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Post by Serza on May 8, 2017 18:36:51 GMT
Thin lips are a sign of someone who rarely smiles. Gee, I wonder how that could ever fit Leliana, right. Lower your defenses. No assault has been done. I wasn't counterattacking, or there'd be a helluva lot more of fire support involved. |
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Post by Iddy on May 8, 2017 18:40:13 GMT
On a different note, DAI's version of Leliana is my favorite. I would go as far as removing her as a LI in DAO just so we could romance the badass and fearsome spymaster in Inquisition.
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Rendering planets viable since 2017
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Serza on May 8, 2017 18:53:14 GMT
Personally, her Inquisition self makes me sad. She went from a woman who's seen some shit but could still be happy in life to a full ruthless spymaster with whose enemies the Maker better have mercy, because she certainly won't.
Some refer to her as Darth Leliana if hardened, and... Well.
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Post by thats1evildude on May 8, 2017 19:32:56 GMT
I like to think that there are two Lelianas: the one that will cut a Chantry sister's throat and torture a man for information, and the other that's sweetness and nugs. One comes out during working hours, the other comes out in private.
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Post by Iddy on May 8, 2017 19:35:53 GMT
I like to think that there are two Lelianas: the one that will cut a Chantry sister's throat and torture a man for information, and the other that's sweetness and nugs. One comes out during working hours, the other comes out in private. Chantry girl in the streets, Orlesian bard in the sheets. |
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Post by Crim on May 9, 2017 14:41:09 GMT
On a different note, DAI's version of Leliana is my favorite. I would go as far as removing her as a LI in DAO just so we could romance the badass and fearsome spymaster in Inquisition. Warden > Inquisitor Couldn't compete tbh.  |
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Post by Crim on May 9, 2017 14:44:49 GMT
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Post by Crim on May 10, 2017 12:25:23 GMT
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Post by Crim on May 10, 2017 12:45:34 GMT
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Post by Iddy on May 11, 2017 14:28:03 GMT
I think Justinia did much more harm than good. She not only pulled Leliana back into the old life of sneaking and killing but also made it look like it was in the service of the Maker, which blurred the lines and blinded her to the path she was following.
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Post by phoray on Jun 6, 2017 4:22:02 GMT
I finished her romance in DAO. I don't regret the decision but I wouldn't do it again.
She's too maleable. Why is she the only character you can harden in DAI?
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Post by Iddy on Jun 6, 2017 11:14:51 GMT
I finished her romance in DAO. I don't regret the decision but I wouldn't do it again. She's too maleable. Why is she the only character you can harden in DAI? Hardening should have never been a thing. It just makes it look like Leliana is easily influenced. |
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Post by thats1evildude on Jun 11, 2017 1:50:24 GMT
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Norstaera
N3
Stealth Swooper
This morning my husband said I was evil like June Cleaver. I cried a single tear of wicked happiness
Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition
Posts: 385 Likes: 745
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Norstaera
This morning my husband said I was evil like June Cleaver. I cried a single tear of wicked happiness
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Bottom
http://www.mediafire.com/convkey/3ead/s5mkgfa593ihxkkzg.jpg
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Post by Norstaera on Jun 11, 2017 3:03:37 GMT
I understood and liked Leliana a lot better after I played Leliana's Song. Marjolaine shaped her when she was young, and that's a powerful influence no matter how badly it ended. I see her more as struggling between two aspects of her character, and the balance is razor thin. The pull of the bard, the intrigue and the danger is like an addiction. She wants to be a better person, and has ideals, but like any addict she can fall. In that sense, I don't know if Divine Justinia helped her (as she admits in the Fade and in her will). When the Inquisitor comes along, it doesn't take much to tip the scales one way or the other.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 11, 2017 18:41:47 GMT
I found it very sad the first run when I didn't realise how badly that early decision not to interfere would reverberate down the line. I really thought it wasn't my place to tell her what to do when I had only recently joined the team and I wasn't officially in charge at all. I suppose the thinking is that everyone is calling me the Herald of Andraste so that carries some weight but I honestly thought that Leliana hadn't bought into that wholeheartedly. Besides which it wasn't as though I had accepted the title or even believed in the Maker so why did my word carry so much weight with her at that point?
Anyway, first run was with a Warden who had romanced Leliana, so I got the letter from him saying how he knew how badly Justinia's death would have affected her and for me to do my best to help. Then despite my best efforts, she cuts that woman's throat and it is clear she is totally ruthless and merciless, going on to blackmail some cleric through threatening their family and I'm left feeling awful because I know my Warden is not going to recognise the Leliana she has become.
Then after finishing the run, I discover it was all down to that early incident back at Haven and I was not pleased because of how weighted it is against you doing the right thing to stop her becoming hardened, seeing as 2 out 3 options end up that way. I think it should only have been if you actively encourage her to kill the spy that it is irrevocable that she will be hardened at that point, because otherwise your subsequent decisions are worthless. |
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Post by Iddy on Jun 12, 2017 11:42:09 GMT
I suppose the thinking is that everyone is calling me the Herald of Andraste so that carries some weight but I honestly thought that Leliana hadn't bought into that wholeheartedly.
