stysiaq
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by stysiaq on Feb 27, 2017 10:52:03 GMT
Hey guys, I might be late to the party, but: Aren't they kind of breaking their own lore with those customizations, like "laser-shells" (what are they supposed to be?), beam-weapon conversion (for the assault-rifle!) and heat-seaking-plasma-guns (how would that work? Superheated plasma would normally fly in a straight line if fired from a gun, it's not a missile with a targeting computer on board!)? Just want to know what you guys think (I mean I am all for crazy weapons, but if they conflict with established lore then I kind of have a problem ) greetings LAX You are quite late to the party. BioWare was never hesitant to break their own lore in favor of more familiar game concepts (ammo) or more familiar visuals (ME3 space battle).
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Post by warbaby2 on Feb 27, 2017 11:05:22 GMT
Hey guys, I might be late to the party, but: Aren't they kind of breaking their own lore with those customizations, like "laser-shells" (what are they supposed to be?), beam-weapon conversion (for the assault-rifle!) and heat-seaking-plasma-guns (how would that work? Superheated plasma would normally fly in a straight line if fired from a gun, it's not a missile with a targeting computer on board!)? Just want to know what you guys think (I mean I am all for crazy weapons, but if they conflict with established lore then I kind of have a problem ) greetings LAX You are quite late to the party. BioWare was never hesitant to break their own lore in favor of more familiar game concepts (ammo) or more familiar visuals (ME3 space battle). You can theoreticise (is that even a word?) away many things... but generally speaking, I think BW just doesn't care. After what the did to the Qunari between DAO and DAI, I'll put nothing past them anymore... then again, if you fire your original writers, I guess there's nobody left to complain besides the fans, really.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Origin: Stysiaq
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Post by stysiaq on Feb 27, 2017 11:23:12 GMT
You are quite late to the party. BioWare was never hesitant to break their own lore in favor of more familiar game concepts (ammo) or more familiar visuals (ME3 space battle). You can theoreticise (is that even a word?) away many things... but generally speaking, I think BW just doesn't care. After what the did to the Qunari between DAO and DAI, I'll put nothing past them anymore... then again, if you fire your original writers, I guess there's nobody left to complain besides the fans, really. Well, as far as the Qunari go I think that general consensus is that their best iteration was the DA2 one. The DA:I changes were a huge mistake. The lack of consistency between different games is kind of sad, since I stopped caring about reading the lore. If it's fluid and always changing, why should I try to memorize the rules written in codex? It would be possibly a waste of time.
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Post by warbaby2 on Feb 27, 2017 11:43:11 GMT
You can theoreticise (is that even a word?) away many things... but generally speaking, I think BW just doesn't care. After what the did to the Qunari between DAO and DAI, I'll put nothing past them anymore... then again, if you fire your original writers, I guess there's nobody left to complain besides the fans, really. Well, as far as the Qunari go I think that general consensus is that their best iteration was the DA2 one. The DA:I changes were a huge mistake. The lack of consistency between different games is kind of sad, since I stopped caring about reading the lore. If it's fluid and always changing, why should I try to memorize the rules written in codex? It would be possibly a waste of time. Hah, I had the same reaction... didn't even bother with the second lore book after DAI. For me, most of what was introduced into DA2 isn't canon anyhow, and the rare occasion I run a pen and paper adventure in Thedas, I ignore it. Anywho, I hope nothing of that magnitude will be in MEA... I mean, as long as there aren't Reaper weapons popping up in the Helios cluster, we'll be fine, I guess.
