inherit
331
0
Apr 25, 2024 23:48:38 GMT
5,916
q5tyhj
I am Ahab
2,030
August 2016
q5tyhj
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
q5tyhj
|
Post by q5tyhj on Sept 12, 2022 14:23:11 GMT
Found a couple interesting posts on the Expanse subreddit RE the Ring builder civilization and their plan to defeat the Unknown Aggressors/dark gods (mostly from carefully parsing/analyzing the "Dreamer Interlude" chapters where Cara is interacting with the Adro Diamond), thought I'd post them here if anyone was interested. Warning: spoilers for Leviathan Falls. On the "Roman master plan", i.e. the plan the Ring builders hatched to defend against/defeath the "Goths" or Unknown Aggressors: So, Duarte knew that the human hive mind would be effective because it actually wasn’t his idea. It was the plan of the Gatebuilders all along. He merely thought it was his idea, but the Protomolecule was manipulating him.
It seems like this was missed by a lot of people, so I’ve made a couple posts explaining it, but I’m too lazy to link them so I’ll just write a brief summary here. I can try to find them if you want though as I do think I elaborate more on it than I do here:
The Gatebuilders knew that they were easy for the Goths to kill, as at this stage in their evolutionary history they were no longer hive jellyfish but rather “beings of rich light” who had their consciousness inextricably linked through their gates and all their technology. They also knew that their own weapons harmed their hive mind, as a result of this. And they also knew that “beings in the Substrate (the world of matter) are difficult to refract through rich light”.
So, presumably, prior to quarantining themselves and shutting down the gate network, they set administrative access to ring station to only respond to someone in the Substrate. Why would they do this, when they themselves were NOT in the Substrate anymore? Because, as Holden’s vision in Abaddon’s Gate showed, they “knew that someday a solution would be found”. They knew that someday one of their Protomolecule rocks would miss, and there was a nonzero statistical likelihood that an intelligent alien species would evolve on the world it originally targeted, find it, and survive the encounter with it to reach the slow zone, and then eventually the Adro Diamond. This would obviously take awhile. In fact, it took 2 billion years. But they were a civilization that had already survived for 3 billion years (the age of the Adro Diamond is 5 billion years old) so they would have been fine with waiting an eternity. Now, had ring station’s administrative access NOT been set to respond only to someone in the Substrate, then this would mean that theoretically a species like the Gatebuilders could have found everything instead of a species like us, and then they would be right back to the drawing board. So that part was critical to their plan.
Next, you have the Protomolecule itself. It manipulates the brain chemistry of those that interact with it, literally changing dopamine and serotonin levels to become addicted to it and fond of it - we see this happen with Cara during the dives, and indirectly we see it happen with Duarte as well. From Holden’s perspective at the very end, we see it happen again without him even understanding it is happening. For a moment, he sees the human hive mind concept as “beautiful”, he has a near religious experience of awe with it, and he almost, almost decides to go with that instead of destroying everything. He had been hooked up to ring station for minutes. Duarte had been hooked up for months.
So, there you have it, and there’s more evidence than what I just stated - including several characters, including Holden, mentioning that the Gatebuilder hive mind would be resurrected as a “hive mind of murder primates”. But in closing, I bet a lot of people would wonder just how this would actually be equivalent to the Gatebuilders returning from the dead, right? Well that one is easy:
The Adro Diamond. Once the human hive mind was complete, it would link up to the Adro Diamond, and the hive mind would gain all the memories and knowledge of the Gatebuilder civilization. This would be subjectively indistinguishable from their original hive mind, the only difference is a physical one - the hive mind is ultimately based on brains in the Substrate, and therefore is unique compared to everything they used in their evolutionary history before that point. It’s like running the same software on different hardware.
Once you realize this was their plan all along, suddenly everything about the alien plot of the prior eight books makes perfect sense, if you think about it. (from www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/s7xggd/roman_master_plan_thread/ ) And also a more general (but extremely detailed) analysis of the biology and evolution of the space-jellyfish Ring builders: www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/sbdzu5/on_the_natural_history_and_evolution_of_the_romans/ Great and interesting stuff. Yeah there was definitely some stuff in there I missed, in those Dreamer chapters. That's the downside of being a fast reader, you tend to miss stuff sometimes, especially when its more implied than stated or stated in an obscure way (like the Dreamer chapters). And I guess the writers acknowledged in an interview that the "Roman master plan" post was accurate and was what they intended, so its good to know.
|
|
inherit
2044
0
Nov 10, 2016 16:47:07 GMT
10,086
AnDromedary
4,377
Nov 10, 2016 16:30:09 GMT
November 2016
andromedary
|
Post by AnDromedary on Sept 12, 2022 16:01:30 GMT
Found a couple interesting posts on the Expanse subreddit RE the Ring builder civilization and their plan to defeat the Unknown Aggressors/dark gods (mostly from carefully parsing/analyzing the "Dreamer Interlude" chapters where Cara is interacting with the Adro Diamond), thought I'd post them here if anyone was interested. Warning: spoilers for Leviathan Falls. On the "Roman master plan", i.e. the plan the Ring builders hatched to defend against/defeath the "Goths" or Unknown Aggressors: So, Duarte knew that the human hive mind would be effective because it actually wasn’t his idea. It was the plan of the Gatebuilders all along. He merely thought it was his idea, but the Protomolecule was manipulating him.
