vit246
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Post by vit246 on Mar 27, 2017 17:59:31 GMT
I am being half-serious and half-Miyazaki. *EDIT* Unnatural plastic looking ugly people. Glitchiest and weirdest animations. Over-animated. Emotionless.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2017 18:02:13 GMT
Well yes and no. The Eclipse(?) engine had serious issues aswell. Look at Swtor which is using the last Iteration of it and it is horrible. Memory leak hasn't been fixed since Dragon Age Origins, it is not well optimized and looks rather cartoony to boot. The frostbite engine is solid, both for performance and visuals, but is it good for RPG's? One of the biggest time sinks for both this game and Inquisition is the recreation of assests and learning how to handle the engine. If the sequel for Dragon Age and Andromeda still has issues with it, i will officially call the engine a bust. Bioware has yet to prove they can do anything amazing with it. Time will tell.
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Post by Ancient on Mar 27, 2017 18:04:45 GMT
Here we have people who know nothing how engines work, but want to talk about it?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2017 18:05:59 GMT
Here we have people who know nothing how engines work, but want to talk about it? Then share your wisdom? Instead of pointing out the obvious.
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 27, 2017 18:07:56 GMT
Well yes and no. The Eclipse(?) engine had serious issues aswell. Look at Swtor which is using the last Iteration of it and it is horrible. Memory leak hasn't been fixed since Dragon Age Origins, it is not well optimized and looks rather cartoony to boot. The frostbite engine is solid, both for performance and visuals, but is it good for RPG's? Discuss! The thing is that game engines really aren't the problem it is how you design your systems around the positives and negatives of those engines. To me a lot of the negatives I have experienced with Andromeda it just seems like BioWare tried to do too much with the game to try and give people everything they wanted in the "ultimate Mass Effect experience".
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Post by sky on Mar 27, 2017 18:11:29 GMT
I thought DAI was fine.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2017 18:16:45 GMT
Look at other games using Frostbite.
I love this game, but it's problems are on bioware and no-one else
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Post by acehilator on Mar 27, 2017 18:18:05 GMT
The engine is amazing. Runs well, everything looks really nice... except Human and Asari faces, lol. Landscapes and armor/weapon textures are dope AF.
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Post by ShadowAngel on Mar 27, 2017 18:18:28 GMT
I don't think it was. Andromeda is a lot bigger than the originals. A lot of why it looks so good and why so much was put into it is because of the engines capabilities. I also don't think we can really compare inquisition with Andromeda. Two entirely different teams (three bioware teams: Montreal, Austin, and Edmonton)worked on them soit's not like Montreal had previous experience with it, so the excuse that they had previous experience with it gets tossed. Optimism says the more games they get under their belt with said engine they get more performance out of it with experience. One thing to think about is Montreal is considered a rookie team to many, and while that certainly shows in this game it's still very noticeable that a lot of effort was put into it and with experience they should only get better.
I'll also add like a previous poster did: the engines aren't always the problem, it's how you work around them that can become an issue. Sometimes you have to sacrifice one aspect for another, down grade one to improve in another. It comes down to what you prioritize for your game and how you want it setup.
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Post by Ancient on Mar 27, 2017 18:24:22 GMT
Here we have people who know nothing how engines work, but want to talk about it? Then share your wisdom? Instead of pointing out the obvious. Engine is not the problem at all. You can create MEA with old Unreal Engine 3 if you want. It would require some big modifications.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Mar 27, 2017 18:35:17 GMT
Then share your wisdom? Instead of pointing out the obvious. Engine is not the problem at all. You can create MEA with old Unreal Engine 3 if you want. It would require some big modifications. Uh, ok. Sure, but why wouldn't you do it in UE4, which could handle the fancy graphics better... So, the engine is not the problem... I sort of agree. The implementation of the engine is horseshit, in all cases, by Biower so far. Melee in DAI on KB&M is simply not worth the time, unless you just love mashing buttons, or even better love to just hold one button down with fierce skill. In MEAMP, surprisingly worse than DAI, are the RPG animation implementation to FB3. The facial animations are at an all time low for Bioware... The expressiveness of NPCs in MEA is equivalent to that in KotOR. So, the engine isn't the problem, but Biower's ability to use the engine is. Somehow, that brings us back to the engine.