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Post by laxian on Feb 27, 2017 12:12:28 GMT
Only thing that bothered me was the shotgun ejecting shells. When I asked a dev about it on Twitter, they said it was just an aesthetic change to make them feel more "shotgunny" but that they still use thermal clips. So that's sort of the lore completely broken there. Why the fuck would a shotgun in ME eject shell casings when they don't actually use shells as ammo? Where are those casings coming from? Does Ryder just ram a load of debris into his shotgun that flies out when he reloads his thermal clips so he looks cool? Well, the pistols seem to have a slide, too (why would a gun without shells containing chemical propellant need to be ejected via a slide? Why would such guns need to chamber a round like an RL handgun?) now... greetings LAX
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Post by kingjuly on Feb 27, 2017 14:25:16 GMT
Only thing that bothered me was the shotgun ejecting shells. When I asked a dev about it on Twitter, they said it was just an aesthetic change to make them feel more "shotgunny" but that they still use thermal clips. So that's sort of the lore completely broken there. Why the fuck would a shotgun in ME eject shell casings when they don't actually use shells as ammo? Where are those casings coming from? Does Ryder just ram a load of debris into his shotgun that flies out when he reloads his thermal clips so he looks cool? Well, the pistols seem to have a slide, too (why would a gun without shells containing chemical propellant need to be ejected via a slide? Why would such guns need to chamber a round like an RL handgun?) now... greetings LAX Possibly to expose the inner workings to allow heat to escape?
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Post by Iakus on Feb 27, 2017 14:35:40 GMT
Hey guys, I might be late to the party, but: Aren't they kind of breaking their own lore with those customizations, like "laser-shells" (what are they supposed to be?), beam-weapon conversion (for the assault-rifle!) and heat-seaking-plasma-guns (how would that work? Superheated plasma would normally fly in a straight line if fired from a gun, it's not a missile with a targeting computer on board!)? Just want to know what you guys think (I mean I am all for crazy weapons, but if they conflict with established lore then I kind of have a problem ) greetings LAX You are quite late to the party. BioWare was never hesitant to break their own lore in favor of more familiar game concepts (ammo) or more familiar visuals (ME3 space battle). WHich is terrible as it sacrifices the uniqueness of the setting and makes it just like every other bland, flavorless shooter out there.
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Post by maximusarael020 on Feb 27, 2017 15:02:15 GMT
I'm not sure what about any of this is lore-breaking. New galaxy with new technology. The Andromeda galaxy residents are not shackled to the technology of the Milky Way, so if they came up with heat-seeking plasma rifles or beam weapons, that's understandable because they have been able to continue advancing their technology without a hard reset ever 50,000.
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Post by warbaby2 on Feb 27, 2017 15:30:20 GMT
I'm not sure what about any of this is lore-breaking. New galaxy with new technology. The Andromeda galaxy residents are not shackled to the technology of the Milky Way, so if they came up with heat-seeking plasma rifles or beam weapons, that's understandable because they have been able to continue advancing their technology without a hard reset ever 50,000. Yea, but advance to what? Space magic? The mere fact that there is an equally advanced society - let alone multiple - in a galaxy far away from our own is a stretch already... let's just hope they don't also use mass effect technology in the same way too, or ME will be the next IP I'll have to write off...
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stysiaq
N3
Gigavorcha Breeder
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
Origin: Stysiaq
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Post by stysiaq on Feb 27, 2017 15:47:28 GMT
WHich is terrible as it sacrifices the uniqueness of the setting and makes it just like every other bland, flavorless shooter out there. Yes, it is really sad that those concepts were abandoned. But frankly, it didn't hurt as much as my other gripes with the trilogy that I would rather not revisit.
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Post by Iakus on Feb 27, 2017 15:49:35 GMT
I'm not sure what about any of this is lore-breaking. New galaxy with new technology. The Andromeda galaxy residents are not shackled to the technology of the Milky Way, so if they came up with heat-seeking plasma rifles or beam weapons, that's understandable because they have been able to continue advancing their technology without a hard reset ever 50,000. in which case they should be as advanced as the Leviathans.
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Post by maximusarael020 on Feb 27, 2017 16:03:55 GMT
I'm not sure what about any of this is lore-breaking. New galaxy with new technology. The Andromeda galaxy residents are not shackled to the technology of the Milky Way, so if they came up with heat-seeking plasma rifles or beam weapons, that's understandable because they have been able to continue advancing their technology without a hard reset ever 50,000. Yea, but advance to what? Space magic? The mere fact that there is an equally advanced society - let alone multiple - in a galaxy far away from our own is a stretch already... let's just hope they don't also use mass effect technology in the same way too, or ME will be the next IP I'll have to write off... It might seem like magic, but it's just technology. If you showed humans from 0 B.C. current technology, it would be exactly like magic to them. Flying vehicles?? Moving pictures?? Communication with people on the other side of the world instantaneously?? ANGRY BIRDS?????? Seems very reasonable. So we wouldn't necessarily be able to understand every new tech immediately in Andromeda as they would have had more time to develop it. It might seem like "space magic".
