj on May 10, 2019 13:16:23 GMT
I think they planned on a more robust, bustling, immersive Fort Tarsis. Something closer to what was shown in the first look. Plenty of movement, people going about their business, the accompanying ambient sounds. People actually walking up to the PC and talking to you, not just stationary people you approach and interact with. This would have been a lot better in the first person in my opinion.
Obviously, plans changed, development time ran short, and they had to settle for a scaled down version of Fort Tarsis.
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Post by shinobiwan on May 10, 2019 14:23:01 GMT
No, it's not that, you can see there actually are movement animations by looking at your shadow. It was just a bad artistic decision. "Bad" = opinion. I like the 1st person in Tarsis. "Like" = opinion. I think it's bad.
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Post by samhain444 on May 10, 2019 15:43:44 GMT
The "official" explanation per the devs was they wanted Fort Tarsis to feel tight and cramped as you moved through it and those close quarters felt better represented in first person point of view. It was a design decision...that's it. Whether it was a good or bad one is relative to the player. Not my first choice but I don't hate it. I'm just glad the combat is in third person...THAT was the right decision.
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Post by cypherj on May 10, 2019 16:08:59 GMT
If this, or something remotely resembling this was the goal, then yes, first person was the better choice. What we got would have probably been better third person.
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Post by Space Cowboy on May 10, 2019 16:15:13 GMT
I think with questions like this it’s rarely just one reason. I suspect a bunch of cost saving measures sold to the players as artistic style.
Tarsis doesn’t look terribly cramped even in first person. Looks pretty empty actually.
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Post by cypherj on May 10, 2019 16:30:06 GMT
I think with questions like this it’s rarely just one reason. I suspect a bunch of cost saving measures sold to the players as artistic style. Tarsis doesn’t look terribly cramped even in first person. Looks pretty empty actually. The Fort Tarsis in that E3 trailer WAS cramped though. Like I said, if what was in that trailer was the goal, even without the graphics, first person would have been the correct choice. The animation was in the Fort. The Strider walking overhead, the cramped aisle with people shopping, and the NPC coming to you, pacing and looking distressed.
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flauntyquill
N2
May you always suck the jelly out of life's doughnut.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: Faeryia
XBL Gamertag: flauntyQuill
Posts: 117 Likes: 226
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Post by flauntyquill on May 10, 2019 16:31:24 GMT
I don't think they did, but my guess would be that they wanted to avoid creating facial and movement animations for PC. No, it's not that, you can see there actually are movement animations by looking at your shadow. It was just a bad artistic decision.
I noticed that too. The shadow. I've been trying to walk up to reflective surfaces like the pool and such trying to see the character's face. So far no luck, but from the shadow on the ground it's obvious the character isn't missing a head or anything like the PC in Mirror's Edge.
And I agree, bad artistic decision. I think it actually works towards making the game less immersive. But I'm not a fan of first person perspective in any game.
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flauntyquill
N2
May you always suck the jelly out of life's doughnut.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: Faeryia
XBL Gamertag: flauntyQuill
Posts: 117 Likes: 226
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Post by flauntyquill on May 10, 2019 16:34:27 GMT
The "official" explanation per the devs was they wanted Fort Tarsis to feel tight and cramped as you moved through it and those close quarters felt better represented in first person point of view. It was a design decision...that's it. Whether it was a good or bad one is relative to the player. Not my first choice but I don't hate it. I'm just glad the combat is in third person...THAT was the right decision.
Thanks! I still think it's a bad idea, but at least now I understand why they did it. And I agree with you on the combat. First person in the javelin would have been terrible.
