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Post by jeangenie on Mar 25, 2017 19:21:32 GMT
Feels like they have created a new game just because that's how the industry works now, not because they had fresh ideas or even particularily wanted to do it.
Bioware has now two IPs (the Fantasy IP and the Shooter IP) that will be updated ad infinitum - or at least until sales collapse, which might happen sooner then we think.
Bioware of old used to come up with new settings that they found exciting, gameplay that fit this setting and then comprehensively explore them with one game plus maybe one sequel. They had their tabeltop inspired RPG, the RPG that was built around a campaign creator, the Star Wars game, the Kung Fu game, the SciFi team shooter trilogy. Obviously, the quality fluctuated, but at least every new release felt fresh and interesting.
There was no need for a new Mass Effect. The world was created to tell a single, long story. Asari, Salarians, Krogan and all the other races simply aren't deep enough (and never were intended to be, and didn't need to be) to be trotted out every few years for decades. We came to know them, lived with them and said goodbye to them. Same goes for most of the concepts of the Mass Effect universe.
And of course, the setting is a poor fit for the Open World that every AAA game now has to have (understandibly so - even a poor open world sells better than no open world). FTL transportation and interplanetary travel required an open world so big that it had to be procedurally generated and feeling empty.
I loved the original trilogy. I though it brought the universe and story to an (controversial, but after all the DLC at least acceptable and often touching) end. Andromeda is an insipid, bland, spiritless second helping full of played out tropes and devoid of wonder and new ideas.
I wish Bioware would go back to making new IPs that they were excited about and that would only get sequels if there were good reasons for it. Hell, since open worlds and gathering & crafting overkill are now mandatory, come up with something that's build around that from the ground up.
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Post by vanillah on Mar 25, 2017 19:24:12 GMT
Welcome to the world of AAA game development. It took you this long to figure this out?? Especially when EA bought Bioware.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Mar 25, 2017 19:26:04 GMT
I think they created a new game because EA has interest in it and because the ME3 ending bombed everything Mass Effect so hard that they had to cheer up fans by immediately asking about what they wanted if there was a new game. People didn't like that it was over when it was done in such a depressing and poorly executed fashion as in ME3 so the thought of the story potentially continuing motivates fans and also BioWare, I think, to be excited for more games.
I'm not gonna lie, although Andromeda stumbles a lot there's some potential in the framework they've set up for a new trilogy or duology arc. I can already picture where it could go and where it could end up, but I should probably be careful not to generate expectations BioWare are just going to miss.
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Post by SKAR on Mar 25, 2017 19:28:03 GMT
Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I wanna see how my relationship with Cora is gonna play out. And if it takes another five years, so be it.
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Post by logram on Mar 25, 2017 19:34:30 GMT
I personally found it So sad that the company who gave us ME1 to 3 with great gameplay, fantastic story etc etc would in all seriusly put there Name to this...this FARCE of ME game and they will tell you that MEA has nothing to do with ME......well shouldent they not remove the Mass Effect from Mass Effect Andromeda Titel?
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Post by maximusarael020 on Mar 25, 2017 19:35:50 GMT
None of the worlds in Mass Effect: Andromeda are "procedurally generated". They tried that and didn't like the results, so all of the worlds in MEA are hand-crafted.
I guess it's probably because, traditionally, new IP's don't do as well, nor new ideas. That's why Horizon: Zero Dawn gets such high praise, for being a great game that is a totally new idea and IP. Otherwise, you get more Resident Evil, more Call of Duty, more Battlefield, more Grand Theft Auto, more Assassins Creed, etc, because those are known to sell, and at the end of the day the publishing company is there to make money, not take a risk on something new.
I agree it would be nice to take a risk on something new and come out with something as cool and well-made as Horizon: Zero Dawn, but big publishers are just not generally going to take those kinds of risks.
I disagree, though, that Mass Effect had no more stories to tell. I think the idea to go to a whole new galaxy was smart and opens up many many possible new and exciting stories. I am very much enjoying MEA, and I hope they will make more Mass Effect games in Andromeda. However, I do also hope they listen to fans and work harder to ensure that animations, quest content and quality, and all the little things fans are complaining about are addressed. This can be excused (probably) as a hiccup for Bioware, as ME3 was I feel a great game. I liked the endings but obviously that's a point of contention that they needed to work on. The next Mass Effect game needs to knock it out of the freaking park, though. It needs to get very high ratings, be fun and exciting with a great story, memorable characters, cool mechanics, and very very few bugs. The next Mass Effect games basically needs to be Game of the Year when it comes out to get the series back on track. But I think they can do it. I think they know what they need to do now, more than ever.
Time will tell.
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Post by alanc9 on Mar 25, 2017 20:12:32 GMT
Let's not overthink this. Plenty of people wanted more Mass Effect even if we don't all agree on exactly how Bio should have done more. "Drop the franchise" never polled very well on the old boards.