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Post by brian on Feb 27, 2017 16:04:49 GMT
This is just a lore guess. But plasma can become quantum entangled with the mind quite easily. Hence, with the will of the wielder. So it bends to the willpower of the mind, which naturally wills to hit the target.
Mind-over-energy.
If you think that's too far fetched, order a copy of the parapsychology textbook from Amazon. Read it and weep.
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Post by maximusarael020 on Feb 27, 2017 16:05:20 GMT
I'm not sure what about any of this is lore-breaking. New galaxy with new technology. The Andromeda galaxy residents are not shackled to the technology of the Milky Way, so if they came up with heat-seeking plasma rifles or beam weapons, that's understandable because they have been able to continue advancing their technology without a hard reset ever 50,000. in which case they should be as advanced as the Leviathans. Potentially. There can be other limiting factors, including when the species in the sector achieve sentience, if there are other catastrophic events (black hole) that wipe out advanced civilizations, etc. That doesn't necessarily mean the species have been around for as long as the Leviathans, just that they could be more advanced because they could have been working on their tech for 100,000 years instead of 50,000.
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Post by warbaby2 on Feb 27, 2017 17:44:12 GMT
Yea, but advance to what? Space magic? The mere fact that there is an equally advanced society - let alone multiple - in a galaxy far away from our own is a stretch already... let's just hope they don't also use mass effect technology in the same way too, or ME will be the next IP I'll have to write off... It might seem like magic, but it's just technology. If you showed humans from 0 B.C. current technology, it would be exactly like magic to them. Flying vehicles?? Moving pictures?? Communication with people on the other side of the world instantaneously?? ANGRY BIRDS?????? Seems very reasonable. So we wouldn't necessarily be able to understand every new tech immediately in Andromeda as they would have had more time to develop it. It might seem like "space magic". I know Clark's laws... maybe, we'll know if it makes sense when we actually see the whole picture.
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Post by bshep on Feb 27, 2017 17:55:09 GMT
The reasonable approach would be to wait to see what is the lore explanation for the plama weapons used by Andromeda races. Same to some of those mods.
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Post by simsimillia on Feb 27, 2017 18:20:52 GMT
Why are Plasma Weapons suddenly an Issue? Plasma Weaponry with tracking capability was already introduced with Mass Effect 2 with the Incinerate Power and the Geth PLASMA Shotgun (which also has minor tracking). Plasma Weaponry isn't really new technology.
Same as lasers. GARDIAN systems are installed on every military vessel.
How and why plasma weapons are tracking: If I'm not mistaken plasma needs to be contained somehow, else it just flies apart as soon as it leaves the gun. Could be that at the center of the plasma balls is a projectile generating a magnetic field that is also capable of making minor adjustments to the flight path of the projectile.
Cryo Technology seems pretty insensible, thermodynamics would fuck that technology right over.
Introducing ThermoClips to Mass Effect and therefor an "ammo" system to the Gameplay was a really, really good decision for the sake of gameplay.
Space Battles seen in the cutscenes never looked like what was described in the codex.
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Post by Sondergaard on Feb 27, 2017 18:32:12 GMT
But that's not going to bother me because I don't give a shit that much, but I'd hazard that a bunch of people will be pissed off now that I flashed that light bulb inside of their heads if they hadn't noticed already. You son of a bitch!