It seems like this was missed by a lot of people, so I’ve made a couple posts explaining it, but I’m too lazy to link them so I’ll just write a brief summary here. I can try to find them if you want though as I do think I elaborate more on it than I do here:
The Gatebuilders knew that they were easy for the Goths to kill, as at this stage in their evolutionary history they were no longer hive jellyfish but rather “beings of rich light” who had their consciousness inextricably linked through their gates and all their technology. They also knew that their own weapons harmed their hive mind, as a result of this. And they also knew that “beings in the Substrate (the world of matter) are difficult to refract through rich light”.
So, presumably, prior to quarantining themselves and shutting down the gate network, they set administrative access to ring station to only respond to someone in the Substrate. Why would they do this, when they themselves were NOT in the Substrate anymore? Because, as Holden’s vision in Abaddon’s Gate showed, they “knew that someday a solution would be found”. They knew that someday one of their Protomolecule rocks would miss, and there was a nonzero statistical likelihood that an intelligent alien species would evolve on the world it originally targeted, find it, and survive the encounter with it to reach the slow zone, and then eventually the Adro Diamond. This would obviously take awhile. In fact, it took 2 billion years. But they were a civilization that had already survived for 3 billion years (the age of the Adro Diamond is 5 billion years old) so they would have been fine with waiting an eternity. Now, had ring station’s administrative access NOT been set to respond only to someone in the Substrate, then this would mean that theoretically a species like the Gatebuilders could have found everything instead of a species like us, and then they would be right back to the drawing board. So that part was critical to their plan.
Next, you have the Protomolecule itself. It manipulates the brain chemistry of those that interact with it, literally changing dopamine and serotonin levels to become addicted to it and fond of it - we see this happen with Cara during the dives, and indirectly we see it happen with Duarte as well. From Holden’s perspective at the very end, we see it happen again without him even understanding it is happening. For a moment, he sees the human hive mind concept as “beautiful”, he has a near religious experience of awe with it, and he almost, almost decides to go with that instead of destroying everything. He had been hooked up to ring station for minutes. Duarte had been hooked up for months.
So, there you have it, and there’s more evidence than what I just stated - including several characters, including Holden, mentioning that the Gatebuilder hive mind would be resurrected as a “hive mind of murder primates”. But in closing, I bet a lot of people would wonder just how this would actually be equivalent to the Gatebuilders returning from the dead, right? Well that one is easy:
The Adro Diamond. Once the human hive mind was complete, it would link up to the Adro Diamond, and the hive mind would gain all the memories and knowledge of the Gatebuilder civilization. This would be subjectively indistinguishable from their original hive mind, the only difference is a physical one - the hive mind is ultimately based on brains in the Substrate, and therefore is unique compared to everything they used in their evolutionary history before that point. It’s like running the same software on different hardware.
Once you realize this was their plan all along, suddenly everything about the alien plot of the prior eight books makes perfect sense, if you think about it. (from www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/s7xggd/roman_master_plan_thread/ ) And also a more general (but extremely detailed) analysis of the biology and evolution of the space-jellyfish Ring builders: www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/sbdzu5/on_the_natural_history_and_evolution_of_the_romans/ That second post about the Builder's biology and evolution was pretty cool. Just reading that brought back to me how awesome the expanse is.
Two points to that, that came to mind while reading: 1) There is this paragraph, where he talks about the Builder's basically discovering or "evolving" multiplexing information transfer by using multiple wavelength's of light: In fact, we do have a somewhat equivalent system. Only in our biology we don't multiplex on the output side but rather on the input side. We don't (usually) have multiple axons but we do have multiple dendrites on one neuron and incoming synaptic information is processed and integrated in drastically different ways, depending on where incoming axons synapse into a cell's dendrites. So it's not such a foreign concept really.
2) One thing I am not sure about is the way he described the jump of the Builders from their initial ocean dwelling form to becoming a space dwelling species. He kinda glosses over it a little, just saying that it wouldn't have been difficult to break free of a moon's gravity, etc. But I do think there is a bit of a blank spot there. Even if the structures of Builders grew very high somehow, reaching orbital speeds (not to mention escape velocity) would still require some form of acceleration drive, wouldn't it? From the description we get, this form of life would not have any kind of active movement, certainly not in vacuum and from his recounting, they only developed the "momentum drive" much later int heir evolutionary path. I guess it is possible that there may have been an extraordinary event like an asteroid impact that may have "thrown" some of them into orbit/space and because it wouldn't have been much of an environmental change from the surface, some of them might have survived and formed their "space branch". Would have been cool to speculate about that particular transition a little further.
Other than that, this is exceptionally well thought through. Kudos to that dude for laying it all out like that.
|
|
inherit
331
0
Apr 25, 2024 23:48:38 GMT
5,916
q5tyhj
I am Ahab
2,030
August 2016
q5tyhj
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
q5tyhj
|
Post by q5tyhj on Sept 12, 2022 16:30:38 GMT
Found a couple interesting posts on the Expanse subreddit RE the Ring builder civilization and their plan to defeat the Unknown Aggressors/dark gods (mostly from carefully parsing/analyzing the "Dreamer Interlude" chapters where Cara is interacting with the Adro Diamond), thought I'd post them here if anyone was interested. Warning: spoilers for Leviathan Falls. On the "Roman master plan", i.e. the plan the Ring builders hatched to defend against/defeath the "Goths" or Unknown Aggressors: So, Duarte knew that the human hive mind would be effective because it actually wasn’t his idea. It was the plan of the Gatebuilders all along. He merely thought it was his idea, but the Protomolecule was manipulating him.
