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Post by Hrungr on Oct 10, 2016 17:33:31 GMT
Cassandra Khaw @casskhaw Who are your favorite Dragon Age fan fiction writers?
Cassandra Khaw @casskhaw ... *prods at @mike_Laidlaw meaningfully*
Mike Laidlaw @mike_Laidlaw Don’t have any. I avoid reading fan fiction so I don’t have any potential to steal someone’s ideas.
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Oct 10, 2016 17:48:17 GMT
Smart. George R R Martin had a story about an author who permitted fan fiction and also read it.
When they encountered a fanfic similar in nature to a story they wanted to tell, they asked the fanfic writer to take it down. The response was "no, and if you don't give me a share of the money from your novel I'll sue you".
Martin was using the anecdote as a reason why he doesn't allow fan fiction.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Oct 10, 2016 17:54:33 GMT
To be honest, even if he had some I don't think he should have answered. I don't know... I just don't think it would be fair to single out particular fanfic writers in that way. I don't think it's the same as pointing to a fanart because a writer is working in their (the devs') world, with their characters, and so on.
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Post by Hrungr on Oct 10, 2016 17:59:10 GMT
Smart. George R R Martin had a story about an author who permitted fan fiction and also read it. When they encountered a fanfic similar in nature to a story they wanted to tell, they asked the fanfic writer to take it down. The response was "no, and if you don't give me a share of the money from your novel I'll sue you". Martin was using the anecdote as a reason why he doesn't allow fan fiction. Yup. Billy & Blar touched on this issue in their podcast about having to be wary at Cons too. If a fan wanted to share a story idea with them, they have to politely, but firmly, shut them down.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Oct 10, 2016 18:01:53 GMT
Smart. George R R Martin had a story about an author who permitted fan fiction and also read it. When they encountered a fanfic similar in nature to a story they wanted to tell, they asked the fanfic writer to take it down. The response was "no, and if you don't give me a share of the money from your novel I'll sue you". Martin was using the anecdote as a reason why he doesn't allow fan fiction. You can't really lock down fanfic, though. Just after reading this post, I did a search on AO3 for "game of thrones," and got back 15,334 results. AO3 is quite popular, and there are some other large fanfic sites as well, but they're not the only ones out there. There are also personal blogs and such in addition to the aggregate fanfic sites, certain fandom oriented forums where fanfic is posted, and all sorts of places all around the internet. Lawyers can't get to them ALL. He can say he doesn't allow or permit fanfic all he wants, it's still going to happen. I believe Anne Rice is the same way, but I'm sure there are all sorts of things out there.
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Post by phoray on Oct 10, 2016 19:35:46 GMT
Smart. George R R Martin had a story about an author who permitted fan fiction and also read it. When they encountered a fanfic similar in nature to a story they wanted to tell, they asked the fanfic writer to take it down. The response was "no, and if you don't give me a share of the money from your novel I'll sue you". Martin was using the anecdote as a reason why he doesn't allow fan fiction. You can't really lock down fanfic, though. Just after reading this post, I did a search on AO3 for "game of thrones," and got back 15,334 results. AO3 is quite popular, and there are some other large fanfic sites as well, but they're not the only ones out there. There are also personal blogs and such in addition to the aggregate fanfic sites, certain fandom oriented forums where fanfic is posted, and all sorts of places all around the internet. Lawyers can't get to them ALL. He can say he doesn't allow or permit fanfic all he wants, it's still going to happen. I believe Anne Rice is the same way, but I'm sure there are all sorts of things out there. It's probably purely deniability. The official statement on the matter is that they do not seek it out or read it for "REASONS". To say otherwise is to invite problems later when the plot happens to have similarities to some grand fanfiction.
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Post by theblackadder13 on Oct 10, 2016 20:38:25 GMT
Didn't Bioware literally sponsor a contest about how could write the best DA2 fan fiction a few years back?
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Post by Hrungr on Oct 10, 2016 20:38:40 GMT
Marco G @wtfman999@darkhorsecomics @mike_Laidlaw @biomarkdarrah Didn't realize there were new DA comics to look forward to in May. Definitely gonna buy! Mike Laidlaw @mike_LaidlawThere sure are! I think this next arc will be very interesting.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2016 22:00:09 GMT
Awesome Inquisitor cosplay. She nailed down the details on both armour and dragon bow. I'd like to get into doing more cosplay photography after my first experience at Edmonton Expo.
