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Post by theflyingzamboni on Feb 5, 2017 16:51:24 GMT
Ian S. Frazier @tibermoon 1mIn SP, there is a way to access more than 3 abilities while in the field. Will explain how it works later. That's a really good news. I want to believe that means more active abilities, but does it? He says "in the field," not "in combat." This could just be about swapping abilities and profiles outside of combat, which we already know.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 5, 2017 17:06:11 GMT
That's a really good news. I want to believe that means more active abilities, but does it? He says "in the field," not "in combat." This could just be about swapping abilities and profiles outside of combat, which we already know. That was already shown though, that you can change loadout in the pause screen. He wouldn't say that they'll talk about it later since they already shown it. Also, he replied to a tweet where he was asked about more then three slots since it'd suck for caster classes, so I think he meant during combat.
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Post by bercon on Feb 5, 2017 17:14:34 GMT
They've very briefly shown it, but they haven't talked it in detail at all. It's entirely possible you are locked into 3 during combat and can only switch between fights based on everything they've shown and said so far.
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Post by bshep on Feb 5, 2017 18:16:37 GMT
I want to believe that means more active abilities, but does it? He says "in the field," not "in combat." This could just be about swapping abilities and profiles outside of combat, which we already know. That was already shown though, that you can change loadout in the pause screen. He wouldn't say that they'll talk about it later since they already shown it. Also, he replied to a tweet where he was asked about more then three slots since it'd suck for caster classes, so I think he meant during combat. Indeed.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 5, 2017 18:26:18 GMT
They've very briefly shown it, but they haven't talked it in detail at all. It's entirely possible you are locked into 3 during combat and can only switch between fights based on everything they've shown and said so far. Again, the question was about having more abilities to use on the field without going back in the menu, since it's bad for caster classes. Ian replied directly to that, so he meant that there are more then three to use at the same time, regardless of the method and the number. It doesn't matter that they just shown it and didn't talk about it. Hen doesn't want to talk it yet because they have plan to reveal it. It won't be a 'secret' if it refers to the switch in the menu because they shown it, it's not something they didn't reveal yet.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 5, 2017 18:27:06 GMT
No it does not. Being interested in the game is no excuse to all the complain here, and trying to imply that they are using "misleading or inaccurate footage" is just another way of jumping the gun because again we don't have all the facts about how the system works or that Bioware is lying about it. Sure i don't know how the system will really function (i also would like more than 3 powers) but i will reserve judgement until Bioware explains how it works, not before. What else would you call gameplay footage that shows a UI with only 3 abilities (and only 3 slots) and a player only using 3 abilities at any one time? Assuming we accept that this isn't really the case, this footage IS misleading. (although for the life of me I can't understand why they would obfuscate something like this) The statement that this is not accurate is not reflected in the gameplay that was shown, why didn't they show something that *does* reflect actual gameplay, isn't that the whole point?... You don't have to like complaints (sorry if it interrupts your hype), but seeing as I don't have any "faith" in BW at this point, I'd stick to reacting to what I can actually see. By all means, I hope I'm wrong. only issue is you are also cherry picking what you are seeing from the vids to set up a false impression. Each one of the profiles seem to have their own unique abilities. During combat in the CES video we saw the down d pad flash. (As has been noted by others ) and during the original gameplay of the weapon wheel bits of it were xed out. We don't know what any of this means. Only that we don't have all the answers.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 5, 2017 18:47:57 GMT
only issue is you are also cherry picking what you are seeing from the vids to set up a false impression. Each one of the profiles seem to have their own unique abilities. During combat in the CES video we saw the down d pad flash. (As has been noted by others ) and during the original gameplay of the weapon wheel bits of it were xed out. We don't know what any of this means. Only that we don't have all the answers. So you are assuming that they intentionally hidden a function of gameplay to create an impression that gameplay is more restricted than it actually is? I don't buy that. That would be against their interests. By all means, I hope I'm wrong and we have access to the same 6-7 abilities we had in ME3, but I doubt it. I'll certainly be very happy to be proven wrong, it would mean that I will probably like gameplay much more. no I'm assuming they are going to show it off when they are ready to explain it.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 5, 2017 19:02:11 GMT
no I'm assuming they are going to show it off when they are ready to explain it. Not very logical, showing gameplay that all but confirms one thing only to "explain it" later. I'm certainly waiting to see what they "reveal", but I'm not holding my breath. Considering the answer of the Dev on this thread, I doubt that we'll see the same number of abilities as ME3, as they seem to want to make SP more like MP. neither venue we have seen gameplay of was really the proper place to show off complex and new gameplay features.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 5, 2017 19:12:31 GMT
no I'm assuming they are going to show it off when they are ready to explain it. Not very logical, showing gameplay that all but confirms one thing only to "explain it" later. I'm certainly waiting to see what they "reveal", but I'm not holding my breath. Considering the answer of the Dev on this thread, I doubt that we'll see the same number of abilities as ME3, as they seem to want to make SP more like MP. Well, the tweet mention the access thing works only on SP, so while they might've make it closer to MP, it doesn't have to be limited to three abilities. Expecially since I don't see it working in any other way then unlocking a new loadout slot in some way (since the button scheme on console is full), they can add three more powers. I do agree to be cautious, but even what they said here made me thing they had something to add more powers. As for the reason why they didn't show it yet, I guess they might've been working on the system/the number of active powers available and weren't ready to say anything until they finalized/cleared the system from problems/bugs.
