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Post by witchcocktor on Feb 5, 2017 15:16:08 GMT
For what it's worth, while I will be disappointed if M/M romances get shafted, I think you are overestimating how concerned they are over sales losses over this. I really doubt that a lack of M/M nudity equality is going to make much of an impact in the sales department, especially if EA thinks they can hit 3mil in a week. This isn't just because we're gay/bi (Etc), it also because the people you see on this board are a tiny subsection of their target market, many and perhaps most of whom are not fans enough to be spending time on here to know the chances of being shafted. While I think they are definitely avoiding talking about it because of backlash, it's more for the sake of putting off dealing with a load of angry fans on twitter. Sales won't probably suffer, but there is other things to consider. Reputation and Bioware fandom for example. People wouldn't be happy about that for sure. Honestly? I don't think the lack of good MLM content is going to do anything for BW's reputation. Now, if there was a lack of content for straight women, shit would hit the fan. Face it, MLM are the least attractive group to make content for.
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Post by Panda on Feb 5, 2017 15:34:38 GMT
Sales won't probably suffer, but there is other things to consider. Reputation and Bioware fandom for example. People wouldn't be happy about that for sure. Honestly? I don't think the lack of good MLM content is going to do anything for BW's reputation. Now, if there was a lack of content for straight women, shit would hit the fan. Face it, MLM are the least attractive group to make content for. I don't think so, since it's not just gay players who enjoys m/m content and then lot of people want or more like already expects representation and LGBT+ friendliness from Bioware just in general. Dragon Age Inquisition won GLAAD award for LGBT+ characters after all so devs should be well aware what people are expecting.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2017 15:43:32 GMT
Honestly? I don't think the lack of good MLM content is going to do anything for BW's reputation. Now, if there was a lack of content for straight women, shit would hit the fan. Face it, MLM are the least attractive group to make content for. I don't think so, since it's not just gay players who enjoys m/m content and then lot of people want or more like already expects representation and LGBT+ friendliness from Bioware just in general. Dragon Age Inquisition won GLAAD award for LGBT+ characters after all so devs should be well aware what people are expecting. Exactly, I'm female and I prefer m/m and I bet there are other females (and some straight males who like to play a different role) who enjoy this, too.
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Post by davkar on Feb 5, 2017 16:08:19 GMT
Sales won't probably suffer, but there is other things to consider. Reputation and Bioware fandom for example. People wouldn't be happy about that for sure. Honestly? I don't think the lack of good MLM content is going to do anything for BW's reputation. Now, if there was a lack of content for straight women, shit would hit the fan. Face it, MLM are the least attractive group to make content for. Agreed, the rainbow ending of ME3 really 'hurt' their reputation and yet MEA is one of the most anticipated game of the year. The romances won't have any substantial effect on the game's reception. Even the straight options are 'bad', I mean look at all the fiddle-faddle about Cora's hair and PB (I still like them before anyone tries to suggest otherwise), but those people who complain about them will buy it regardless. Ultimately this is a space adventure action-rpg, not a dating sim. There are more important matters, in terms of reaching a critical and financial success. The open world element, multiplayer, story, optimization, etc.
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Post by Tittus on Feb 6, 2017 11:53:45 GMT
I just hope that Cora is avaliable as LI for Sara Ryder. I'm tired of all the badass women of Bioware being only for the male protagonists. Morrigan, Cassandra, Ashley, Miranda (There was Isabela, but I don't know if she counts when everyone was bi). For just once, I wanted a sexy woman for my female protagonist without having to resort to mods. Also, I love Sera from DAI and she's my canon romance for the game. I'm also sure that I'll enjoy Peebee very much, but, I don't want to feel that she's my only option. And no, Vetra isn't an option to me. Turians are a big no. If she at least was a drell with lips to kiss...
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Post by PhatePhoenix on Feb 6, 2017 13:26:16 GMT
Anyone else still have their fingers crossed for a LI-information blow-out on the fourteenth? Maybe not everybody, but, a few?
