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Post by Sailears on Feb 15, 2017 12:48:14 GMT
Kit with Stasis, Pull and Throw.... Trash tier? When compared with say Reave/cluster grenade drell adept (which coincidentally many people spec out of pull) or Fury, or Human adept and you're up against two brutes, a bunch of ravagers, a couple of atlases, throw in some banshees or whatever, and yes... yes it would be trash to have stasis/pull/throw on one kit in me3mp. In any case I have played things like no cluster grenade drell adept and made them work using weapons for headshots on shielded mooks with simultaneous pull projectile to setup reave explosions on groups, and the amount of effort you have to go to when another drell adept can simply waltz in, reave and toss a couple of cluster grenades annihilating a spawn is ridiculous. I have also played asari adept without warp and again it falls well short of biotic explosion or DoT spam. Anyway I've said my piece about helping the game to cater to more control of enemies and the battlefield, setting things up for other teammates who can build for damage. If biotics end up being too similar to me3 then I'm probably going to spend most of my time on melee builds.
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Post by zorinho20 on Feb 15, 2017 13:47:43 GMT
Don't stand so close to me when I'm using you as soft cover. Excuse me? It was you who suggested to do it in the box! Ability of BSN to make innuendos of innocent things always amazed me
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Post by Pounce de León on Feb 15, 2017 14:06:50 GMT
Excuse me? It was you who suggested to do it in the box! Ability of BSN to make innuendos of innocent things always amazed me Honi soit, qui mal y pense. (I'm entirely innocent - it all just my shoddy Englische.)
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Post by crashsuit on Feb 15, 2017 16:24:14 GMT
Don't stand so close to me when I'm using you as soft cover. Excuse me? It was you who suggested to do it in the box! As if there's any other place to do it
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Post by Beerfish on Feb 15, 2017 16:39:11 GMT
I hope that in MEA, biotic explosions are less prevalent and biotic powers can be used in combination without setting off explosions. I kind of got bored with almost everything causing an explosion in me3. I would assume you either played with friends or with players that would change classes in the lobby? Pure pugging this is not an issue at all because in many cases it seems tech classes are chose over biotics. In fact it is a very rare occurrence in my gaming experience to have games filled with BE's and on top of that BioWare created whole enemies and classes to lessen BES. If anything to me the BE filled games are very under represented compared to the straight out use the biggest gun to kill all.
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Post by Sailears on Feb 15, 2017 17:13:24 GMT
I hope that in MEA, biotic explosions are less prevalent and biotic powers can be used in combination without setting off explosions. I kind of got bored with almost everything causing an explosion in me3. I would assume you either played with friends or with players that would change classes in the lobby? Pure pugging this is not an issue at all because in many cases it seems tech classes are chose over biotics. In fact it is a very rare occurrence in my gaming experience to have games filled with BE's and on top of that BioWare created whole enemies and classes to lessen BES. If anything to me the BE filled games are very under represented compared to the straight out use the biggest gun to kill all. I used to pug a lot when I used to play and usually changed classes accordingly depending on the team composition. My go to characters towards the end of my time playing were Asariguard, Krogan Shaman, Melee Quarian Female Engineer, N7 Shadow and Quarian Female Infiltrator. If more than two other pug players were biotic I'd usually take something like the Shaman or Asariguard - because I had become so bored of all the other adepts, even drell adept which used to be my favourite character. Shaman was the most fun krogan character, despite a dull set of powers, and Asariguard had the best of the visual control I enjoyed (at least you could see things ragdolled with lift grenades and charge, or use stasis to hold chokepoints and headshot). Edit: I should have added - yes I remember that gameplay had skewed so much towards pure weapon damage being more efficient than anything else. In any case in a biotic team it was the same monotonous explosions over and over. If at least the sound effects were more varied from say a Throw->Stasis explosion compared with a Throw->Warp explosion, it would have gone a long way to easing the monotony (I know the gameplay effect is different). Or at the very least make new combos like Warp partially debuffs the enemy armour allowing Stasis to work on it with reduced duration or something.