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Post by SKAR on Feb 5, 2017 23:50:10 GMT
In the event that it is true, very disappointing.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 6:48:59 GMT
Fabrice Condominas @faburisu The ability to switch profiles more dynamically is, quite literally, a game changer for the toughest combats. It seems the way to access more powers is by switching profiles, in the middle of battle.
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Post by longshadow on Feb 10, 2017 8:46:39 GMT
Since the main difference between sp and mp is the presence of our squadmates I'm assuming that the extra power(s) might be a way to direct our squadies to attack. In all the gameplay videos, we saw that the boxes next to our squadmates avatars are greyed out on purpose. It seems that this is an aspect of the gameplay that BW doesn't want to show us yet, not until their lengthy gameplay presentation video. We do know from the leaked footage that these boxes are showing a power. We don't know if it's the "primary" power of each squadmate or the power they're using that exact moment. I'm guessing it's their "primary" power. There was only one time in the official trailers where these boxes were showing something but it wasn't a power, it was that "target" thing... ...and we don't know what that is yet.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 12:19:11 GMT
Except they just tweeted about using (dynamically) profiles is determinant/very useful in tough battles, which is a big hint on being able to use profiles without going in the menu screen. Not to mention Ian's tweet about using more then 3 is a direct response to a tweet about caster classes. Squadmates aren't relevant to that. Beside, they already said we can only order squadmates to use powers in general, not a particular one.
I understand being cautious or pessimistic, but all recent tweets point to another direction.
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Post by ssanyesz on Feb 10, 2017 13:52:28 GMT
Fabrice Condominas @faburisu The ability to switch profiles more dynamically is, quite literally, a game changer for the toughest combats. It seems the way to access more powers is by switching profiles, in the middle of battle. I don't have anything against profile switching, but if i want or like to play as an engineer, then i won't be switching profiles because i want my bonuses for turret, remnant vi and tech skills, but those already took 2 slots out of 3 and let's add Overload to the list to fill up the slots, but if i want Incinerate or Cryo Blast, then i have to abandon the those tech skills by choosing an another profile and the bonuses too, now that doesn't sound that good at all. But i can understand that chosing Infiltrator profile to snipe enemies far away, then switching to Soldier profile to deal with the rest close quarters makes sense. Maybe it will be good for weapon specialized classes/profiles, but not so much for "casters", like Engineer, Adept and Sentinel.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 13:57:38 GMT
It seems the way to access more powers is by switching profiles, in the middle of battle. I don't have anything against profile switching, but if i want or like to play as an engineer, then i won't be switching profiles because i want my bonuses for turret, remnant vi and tech skills, but those already took 2 slots out of 3 and let's add Overload to the list to fill up the slots, but if i want Incinerate or Cryo Blast, then i have to abandon the those tech skills by choosing an another profile and the bonuses too, now that doesn't sound that good at all. But i can understand that chosing Infiltrator profile snipe enemies far away, then switching to Soldier profile to deal with them close quarters makes sense. But not so much for "casters". Why? You can create different caster profiles.
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Post by longshadow on Feb 10, 2017 14:01:34 GMT
Except they just tweeted about using (dynamically) profiles is determinant/very useful in tough battles, which is a big hint on being able to use profiles without going in the menu screen. Not to mention Ian's tweet about using more then 3 is a direct response to a tweet about caster classes. Squadmates aren't relevant to that. Beside, they already said we can only order squadmates to use powers in general, not a particular one. I understand being cautious or pessimistic, but all recent tweets point to another direction. I think that the profile and the powers (skills) you choose to have in a current loadout are two separate things. By changing to a different profile your skills loadout remains the same, at least this is what I think I saw in the CES trailer. I hope I'm wrong though, being able to change skills on the fly is something I would like to have.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 14:08:33 GMT
Except they just tweeted about using (dynamically) profiles is determinant/very useful in tough battles, which is a big hint on being able to use profiles without going in the menu screen. Not to mention Ian's tweet about using more then 3 is a direct response to a tweet about caster classes. Squadmates aren't relevant to that. Beside, they already said we can only order squadmates to use powers in general, not a particular one. I understand being cautious or pessimistic, but all recent tweets point to another direction. I think that the profile and the powers (skills) you choose to have in a current loadout are two separate things. By changing to a different profile your skills loadout remains the same, at least this is what I think I saw in the CES trailer. I hope I'm wrong though, being able to change skills on the fly is something I would like to have. I think those are separare things. What the CES keynote shows is just (possibly) a part on how the system works, based on their recent tweets. I don't think we can access that menu in battle (it'll make the operation too long as well), while what they said recently is about accessing more powers during combat. The last tweet about profiles kind of lean towards profile switching beside the menu. Either way, next week we're supposed to see the long gameplay video, apparently, so it might end this debate for good.