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Post by Andraste_Reborn on Oct 10, 2016 23:19:50 GMT
Smart. George R R Martin had a story about an author who permitted fan fiction and also read it. When they encountered a fanfic similar in nature to a story they wanted to tell, they asked the fanfic writer to take it down. The response was "no, and if you don't give me a share of the money from your novel I'll sue you". Martin was using the anecdote as a reason why he doesn't allow fan fiction. You can't really lock down fanfic, though. Just after reading this post, I did a search on AO3 for "game of thrones," and got back 15,334 results. AO3 is quite popular, and there are some other large fanfic sites as well, but they're not the only ones out there. There are also personal blogs and such in addition to the aggregate fanfic sites, certain fandom oriented forums where fanfic is posted, and all sorts of places all around the internet. Lawyers can't get to them ALL. He can say he doesn't allow or permit fanfic all he wants, it's still going to happen. I believe Anne Rice is the same way, but I'm sure there are all sorts of things out there. Moreover, noncommercial fanworks are fair use under US copyright law. There's a reason that Martin and Rice have never taken any fanwriters to court, although Rice used to issue take-down notices. The same organization that runs the AO3 has a legal branch which have already got vidders the ability to legally use DVDs and Bluray discs for vidding under the DMCA, so it's not like the fanwriter would necessarily be without a good lawyer. I think it's generally a bad idea for writers to READ fanfic of their own work, but it's an even worse idea to go chasing your hardcore fanbase with legal action. Just tell fans you won't read it and get on with your life.
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Oct 11, 2016 0:14:10 GMT
Nevermind fanfic, I'm surprised fiction writers read any fiction by any other writer, at least in the same market. How do you know that this great idea you think up in 2016 wasn't actually something you read 15 years ago and forgot about, consciously but not subconsciously?
And there's such a fine line between homage and derivative, how do you know when you cross the line?
Meh, the whole thing is a minefield. I really don't know how writers get anything done. I'd be a nervous wreck.
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Post by Andraste_Reborn on Oct 11, 2016 2:13:04 GMT
Meh, the whole thing is a minefield. I really don't know how writers get anything done. I'd be a nervous wreck. Well, you certainly would be if you worried about whether your ideas were original or not . (Spoilers: they're not. And that's OK.) Personally, I long ago stopped worrying about that and started worrying about slightly more useful things like when my next rejection e-mail will arrive so I can send this thing to the next magazine that will also reject it, and so on.
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Post by Awkward Octopus on Oct 11, 2016 4:25:00 GMT
Nevermind fanfic, I'm surprised fiction writers read any fiction by any other writer, at least in the same market. How do you know that this great idea you think up in 2016 wasn't actually something you read 15 years ago and forgot about, consciously but not subconsciously? And there's such a fine line between homage and derivative, how do you know when you cross the line? Meh, the whole thing is a minefield. I really don't know how writers get anything done. I'd be a nervous wreck. I'm an artist, but I think the same idea applies. If you're worried about this kind of thing (and I do worry, constantly), the trick is not to avoid consuming other art (or written works), but to consume ALL OF IT. As much as you can. Read, read, read. Research everything. Study art and artists and technique. Read articles. Watch film, read comics, play video games. Because then, you're much less likely to accidentally be too similar to a single piece. Instead, you can point directly at the 15 pieces you intentionally were inspired by and referenced, and own it. Say: "these things were my inspiration. I read them. I looked at them. I studied them. And then I put them away and made my thing." And because you're aware, because you had so many influences, because you studied, you're not inspired by any one thing, but by all the things, and are therefore more likely to have made it your own. In spirit and substance. It's impossible to be completely original, but you can infuse it with whatever makes it uniquely you. But that requires practice and knowledge and not taking too much inspiration from a single source, or taking a single person's advice too seriously.
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Post by Bondari the Reloader on Oct 11, 2016 4:27:26 GMT
Didn't Bioware literally sponsor a contest about how could write the best DA2 fan fiction a few years back? I have some vague recollections about something like this, as well, but if I remember correctly there were fairly restrictive rules. Either there were prompts, or you couldn't use certain characters, or maybe both? My memory is quite fuzzy. I didn't pay too close attention to it since I hadn't played DA2 yet and wasn't going to enter. I always wondered if they'd ever do a fiction contest again, but I can definitely see why it would be a bad idea. It's a shame, though, since it means good fanfic writers don't get the same level of recognition as good fan artists or cosplayers.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Oct 11, 2016 9:52:35 GMT
Nevermind fanfic, I'm surprised fiction writers read any fiction by any other writer, at least in the same market. How do you know that this great idea you think up in 2016 wasn't actually something you read 15 years ago and forgot about, consciously but not subconsciously? And there's such a fine line between homage and derivative, how do you know when you cross the line? Meh, the whole thing is a minefield. I really don't know how writers get anything done. I'd be a nervous wreck. I see your point, but these writers have already been influenced by things they read as a kid, and later on as an adult before they became professional in their own writing. We absorb everything we've ever been exposed to. There's also something to be said for enjoying a particular genre and also writing professionally in that genre. I'd think that seeing that creativity, or knowing about the research required first-hand, would do much to foster admiration for another author. And too, there are other components of a work to like and admire. One of the things Stephen King does really well is character development, even if his plots are sometimes a little all over the place; he also seems to be attuned to portraying children, in the same way that Steven Spielberg gets good performances out of them. So another horror author could read his work and enjoy that aspect of it. That said, I'm sure there are some authors who don't read much newer fiction for that reason, or those that read everything for the same reason (to know what to avoid). Everyone will have their own way.