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Post by Beerfish on Feb 15, 2017 17:14:59 GMT
I would assume you either played with friends or with players that would change classes in the lobby? Pure pugging this is not an issue at all because in many cases it seems tech classes are chose over biotics. In fact it is a very rare occurrence in my gaming experience to have games filled with BE's and on top of that BioWare created whole enemies and classes to lessen BES. If anything to me the BE filled games are very under represented compared to the straight out use the biggest gun to kill all. I used to pug a lot when I used to play and usually changed classes accordingly depending on the team composition. My go to characters towards the end of my time playing were Asariguard, Krogan Shaman, Melee Quarian Female Engineer, N7 Shadow and Quarian Female Infiltrator. If more than two other pug players were biotic I'd usually take something like the Shaman or Asariguard - because I had become so bored of all the other adepts, even drell adept which used to be my favourite character. Shaman was the most fun krogan character, despite a dull set of powers, and Asariguard had the best of the visual control I enjoyed (at least you could see things ragdolled with lift grenades and charge, or use stasis to hold chokepoints and headshot). I agree about the assgaurd, that class with the right opponent can control the battle field more than most.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Feb 15, 2017 18:06:41 GMT
I kit with Stasis, Pull and Throw.... Can prime and detonate all defenses except armor.
This is why you have a gun.
This kit would control a battlefield well, and unless the Drell was played by an ace, this kit easily tops most scoreboards. It would be a fun kit to play.
What is your point again Sailears? I am definitely not getting it. At all.
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Post by Sailears on Feb 15, 2017 18:28:13 GMT
Of course it would be a fun kit to play and I'd like more of that kind of thing.
My point is the power system and shields/armour/health system in me3 does not allow for flexibility or creativity in use of crowd control powers beyond "shoot off their shields" for enemies with health - which are then laughably easy to control using something like Pull.
There is no grey area for power charging, debuff, combos and so on for gradual effectiveness of powers. For example if armour and health was condensed into a single hitpoint bar reflecting an effective mass value of the enemy unit (taking into account damping fields and so on), and then powers could be charged from an energy bar to have varying levels of effect against said enemy (ie from entirely ineffective to longer lockdown duration) with a corresponding cooldown penalty/recovery state or time, this would provide more interesting gameplay compared with the black/white system in me3mp. That's the short version.
As for the gun thing - me3mp was biased too much towards weapon play as it is.
Once again I'm not advocating being able to nemesis lift an entire enemy spawn with one button press like ME1, but there should be the scope for building up energy for more powerful and effective control skills - not simply primers and detonators.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 15, 2017 19:34:53 GMT
I am a biotic whiner, I want those nice looking, sweet, powerful blue explosions always. the more the better.
And while I do understand the underlying game mechanics being referenced here, and yes, a combo of biotic and tech explosions are the most powerful, I want more biotic explosions.
Sadly I almost never find a group which feels the same
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Post by Kenny Bania on Feb 15, 2017 19:57:02 GMT
I kit with Stasis, Pull and Throw.... Can prime and detonate all defenses except armor. This is why you have a gun. This kit would control a battlefield well, and unless the Drell was played by an ace, this kit easily tops most scoreboards. It would be a fun kit to play. What is your point again Sailears? I am definitely not getting it. At all. The ability to self detonate BEs on armor or prime to get the benefits of warp ammo would be missed.
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Feb 15, 2017 20:43:46 GMT
I love playing as the Justicar but i wish she had a something other than that damn stoopit bubble.
Biotic Focus, Annihilation Field, Dark Channel, Throw, whatever. Anything other than that damn stoopit bubble!
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Feb 15, 2017 21:26:20 GMT
I kit with Stasis, Pull and Throw.... Can prime and detonate all defenses except armor. This is why you have a gun. This kit would control a battlefield well, and unless the Drell was played by an ace, this kit easily tops most scoreboards. It would be a fun kit to play. What is your point again Sailears? I am definitely not getting it. At all. The ability to self detonate BEs on armor or prime to get the benefits of warp ammo would be missed. Use Incendiary or Disruptor or Cryo... Problem solved. I get your point, I even mentioned it in my post. However, there are other kits in ME3MP with similar limitations, and using ammo power changes the game significantly. I would laugh my ass off playing a kit with these powers. It would absolutely destroy Cerberus.
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Post by Sailears on Feb 15, 2017 21:41:38 GMT
I love playing as the Justicar but i wish she had a something other than that damn stoopit bubble. Biotic Focus, Annihilation Field, Dark Channel, Throw, whatever. Anything other than that damn stoopit bubble! If the biotic bubble actually blocked incoming projectiles it could have been interesting. But it looks like we're getting Biotic Aegis to do that job so that's one box ticked. Edit: For the record I think the bubble is a great power that synergises very well for biotic explosions with the justicar, as well as debuff and control of enemy flow allowing you to **** whole chokepoints. I should clarify when I say it is not as "interesting" as it could have been if it destroyed projectiles (and maybe once it takes a certain amount of damage it dissipates).