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Post by longshadow on Feb 10, 2017 14:25:17 GMT
So, you think that we can create custom profiles with any 3 skills that we like, store them in a slot and then switch to any of them (or alternate between 2 pre-selected ones) during battle with the push of a button?
Sounds optimistic but I really hope it's true.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 15:10:24 GMT
So, you think that we can create custom profiles with any 3 skills that we like, store them in a slot and then switch to any of them (or alternate between 2 pre-selected ones) during battle with the push of a button? Sounds optimistic but I really hope it's true. I doubt it. The "big reveal" is more likely to be that you can switch profiles in the field, but not during combat, like in DA:I. The last tweet seems to actually hint towards switching in combat. You can't know beforehand if a fight is necessarily tough, so switching profiles in combat is useful to deal with those fights. Hence what the tweet hinted at.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 16:05:33 GMT
The last tweet seems to actually hint towards switching in combat. You can't know beforehand if a fight is necessarily tough, so switching profiles in combat is useful to deal with those fights. Hence what the tweet hinted at. The tweet says "in the field" what that means is anyone's guess. I guess we'll see. As I said previously, I'll be happy if my concerns about the restriction will be proven wrong. I know, and we did say it was vague, although it was a response to complaints about caster builds. There reason why I'm leaning towards combat is the last tweet : Fabrice Condominas @faburisu The ability to switch profiles more dynamically is, quite literally, a game changer for the toughest combats. It seems the way to access more powers is by switching profiles, in the middle of battle. It doesn't makes sense if he's talking before combat, because we don't necessarily know which combat will be tough. At least in my opinion.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2017 16:21:49 GMT
So, to summarize what we know (or believe) thus far:
- In the interest of "streamlining" or "simplification", instead of having all powers available from a single interface, we'll need to manage multiple swappable profiles / palettes. This would imply the need to memorize and develop muscle memory skills with multiple key mappings, e.g., that overload that was mapped to your triangle button a moment ago is now something else - oops! Oh, and you'll also need to find a way to headcanon / accept the idea that, although your combat abilities are limited to a select few at any moment in time, they can be instantaneously reprogrammed.
- From what we've seen thus far, there may not be a mini-map that displays relative enemy locations - so, unless you can somehow continuously twirl in circles to constantly watch their arrival (spawning) and movements while fighting, you probably won't really know where they (or your squadmates) are. You'll know combat is over when your squadmates come out from behind cover and stand there waiting for you to continue.
- You won't be able to manage squadmate power use, so any tech or biotic explosions may be mostly on you. You'll just have to cross your fingers and hope they use the right powers at the right times to support your tactical / gameplay choices. Will they also be restricted to swappable profiles - or have all of their abilities available? Don't know yet.
- I've seen no indication of any ability to pause and/or pause-to-aim during battle. Just intense, frenetic combat.