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Post by circusdragon on Oct 11, 2016 12:10:40 GMT
Nevermind fanfic, I'm surprised fiction writers read any fiction by any other writer, at least in the same market. How do you know that this great idea you think up in 2016 wasn't actually something you read 15 years ago and forgot about, consciously but not subconsciously? And there's such a fine line between homage and derivative, how do you know when you cross the line? Meh, the whole thing is a minefield. I really don't know how writers get anything done. I'd be a nervous wreck. I'm an artist, but I think the same idea applies. If you're worried about this kind of thing (and I do worry, constantly), the trick is not to avoid consuming other art (or written works), but to consume ALL OF IT. As much as you can. Read, read, read. Research everything. Study art and artists and technique. Read articles. Watch film, read comics, play video games. Because then, you're much less likely to accidentally be too similar to a single piece. Instead, you can point directly at the 15 pieces you intentionally were inspired by and referenced, and own it. Say: "these things were my inspiration. I read them. I looked at them. I studied them. And then I put them away and made my thing." And because you're aware, because you had so many influences, because you studied, you're not inspired by any one thing, but by all the things, and are therefore more likely to have made it your own. In spirit and substance. It's impossible to be completely original, but you can infuse it with whatever makes it uniquely you. But that requires practice and knowledge and not taking too much inspiration from a single source, or taking a single person's advice too seriously. Yes, absolutely! I am in university right now, and in every unit we are expected to read as much as we can, and look at work of a huge variety or artists. Because that's how you learn and get better. I personally make sure all my social media feeds are full with artists that inspire me. If you pair that with your own creativity and ideas (brainstorms are my favourite for coming up with stuff) then it's very unlikely that you would be plagiarising anything.
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Post by ladyiolanthe on Oct 11, 2016 13:51:45 GMT
Not to mention that even if something IS highly derivative, it can still be published. I'm thinking of Dennis L. McKiernan, whose The Iron Tower trilogy is very, very much like J. R. R. Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings trilogy.
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Oct 11, 2016 18:57:51 GMT
Not to mention that even if something IS highly derivative, it can still be published. I'm thinking of Dennis L. McKiernan, whose The Iron Tower trilogy is very, very much like J. R. R. Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings trilogy. McKiernan was totally up-front about writing homage to Tolkien. He wrote about not wanting LOTR to end, so he wrote more stuff like it. The funny thing is, he ended up writing some pretty original stuff, and the more he wrote, the more he discovered his own voice and his own unique ideas.
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Post by ladyiolanthe on Oct 12, 2016 1:23:23 GMT
Not to mention that even if something IS highly derivative, it can still be published. I'm thinking of Dennis L. McKiernan, whose The Iron Tower trilogy is very, very much like J. R. R. Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings trilogy. McKiernan was totally up-front about writing homage to Tolkien. He wrote about not wanting LOTR to end, so he wrote more stuff like it. The funny thing is, he ended up writing some pretty original stuff, and the more he wrote, the more he discovered his own voice and his own unique ideas. I know, and I do enjoy his work. I was just using him as an example for people who are too paralyzed to write anything because they're afraid they'll get sued. I also think it's important to keep this in perspective: pretty much nothing you write will ever be completely free of influence. And that's okay. That is how we humans are wired, from time immemorial. Pretty much every story you have ever read or heard probably has something in common with another story out there in this little world of ours.
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Post by Heimdall on Oct 12, 2016 21:25:47 GMT
My 2 cents:
In my only dabbling attempts at fiction, if I'm attracted to a story idea I worry is too much like a storyline in whatever piece of media probably inspired it, I start changing small details. Then, I change more details. Then a couple more. And so on until it feels sufficiently original without sacrificing what attracted me to it in the first place.
Often that involves ideas that I gleaned from other sources. That's why consuming a lot of stories is important, it helps you accumulate the building blocks that help you construct your ideas. Originality is at least as much about rearranging old ideas as it is about creating new ones.
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Post by Hrungr on Oct 12, 2016 23:53:23 GMT
Mike Laidlaw @mike_LaidlawI'm reading a thing here for work and chuckling aloud now and then. That's a good sign. Mike Laidlaw @mike_Laidlaw In the background, I can hear @patrickweekes and @hanlsp plotting. It is a good day. - Should we just start mailing you our tears now and skip the wait...?
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Post by Gold Dragon on Oct 13, 2016 4:13:18 GMT
That is one toothy grin, Hrungr.
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Post by Hrungr on Oct 13, 2016 4:27:32 GMT
That is one toothy grin, Hrungr. Hell, that gator is my patronus!
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Post by BioFan on Oct 13, 2016 6:03:44 GMT
That is one toothy grin, Hrungr. Hell, that gator is my patronus! I got an owl. I'm always watching for dat news
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Post by Hrungr on Oct 13, 2016 18:57:55 GMT
Chelsie @dragontemptress @mike_Laidlaw do u work on any projects related to mass effect or only dragon age?
Mike Laidlaw @mike_Laidlaw Dragon Age only, this far, barring a brief stint on Mass 1 about a decade ago.
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