Mass Effect 1-3 (LE and OT) Narrative Discussion/Critique
Nov 20, 2021 21:15:56 GMT
SirSourpuss likes this
Post by lordmoral on Nov 20, 2021 21:15:56 GMT
(A repost of a thread I made on Reddit, my account there is Lordmoral, which I though would be fine to share with you given that not all have Reddit account).
Hello, please keep discussion at level:
I wanted to discuss things like how silly the story is and how we let our own hype at the moment get the better of us blinding us to potential issues that lead to a rushed development for ME3 and how we should watch out that our love for the franchise doesn't get turned into an excuse for EA/Bioware to do choices that hurt the series as they might get the wrong ideas. I played the originals when they came out and they are still silly structured, I welcome any feedback to this post.
In contrast to ME1, ME2 and subsequently ME3 are pretty much linear in nature, I will be talking primarily of ME2 as some of the main story and N7 quests (even some small quests in ME1) could and should have had more branching paths within the same game and even more options on ME3. So without any further ado here are the points I wanted to discuss (I know the games won't be changed, these are things I wanted to discuss):
Remember Shepard words after the final in game conversation with The Illusive Man: "The Reapers are still out there, and I am gonna find some way to defeat them."
1. Keepers Quest Data: this is a big one even though we already know the start of the Reapers by ME1 ending, but as someone seeking to prove the existence of the Reapers (not that the Council never knew or didn't believed Shepard as the Citadel Vaults prove) to start rallying support in ME2 and not rush that aspect in ME3. We have data, witnesses and the method for others to prove it for themselves what Virgil told us on Illos, so why Bioware didn't used it?
2. Anderson role: this is a big one, even if the Alliance does make trips to the Terminus Systems using both Special Operations, establishing an official colony in Franklin (the one of the Javelin missiles ) and (if you play Arrival before Collectors Base Hackett will tell you) the Alliance basically evacuates all small colonies and places ships guarding the bigger ones yet we can't get a bit more support from the Alliance on the Reaper IFF mission? The most definite prove that the Reapers are a threat and we can't tip Anderson off about a Cerberus lab hidden inside a brown star (the Council and Alliance are more likely to send in the cavalry after a Cerberus facility than if Shepard mentions Reapers as how easily everyone fell for The Illusive Man trap, more on that later).
1) the mission could have gone the same way if no one was warned but if we did contacted someone else about the Cerberus laboratory we could have had Anderson (if not chosen as Councilor) leading a joint task force and then running into the Normandy as we go back and forth of how fast they responded to that and not what is really in the brown star, then we point them to the location of the Reaper corpse. Rather than focusing on exploring the interior of the ship the task force would send probes to explore the vessel and move to hook it up to tethering lines in order to move it to a better location for study. Then the barriers come back up, the probes are inside however and they serve as eyes and ears as well remote data acquisition, they also are used to track Shepard and Co through the mission. The rest of the mission could still play out similarly as when the Barriers are down the vessel goes with the Probes which will still be sending data to the Fleet.
2) afterwards when we are discussing Legion fate the Fleet CO (Anderson or someone else) requests to come aboard to which we can agree or no and if we do allow them we tell the Cerberus personnel to wait in the third deck while Shepard greets the guests. Turns out one of them is the Virmire Survivor and the other is either Anderson and the Fleet CO or just the CO. We tour the ship and talk to Mordin Solus (his data about the Collectors and Protheans would be mighty useful) and Legion if we do activate it and the perspective they all get leaves them in a shocked state. We have a few words with the trio and then the VS decides to talk a little while in Shepard Cabin (the tour ends in Deck 1 anyway) more so if they are their LI. In there we can decide to start mending the relationship or end it discussing what happened on Horizon and promise to meet up again after the Collectors are dealt with, for obvious reasons no romantic night but more like what Liara got. Missions continue as normal
3. Collectors Base aftermath: this is a big one, when you do, and survive, the Collectors Base it baffles me how Anderson behaves like, we have just been through a massive glorious battle with tons of valuable intel and we can't give Anderson the lowdown of what happened there? I have got a few ideas:
1) in the event both Mordin and Samara survived players could request a meeting with the Council and present them with testimony of what went down beyond the Omega 4 Relay as well Doctor Solus analysis (this is where the Keepers data would come into play). Mordin is a recognized name and Samara carries great respect with the Asari so they would be forced to look at the evidence and discussion. Destroying the Base would earn you backing from the Council and Alliance so there is that as well while letting Cerberus take it earns you negative points which tally at the end, it would function like the Suicide Mission where there is an invisible math equation analyzing who you have left at the rear guard, and determine how much the Council starts setting aside actual resources behind the scenes to shore up defenses (which would have factored how much punishment the Alliance and other would be able to receive and deliver against the Reaper attacks, do nothing the story progresses as usual but do the meeting and end up winning it the strength of the Armies would receive a bonus WA points) either way, the Alliance assigns the VS to the Normandy to get more intel on a few topics Shepard mentioned (ground canon remains, Heretic Station (even if it is Heretic scrapyard) and one which is personal for them (an investigation into a Cerberus base which has various ways to deal with it depending on the fate of the Collectors Base and serves to explore the Shepard/Cerberus relationship in ME2 rather than that rushed conflict we had in ME3).
