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Post by rpgmaster on Mar 28, 2017 0:49:12 GMT
Who didn't give a damn about combat.
When I bought ME1 in 2007 the combat was well down on my list of features that interested me.
Since then they have prioritized combat more and more (specifically shooting, biotics being nerfed) and the RPG features and play-style is stripped more and more. I don't think there's a single non-combat skill in this game.
Combat should be optional. In an ideal RPG you should be able to complete it without engaging in combat at all.
Oh well.
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Post by dlaren on Mar 28, 2017 0:57:08 GMT
Maybe this is more your speed: ...and I'm not saying that to be flippant either. I'm enjoying the game, but I've listened to the audio book twice now and I'd argue that the book is more enjoyable than the game.
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Post by warbaby2 on Mar 28, 2017 0:59:37 GMT
Well, when you believe the marketing, ME is pretty much about combat and "a good banging" now... and not even that's true, since the combat gets way too easy later in the game, and the banging? Meh... I had one zero-g fun time with PeeBee after close to 60 hours, and that happened off screen. Real shame, the game could have been about so much more... but, to be fair, the concept doesn't lend itself to THAT kind of RPG.
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Post by tziwen on Mar 28, 2017 1:02:55 GMT
Who didn't give a damn about combat. When I bought ME1 in 2007 the combat was well down on my list of features that interested me. Since then they have prioritized combat more and more (specifically shooting, biotics being nerfed) and the RPG features and play-style is stripped more and more. I don't think there's a single non-combat skill in this game. Combat should be optional. In an ideal RPG you should be able to complete it without engaging in combat at all. Oh well. Drakensang 1 & 2 are for you mate.
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Post by rpgmaster on Mar 28, 2017 1:20:06 GMT
Well, when you believe the marketing, ME is pretty much about combat and "a good banging" now... and not even that's true, since the combat gets way too easy later in the game, and the banging? Meh... I had one zero-g fun time with PeeBee after close to 60 hours, and that happened off screen. Real shame, the game could have been about so much more... but, to be fair, the concept doesn't lend itself to THAT kind of RPG. I think the concept of settling new colonies lends itself very nicely to choice and consequence and a diplomacy based RPG. They could have made it so that where you decide to set up bases and who you put in charge or what type of people settle there were very important decisions that had long range story consequences. They could have had factions that you become allies or enemies with, resource management. I think the time skip concept of DAII would have been more suited to this game, so you could see your settlements grow and the consequences of your decisions. But going to a new galaxy here was just another excuse to shoot thousands of aliens.
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Post by Link"Guess"ski on Mar 28, 2017 3:22:49 GMT
Yeah, I liked BioWare before they started to make games "for consumers" as part of the EA lifestyle. Frankly this was forced upon them as early as ME2. Bigger budgets and marketing = bigger risk so they had to go popular, but even non-publisher studios go for this and arguably BioWare were doing it too before EA got them since ME1 targeting a TPS-style combat was kind of BioWare realizing that TPS was getting popular.
Casey Hudson is and always was a cool kid that stood out from most of the BioWare creative leads in that he was forward thinking and seeking towards cooler concepts than the average DnD fare. His vision of KOTOR was based on how cool and popular the movies were and that same look for catchy and appealing is exactly how Mass Effect began too, and it's what made it so unique too, because the team that made it were so in on the ideas of just exploring ideas they loved. But to be fair, that was ME1 and while I love ME2 I've not felt completely at home in BioWare games ever since ME3.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 28, 2017 3:43:50 GMT
Mass Effect Andromeda is probably Biowares most RPG RPG in a Mass Effect since the original. Maybe even the best RPG a Mass Effect has ever been. As for the no combat thing I've already had quests that are resolved without a second of combat.
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Post by ticktak77 on Mar 28, 2017 3:47:02 GMT
What a weird thing to suggest.
"I hate that they've improved one aspect of the series to become the best it's ever been, even though it's independent of the rest of the game"
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Post by ShadowAngel on Mar 28, 2017 3:55:18 GMT
The combat in the first was critiqued because of its clumsiness. Plus I don't see why it's an issue when that is an intentional design to the game, and if it's one of the focus points it's going to continue to get improved. Personally I think andromeda did a downgrade when it comes to abilities. The previous games you could use 7? 8 abilities? Now we're restricted to 3. I even dislike the cover system automatically putting you into cover as I preferred picking when I move into cover and being able to slide over from one cart to the next, one side of a door way to the other. The gunplay itself is absolutely the best though.