(Specifically the non-straight and/or asexual ones would be magical.)
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Post by Mihura on Feb 6, 2017 14:14:57 GMT
Anyone else still have their fingers crossed for a LI-information blow-out on the fourteenth? Maybe not everybody, but, a few? ( Specifically the non-straight and/or asexual ones would be magical.) I really like that but with the recent sentiment about being quiet about the LIs, I highly doubt it.
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Post by PhatePhoenix on Feb 6, 2017 14:31:08 GMT
Anyone else still have their fingers crossed for a LI-information blow-out on the fourteenth? Maybe not everybody, but, a few? ( Specifically the non-straight and/or asexual ones would be magical.) I really like that but with the recent sentiment about being quiet about the LIs, I highly doubt it. Let me dream! It could be my early birthday present.
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Post by Mihura on Feb 6, 2017 14:33:34 GMT
I really like that but with the recent sentiment about being quiet about the LIs, I highly doubt it. Let me dream! It could be my early birthday present. Or maybe they will reveal all the straight LIs or something. Ah! I would laugh and cry at the same time.
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Post by PhatePhoenix on Feb 6, 2017 14:38:00 GMT
Let me dream! It could be my early birthday present. Or maybe they will reveal all the straight LIs or something. Ah! I would laugh and cry at the same time. And another finger of the monkey's paw curls closed.[ HIGH-PITCHING SCREAMING IN THE DISTANCE]
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Feb 6, 2017 14:57:17 GMT
I really like that but with the recent sentiment about being quiet about the LIs, I highly doubt it. Let me dream! It could be my early birthday present. Well, it does seem like that sentiment is not universally shared among the Bioware staff considering some, particularly Mike Gamble, has answered that on multiple occasions now.
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Post by Ceoldoren on Feb 6, 2017 15:02:25 GMT
I just hope that Cora is avaliable as LI for Sara Ryder. I'm tired of all the badass women of Bioware being only for the male protagonists. Morrigan, Cassandra, Ashley, Miranda (There was Isabela, but I don't know if she counts when everyone was bi). For just once, I wanted a sexy woman for my female protagonist without having to resort to mods. Also, I love Sera from DAI and she's my canon romance for the game. I'm also sure that I'll enjoy Peebee very much, but, I don't want to feel that she's my only option. And no, Vetra isn't an option to me. Turians are a big no. If she at least was a drell with lips to kiss... I've said it before, I really wouldn't count on it. It doesn't look good from the leaks, and she seems to fit into the starting female squaddie LI template like Morrigan, Cassandra etc. If it makes you feel any better, you'll probably get two f/f romances just like I'll probably get two m/m romances. And we both probably won't get the human LI we want. (I'm quite certain Liam is straight. I prefer Jaal to him but I still wish he was bi.)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2017 15:07:14 GMT
Well, it does seem like that sentiment is not universally shared among the Bioware staff considering some, particularly Mike Gamble, has answered that on multiple occasions now. Yes, I am still hoping for something on Valentine's Day. I also think Ian is more inclined than most to answer, as are Tom and Fryda, but the consensus at the moment seems to remain tight-lipped. Despite both Cora and Peebee's confirmation At the very least confirm or allude to a non-straight and asexual romance, so everyone at least knows one character they can romance. At the moment a lot of straight players are getting angry at non-straight players for wanting to know characters they can romance. Its all very well and good for them to say that, given they pretty much know two characters they can romance
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Post by Tittus on Feb 6, 2017 15:52:12 GMT