2) we can get more scenes and dialog with the VS where we can have it serve sometime in our ship (romances would count for Paramour in this game for ME1 LI including that moment for Liara romances) but, we can't complete: LotSB, Overlord or start Arrival with them in our parties for obvious reasons as they are too hot in terms of attracting attention to the VS. The missions we could do are any remaining N7 missions, recruitment, loyalty quests and a series of missions with them pertaining Alliance/Council business (see previous point). Per the conclusion of those they would return to Alliance space to continue their career and in Williams case we hear it from her how she qualifies for the rank she has in ME3 due to the Brass finding out all her commendations and awards she should have earned but for some reason they lost the documents all the time. It is from this point onwards that we can complete the three controversial DLC missions oh, if Arrival was completed before all this then the VS would not have been able to join Shepard.
4. Intact Prothean device: this one irked me a lot, how do you have the player find an intact Prothean device in a side quest and not have the option to put it in the ship and taking it to Anderson?
5. Horizon questions: how did the Virmire Survivor escape the Collectors Stasis you may ask yourself? Well we have Mass Effect Paragon Lost (an anime style movie) detailing some interesting backstory of James Vega where we see why everyone was blaming Cerberus for the abductions (not that they haven't done anything to dispel the rumors) and they have an antidote for the Collectors Stasis fields, that would have turned the most Paragon of Shepard into the loudest screamers. Imagine that information came during the trial and then we decide to get the F out of there and as we are moving the VS runs to call us to stop just as we are getting into the Skycars and A/K forces themselves into the vehicle if they are the LI and Shepard only notices that when he is about to enter the Normandy to scream alone in the cargo hold.
That is it for now, I know ME2 is a lot of people favorite game as it is mine but those glaring narrative mistakes on a RPG series (not the shooters with RPG elements we got in ME2 and ME3) added up and we have only us to blame, we gave the developers too big a pass as ME2 was receiving the post launch DLC content.
Hello, please keep discussion at level:
I wanted to discuss things like how silly the story is and how we let our own hype at the moment get the better of us blinding us to potential issues that lead to a rushed development for ME3 and how we should watch out that our love for the franchise doesn't get turned into an excuse for EA/Bioware to do choices that hurt the series as they might get the wrong ideas. I played the originals when they came out and they are still silly structured, I welcome any feedback to this post.
In contrast to ME1, ME2 and subsequently ME3 are pretty much linear in nature, I will be talking primarily of ME2 as some of the main story and N7 quests (even some small quests in ME1) could and should have had more branching paths within the same game and even more options on ME3. So without any further ado here are the points I wanted to discuss (I know the games won't be changed, these are things I wanted to discuss):
Remember Shepard words after the final in game conversation with The Illusive Man: "The Reapers are still out there, and I am gonna find some way to defeat them."
Spoilers for ME2 and ME Paragon Lost follows
1. Keepers Quest Data: this is a big one even though we already know the start of the Reapers by ME1 ending, but as someone seeking to prove the existence of the Reapers (not that the Council never knew or didn't believed Shepard as the Citadel Vaults prove) to start rallying support in ME2 and not rush that aspect in ME3. We have data, witnesses and the method for others to prove it for themselves what Virgil told us on Illos, so why Bioware didn't used it?
2. Anderson role: this is a big one, even if the Alliance does make trips to the Terminus Systems using both Special Operations, establishing an official colony in Franklin (the one of the Javelin missiles ) and (if you play Arrival before Collectors Base Hackett will tell you) the Alliance basically evacuates all small colonies and places ships guarding the bigger ones yet we can't get a bit more support from the Alliance on the Reaper IFF mission? The most definite prove that the Reapers are a threat and we can't tip Anderson off about a Cerberus lab hidden inside a brown star (the Council and Alliance are more likely to send in the cavalry after a Cerberus facility than if Shepard mentions Reapers as how easily everyone fell for The Illusive Man trap, more on that later).