Mass effect really wouldn't be mass effect if you couldn't shoot aliens, but that's just me. I also notice many saying Andromeda is more of a shooter than an rpg, but I actually disagree and see ME2 and 3 closer to a shooter than andromeda.
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Post by dazzarlok on Mar 28, 2017 14:58:52 GMT
Haha, as much as I love ME1, the combat in that game was atrocious; if the story, characters, and dialogue didn't interest me as much as they did, I would have stopped playing ME after a couple of hours, because the combat definitely wasn't enough to keep me invested. I play mostly RPGs, very rarely do I ever play shooters (I've never touched games like CoD or Titanfall), but I definitely prefer ME:A's combat over ME1's. When going back and playing ME1, I just crank the difficulty down to its easiest setting and go from there so I can get to the story bits faster, which lets me get to ME2 with my new character faster.
I'm glad they improved the combat. I don't care how much RPG elements you have, the combat needs to be fun either way.
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Post by rpgmaster on Mar 28, 2017 15:12:17 GMT
Mass Effect Andromeda is probably Biowares most RPG RPG in a Mass Effect since the original. Maybe even the best RPG a Mass Effect has ever been. Can you give examples?
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Post by rpgmaster on Mar 28, 2017 15:13:31 GMT
What a weird thing to suggest. "I hate that they've improved one aspect of the series to become the best it's ever been, even though it's independent of the rest of the game" BioWare could have introduced racing into ME and it could have been the best racing in any game ever. But I wouldn't have cared because that's not what interested me in ME.
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Post by Andrew Lucas on Mar 28, 2017 15:14:53 GMT
Mass Effect Andromeda is probably Biowares most RPG RPG in a Mass Effect since the original. Maybe even the best RPG a Mass Effect has ever been. As for the no combat thing I've already had quests that are resolved without a second of combat. It really is the best Mass Effect RPG, by a huge margin. No denial.
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Post by rpgmaster on Mar 28, 2017 15:15:36 GMT
The combat in the first was critiqued because of its clumsiness. Plus I don't see why it's an issue when that is an intentional design to the game, and if it's one of the focus points it's going to continue to get improved. Personally I think andromeda did a downgrade when it comes to abilities. The previous games you could use 7? 8 abilities? Now we're restricted to 3. I even dislike the cover system automatically putting you into cover as I preferred picking when I move into cover and being able to slide over from one cart to the next, one side of a door way to the other. The gunplay itself is absolutely the best though. Mass effect really wouldn't be mass effect if you couldn't shoot aliens, but that's just me. I also notice many saying Andromeda is more of a shooter than an rpg, but I actually disagree and see ME2 and 3 closer to a shooter than andromeda. I didn't say you shouldn't be able to shoot aliens. That's going from one extreme to another. I'm saying it should be optional. An RPG should be designed in a way so they player can avoid violent solutions if he chooses.
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Post by dazzarlok on Mar 28, 2017 15:17:40 GMT
What a weird thing to suggest. "I hate that they've improved one aspect of the series to become the best it's ever been, even though it's independent of the rest of the game" BioWare could have introduced racing into ME and it could have been the best racing in any game ever. But I wouldn't have cared because that's not what interested me in ME. That's fine if it didn't interest you, but many people want good gameplay in their video games
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Post by ticktak77 on Mar 28, 2017 15:18:26 GMT
What a weird thing to suggest. "I hate that they've improved one aspect of the series to become the best it's ever been, even though it's independent of the rest of the game" BioWare could have introduced racing into ME and it could have been the best racing in any game ever. But I wouldn't have cared because that's not what interested me in ME. Ok, "RPG MASTER". Maybe a name change? "RPGMASTERWHODOESNTLIKESTANDARDRPGELEMENTSSOMAYBEISNTAMASTERAFTERALL?"
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Post by rpgmaster on Mar 28, 2017 15:23:02 GMT
BioWare could have introduced racing into ME and it could have been the best racing in any game ever. But I wouldn't have cared because that's not what interested me in ME. That's fine if it didn't interest you, but many people want good gameplay in their video games Combat is not the only form of gameplay though, especially in RPGs.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 28, 2017 15:23:05 GMT
Well, how come you're still with us four games later if you don't like combat? Perhaps you thought that you could've reasoned with the Reapers by dialogue mechanics.