I just hope that Cora is avaliable as LI for Sara Ryder. I'm tired of all the badass women of Bioware being only for the male protagonists. Morrigan, Cassandra, Ashley, Miranda (There was Isabela, but I don't know if she counts when everyone was bi). For just once, I wanted a sexy woman for my female protagonist without having to resort to mods. Also, I love Sera from DAI and she's my canon romance for the game. I'm also sure that I'll enjoy Peebee very much, but, I don't want to feel that she's my only option. And no, Vetra isn't an option to me. Turians are a big no. If she at least was a drell with lips to kiss... I've said it before, I really wouldn't count on it. It doesn't look good from the leaks, and she seems to fit into the starting female squaddie LI template like Morrigan, Cassandra etc. If it makes you feel any better, you'll probably get two f/f romances just like I'll probably get two m/m romances. And we both probably won't get the human LI we want. (I'm quite certain Liam is straight. I prefer Jaal to him but I still wish he was bi.) Yeah I know that. The chances of having two bi females in the squad is very low. If Vetra is indeed lesbian or bi, then I give up completely. Well, but let's see. Only female Shepard had a chance with Garrus. So maybe they invert it this time?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2017 15:56:12 GMT
I've said it before, I really wouldn't count on it. It doesn't look good from the leaks, and she seems to fit into the starting female squaddie LI template like Morrigan, Cassandra etc. If it makes you feel any better, you'll probably get two f/f romances just like I'll probably get two m/m romances. And we both probably won't get the human LI we want. (I'm quite certain Liam is straight. I prefer Jaal to him but I still wish he was bi.) Yeah I know that. The chances of having two bi females in the squad is very low. If Vetra is indeed lesbian or bi, then I give up completely. Well, but let's see. Only female Shepard had a chance with Garrus. So maybe they invert it this time? I could see Vetra being bi simply because of the male demand to romance Garrus that never came to fruition.
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Post by Ceoldoren on Feb 6, 2017 15:59:36 GMT
I've said it before, I really wouldn't count on it. It doesn't look good from the leaks, and she seems to fit into the starting female squaddie LI template like Morrigan, Cassandra etc. If it makes you feel any better, you'll probably get two f/f romances just like I'll probably get two m/m romances. And we both probably won't get the human LI we want. (I'm quite certain Liam is straight. I prefer Jaal to him but I still wish he was bi.) Yeah I know that. The chances of having two bi females in the squad is very low. If Vetra is indeed lesbian or bi, then I give up completely. Well, but let's see. Only female Shepard had a chance with Garrus. So maybe they invert it this time? I honestly don't know how credible those Bi Vetra claims are. I don't know who actually came up with that leak. Bi option on the squad is Peebee. And we probably have a lesbian crewmember. Most are speculating Dr.Lexi but that's another Asari and two asari for your f/f options seems kinda shitty so I don't know. The only truly credible leak source is DaveLiam. And his friend only saw the two Peebee scenes and the one m/m scene. The rest you should take with a grain of salt. (Which sucks, because I really really want to believe the Jaal leak.)
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Post by Ianamus on Feb 6, 2017 19:03:15 GMT
Honestly? I don't think the lack of good MLM content is going to do anything for BW's reputation. Now, if there was a lack of content for straight women, shit would hit the fan. Face it, MLM are the least attractive group to make content for. Agreed, the rainbow ending of ME3 really 'hurt' their reputation and yet MEA is one of the most anticipated game of the year. The romances won't have any substantial effect on the game's reception. Even the straight options are 'bad', I mean look at all the fiddle-faddle about Cora's hair and PB (I still like them before anyone tries to suggest otherwise), but those people who complain about them will buy it regardless. Ultimately this is a space adventure action-rpg, not a dating sim. There are more important matters, in terms of reaching a critical and financial success. The open world element, multiplayer, story, optimization, etc. It's interesting, because after seeing the general responses to Mass Effect Andromeda news- both here, on other sites and in real life, there does seem a an almost ubiquitous cloud of skepticism. I get the impression that the ME3 endings had more of a lasting impact of sentiment towards the series than I ever expected. I even spoke to people at work whose only knowledge of the series was that it had an infamously bad ending.