1) the mission could have gone the same way if no one was warned but if we did contacted someone else about the Cerberus laboratory we could have had Anderson (if not chosen as Councilor) leading a joint task force and then running into the Normandy as we go back and forth of how fast they responded to that and not what is really in the brown star, then we point them to the location of the Reaper corpse. Rather than focusing on exploring the interior of the ship the task force would send probes to explore the vessel and move to hook it up to tethering lines in order to move it to a better location for study. Then the barriers come back up, the probes are inside however and they serve as eyes and ears as well remote data acquisition, they also are used to track Shepard and Co through the mission. The rest of the mission could still play out similarly as when the Barriers are down the vessel goes with the Probes which will still be sending data to the Fleet.
2) afterwards when we are discussing Legion fate the Fleet CO (Anderson or someone else) requests to come aboard to which we can agree or no and if we do allow them we tell the Cerberus personnel to wait in the third deck while Shepard greets the guests. Turns out one of them is the Virmire Survivor and the other is either Anderson and the Fleet CO or just the CO. We tour the ship and talk to Mordin Solus (his data about the Collectors and Protheans would be mighty useful) and Legion if we do activate it and the perspective they all get leaves them in a shocked state. We have a few words with the trio and then the VS decides to talk a little while in Shepard Cabin (the tour ends in Deck 1 anyway) more so if they are their LI. In there we can decide to start mending the relationship or end it discussing what happened on Horizon and promise to meet up again after the Collectors are dealt with, for obvious reasons no romantic night but more like what Liara got. Missions continue as normal
3. Collectors Base aftermath: this is a big one, when you do, and survive, the Collectors Base it baffles me how Anderson behaves like, we have just been through a massive glorious battle with tons of valuable intel and we can't give Anderson the lowdown of what happened there? I have got a few ideas:
1) in the event both Mordin and Samara survived players could request a meeting with the Council and present them with testimony of what went down beyond the Omega 4 Relay as well Doctor Solus analysis (this is where the Keepers data would come into play). Mordin is a recognized name and Samara carries great respect with the Asari so they would be forced to look at the evidence and discussion. Destroying the Base would earn you backing from the Council and Alliance so there is that as well while letting Cerberus take it earns you negative points which tally at the end, it would function like the Suicide Mission where there is an invisible math equation analyzing who you have left at the rear guard, and determine how much the Council starts setting aside actual resources behind the scenes to shore up defenses (which would have factored how much punishment the Alliance and other would be able to receive and deliver against the Reaper attacks, do nothing the story progresses as usual but do the meeting and end up winning it the strength of the Armies would receive a bonus WA points) either way, the Alliance assigns the VS to the Normandy to get more intel on a few topics Shepard mentioned (ground canon remains, Heretic Station (even if it is Heretic scrapyard) and one which is personal for them (an investigation into a Cerberus base which has various ways to deal with it depending on the fate of the Collectors Base and serves to explore the Shepard/Cerberus relationship in ME2 rather than that rushed conflict we had in ME3).
2) we can get more scenes and dialog with the VS where we can have it serve sometime in our ship (romances would count for Paramour in this game for ME1 LI including that moment for Liara romances) but, we can't complete: LotSB, Overlord or start Arrival with them in our parties for obvious reasons as they are too hot in terms of attracting attention to the VS. The missions we could do are any remaining N7 missions, recruitment, loyalty quests and a series of missions with them pertaining Alliance/Council business (see previous point). Per the conclusion of those they would return to Alliance space to continue their career and in Williams case we hear it from her how she qualifies for the rank she has in ME3 due to the Brass finding out all her commendations and awards she should have earned but for some reason they lost the documents all the time. It is from this point onwards that we can complete the three controversial DLC missions oh, if Arrival was completed before all this then the VS would not have been able to join Shepard.
4. Intact Prothean device: this one irked me a lot, how do you have the player find an intact Prothean device in a side quest and not have the option to put it in the ship and taking it to Anderson?
5. Horizon questions: how did the Virmire Survivor escape the Collectors Stasis you may ask yourself? Well we have Mass Effect Paragon Lost (an anime style movie) detailing some interesting backstory of James Vega where we see why everyone was blaming Cerberus for the abductions (not that they haven't done anything to dispel the rumors) and they have an antidote for the Collectors Stasis fields, that would have turned the most Paragon of Shepard into the loudest screamers. Imagine that information came during the trial and then we decide to get the F out of there and as we are moving the VS runs to call us to stop just as we are getting into the Skycars and A/K forces themselves into the vehicle if they are the LI and Shepard only notices that when he is about to enter the Normandy to scream alone in the cargo hold.
That is it for now, I know ME2 is a lot of people favorite game as it is mine but those glaring narrative mistakes on a RPG series (not the shooters with RPG elements we got in ME2 and ME3) added up and we have only us to blame, we gave the developers too big a pass as ME2 was receiving the post launch DLC content.