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Post by FireAndBlood on Mar 27, 2017 18:54:46 GMT
Well yes and no. The Eclipse(?) engine had serious issues aswell. Look at Swtor which is using the last Iteration of it and it is horrible. Memory leak hasn't been fixed since Dragon Age Origins, it is not well optimized and looks rather cartoony to boot. The frostbite engine is solid, both for performance and visuals, but is it good for RPG's? One of the biggest time sinks for both this game and Inquisition is the recreation of assests and learning how to handle the engine. If the sequel for Dragon Age and Andromeda still has issues with it, i will officially call the engine a bust. Bioware has yet to prove they can do anything amazing with it. Time will tell. SWTOR is using the Eclipse engine?!?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2017 18:56:31 GMT
Well yes and no. The Eclipse(?) engine had serious issues aswell. Look at Swtor which is using the last Iteration of it and it is horrible. Memory leak hasn't been fixed since Dragon Age Origins, it is not well optimized and looks rather cartoony to boot. The frostbite engine is solid, both for performance and visuals, but is it good for RPG's? One of the biggest time sinks for both this game and Inquisition is the recreation of assests and learning how to handle the engine. If the sequel for Dragon Age and Andromeda still has issues with it, i will officially call the engine a bust. Bioware has yet to prove they can do anything amazing with it. Time will tell. SWTOR is using the Eclipse engine?!? No i was wrong, its actually using something called The Hero Engine. I was pretty sure it was using the same engine as Dragon Age II, which was the ugraded version of Eclipse.
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Post by ticktak77 on Mar 27, 2017 19:05:05 GMT
Plenty of games have been built, from the ground up, on Frostbite 2.0, and work just fine.
I play 2 of them regularly - Battlefield 1, a multiplayer shooter, and FIFA 17, a sports game.
2 very diverse games, that play just fine on that engine.
These issues are specific to Bioware and no one else.
People need to stop blaming:
The release date
EA
The engine
Space hamsters
ME3's endings
Global Warming
SJW
etc
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Post by coldlogic on Mar 27, 2017 19:05:44 GMT
Honestly I've been wondering if the engine was the problem. Seriously. I don't know much about engines or how they work, but what I do know is that faces and animations looked better in Mass Effect 3, a game that came out 5 years ago. So I really wonder, is it the engine, or is it the artists and designers? Because, to be honest, everything aside from faces and animations is amazing. The scenery is fantastic, the environments are spot on, it's all very well done and very engrossing. But the people... How can landscapes and ships and bases all look so amazing and then you have those faces...
So I'd really honestly sincerely like to know, is the Frostbite engine just really bad for making faces? Or did the designers just fall short?
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Post by derrame on Mar 27, 2017 19:11:59 GMT
this engine is great, but this game seems a bit rushed to release, maybe it needed some performance improvement and bug fixed before release
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Post by iTofu on Mar 27, 2017 19:14:15 GMT
Sometimes you have to sacrifice one aspect for another, down grade one to improve in another. It comes down to what you prioritize for your game and how you want it setup. That could be the next Bioware IP! Inside the game, you're the creator of AAA games and your dialogue choices that change the landscape of the game inside the game, but all choices have the same ending: The internet collectively questions your sacrifices and informs you that you're a failure.
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Post by ApocAlypsE on Mar 27, 2017 19:23:50 GMT
I hate this engine. Geared for FPS thus not flexible, runs poorly on some systems, not moddable (DICE proud of it), I don't remember a single game that didn't come out bugged as hell. EA forces this engine down the throat of every developer under them. What engine I've wanted ME:A to run under? UE4. Better looking (just look at the complete new Unreal Tournament maps or the new Tekken game, not to mention the Paris Flat (?) tech demo), runs better, and you can do ANYTHING on it.
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Post by azarhal on Mar 27, 2017 19:35:35 GMT
Look at other games using Frostbite. I love this game, but it's problems are on bioware and no-one else There is a lots of glitches in MEA that showed up in DAI and Battlefield 1 too. Textures/mesh loading issue, T-pose/animations freezing and even falling through the world for some examples. Battlefields 1 has a lots of video on youtube showing them, nobody hated on the game for it though.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2017 19:43:00 GMT
I hate this engine. Geared for FPS thus not flexible, runs poorly on some systems, not moddable (DICE proud of it), I don't remember a single game that didn't come out bugged as hell. You know what is kind of ironic about the whole not modding thing? A division of DICE is made up by people that made the Desert Combat mod for Battlefield 1942. It was actually the inspiration for Battlefield 2 being set in a modern era. So EA has modders to thank for the huge success of the modern military shooter era they entered, but will never acknowledge it.