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Post by Space Cowboy on May 10, 2019 16:34:28 GMT
I think with questions like this it’s rarely just one reason. I suspect a bunch of cost saving measures sold to the players as artistic style. Tarsis doesn’t look terribly cramped even in first person. Looks pretty empty actually. The Fort Tarsis in that E3 trailer WAS cramped though. Like I said, if what was in that trailer was the goal, even without the graphics, first person would have been the correct choice. The animation was in the Fort. The Strider walking overhead, the cramped aisle with people shopping, and the NPC coming to you, pacing and looking distressed. Yeah it’s too bad they didn’t or couldn’t implement it like that
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flauntyquill
N2
May you always suck the jelly out of life's doughnut.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: Faeryia
XBL Gamertag: flauntyQuill
Posts: 117 Likes: 226
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Post by flauntyquill on May 10, 2019 16:37:54 GMT
I think with questions like this it’s rarely just one reason. I suspect a bunch of cost saving measures sold to the players as artistic style. Tarsis doesn’t look terribly cramped even in first person. Looks pretty empty actually. I thought it was desolate at first. Very empty and dead. But now as the story has progressed there is a lot more movement and people there. I still think it's freaky that a lot of the NPCs don't seem to see you like you're invisible, but at least they look busy now.
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Post by Space Cowboy on May 10, 2019 16:41:46 GMT
I think with questions like this it’s rarely just one reason. I suspect a bunch of cost saving measures sold to the players as artistic style. Tarsis doesn’t look terribly cramped even in first person. Looks pretty empty actually. I thought it was desolate at first. Very empty and dead. But now as the story has progressed there is a lot more movement and people there. I still think it's freaky that a lot of the NPCs don't seem to see you like you're invisible, but at least they look busy now. I remember npcs getting out of your way when walking through the market to the forge area but that’s about it. Good that it improves a bit I guess.
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Post by PillarBiter on May 10, 2019 19:48:21 GMT
"Bad" = opinion. I like the 1st person in Tarsis. "Like" = opinion. I think it's bad. Congratulations, you successfully differentiated between fact and opinion. Keep it up!!
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xrayspex73
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
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Post by xrayspex73 on May 10, 2019 21:13:39 GMT
It was laziness. Even though your character model is there in first-person perspective, it is not the same work as animating a model meant to be viewed in 3rd person perspective. More work would have had to go into it and they didn't want to mess with player character facial animations. So instead we get a floaty camera FPS view. It's dreadful. The fact that they are now allowing you to grab missions without even going to the NPCs and now launch to new missions without going back to FT, it is clear that they are de-emphasizing FT to a point of meaninglessness. They realized everyone hates it.
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Post by samhain444 on May 10, 2019 21:56:59 GMT
It was laziness. Even though your character model is there in first-person perspective, it is not the same work as animating a model meant to be viewed in 3rd person perspective. More work would have had to go into it and they didn't want to mess with player character facial animations. So instead we get a floaty camera FPS view. It's dreadful. The fact that they are now allowing you to grab missions without even going to the NPCs and now launch to new missions without going back to FT, it is clear that they are de-emphasizing FT to a point of meaninglessness. They realized everyone hates it. If the NPCs don't have anything different to say when replaying Legendary Contracts, why go back to them? Makes sense to allow you to go directly to the map. If there a conversation bubble, then you go back. I didn't hate exploring Fort Tarsis...I didn't hate the NPCs or what they had to say...however, I did not enjoy having to walk to Brin, Matthius and Yarrow separately to launch the contracts. It was a smart quality of life change. When new content is added, you will be walking Fort Tarsis to engage the NPCs again.
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Post by shinobiwan on May 10, 2019 22:26:35 GMT
"Like" = opinion. I think it's bad. Congratulations, you successfully differentiated between fact and opinion. Keep it up!! Hey, you pointed out that an obvious statement of opinion was an opinion first, so I'm happy to give you all the credit.
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Post by SofaJockey on May 11, 2019 11:47:24 GMT
The "official" explanation per the devs was they wanted Fort Tarsis to feel tight and cramped as you moved through it and those close quarters felt better represented in first person point of view. It was a design decision...that's it. Whether it was a good or bad one is relative to the player. Not my first choice but I don't hate it. I'm just glad the combat is in third person...THAT was the right decision. This and furthermore in cramped walkways you run into issues 3rd Person as the Field of View ends up in a wall. NPCs facial expressions are also distanced 3rd Person, a problem both Andromeda and Inquisition suffered from. The 'reasons' are plan to see even if disliked by some.
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