It seems like this was missed by a lot of people, so I’ve made a couple posts explaining it, but I’m too lazy to link them so I’ll just write a brief summary here. I can try to find them if you want though as I do think I elaborate more on it than I do here:
The Gatebuilders knew that they were easy for the Goths to kill, as at this stage in their evolutionary history they were no longer hive jellyfish but rather “beings of rich light” who had their consciousness inextricably linked through their gates and all their technology. They also knew that their own weapons harmed their hive mind, as a result of this. And they also knew that “beings in the Substrate (the world of matter) are difficult to refract through rich light”.
So, presumably, prior to quarantining themselves and shutting down the gate network, they set administrative access to ring station to only respond to someone in the Substrate. Why would they do this, when they themselves were NOT in the Substrate anymore? Because, as Holden’s vision in Abaddon’s Gate showed, they “knew that someday a solution would be found”. They knew that someday one of their Protomolecule rocks would miss, and there was a nonzero statistical likelihood that an intelligent alien species would evolve on the world it originally targeted, find it, and survive the encounter with it to reach the slow zone, and then eventually the Adro Diamond. This would obviously take awhile. In fact, it took 2 billion years. But they were a civilization that had already survived for 3 billion years (the age of the Adro Diamond is 5 billion years old) so they would have been fine with waiting an eternity. Now, had ring station’s administrative access NOT been set to respond only to someone in the Substrate, then this would mean that theoretically a species like the Gatebuilders could have found everything instead of a species like us, and then they would be right back to the drawing board. So that part was critical to their plan.
Next, you have the Protomolecule itself. It manipulates the brain chemistry of those that interact with it, literally changing dopamine and serotonin levels to become addicted to it and fond of it - we see this happen with Cara during the dives, and indirectly we see it happen with Duarte as well. From Holden’s perspective at the very end, we see it happen again without him even understanding it is happening. For a moment, he sees the human hive mind concept as “beautiful”, he has a near religious experience of awe with it, and he almost, almost decides to go with that instead of destroying everything. He had been hooked up to ring station for minutes. Duarte had been hooked up for months.
So, there you have it, and there’s more evidence than what I just stated - including several characters, including Holden, mentioning that the Gatebuilder hive mind would be resurrected as a “hive mind of murder primates”. But in closing, I bet a lot of people would wonder just how this would actually be equivalent to the Gatebuilders returning from the dead, right? Well that one is easy:
The Adro Diamond. Once the human hive mind was complete, it would link up to the Adro Diamond, and the hive mind would gain all the memories and knowledge of the Gatebuilder civilization. This would be subjectively indistinguishable from their original hive mind, the only difference is a physical one - the hive mind is ultimately based on brains in the Substrate, and therefore is unique compared to everything they used in their evolutionary history before that point. It’s like running the same software on different hardware.
Once you realize this was their plan all along, suddenly everything about the alien plot of the prior eight books makes perfect sense, if you think about it. (from www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/s7xggd/roman_master_plan_thread/ ) And also a more general (but extremely detailed) analysis of the biology and evolution of the space-jellyfish Ring builders: www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/sbdzu5/on_the_natural_history_and_evolution_of_the_romans/ That second post about the Builder's biology and evolution was pretty cool. Just reading that brought back to me how awesome the expanse is. Two points to that, that came to mind while reading: 1) There is this paragraph, where he talks about the Builder's basically discovering or "evolving" multiplexing information transfer by using multiple wavelength's of light: In fact, we do have a somewhat equivalent system. Only in our biology we don't multiplex on the output side but rather on the input side. We don't (usually) have multiple axons but we do have multiple dendrites on one neuron and incoming synaptic information is processed and integrated in drastically different ways, depending on where incoming axons synapse into a cell's dendrites. So it's not such a foreign concept really. 2) One thing I am not sure about is the way he described the jump of the Builders from their initial ocean dwelling form to becoming a space dwelling species. He kinda glosses over it a little, just saying that it wouldn't have been difficult to break free of a moon's gravity, etc. But I do think there is a bit of a blank spot there. Even if the structures of Builders grew very high somehow, reaching orbital speeds (not to mention escape velocity) would still require some form of acceleration drive, wouldn't it? From the description we get, this form of life would not have any kind of active movement, certainly not in vacuum and from his recounting, they only developed the "momentum drive" much later int heir evolutionary path. I guess it is possible that there may ahve been an extraordinary event like an asteroid impact that may have "thrown" some of them into orbit/space and because itwuoldn't ahve been much of an environmental change from the surfece, some of them might have survived and formed their "space branch". Would have been cool to speculate abuot that particular transition a little further. Other than that, this is exceptionally well thought through. Kudos to that dude for laying it all out like that.