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Post by Felya87 on Feb 6, 2017 20:05:32 GMT
Agreed, the rainbow ending of ME3 really 'hurt' their reputation and yet MEA is one of the most anticipated game of the year. The romances won't have any substantial effect on the game's reception. Even the straight options are 'bad', I mean look at all the fiddle-faddle about Cora's hair and PB (I still like them before anyone tries to suggest otherwise), but those people who complain about them will buy it regardless. Ultimately this is a space adventure action-rpg, not a dating sim. There are more important matters, in terms of reaching a critical and financial success. The open world element, multiplayer, story, optimization, etc. It's interesting, because after seeing the general responses to Mass Effect Andromeda news- both here, on other sites and in real life, there does seem a an almost ubiquitous cloud of skepticism. I get the impression that the ME3 endings had more of a lasting impact of sentiment towards the series than I ever expected. I even spoke to people at work whose only knowledge of the series was that it had an infamously bad ending. I am one of those who are wary thanks to the ME3 endings. I have many friends who are just like me. We all felt burned, and there is a say that translated in english is something like that: once burned by the hot water, one is wary of the cold water too. But if before some of my friends were more optimistic, the lack of informations had made them very skeptical. It doesn't feel really reassuring not have even a decent gameplay of more than five minutes at less than two months from the launch of the game. I think those two things, a lack of informations and gameplay, and the ghost of the ME3 endings are helping the skepticism clouds.
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Post by davkar on Feb 7, 2017 8:08:02 GMT
It's interesting, because after seeing the general responses to Mass Effect Andromeda news- both here, on other sites and in real life, there does seem a an almost ubiquitous cloud of skepticism. I get the impression that the ME3 endings had more of a lasting impact of sentiment towards the series than I ever expected. I even spoke to people at work whose only knowledge of the series was that it had an infamously bad ending. I am one of those who are wary thanks to the ME3 endings. I have many friends who are just like me. We all felt burned, and there is a say that translated in english is something like that: once burned by the hot water, one is wary of the cold water too. But if before some of my friends were more optimistic, the lack of informations had made them very skeptical. It doesn't feel really reassuring not have even a decent gameplay of more than five minutes at less than two months from the launch of the game. I think those two things, a lack of informations and gameplay, and the ghost of the ME3 endings are helping the skepticism clouds. The ME3 ending was (still is) one of my worst gaming experiences. It was the vanilla ending, I had the Tali romance so it was an extra punch. Tableflipping, tears, cursing, rage, hate, I even did my best Charlton Heston impression. I felt betrayed and depressed for days. The EC improved it a bit, but at that point I didn't really care. If originally they cut in the red ending (with it destroying only the squids) after the arms open, throw in a few DAO like epilogue slides I would have been happy. Or if they insist on using starbrat then pick a different, more credible figure. The child dying=instant drama felt forced. It was an obvious mind thing, so why not use a dead squadmate like Mordin, Legion or rather Kaidan/Ash since one of them is 100% dead while the rest could be alive/absent. You know, someone you really cared about. The unskippable dream sequences partially worked when they were about the lost ones whispering. Playing hide-and-seek with the little beep? Not so much. Anyway MEA is a new chapter. Nah, a new book! The first reveal trailer was okay. When they skipped every E3, -con I was getting a bit annoyed by the lack of information and footage, but once the trailers arrived they won me over trailer by trailer. VGA trailer - all right, tell me more. Nvidia 'demo' - really BW...? GE trailer - wooo, take my money! And the briefings, they are sooo good! At this point MEA feels like the ME1 atmosphere mixed with the ME2 characters and ME3 gameplay - so the 'perfect' ME game. The best part; even if it's a disappointment it wouldn't matter, this is just one game, it doesn't have the same level of emotional attachment like Shep and co had in the trilogy.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2017 13:12:42 GMT
Quoting Ceoldoren from Vetra thread Guess I should spoiler since this touches on the leaks. From what I've read from daveliam at this point it was only confirmed that scenes with Jaal, PeeBee, and a M/M mystery man was shown so far, the rest with Liam and cora was probably his speculation (unless he would like to reply and tell me that his leaks also included cora and liam). Like you said PeeBee being an asari it was a given that she'll be bi, but bear in mind that it's part of the lore for asari to be bi so I don't think she should necessarily take the bi female spot. Also, many females may not want to romance an Asari and having one as their only option for a squad romance would be kind lame for them so while it may be unlikely based on past mass effect female squadmates, I think Cora and Liam could definitely be bi just to give homosexual pcs a human romance option because not everyone wants to be stuck with an asari/just aliens (though I personally am looking forward to romancing PeeBee, and Cora in another playthrough, not sure if I'll play femRyder as I've never played a female shepard and just watched her romances on YouTube). But if Bioware does decide to not give f/f human squad/crew romance then that just leaves either vetra or a potential last squadmate. Of course there is always the possibility that bioware decided to make Vetra straight as well since the ladies got garrus in Mass Effect 2/3. On the crew member romances, I think you are right that we'll probably have only two and I'm thinking it's Dr. Lexi (another asari) and a M/M (Reyes supposedly) so this would mean that when it comes to crew members F/F would not have any options outside asari unless bioware created a third crew member that can be romanced. We don't have really any information on the romances that can happen outside the squad/crew so it's hard to say if they'll just be flings, but whether they are flings or not, they will likely not be of equal quality to the crew/squad romances.