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Post by ShadowAngel on Mar 28, 2017 15:23:22 GMT
The combat in the first was critiqued because of its clumsiness. Plus I don't see why it's an issue when that is an intentional design to the game, and if it's one of the focus points it's going to continue to get improved. Personally I think andromeda did a downgrade when it comes to abilities. The previous games you could use 7? 8 abilities? Now we're restricted to 3. I even dislike the cover system automatically putting you into cover as I preferred picking when I move into cover and being able to slide over from one cart to the next, one side of a door way to the other. The gunplay itself is absolutely the best though. Mass effect really wouldn't be mass effect if you couldn't shoot aliens, but that's just me. I also notice many saying Andromeda is more of a shooter than an rpg, but I actually disagree and see ME2 and 3 closer to a shooter than andromeda. I didn't say you shouldn't be able to shoot aliens. That's going from one extreme to another. I'm saying it should be optional. An RPG should be designed in a way so they player can avoid violent solutions if he chooses. What rpg does that? Off the top if my head the whitcher has always required combat at some point, every mass effect requires combat at some point, dragon age, bald aura gate, etc etc. you'll have to educate me on this as I don't see RPGs that let you get away without using combat. Even then, bioware emphasized in combat since the start, so it doesn't matter if you like it or not as that's what they want their game to be. Hence the continuation of them improving it game by game. if your issue is getting away from combat andromeda really does that best. You can simply run away from many encounters outside of story mandatory ones to progress the story.
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Post by dazzarlok on Mar 28, 2017 15:24:57 GMT
That's fine if it didn't interest you, but many people want good gameplay in their video games Combat is not the only form of gameplay though, especially in RPGs. I didn't say it was. I'm more referring to the fact that it's a good thing that Bioware improved the combat from ME1, because ME1's combat was mediocre at best.
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Post by rpgmaster on Mar 28, 2017 15:27:19 GMT
I didn't say you shouldn't be able to shoot aliens. That's going from one extreme to another. I'm saying it should be optional. An RPG should be designed in a way so they player can avoid violent solutions if he chooses. What rpg does that? Off the top if my head the whitcher has always required combat at some point, every mass effect requires combat at some point, dragon age, bald aura gate, etc etc. you'll have to educate me on this as I don't see RPGs that let you get away without using combat. Even then, bioware emphasized in combat since the start, so it doesn't matter if you like it or not as that's what they want their game to be. Hence the continuation of them improving it game by game. if your issue is getting away from combat andromeda really does that best. You can simply run away from many encounters outside of story mandatory ones to progress the story. fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Forum:Completing_Fallout_without_killing_anyone
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Post by kotoreffect3 on Mar 28, 2017 15:27:55 GMT
Combat has always been an important part if the ME games. In the trilogy you were playing as a special forces space marine for crying out loud. Not saying the non combat sequences aren't important but going in you had to know there would be plenty of combat.
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Post by rpgmaster on Mar 28, 2017 15:28:33 GMT
Well, how come you're still with us four games later if you don't like combat? Perhaps you thought that you could've reasoned with the Reapers by dialogue mechanics. Because the universe grabbed me by the quads and refused to let go.
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Post by dazzarlok on Mar 28, 2017 15:29:05 GMT
What rpg does that? Off the top if my head the whitcher has always required combat at some point, every mass effect requires combat at some point, dragon age, bald aura gate, etc etc. you'll have to educate me on this as I don't see RPGs that let you get away without using combat. Even then, bioware emphasized in combat since the start, so it doesn't matter if you like it or not as that's what they want their game to be. Hence the continuation of them improving it game by game. if your issue is getting away from combat andromeda really does that best. You can simply run away from many encounters outside of story mandatory ones to progress the story. fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Forum:Completing_Fallout_without_killing_anyoneAre there any others?
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Post by Iakus on Mar 28, 2017 15:30:03 GMT
Well, how come you're still with us four games later if you don't like combat? Perhaps you thought that you could've reasoned with the Reapers by dialogue mechanics. I would like to propose a moment of silence in memory of that recently demolished strawman...
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