Yeah iirc the person who wrote that post on the biology/evolution of the Ring builders said that they had a background in biology and/or neuroscience/neurobiology, so they were able to parse and explain those Dreamer chapters with a lot more detail than most readers (including myself) probably picked up on. And I think one of the Expanse authors also has a degree in biology, which is how/why they were able to come up with such an interesting and imaginative (but also plausible/realistic) account of a genuinely foreign form of intelligent alien life (in terms of organisms radically different from humans, or any Earth species analog). Its definitely one of the things that makes the series so compelling and re-readable. As far as the Ring builders/space jellyfish escaping the frozen moon that was their home and moving into space, that's something I missed the first time around. But I expect that their ability to leave the moon and survive in the vacuum of space had as much or more to do with their technological development than their biological or evolutionary development (although the ability to survive in vacuum definitely involves a biological element as well), and at the point that they move into space the very distinction between technology and biology becomes blurred: the ring gates and ring station and the protomolecule have effectively been incorporated into their group-consciousness and biology. The protomocule harvesting genetic information and evolutionary developments from "fast" life" sort of incapsulates this: its both organic/biological and technological. This helps explain why all the Ring builder/protomolecule technology (the various ruins, the guardians on the ring station and on Ilus, the orbital construction platforms on Laconia and the ships that were built there using protomolecule tech) are described as looking strangely organic- for the ring builders, there wasn't any sharp distinction between biology and tech as they had become deeply intertwined with one another, going back deep into their evolutionary history. Really great stuff though, I'm glad you enjoyed it (I certainly did).
|
|
inherit
Supra et Ultra
3406
0
Member is Online
41,569
dazk
14,799
February 2017
dazk
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
DazK1805
|
Post by dazk on Sept 13, 2022 2:06:29 GMT
Found a couple interesting posts on the Expanse subreddit RE the Ring builder civilization and their plan to defeat the Unknown Aggressors/dark gods (mostly from carefully parsing/analyzing the "Dreamer Interlude" chapters where Cara is interacting with the Adro Diamond), thought I'd post them here if anyone was interested. Warning: spoilers for Leviathan Falls. On the "Roman master plan", i.e. the plan the Ring builders hatched to defend against/defeath the "Goths" or Unknown Aggressors: So, Duarte knew that the human hive mind would be effective because it actually wasn’t his idea. It was the plan of the Gatebuilders all along. He merely thought it was his idea, but the Protomolecule was manipulating him.
It seems like this was missed by a lot of people, so I’ve made a couple posts explaining it, but I’m too lazy to link them so I’ll just write a brief summary here. I can try to find them if you want though as I do think I elaborate more on it than I do here:
The Gatebuilders knew that they were easy for the Goths to kill, as at this stage in their evolutionary history they were no longer hive jellyfish but rather “beings of rich light” who had their consciousness inextricably linked through their gates and all their technology. They also knew that their own weapons harmed their hive mind, as a result of this. And they also knew that “beings in the Substrate (the world of matter) are difficult to refract through rich light”.
So, presumably, prior to quarantining themselves and shutting down the gate network, they set administrative access to ring station to only respond to someone in the Substrate. Why would they do this, when they themselves were NOT in the Substrate anymore? Because, as Holden’s vision in Abaddon’s Gate showed, they “knew that someday a solution would be found”. They knew that someday one of their Protomolecule rocks would miss, and there was a nonzero statistical likelihood that an intelligent alien species would evolve on the world it originally targeted, find it, and survive the encounter with it to reach the slow zone, and then eventually the Adro Diamond. This would obviously take awhile. In fact, it took 2 billion years. But they were a civilization that had already survived for 3 billion years (the age of the Adro Diamond is 5 billion years old) so they would have been fine with waiting an eternity. Now, had ring station’s administrative access NOT been set to respond only to someone in the Substrate, then this would mean that theoretically a species like the Gatebuilders could have found everything instead of a species like us, and then they would be right back to the drawing board. So that part was critical to their plan.
Next, you have the Protomolecule itself. It manipulates the brain chemistry of those that interact with it, literally changing dopamine and serotonin levels to become addicted to it and fond of it - we see this happen with Cara during the dives, and indirectly we see it happen with Duarte as well. From Holden’s perspective at the very end, we see it happen again without him even understanding it is happening. For a moment, he sees the human hive mind concept as “beautiful”, he has a near religious experience of awe with it, and he almost, almost decides to go with that instead of destroying everything. He had been hooked up to ring station for minutes. Duarte had been hooked up for months.
So, there you have it, and there’s more evidence than what I just stated - including several characters, including Holden, mentioning that the Gatebuilder hive mind would be resurrected as a “hive mind of murder primates”. But in closing, I bet a lot of people would wonder just how this would actually be equivalent to the Gatebuilders returning from the dead, right? Well that one is easy:
The Adro Diamond. Once the human hive mind was complete, it would link up to the Adro Diamond, and the hive mind would gain all the memories and knowledge of the Gatebuilder civilization. This would be subjectively indistinguishable from their original hive mind, the only difference is a physical one - the hive mind is ultimately based on brains in the Substrate, and therefore is unique compared to everything they used in their evolutionary history before that point. It’s like running the same software on different hardware.
Once you realize this was their plan all along, suddenly everything about the alien plot of the prior eight books makes perfect sense, if you think about it. (from www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/s7xggd/roman_master_plan_thread/ ) And also a more general (but extremely detailed) analysis of the biology and evolution of the space-jellyfish Ring builders: www.reddit.com/r/TheExpanse/comments/sbdzu5/on_the_natural_history_and_evolution_of_the_romans/ That second post about the Builder's biology and evolution was pretty cool. Just reading that brought back to me how awesome the expanse is.