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Post by Mihura on Feb 7, 2017 13:32:31 GMT
Quoting Ceoldoren from Vetra thread Guess I should spoiler since this touches on the leaks. From what I've read from daveliam at this point it was only confirmed that scenes with Jaal, PeeBee, and a M/M mystery man was shown so far, the rest with Liam and cora was probably his speculation (unless he would like to reply and tell me that his leaks also included cora and liam). Like you said PeeBee being an asari it was a given that she'll be bi, but bear in mind that it's part of the lore for asari to be bi so I don't think she should necessarily take the bi female spot. Also, many females may not want to romance an Asari and having one as their only option for a squad romance would be kind lame for them so while it may be unlikely based on past mass effect female squadmates, I think Cora and Liam could definitely be bi just to give homosexual pcs a human romance option because not everyone wants to be stuck with an asari/just aliens (though I personally am looking forward to romancing PeeBee, and Cora in another playthrough, not sure if I'll play femRyder as I've never played a female shepard and just watched her romances on YouTube). But if Bioware does decide to not give f/f human squad/crew romance then that just leaves either vetra or a potential last squadmate. Of course there is always the possibility that bioware decided to make Vetra straight as well since the ladies got garrus in Mass Effect 2/3. On the crew member romances, I think you are right that we'll probably have only two and I'm thinking it's Dr. Lexi (another asari) and a M/M (Reyes supposedly) so this would mean that when it comes to crew members F/F would not have any options outside asari unless bioware created a third crew member that can be romanced. We don't have really any information on the romances that can happen outside the squad/crew so it's hard to say if they'll just be flings, but whether they are flings or not, they will likely not be of equal quality to the crew/squad romances. If the f/f option is only Asaris, I am going to be very disappointed. At least I hope there is a human, that is like the bare minimal.