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 25, 2017 20:41:34 GMT
Sorry to break it to you, but with how people react to games and I include Andromeda in this list you are much less likely to see new IPs because people turn on games in a heartbeat anymore. Combine that with the development costs of modern gaming and the players refusing to really acknowledge that game prices haven't really increased with inflation you get stuck with people sticking to franchises that will be less of a risk. THQ learned the hard way about taking too much risk with different projects and went out of business because of it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2017 20:54:26 GMT
I posted some thoughts on other threads...I think the MET had great potential for various standalone games, that I would play without thought:
C-Sec Citadel Omega: Rising to power The Geth/ Quarian War A game placed on Earth/Solar System within MEU. A game about the various MEU mercenary groups.
They would have a short dev cycle, reusing much of ME3 assets, and would have 6-10 hours of duration. This way we would have a polished experience, without inflicting much world-changing events.
It saddens me the way they did ME3, spreading themselves too thin. We could've had a lot of great games leading to the events of ME3, giving the team precious time to give us a better experience. Alas...
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Post by xassantex on Mar 25, 2017 21:26:16 GMT
You need to remember tons of people cried and begged for a ME4.. Other were hoping for a new scifi game. Casey Hudson has put the ME team in a tight corner with his idea of 3 endings ... but at the same time he was stuck also because of a friggin leak before launch. ( if that is indeed the real reason) . Had there been one single huge climactic ending there would have been room for a post MET game, taking place even a century after to erase Shepard out of the game . I would have liked a completely new game but i don't mind Andromeda. There is room for sequels. People bitch incoherently to incredible levels these days ( about anything and everything really) and i'm hoping companies don't even bother with forums for realistic and constructive feedback.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2017 21:30:17 GMT
Hells, yes! I love the verse, and I like the new branch of it. I find Andromeda so far exciting and fresh, a bit like Voyager, and I haven't seen Voyager's theme in a game before.
I am also looking forward to the new IP.
I will even buy a new DA game. On sale.
Mass Effect setting stayed more consistent imo over the game's than DA world.
So, HELL, YES! And great work, BioWare!
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Post by Doctor Fumbles on Mar 25, 2017 21:33:56 GMT
Of course making MEA was the best direction. Do you know how many Sci-fi games with good gun gameplay are lacking these days? Most of the new games focus on the real world(GTA V, Watchdogs, etc.), or the overdone fantasy world(Witcher 3) which I am sick and tired of seeing. If there were more sci-fi third person shooters, maybe I would have been on the haters side, but as it currently stands, sci-fi games like ME franchise are in a drought. Also, I wish Horizon Dawn Zero does well, but it is not my cup of tea because of the lack of guns in it, and I can't make my own character.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2017 21:38:09 GMT
Of course making MEA was the best direction. Do you know how many Sci-fi games with good gun gameplay are lacking these days? Most of the new games focus on the real world(GTA V, Watchdogs, etc.), or the overdone fantasy world(Witcher 3) which I am sick and tired of seeing. If there were more sci-fi third person shooters, maybe I would have been on the haters side, but as it currently stands, sci-fi games like ME franchise are in a drought. Also, I wish Horizon Dawn Zero does well, but it is not my cup of tea because of the lack of guns in it, and I can't make my own character. And it's also on a console only. And, yeah, why should only one game be good? Made to one formula? I'd try Zero Dawn if they'd let me play it on PC...
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Post by colfoley on Mar 25, 2017 21:42:39 GMT
Yes.
I think the one problem is that most people aren't putting any of the agency behind BioWare in what they are doing, that they are only EAs puppets. But they clearly wanted to do this game. Not only is the love and attention they put in the game evident of this, but I am really uncertain if the game would even be made if BioWare didn't want to do it OR that they would have even joined forces with EA in the first place because the objective was to be able to make bigger, better games with the merger...and they succeeded.
This is doubly true for Mass Effect because Mass Effect was always meant to be a series from the very beginning. A trilogy. And while the trilogy did wrap itself up eventually, they were hinting and aluding to the fact that they wanted to do another game even before the final one was released.