Two points to that, that came to mind while reading: 1) There is this paragraph, where he talks about the Builder's basically discovering or "evolving" multiplexing information transfer by using multiple wavelength's of light: In fact, we do have a somewhat equivalent system. Only in our biology we don't multiplex on the output side but rather on the input side. We don't (usually) have multiple axons but we do have multiple dendrites on one neuron and incoming synaptic information is processed and integrated in drastically different ways, depending on where incoming axons synapse into a cell's dendrites. So it's not such a foreign concept really.
2) One thing I am not sure about is the way he described the jump of the Builders from their initial ocean dwelling form to becoming a space dwelling species. He kinda glosses over it a little, just saying that it wouldn't have been difficult to break free of a moon's gravity, etc. But I do think there is a bit of a blank spot there. Even if the structures of Builders grew very high somehow, reaching orbital speeds (not to mention escape velocity) would still require some form of acceleration drive, wouldn't it? From the description we get, this form of life would not have any kind of active movement, certainly not in vacuum and from his recounting, they only developed the "momentum drive" much later int heir evolutionary path. I guess it is possible that there may have been an extraordinary event like an asteroid impact that may have "thrown" some of them into orbit/space and because it wouldn't have been much of an environmental change from the surface, some of them might have survived and formed their "space branch". Would have been cool to speculate about that particular transition a little further.
Other than that, this is exceptionally well thought through. Kudos to that dude for laying it all out like that.
I thought it did mention some form of biological propulsion that they had in regard to movement and this allowed them to initially move in space and that they detached and entered space just through a lack of gravity. There propulsionfurther down the time line in space I thought was some form of "wave" jumping, folding space but honestly some of it went over my head.
|
|
inherit
331
0
Apr 25, 2024 23:48:38 GMT
5,916
q5tyhj
I am Ahab
2,030
August 2016
q5tyhj
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
q5tyhj
|
Post by q5tyhj on Sept 13, 2022 21:26:51 GMT
That second post about the Builder's biology and evolution was pretty cool. Just reading that brought back to me how awesome the expanse is.
Two points to that, that came to mind while reading: 1) There is this paragraph, where he talks about the Builder's basically discovering or "evolving" multiplexing information transfer by using multiple wavelength's of light: In fact, we do have a somewhat equivalent system. Only in our biology we don't multiplex on the output side but rather on the input side. We don't (usually) have multiple axons but we do have multiple dendrites on one neuron and incoming synaptic information is processed and integrated in drastically different ways, depending on where incoming axons synapse into a cell's dendrites. So it's not such a foreign concept really.
2) One thing I am not sure about is the way he described the jump of the Builders from their initial ocean dwelling form to becoming a space dwelling species. He kinda glosses over it a little, just saying that it wouldn't have been difficult to break free of a moon's gravity, etc. But I do think there is a bit of a blank spot there. Even if the structures of Builders grew very high somehow, reaching orbital speeds (not to mention escape velocity) would still require some form of acceleration drive, wouldn't it? From the description we get, this form of life would not have any kind of active movement, certainly not in vacuum and from his recounting, they only developed the "momentum drive" much later int heir evolutionary path. I guess it is possible that there may have been an extraordinary event like an asteroid impact that may have "thrown" some of them into orbit/space and because it wouldn't have been much of an environmental change from the surface, some of them might have survived and formed their "space branch". Would have been cool to speculate about that particular transition a little further.
Other than that, this is exceptionally well thought through. Kudos to that dude for laying it all out like that.
I thought it did mention some form of biological propulsion that they had in regard to movement and this allowed them to initially move in space and that they detached and entered space just through a lack of gravity. There propulsionfurther down the time line in space I thought was some form of "wave" jumping, folding space but honestly some of it went over my head. I feel like the writing in the Dreamer chapters may have been a little bit too obscure and poetic, it was extremely easy to miss all these little details (I missed this bit too, about moving into space and having a form of self-propulsion and so on). Sort of a minor gripe, and its been very satisfying to read these posts from people who parsed and analyzed all the things I missed.
|
|
hoku
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 237 Likes: 428
inherit
11769
0
428
hoku
237
Dec 28, 2020 12:22:50 GMT
December 2020
hoku
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by hoku on Jan 20, 2023 20:01:46 GMT
|
|
hoku
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 237 Likes: 428
inherit
11769
0
428
hoku
237
Dec 28, 2020 12:22:50 GMT
December 2020
hoku
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by hoku on Feb 8, 2023 2:02:53 GMT
the recently announced Boom-Studios comics blew past the kickstarter deadline within a short time. They will also be available in comic stores otherwise, just without some of the perks and versions. I predordered/backed digital DRM free PDF copies. Story aside, hoping for many cool covers which could lead to posters/prints hopefully. Now if they would only let Clinton Shorter release the later season (5+6) soundtracks, as well as a complete Series BluRay set... and hopefully the recently announced action figures from Nacelle will look decent too! The first wave of collectibles for this show will include six main characters: Chrisjen Avasarala, Camina Drummer, James Holden, Amos Burton, Bobbie Draper, and Naomi Nagata. At this time, there is no release date or pricing details available for Nacelle’s The Expanse collectibles.