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Post by Felya87 on Feb 7, 2017 13:42:50 GMT
I am one of those who are wary thanks to the ME3 endings. I have many friends who are just like me. We all felt burned, and there is a say that translated in english is something like that: once burned by the hot water, one is wary of the cold water too. But if before some of my friends were more optimistic, the lack of informations had made them very skeptical. It doesn't feel really reassuring not have even a decent gameplay of more than five minutes at less than two months from the launch of the game. I think those two things, a lack of informations and gameplay, and the ghost of the ME3 endings are helping the skepticism clouds. The ME3 ending was (still is) one of my worst gaming experiences. It was the vanilla ending, I had the Tali romance so it was an extra punch. Tableflipping, tears, cursing, rage, hate, I even did my best Charlton Heston impression. I felt betrayed and depressed for days. The EC improved it a bit, but at that point I didn't really care. If originally they cut in the red ending (with it destroying only the squids) after the arms open, throw in a few DAO like epilogue slides I would have been happy. Or if they insist on using starbrat then pick a different, more credible figure. The child dying=instant drama felt forced. It was an obvious mind thing, so why not use a dead squadmate like Mordin, Legion or rather Kaidan/Ash since one of them is 100% dead while the rest could be alive/absent. You know, someone you really cared about. The unskippable dream sequences partially worked when they were about the lost ones whispering. Playing hide-and-seek with the little beep? Not so much. Anyway MEA is a new chapter. Nah, a new book! The first reveal trailer was okay. When they skipped every E3, -con I was getting a bit annoyed by the lack of information and footage, but once the trailers arrived they won me over trailer by trailer. VGA trailer - all right, tell me more. Nvidia 'demo' - really BW...? GE trailer - wooo, take my money! And the briefings, they are sooo good! At this point MEA feels like the ME1 atmosphere mixed with the ME2 characters and ME3 gameplay - so the 'perfect' ME game. The best part; even if it's a disappointment it wouldn't matter, this is just one game, it doesn't have the same level of emotional attachment like Shep and co had in the trilogy. I know, ok? I still can't finish the game. I defeat kay Lang, and than off the PS3. Is not worth my time play more. The first time I was too much shocked to believe what my eyes were seeing. I was watching the credits, waiting for the final video. Than the "buy the DLCs!" page. I was shocked. I felt robbed, and like I wasted so many hours playng the trilogy!!! I finisched the game a few days after my friends, and they told me it was bad. I was sure they were exagerating!!! Nope. It was even worse than what I feared. I don't think I have ever seen a worse ending ever. No recognition of choices throught the game. No chance to have a different destiny for my character. Complete nonsense in narrative, dialogues and everything. The child! I still don't get why my Shepard should care about him: ok, she may have some motherly instinct, but even that have a limit. I always found the dreams stupid waste of time, never given any attention, beside believing Shep was being indoctrinate. If the devs wanted to go with the "survival guilt", they missed completely the mark. The Virmine victime, as you said, would have made some sense. The nameless child no. Frankly I'm here on the forum and waiting for news from the game because is a new start, I want to hope BioWare have learned it lessons from ME3, but for now I have not seen anything that would make me spend full price for the game: we know basically nothing, and haven't seen much. I'm patiently waiting, but the more time pass, the more I believe I'm just wasting time.
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Post by Mir Aven on Feb 7, 2017 14:05:11 GMT
...Sometimes I think it would be the right idea to just scrap all the romance options and focus on the story and the character development/interactions... I wish. Having romances seemed like a fun thing at first. Now I have the impression that it overshadows everything else despite being optional.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 7, 2017 14:08:38 GMT
...Sometimes I think it would be the right idea to just scrap all the romance options and focus on the story and the character development/interactions... I wish. Having romances seemed like a fun thing at first. Now I have the impression that it overshadows everything else despite being optional. Kinda, the thing is that they haven't really given us anything substantial yet. There's only so many thoughts one can have about gameplay and there's too little to go on to really speculate extensively on the main story since we're going to a new galaxy and all. The squad/crew are the only things that can really be speculated on due to having some scraps of info on them.
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Post by Mir Aven on Feb 7, 2017 14:49:02 GMT
I wish. Having romances seemed like a fun thing at first. Now I have the impression that it overshadows everything else despite being optional. Kinda, the thing is that they haven't really given us anything substantial yet. There's only so many thoughts one can have about gameplay and there's too little to go on to really speculate extensively on the main story since we're going to a new galaxy and all. The squad/crew are the only things that can really be speculated on due to having some scraps of info on them. I agree that there isn't much to talk about right now. The issue is, well for me anyway, that most people are talking about romances now, they'll talk about it when the game comes out and then they'll keep talking about it while they wait for another game. Like it's the most important thing in the world and nothing else mattered. And it's not just the BSN, when I go to forums for other games I see threads asking if you can romance the characters in the game and when they find out that you can't they get angry. Like the fact that they can't get their waifu or husbando were insulting to them. I understand that people enjoy romances but it gets tiring. But I said enough, I don't want it to look like I'm whining and I don't want others to get thei pitchforks ready so I'll end it at this.
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