Dragon Age was a bit more dubious because I have heard that Origins was supposed to be it. But it was clear with Dragon Age 2 that BioWare wanted to tell a long term story because 2 set up Inquisition rather well, plus other plot lines that should continue onto Dragon Age 4...and beyond.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Mar 25, 2017 21:43:05 GMT
I personally found it So sad that the company who gave us ME1 to 3 with great gameplay, fantastic story etc etc would in all seriusly put there Name to this...this FARCE of ME game and they will tell you that MEA has nothing to do with ME......well shouldent they not remove the Mass Effect from Mass Effect Andromeda Titel? I've sometimes thought they should've just went for a new Sci fi IP as a spiritual successor to Mass Effect, but I think even if they removed the Turians and the Milky Way lore, chances are it'll just end up feeling too much like a re-attempt to create Mass Effect all over again. That said, there are things in the game where I'm like "this just doesn't feel like Mass Effect" and not just in terms of gameplay. There's a lot of the new designs that just don't match up with the old style. It also feels like they didn't succeed at replicating the "golden rule" or Mass Effect artstyle.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 25, 2017 21:45:52 GMT
Of course making MEA was the best direction. Do you know how many Sci-fi games with good gun gameplay are lacking these days? Most of the new games focus on the real world(GTA V, Watchdogs, etc.), or the overdone fantasy world(Witcher 3) which I am sick and tired of seeing. If there were more sci-fi third person shooters, maybe I would have been on the haters side, but as it currently stands, sci-fi games like ME franchise are in a drought. Also, I wish Horizon Dawn Zero does well, but it is not my cup of tea because of the lack of guns in it, and I can't make my own character. Hell isn't good sci fi in a bit of a drought to begin with? I mean I say this as someone who might have a limited perspective because I know there is apparently good sci fi out there in the pop culture realm that I have not experienced (the Expanse) but basically right now its just Star Trek, Star Wars, and Doctor Who.....hmmm. But anyways compare that to the nineties and early 2000s when you had new and truly awesome sci fi shows/ movies/ games left and right.
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Post by Doctor Fumbles on Mar 25, 2017 21:49:14 GMT
Of course making MEA was the best direction. Do you know how many Sci-fi games with good gun gameplay are lacking these days? Most of the new games focus on the real world(GTA V, Watchdogs, etc.), or the overdone fantasy world(Witcher 3) which I am sick and tired of seeing. If there were more sci-fi third person shooters, maybe I would have been on the haters side, but as it currently stands, sci-fi games like ME franchise are in a drought. Also, I wish Horizon Dawn Zero does well, but it is not my cup of tea because of the lack of guns in it, and I can't make my own character. Hell isn't good sci fi in a bit of a drought to begin with? I mean I say this as someone who might have a limited perspective because I know there is apparently good sci fi out there in the pop culture realm that I have not experienced (the Expanse) but basically right now its just Star Trek, Star Wars, and Doctor Who.....hmmm. But anyways compare that to the nineties and early 2000s when you had new and truly awesome sci fi shows/ movies/ games left and right. You are correct. Most good sci-fi shows are gone or cancelled. Farscape, Stargate franchise, Babylon 5, Firefly, and I am sure there are more.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2017 21:50:24 GMT
You need to remember tons of people cried and begged for a ME4.. Other were hoping for a new scifi game. Casey Hudson has put the ME team in a tight corner with his idea of 3 endings ... but at the same time he was stuck also because of a friggin leak before launch. ( if that is indeed the real reason) . Had there been one single huge climactic ending there would have been room for a post MET game, taking place even a century after to erase Shepard out of the game . I would have liked a completely new game but i don't mind Andromeda. There is room for sequels. People bitch incoherently to incredible levels these days ( about anything and everything really) and i'm hoping companies don't even bother with forums for realistic and constructive feedback. I disagree. There's a lot of constructive feedback on forums. Sure, they are buried under tons of garbage, but it's there. One thing I can assure you: We had Shepard's clone fight on Citadel DLC because of all the constructive criticism Kai Leng's fight had, on the original forums and elsewhere.
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Post by derrame on Mar 25, 2017 22:12:20 GMT
yes, a new game please, but not open world, let's return to quality instead of quantity
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Post by griffith82 on Mar 25, 2017 22:26:38 GMT
Feels like they have created a new game just because that's how the industry works now, not because they had fresh ideas or even particularily wanted to do it. Bioware has now two IPs (the Fantasy IP and the Shooter IP) that will be updated ad infinitum - or at least until sales collapse, which might happen sooner then we think. Bioware of old used to come up with new settings that they found exciting, gameplay that fit this setting and then comprehensively explore them with one game plus maybe one sequel. They had their tabeltop inspired RPG, the RPG that was built around a campaign creator, the Star Wars game, the Kung Fu game, the SciFi team shooter trilogy. Obviously, the quality fluctuated, but at least every new release felt fresh and interesting. There was no need for a new Mass Effect. The world was created to tell a single, long story. Asari, Salarians, Krogan and all the other races simply aren't deep enough (and never were intended to be, and didn't need to be) to be trotted out every few years for decades. We came to know them, lived with them and said goodbye to them. Same goes for most of the concepts of the Mass Effect universe. And of course, the setting is a poor fit for the Open World that every AAA game now has to have (understandibly so - even a poor open world sells better than no open world). FTL transportation and interplanetary travel required an open world so big that it had to be procedurally generated and feeling empty. I loved the original trilogy. I though it brought the universe and story to an (controversial, but after all the DLC at least acceptable and often touching) end. Andromeda is an insipid, bland, spiritless second helping full of played out tropes and devoid of wonder and new ideas. I wish Bioware would go back to making new IPs that they were excited about and that would only get sequels if there were good reasons for it. Hell, since open worlds and gathering & crafting overkill are now mandatory, come up with something that's build around that from the ground up. Should ME A been made? Let me think.....YES!!!!!