|
|
inherit
Supra et Ultra
3406
0
Member is Online
41,569
dazk
14,799
February 2017
dazk
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
DazK1805
|
Post by dazk on Feb 8, 2023 3:31:55 GMT
the recently announced Boom-Studios comics blew past the kickstarter deadline within a short time. They will also be available in comic stores otherwise, just without some of the perks and versions. I predordered/backed digital DRM free PDF copies. Story aside, hoping for many cool covers which could lead to posters/prints hopefully. Now if they would only let Clinton Shorter release the later season (5+6) soundtracks, as well as a complete Series BluRay set... and hopefully the recently announced action figures from Nacelle will look decent too! The first wave of collectibles for this show will include six main characters: Chrisjen Avasarala, Camina Drummer, James Holden, Amos Burton, Bobbie Draper, and Naomi Nagata. At this time, there is no release date or pricing details available for Nacelle’s The Expanse collectibles. So a bit unsure and possibly quite annoyed as apparently these comics from what I read will fill the time gap of 30 years between Babylons Ashes and Perseoplis Rising. Comics are really hard and or really expensive to get in Australia as they tend to only be released OS. Were you able to get DRM Free PDF copies because you helped fund the Kickstarter or can you just order them?
|
|
hoku
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 237 Likes: 428
inherit
11769
0
428
hoku
237
Dec 28, 2020 12:22:50 GMT
December 2020
hoku
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by hoku on Feb 8, 2023 14:22:32 GMT
So a bit unsure and possibly quite annoyed as apparently these comics from what I read will fill the time gap of 30 years between Babylons Ashes and Perseoplis Rising. Comics are really hard and or really expensive to get in Australia as they tend to only be released OS. Were you able to get DRM Free PDF copies because you helped fund the Kickstarter or can you just order them?
are you annoyed because you hope(d) that the 30 year gap would be told in live action? I haven't read anything that would rule it out, even despite the comics.
why are you unsure about it? worried that they shoehorn dumb story things into the (books/tv 1-6 > 7-9 books) gap or/and alter the characters too much?
the creators/writers and Alcon are involved, so I'm personally calmer and reassured because of that.
as for the kickstarter the physical editions are indeed very expensive to ship overseas (Europe in my case) as they come in batches individually or some batched together. As for the DRM free PDF copies: you can simply order back it just as I did if you want, the campaign will go on for a couple of weeks
|
|
inherit
Supra et Ultra
3406
0
Member is Online
41,569
dazk
14,799
February 2017
dazk
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
DazK1805
|
Post by dazk on Feb 8, 2023 22:02:33 GMT
So a bit unsure and possibly quite annoyed as apparently these comics from what I read will fill the time gap of 30 years between Babylons Ashes and Perseoplis Rising. Comics are really hard and or really expensive to get in Australia as they tend to only be released OS. Were you able to get DRM Free PDF copies because you helped fund the Kickstarter or can you just order them?
are you annoyed because you hope(d) that the 30 year gap would be told in live action? I haven't read anything that would rule it out, even despite the comics.
why are you unsure about it? worried that they shoehorn dumb story things into the (books/tv 1-6 > 7-9 books) gap or/and alter the characters too much?
the creators/writers and Alcon are involved, so I'm personally calmer and reassured because of that.
as for the kickstarter the physical editions are indeed very expensive to ship overseas (Europe in my case) as they come in batches individually or some batched together. As for the DRM free PDF copies: you can simply order back it just as I did if you want, the campaign will go on for a couple of weeks
Annoyed because like game makers I am sick of story being told in different formats that may not be readily or financially accessible to all people, comics being the main one for me in Australia. Unsure that I will be able to access it. Thanks re the other info.
|
|
inherit
2044
0
Nov 10, 2016 16:47:07 GMT
10,086
AnDromedary
4,377
Nov 10, 2016 16:30:09 GMT
November 2016
andromedary
|
Post by AnDromedary on Feb 9, 2023 17:53:01 GMT
Not a fan of comics. Have yet to find comics that extend an existing series in a good way without bringing down the general quality.
And who the f is Andy Diggle? Is that a pseudonym? The tv show was great because Daniel and Ty were directly involved. What about these comics? I am worried they are extending the franchise only to make more money at this point. That would be a dam shame.
|
|
inherit
Supra et Ultra
3406
0
Member is Online
41,569
dazk
14,799
February 2017
dazk
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
DazK1805
|
Post by dazk on Feb 9, 2023 21:59:28 GMT
Not a fan of comics. Have yet to find comics that extend an existing series in a good way without bringing down the general quality. And who the f is Andy Diggle? Is that a pseudonym? The tv show was great because Daniel and Ty were directly involved. What about these comics? I am worried they are extending the franchise only to make more money at this point. That would be a dam shame. This link to the kickstarter that hoku provided has some good background info. on Diggle and it looks like it has supervision and endorsement from the shows director/writers. www.kickstarter.com/projects/boom-studios/the-expanse-dragon-tooth-reveals-the-missing-yearsThat said I am also not a fan of expansions (see what I did there ) that extend out the original media platform. Think books expanding games, comics expanding games and TV shows expanding games. Whilst some can be good and informative it's comics for me that just do not have the capacity to provide in depth character and story expansion and the AC franchise burned me big time with comics. I think it is lazy and expensive for the quality and quantity you get. At least with books/novels expanding games the cost is usually worth the volume of story and character depth for the price but I am still not a fan. If you make a game make DLC to expand your story and obviously that is harder with a show that has been canned but The Expanse have a history of Novellas and could easily have used that medium.