I'll welcome more information, but none of this sounds good to me.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 16:26:03 GMT
I know, and we did say it was vague, although it was a response to complaints about caster builds. There reason why I'm leaning towards combat is the last tweet : It doesn't makes sense if he's talking before combat, because we don't necessarily know which combat will be tough. At least in my opinion. I hope you are right. But I find it difficult to see how this goes with the admittance of a dev on this very thread that they indeed want to make the SP more like the MP. And in any case, if you can switch profiles in combat, the whole thing seems even more cumbersome and unnecessary to me, they could have just used a larger UI with more slots. Oh well. I guess we'll see. Yeah, but the system is more similar to before anyway, with the fact that you can't access power with radial menu/pause. But the very presence of weapon and ammo selection on pause shows they don't want to make it exactly the same. I guess the loadout of a profile being limited to 3 is the part where it gets similar, but the profile switch is peculiarity of SP. Keep in mind that Ian also said on this forum/thread that the system isnt too much different from the suggestion a user made of profiles being the same as weapon sets in DAO, where they gave you access to different abilities if you placed different ones. It shouldn't be long now until they shown it, since the long gameplay video should be up next week.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 16:30:25 GMT
So, to summarize what we know (or believe) thus far: - In the interest of "streamlining" or "simplification", instead of having all powers available from a single interface, we'll need to manage multiple swappable profiles / palettes. This would imply the need to memorize and develop muscle memory skills with multiple key mappings, e.g., that overload that was mapped to your triangle button a moment ago is now something else - oops! Oh, and you'll also need to find a way to headcanon / accept the idea that, although your combat abilities are limited to a select few at any moment in time, they can be instantaneously reprogrammed. - From what we've seen thus far, there may not be a mini-map that displays relative enemy locations - so, unless you can somehow continuously twirl in circles to constantly watch their arrival (spawning) and movements while fighting, you probably won't really know where they (or your squadmates) are. You'll know combat is over when your squadmates come out from behind cover and stand there waiting for you to continue. - You won't be able to manage squadmate power use, so any tech or biotic explosions may be mostly on you. You'll just have to cross your fingers and hope they use the right powers at the right times to support your tactical / gameplay choices. - I've seen no indication of any ability to pause and/or pause-to-aim during battle. Just intense, frenetic combat. I'll welcome more information, but none of this sounds good to me. You can pause and access the radial menu for weapon and ammo choice, they shown that in December. I think pause to aim is gone though. The swappable profiles isn't that different in how DA games work, where by pressing LT/RT or L2/R2 you access different abilities. You could map 6 in DAO-DA2 without accessing the radial menu with everyone and 8-9 in DAI. I think it'd have been better for PC to just have the various profiles's abilities hotkeyed to different keys, not the same three with a button switch.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2017 16:46:10 GMT
So, to summarize what we know (or believe) thus far: - In the interest of "streamlining" or "simplification", instead of having all powers available from a single interface, we'll need to manage multiple swappable profiles / palettes. This would imply the need to memorize and develop muscle memory skills with multiple key mappings, e.g., that overload that was mapped to your triangle button a moment ago is now something else - oops! Oh, and you'll also need to find a way to headcanon / accept the idea that, although your combat abilities are limited to a select few at any moment in time, they can be instantaneously reprogrammed. - From what we've seen thus far, there may not be a mini-map that displays relative enemy locations - so, unless you can somehow continuously twirl in circles to constantly watch their arrival (spawning) and movements while fighting, you probably won't really know where they (or your squadmates) are. You'll know combat is over when your squadmates come out from behind cover and stand there waiting for you to continue. - You won't be able to manage squadmate power use, so any tech or biotic explosions may be mostly on you. You'll just have to cross your fingers and hope they use the right powers at the right times to support your tactical / gameplay choices. - I've seen no indication of any ability to pause and/or pause-to-aim during battle. Just intense, frenetic combat. I'll welcome more information, but none of this sounds good to me. You can pause and access the radial menu for weapon and ammo choice, they shown that in December. I think pause to aim is gone though. The swappable profiles isn't that different in how DA games work, where by pressing LT/RT or L2/R2 you access different abilities. You could map 6 in DAO-DA2 without accessing the radial menu with everyone and 8-9 in DAI. I think it'd have been better for PC to just have the various profiles's abilities hotkeyed to different keys, not the same three with a button switch. The loss of pause-to-aim will make it extremely difficult to impossible for some players to continue with ME. Really, if they could allow camera movement and display a mini-map when you bring up the weapon/ammo change wheel, that functionality would still be available. I rarely use the hotkeys in DAO - always preferred the power wheel, especially since it also gave me access to follower skills. Even so, the same skills could be hotkeyed to the same keypresses for an entire playthrough. That doesn't appear to be the case with ever-changing loadouts due to profile switches.
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The Elder King
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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The Elder King
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theelderking
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 10, 2017 16:54:47 GMT
You can pause and access the radial menu for weapon and ammo choice, they shown that in December. I think pause to aim is gone though. The swappable profiles isn't that different in how DA games work, where by pressing LT/RT or L2/R2 you access different abilities. You could map 6 in DAO-DA2 without accessing the radial menu with everyone and 8-9 in DAI. I think it'd have been better for PC to just have the various profiles's abilities hotkeyed to different keys, not the same three with a button switch. The loss of pause-to-aim will make it extremely difficult to impossible for some players to continue with ME. Really, if they could allow camera movement and display a mini-map when you bring up the weapon/ammo change wheel, that functionality would still be available. I rarely use the hotkeys in DAO - always preferred the power wheel, especially since it also gave me access to follower skills. Even so, the same skills could be hotkeyed to the same keypresses for an entire playthrough. That doesn't appear to be the case with ever-changing loadouts due to profile switches. I meant on console. There are three buttons where you can use powers, and an additional one (two in DAI) 'set' pops out when you press another button. Without the latter you're limited to three powers in real time. The same, I think, will happen in Andromeda, only with profiles.
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