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Post by brad2240 on Mar 25, 2017 22:42:19 GMT
Feels like they have created a new game just because that's how the industry works now, not because they had fresh ideas or even particularily wanted to do it... ...new settings that they found exciting... Isn't it presumptuous to speak for Bioware in regards to why they made a game, what they wanted to do and how excited they were about it? Speak for yourself, please. Source on that? With direct quotes from Bioware devs stating they only ever intended to tell one story in this universe and that they didn't intend for their creations to endure? That's your opinion, and not one everybody shares.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2017 23:11:22 GMT
Of course making MEA was the best direction. Do you know how many Sci-fi games with good gun gameplay are lacking these days? Most of the new games focus on the real world(GTA V, Watchdogs, etc.), or the overdone fantasy world(Witcher 3) which I am sick and tired of seeing. If there were more sci-fi third person shooters, maybe I would have been on the haters side, but as it currently stands, sci-fi games like ME franchise are in a drought. Also, I wish Horizon Dawn Zero does well, but it is not my cup of tea because of the lack of guns in it, and I can't make my own character. Hell isn't good sci fi in a bit of a drought to begin with? I mean I say this as someone who might have a limited perspective because I know there is apparently good sci fi out there in the pop culture realm that I have not experienced (the Expanse) but basically right now its just Star Trek, Star Wars, and Doctor Who.....hmmm. But anyways compare that to the nineties and early 2000s when you had new and truly awesome sci fi shows/ movies/ games left and right. I really enjoyed a couple of small-scale Sci-Fi series in that last two years, the Dark Matters and Killjoys. Both had cool story-lines and neat settings. To be honest I found them by far more interesting that what have become of Star Wars Official setting (I still like Ye Olde Republic gossip). I rather enjoyed th first season of Expanse as well, and put the novels on order in the library. Comparatively, fantasy is flagging nowadays, ater its hay day in the late nineties-first decade of this century. Once they run out of Martin's books to turn into series, there is not much there right now. Bakker had his day, Lynch was one book wonder, Abercrombie maybe... I dunno, I have not been reading fiction lately, more of the real stuff :)
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Post by colfoley on Mar 25, 2017 23:14:57 GMT
Hell isn't good sci fi in a bit of a drought to begin with? I mean I say this as someone who might have a limited perspective because I know there is apparently good sci fi out there in the pop culture realm that I have not experienced (the Expanse) but basically right now its just Star Trek, Star Wars, and Doctor Who.....hmmm. But anyways compare that to the nineties and early 2000s when you had new and truly awesome sci fi shows/ movies/ games left and right. I really enjoyed a couple of small-scale Sci-Fi series in that last two years, the Dark Matters and Killjoys. Both had cool story-lines and neat settings. To be honest I found them by far more interesting that what have become of Star Wars Official setting (I still like Ye Olde Republic gossip). I rather enjoyed th first season of Expanse as well, and put the novels on order in the library. Comparatively, fantasy is flagging nowadays, ater its hay day in the late nineties-first decade of this century. Once they run out of Martin's books to turn into series, there is not much there right now. Bakker had his day, Lynch was one book wonder, Abercrombie maybe... I dunno, I have not been reading fiction lately, more of the real stuff They already have run out of Martin books to turn into series...
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Post by FluffyCannibal on Mar 25, 2017 23:15:39 GMT
I can't even.
It's not just that I don't agree with you. It's not just how downright presumptuous you are. It's how monumentally wrong you managed to be in a single post. Congratulations, you've made yourself look like a total idiot.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 25, 2017 23:16:40 GMT
I really enjoyed a couple of small-scale Sci-Fi series in that last two years, the Dark Matters and Killjoys. Both had cool story-lines and neat settings. To be honest I found them by far more interesting that what have become of Star Wars Official setting (I still like Ye Olde Republic gossip). I rather enjoyed th first season of Expanse as well, and put the novels on order in the library. Comparatively, fantasy is flagging nowadays, ater its hay day in the late nineties-first decade of this century. Once they run out of Martin's books to turn into series, there is not much there right now. Bakker had his day, Lynch was one book wonder, Abercrombie maybe... I dunno, I have not been reading fiction lately, more of the real stuff :) They already have run out of Martin books to turn into series... Sorry, I have not been following the TV version, I've just read the books back in the time. I am sure it's a good show. :)
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