|
|
inherit
2044
0
Nov 10, 2016 16:47:07 GMT
10,086
AnDromedary
4,377
Nov 10, 2016 16:30:09 GMT
November 2016
andromedary
|
Post by AnDromedary on Feb 9, 2023 22:35:49 GMT
Not a fan of comics. Have yet to find comics that extend an existing series in a good way without bringing down the general quality. And who the f is Andy Diggle? Is that a pseudonym? The tv show was great because Daniel and Ty were directly involved. What about these comics? I am worried they are extending the franchise only to make more money at this point. That would be a dam shame. This link to the kickstarter that hoku provided has some good background info. on Diggle and it looks like it has supervision and endorsement from the shows director/writers. www.kickstarter.com/projects/boom-studios/the-expanse-dragon-tooth-reveals-the-missing-yearsThat said I am also not a fan of expansions (see what I did there ) that extend out the original media platform. Think books expanding games, comics expanding games and TV shows expanding games. Whilst some can be good and informative it's comics for me that just do not have the capacity to provide in depth character and story expansion and the AC franchise burned me big time with comics. I think it is lazy and expensive for the quality and quantity you get. At least with books/novels expanding games the cost is usually worth the volume of story and character depth for the price but I am still not a fan. If you make a game make DLC to expand your story and obviously that is harder with a show that has been canned but The Expanse have a history of Novellas and could easily have used that medium. Well, to me it's all a question of quality. For example, I liked the first 3 Mass Effect novels, written by Drew Karpyshyn because their writing quality was at least on par with the that of the games. Hated most of the comics that I read and the fourth book (obviously) because they just felt quite trashy. That is the problem and I am afraid the same may happen ehre.
As for that kickstarter page, it all seems a bit vague and weird to me. What does "under the creative guidance of James S. A. Corey" even mean? And if this is meant for fans, why use their pen name and not the real names of the authors?
Ah anyway, we'll have to wait and see. maybe it'll be great, who knows but until then, I'll remain quite skeptical.
|
|
hoku
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 237 Likes: 428
inherit
11769
0
428
hoku
237
Dec 28, 2020 12:22:50 GMT
December 2020
hoku
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by hoku on Feb 17, 2023 20:47:04 GMT
|
|
inherit
Supra et Ultra
3406
0
Member is Online
41,569
dazk
14,799
February 2017
dazk
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
DazK1805
|
Post by dazk on Feb 17, 2023 22:39:35 GMT
Looks good, I love Drummer.
|
|
inherit
331
0
Apr 25, 2024 23:48:38 GMT
5,916
q5tyhj
I am Ahab
2,030
August 2016
q5tyhj
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
q5tyhj
|
Post by q5tyhj on Feb 18, 2023 1:23:37 GMT
Not a fan of comics. Have yet to find comics that extend an existing series in a good way without bringing down the general quality. And who the f is Andy Diggle? Is that a pseudonym? The tv show was great because Daniel and Ty were directly involved. What about these comics? I am worried they are extending the franchise only to make more money at this point. That would be a dam shame. I mean, The Watchman graphic novel was pretty sweet. Same for The Fountain. But I have no desire for an Expanse comic/graphic novel- we already have the real novels, if they're going to tell the last segment of the story (i.e. everything that happens after the point in the story where the Prime TV series ended), it should really be as a show or movie. I honestly don't understand why finishing the Expanse story on visual media (TV or film) isn't just a no-brainer: the show was really popular, wasn't it? Am I wrong it assuming it was at least financially viable, if not financially lucrative, as well? So what's the holdup? Just do it already. There's gotta be someone willing to put down the money to finish off one of the more popular and enjoyable TV series in recent memory.
|
|
inherit
331
0
Apr 25, 2024 23:48:38 GMT
5,916
q5tyhj
I am Ahab
2,030
August 2016
q5tyhj
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
q5tyhj
|
Post by q5tyhj on Feb 18, 2023 1:33:30 GMT
Looks good, I love Drummer. hate to be that guy, but this is an extremely thirst-inducing gif... Cara Gee, omfg...
|
|
inherit
Supra et Ultra
3406
0
Member is Online
41,569
dazk
14,799
February 2017
dazk
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
DazK1805
|
Post by dazk on Feb 18, 2023 1:35:33 GMT
Looks good, I love Drummer. hate to be that guy, but this is an extremely thirst-inducing gif... Cara Gee, omfg...
|
|
hoku
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 237 Likes: 428
inherit
11769
0
428
hoku
237
Dec 28, 2020 12:22:50 GMT
December 2020
hoku
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by hoku on Feb 18, 2023 15:10:10 GMT
I honestly don't understand why finishing the Expanse story on visual media (TV or film) isn't just a no-brainer: the show was really popular, wasn't it? Am I wrong it assuming it was at least financially viable, if not financially lucrative, as well? So what's the holdup? Just do it already. There's gotta be someone willing to put down the money to finish off one of the more popular and enjoyable TV series in recent memory.
I've seen talk on r/theExpanse and elsewhere that Alcon Entertainment (the primary company behind the Expanse) had to concede some sort of rights to Amazon in exchange for their 4-6 season deal. Apparently that includes - hopefully temporary - exclusive rights for what I guess is live action, streaming, BluRays and such things.