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We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MasterDassJennir
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Post by bshep on Feb 27, 2017 18:40:53 GMT
Why are Plasma Weapons suddenly an Issue? Plasma Weaponry with tracking capability was already introduced with Mass Effect 2 with the Incinerate Power and the Geth PLASMA Shotgun (which also has minor tracking). Plasma Weaponry isn't really new technology. Same as lasers. GARDIAN systems are installed on every military vessel. How and why plasma weapons are tracking: If I'm not mistaken plasma needs to be contained somehow, else it just flies apart as soon as it leaves the gun. Could be that at the center of the plasma balls is a projectile generating a magnetic field that is also capable of making minor adjustments to the flight path of the projectile. Cryo Technology seems pretty insensible, thermodynamics would fuck that technology right over. Introducing ThermoClips to Mass Effect and therefor an "ammo" system to the Gameplay was a really, really good decision for the sake of gameplay. Space Battles seen in the cutscenes never looked like what was described in the codex. I like this human she understand! Geth Plasma Shotgun"This three-barrelled geth weapon fires miniature but potent cluster rounds of superconducting projectiles and has a longer range than standard shotguns. A two-stage trigger system allows for either quick-fire capacitors or a charge-and-release attack to electrify the projectiles as they exit the weapon. As the rounds hit the target, they fragment and electricity arcs between the pieces, flash-converting the air to conductive plasma. The resulting impact, heat, and electrical charge overloads shields and barriers and causes massive trauma to unarmored targets."
Geth Spitfire Like the geth plasma shotgun, the Spitfire is not a true energy weapon. Instead, the minigun magnetically flings clusters of superconducting toroids. These donut-shaped projectiles are designed to shatter upon impact, arcing electricity between the fragments and flash-converting them to plasma. The gun's punishing, automatic blasts impact with the heat of a cutting torch.
Geth Plasma SMG This geth weapon works on the same principles as the Spitfire: it shoots superconducting toroids that break apart on impact, retaining an electrical charge that flash-converts the shrapnel into plasma. Unlike the Spitfire, however, the plasma SMG has been modified to take thermal clips. Holding down the trigger speeds up its rate of fire, rapidly depleting the gun’s heat sink in exchange for nearly continuous fire.
The plasma is only created on impact, but yeah no one can deny that the technology is already known to the Mass Effect universe.
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Post by Cypher on Feb 27, 2017 18:46:41 GMT
But that's not going to bother me because I don't give a shit that much, but I'd hazard that a bunch of people will be pissed off now that I flashed that light bulb inside of their heads if they hadn't noticed already. You son of a bitch! Mission accomplished!
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Post by laxian on Feb 27, 2017 21:07:17 GMT
WHich is terrible as it sacrifices the uniqueness of the setting and makes it just like every other bland, flavorless shooter out there. Yes, it is really sad that those concepts were abandoned. But frankly, it didn't hurt as much as my other gripes with the trilogy that I would rather not revisit. Please do (I know it's painful, but I have my own list of gripes with ME3 especially (two and one have some, too but then again it's only minor stuff there, like the fuckig "ammo" (thermal clips!) in ME2 (and 3)), don't mind us (or don't - as I said, I've got a ton of gripes, too!) greetings LAX
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Post by Iakus on Feb 27, 2017 21:31:08 GMT
The reasonable approach would be to wait to see what is the lore explanation for the plama weapons used by Andromeda races. Same to some of those mods. "Resources"
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Feb 27, 2017 21:53:55 GMT
Actually they explain, lore wise, why weapons use 'ammo' in Mass Effect 2 and 3. They found that the Geth used thermal clips instead of an internal heatsink and it allowed them to put more rounds down range, faster than the normal weapons. So, other weapons manufacturers started using this new system. As for upgrades, technically they havent broken any lore. If anything, they're just expanding it. Lastly, the plasma tech is completely unknown right now. You cant say it breaks lore when you know nothing about it. yeah...spectre weapons never overheated really...and even if they did I dare you to ask ANY soldier if they would rather have a weapon that never runs out of bullets and just requires you not to spray and pray OR a weapon that will stop firing unless you swap a heat sink in it which in turn ALSO requires you to carry more gear....oh, also noteworthy, the thermal clips afforded no increment in pure power of the guns. Yeah Bioware made this decision because some exec wanted the game to feel "20% more like a shooter"
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