I remember this scene at Haven when Leliana says "Even if we were to stop these claims from spreading..." to which Cassandra replies, clearly upset at the implication of doing such thing: "We did not". |
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Fan from 2003 - 2020
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Sept 11, 2017 22:25:37 GMT
Josephine and Leliana before the Inquisition.  |
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Post by Iddy on Sept 23, 2017 12:06:09 GMT
I don't understand the whole "I got ninjamanced by Leliana" thing. It is impossible to start the romance unless you make the conscious decision of picking a flirty dialogue option.
There must be a dialogue option people love choosing and don't realize it triggers the romance.
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davesin
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
Posts: 489 Likes: 858
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davesin
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by davesin on Sept 23, 2017 15:15:33 GMT
Well, the "ninjamance" can be triggered by somehow neutral dialogue option. Something like: "You really loved her, didn't you?" So, yeah, it's possible.
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ღ I am a golem. Obviously.
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Dreadnaw Rising
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Post by phoray on Sept 23, 2017 15:37:49 GMT
I found it very sad the first run when I didn't realise how badly that early decision not to interfere would reverberate down the line. I really thought it wasn't my place to tell her what to do when I had only recently joined the team and I wasn't officially in charge at all. I suppose the thinking is that everyone is calling me the Herald of Andraste so that carries some weight but I honestly thought that Leliana hadn't bought into that wholeheartedly. Besides which it wasn't as though I had accepted the title or even believed in the Maker so why did my word carry so much weight with her at that point?
Anyway, first run was with a Warden who had romanced Leliana, so I got the letter from him saying how he knew how badly Justinia's death would have affected her and for me to do my best to help. Then despite my best efforts, she cuts that woman's throat and it is clear she is totally ruthless and merciless, going on to blackmail some cleric through threatening their family and I'm left feeling awful because I know my Warden is not going to recognise the Leliana she has become.
Then after finishing the run, I discover it was all down to that early incident back at Haven and I was not pleased because of how weighted it is against you doing the right thing to stop her becoming hardened, seeing as 2 out 3 options end up that way. I think it should only have been if you actively encourage her to kill the spy that it is irrevocable that she will be hardened at that point, because otherwise your subsequent decisions are worthless. i didn't realize it was an order one way or the other. Leliana didn't stop me from observing her, as a general coworker bystander. Retrospectively bemused, I actually agreed with killing the traitor and said something like, "Cool. You're taking care of things." *thumbs up." Now I've played it 5 times, I can see where someone who is just against murder in general would be horrified by the decision and speak out, like you would (in good world) against any injustice you deemed one. So, still not really an order....There is also dialogue available to imply that not killing the spy was just a waste of resources, so you can take a merc perpspective when being against the killing. I feel like it was all "input" not orders, and our passionate stance against the killing just made her reconsider- she didn't take it as an order. I agree with you in that it shouldn't have been "you get it all right or you're screwed". I was for killing a traitor, but against saying the soldiers who had volunteered were mere canon fodder, and against killing the nun. Too bad for me. And what's worse, Leliana defied a direct order by someone she helped vote in as leader. Which makes me pretty much just hate her. And then I can't stop her from holding hostages, which made me hate her even more. |
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Post by Iddy on Sept 23, 2017 16:59:12 GMT
I know that everything ends the same way and the writers will never kill her off, but I think Divine Leliana is much safer when hardened.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Sept 24, 2017 15:53:51 GMT
The thing is if you object to the killing then she does reconsider. I still don't see why she would be so influenced by me at that point, whether from the point of view of taking orders or just input. She is the Spy Master and the organisation depends on her doing the role to the best of her ability without being unduly influenced by other people who may not understand the necessity for her actions.
Take Walsingham at the time of Elizabeth I. She left it to him to do what he had to do to keep her safe. It is likely she preferred not to know because she might have objected to his methods and even when she did, on the whole she accepted that it was necessary. Occasionally she did put her foot down and not allow him to do something but then as Queen she had that right. At the beginning of DAI the PC does not have anywhere near that level of power or influence. Then the stupid part is at the end, if you give her a direct order as Inquisitor, when she should listen to you, if you got it wrong back in Haven, she totally ignores you.
This is why this is one of the few times I feel metagaming is justified because the logic behind the way they wrote that sequence is just not plausible and it makes the whole concept of her being a Spy Master in that early sequence or you being the head of the organisation in the end one just not believable.
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Post by Iddy on Oct 11, 2017 13:39:35 GMT
I wish hardening Leliana were not portrayed as the objectively wrong option. It feels like we're choosing between Reasonable and Blood Thirsty Psycho, rather than Idealist and Pragmatic.
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Post by vertigomez on Jan 3, 2018 16:57:59 GMT
I find myself falling more and more in love with Leliana as a character, which is something I never would have expected since I hated her on my first run of Origins. But seeing her in Inquisition, listening to some of her comments in DAO, thinking about Pope Leliana, watching the Sacred Ashes trailer and getting overwhelmed by Leli feels... it's great, she's great, I love her, and I think I FINALLY understand her as a character. :dumb:
^ for nostalgia purposes
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Post by vertigomez on Jan 20, 2018 5:16:01 GMT
Leliana: They say that when Alindra has cried enough, she will be able to cross the river to be reunited with her solider. Warden: Why do stories always end so badly? Leliana: (insistent) It doesn't end so badly! It ends hopefully. Alindra will one day be with her love again. We don't know when, but she will. Lovely bit of unintentional foreshadowing in DAO. 
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