I'm guessing Alcon is waiting till that exclusivity window closes before potentially doing more in those areas.
They "IP" certainly isn't on ice or dead and is doing rather well. Since the TV series 6 ended about a year ago they have announced:
a video game game (prequel)
a comic book series (TV/Books 1-6 sequel slash book 7-9 prequel) from a highly successful if not record breaking kickstarter action figures "Ty and That guy" podcast that is ongoing.
--
I'm probably in the minority, but I loved the "tease and open end" which they've ended with after season 6 (knowing the broad strokes of what's gonna happen in books 7-9). I'm totally OK if there aren't any further live action adaptions of books 7-9, but I'm certainly not opposed to it. What makes me most exited is the branching out (see list above)
If I could wish I'd want them to release:
Clinton Shorter's season 5 and 6 soundtracks a complete 4K UHD BluRay set a big video game series (covering everything) akin to Mass Effect.
|
|
inherit
Supra et Ultra
3406
0
Member is Online
41,569
dazk
14,799
February 2017
dazk
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
DazK1805
|
Post by dazk on Feb 18, 2023 22:07:52 GMT
I honestly don't understand why finishing the Expanse story on visual media (TV or film) isn't just a no-brainer: the show was really popular, wasn't it? Am I wrong it assuming it was at least financially viable, if not financially lucrative, as well? So what's the holdup? Just do it already. There's gotta be someone willing to put down the money to finish off one of the more popular and enjoyable TV series in recent memory.
I've seen talk on r/theExpanse and elsewhere that Alcon Entertainment (the primary company behind the Expanse) had to concede some sort of rights to Amazon in exchange for their 4-6 season deal. Apparently that includes - hopefully temporary - exclusive rights for what I guess is live action, streaming, BluRays and such things.
I'm guessing Alcon is waiting till that exclusivity window closes before potentially doing more in those areas.
They "IP" certainly isn't on ice or dead and is doing rather well. Since the TV series 6 ended about a year ago they have announced:
a video game game (prequel)
a comic book series (TV/Books 1-6 sequel slash book 7-9 prequel) from a highly successful if not record breaking kickstarter action figures "Ty and That guy" podcast that is ongoing.
--
I'm probably in the minority, but I loved the "tease and open end" which they've ended with after season 6 (knowing the broad strokes of what's gonna happen in books 7-9). I'm totally OK if there aren't any further live action adaptions of books 7-9, but I'm certainly not opposed to it. What makes me most exited is the branching out (see list above)
If I could wish I'd want them to release:
Clinton Shorter's season 5 and 6 soundtracks a complete 4K UHD BluRay set a big video game series (covering everything) akin to Mass Effect.
Thanks for your post hoku I keep forgetting about the podcast, I watched it a lot after season 6 but it just fell off my radar.
|
|
inherit
331
0
Apr 25, 2024 23:48:38 GMT
5,916
q5tyhj
I am Ahab
2,030
August 2016
q5tyhj
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
q5tyhj
|
Post by q5tyhj on Feb 19, 2023 0:19:31 GMT
hate to be that guy, but this is an extremely thirst-inducing gif... Cara Gee, omfg... Well played, sir
|
|
hoku
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 237 Likes: 428
inherit
11769
0
428
hoku
237
Dec 28, 2020 12:22:50 GMT
December 2020
hoku
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by hoku on Mar 24, 2023 0:54:24 GMT
The Expanse: A Telltale Series Developer Presentation - Future Games Show Spring Showcase 2023
|
|
inherit
Supra et Ultra
3406
0
Member is Online
41,569
dazk
14,799
February 2017
dazk
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
DazK1805
|
Post by dazk on Mar 24, 2023 1:10:07 GMT
The Expanse: A Telltale Series Developer Presentation - Future Games Show Spring Showcase 2023 Looks good, not quite sure they have nailed Drummer's facial animation though but it still seems like they are working on the game since it's "Pre-Alpha".
|
|
hoku
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 237 Likes: 428
inherit
11769
0
428
hoku
237
Dec 28, 2020 12:22:50 GMT
December 2020
hoku
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by hoku on Mar 24, 2023 10:19:09 GMT
I'm not too fond of the overall "modern animated cartoony" design of the characters shown so far either - pre-alpha or not. This kinda seems to be the telltale studios art style and I don't expect it to change much until the final version.
Don't mind the overall world/level designs and looks though. Personally I just prefer a more "video-gamey" look for the characters rather than this "modern animated cartoony" (think 2010 Star Wars Clone Wars and similiar).
Still looking forward to the game very much, love that Cara Gee provides Drummer's voice and Alcon and JA Corey (the Expanse IP holder and creators) are actually involved and not just "lending" the IP.
|
|
hoku
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 237 Likes: 428
inherit
11769
0
428
hoku
237
Dec 28, 2020 12:22:50 GMT
December 2020
hoku
Mass Effect Trilogy, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by hoku on May 19, 2023 14:49:22 GMT
the Expanse: a telltale series - Episode 1 launches July 27th- pre-orders start June 1st, 2023
- Episodes 2 -> 5 release every two weeks after the first one drops on July 27th.
- Standard Edition $40
- Deluxe Edition $45 (will receive future DLC - no details yet)
- PC (only on Epic Games Store for now)
- PlayStation 5 and PlayStation 4
- Xbox Series X|S and Xbox One
|
|