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Post by ticktak77 on Mar 27, 2017 19:51:39 GMT
Honestly I've been wondering if the engine was the problem. Seriously. I don't know much about engines or how they work, but what I do know is that faces and animations looked better in Mass Effect 3, a game that came out 5 years ago. S o I really wonder, is it the engine, or is it the artists and designers? Battlefield 1 and FIFA 17 both use the same engine. Facial animations in those games are very good. FIFA 17's facials, in particular it's "THE JOURNEY" story mode, are incredibly detailed and nuanced. There's 2 main ways of getting facial and body animations into a game. 1) Using motion capture, or, essentially, "photocopying" real people's facial and body animations, and then transferring those copies in game. or 2) By using actual artistic animations, much like the way a cartoon sketch artist would design a cartoon. Most games use a combination of both - use Mo-Cap to get realistic and believable animations, and then use self-created animations to add nuance and detail. Mass Effect Andromeda does not use any Mo-Cap, and instead only uses full on artistic representations. The problem we've seen here, is that the Andromeda artistic impressions of the animations aren't all that good. Combining subpar artistic impressions of animation, with some sort of weird technical glitches people are seeing with the eyes and lips, means an extremely subpar facial and body animation presentation in Andromeda. LONG STORY SHORT - It's not the engine, but Bioware.
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Post by neocodex and 23 others on Mar 27, 2017 19:56:45 GMT
. The frostbite engine is solid, both for performance and visuals, but is it good for RPG's? You cannot be serious about performance, the performance is absolutely abysmal, at least for todays GPUs. It is surprisingly very GPU intensive game, there isn't really a single thread CPU bottleneck like it used to be in other engines in the past (looking at CryEngine). It sure does look great, but for today, you can barely get 50 fps on a GTX970 and that's not smooth enough for a shooter game. 50 fps was just fine in DAI, but when there's shooting involved (particulary if you want to snipe) such bad performance is the worst. I would literally have to get at least a GTX 1080 to have somewhat stable 100 fps in this game. But I cannot argue about the visuals, they look good. But that is the only good thing about the Frostbite. And I never liked how characters moved in DAI and even more in MEA, it looks weird, and movement was very clunky and somewhat laggy in DAI, they at least fixed that with the jump jets now.
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Post by ticktak77 on Mar 27, 2017 20:02:48 GMT
. The frostbite engine is solid, both for performance and visuals, but is it good for RPG's? You cannot be serious about performance, the performance is absolutely abysmal, at least for todays GPUs. It is surprisingly very GPU intensive game, there isn't really a single thread CPU bottleneck like it used to be in other engines in the past (looking at CryEngine). It sure does look great, but for today, you can barely get 50 fps on a GTX970 and that's not smooth enough for a shooter game. 50 fps was just fine in DAI, but when there's shooting involved (particulary if you want to snipe) such bad performance is the worst. I would literally have to get at least a GTX 1080 to have somewhat stable 100 fps in this game. But I cannot argue about the visuals, they look good. But that is the only good thing about the Frostbite. And I never liked how characters moved in DAI and even more in MEA, it looks weird, and movement was very clunky and somewhat laggy in DAI, they at least fixed that with the jump jets now. Engine performance is fine - lots of other games function almost flawlessly on the engine. Again, point your ire at the right entity; Bioware, not Frostbite. Think of the engine as the base boards that you build a home on. Even if it's a great foundation, eventually you are going to get to a point where those boards can't handle excessive load and will start to underperform. It's up to the builder (Bioware) to know when that point is, and not to over-stress it
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Post by arreyanne on Mar 27, 2017 20:36:33 GMT
AH SWTOR is played on the Hero engine big pile of mess. The game aint to bad but the engine limitations were discussed by the original lead designer a couple of years ago.
And the frostbite engine stinks period. Should have stayed with Unreal
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Post by ravenous on Mar 27, 2017 22:06:35 GMT
there are other games out there that have used or are using the Frostbite Engine and amazing in my opinion, the Engine is fine and is not the problem. The problem is really simple here and that problem is Bioware and they rushed this game I'll admit even though I really like it
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