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Post by crashsuit on Feb 15, 2017 21:55:40 GMT
The bubble is great. It's a unique power that differentiates the kit, encourages unique strategies, and can be specced in significantly different ways.
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Post by Sailears on Feb 15, 2017 22:03:37 GMT
The ability to self detonate BEs on armor or prime to get the benefits of warp ammo would be missed. Use Incendiary or Disruptor or Cryo... Problem solved. I get your point, I even mentioned it in my post. However, there are other kits in ME3MP with similar limitations, and using ammo power changes the game significantly. I would laugh my ass off playing a kit with these powers. It would absolutely destroy Cerberus. To add to the point, even though it would wreck all the mooks and phantoms, you're still left with only shooting when it comes to an Atlas. In my opinion that is bad design to make powers either very powerful or totally ineffective beyond stagger. For example if pull lasted 9 seconds with a 2 second cooldown and one hit left a debuff that reduced the effective mass of an armoured target for those 9 seconds, a second hit doubled the intensity of the debuff, allowing a third hit to treat it as if it were health, disabling the target for the remaining 3 seconds. I don't like this method but it's just for illustration. Alternatively the power key could be held/charged up with each additional second ticking up intensity but reducing lockdown duration - if released after 3 seconds fires off a pull projectile that works on armour, but with 3x the cooldown and a third of the effect duration. Ideally there ought to be varying thresholds in the effective mass so not all "boss"/armoured units require the same power intensity to overcome their threshold in order to be affected. For example a ravager could require charging for 2 seconds, but a brute might need a more powerful cast and charging for 3 seconds to be affected. Stuff like that while perhaps not necessary or only situationally useful would for me add another layer of depth to the variety and skill in gameplay.
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Post by SalMasRac on Feb 15, 2017 22:57:42 GMT
I love playing as the Justicar but i wish she had a something other than that damn stoopit bubble. Biotic Focus, Annihilation Field, Dark Channel, Throw, whatever. Anything other than that damn stoopit bubble! Reported. So maybe allowing for a "combo" of sorts, like mentioned above, use Warp to allow Pull, Throw, or Statis to work on Armor with reduced effectiveness, while still being able to prime for detonations and Warp Ammo bonus, and of course self-detonate, would be a decent idea, and really not too difficult to implement. Maybe they've done something like this in Andromeda? That's a great question. We'll know more about that closer to release (tm).
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Post by Pearl on Feb 16, 2017 1:02:21 GMT
unless the Drell was played by an ace You rang?
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Feb 16, 2017 1:15:14 GMT
unless the Drell was played by an ace You rang? Most BSNers qualify by now.... Those that cannot Drell, I simply don't know what to say to you anymore 😯
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Post by The Biotic Trebuchet on Feb 16, 2017 1:52:01 GMT
1°. Warp 2°.Throw 3°.????? (#SpaceMagic) 4°.Boom 5°.Profit
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Post by Kenny Bania on Feb 16, 2017 2:53:04 GMT
The ability to self detonate BEs on armor or prime to get the benefits of warp ammo would be missed. Use Incendiary or Disruptor or Cryo... Problem solved. I get your point, I even mentioned it in my post. However, there are other kits in ME3MP with similar limitations, and using ammo power changes the game significantly. I would laugh my ass off playing a kit with these powers. It would absolutely destroy Cerberus. Or you could replace Pull with Warp and get the best of both worlds. I don't see why you need all 3 control powers. The AA is my favourite kit for a reason.
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Post by Cyberzombie on Feb 16, 2017 3:14:53 GMT
Or you could replace Pull with Warp and get the best of both worlds. I don't see why you need all 3 control powers. The AA is my favourite kit for a reason. because Biotic explosion spam and pure damage is boring
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Post by Kenny Bania on Feb 16, 2017 3:42:33 GMT
Or you could replace Pull with Warp and get the best of both worlds. I don't see why you need all 3 control powers. The AA is my favourite kit for a reason. because Biotic explosion spam and pure damage is boring In your opinion...
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Post by Cyberzombie on Feb 16, 2017 4:30:41 GMT
because Biotic explosion spam and pure damage is boring In your opinion... Technically it's someone else's opinion, I just thought it was an appropriate answer to your question.
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Post by zorinho20 on Feb 16, 2017 5:44:59 GMT
Press a button, something awesome has to happen.
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